Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXVII

[payitforward]

Let’s get a new coach and front office before trading Wall, Otto, of heaven forbid Brad. Let’s give these guys a chance, it’s very hard working for a bad organization for your entire career I would imagine. And no one should wants Ernie making any more decisions on personnel.

For sure, firing Ernie should be the next move this organization makes. It should have happened long ago, & it should happen today!

But, that doesn't affect whether any or all of those 3 guys should be traded.

It's time to start over. This generation of the Wiz is not going to win a title; it's not going to contend for a title, it's not going to pass Philly, Boston, Toronto, Milwaukee or even Indiana in the standings this year or any year soon. Those teams are all better than us, way better, & most of them are also younger than us & still improving from within.

But, as you say, it would be a disaster if it were Ernie who led this restart. So, in that sense, sure -- lets get "a new... front office before trading" any of them -- & then lets trade at least Wall & Beal forthwith.

I'm all for a new coach as well. Brooks adds no value whatever. But there is no coach that can turn back time, & no coach can change the value of our current personnel compared to those 5 teams I mention above.

[dckingsfan]

I wish I could give a +1000 your post PIF. It really is time to blow it up. Get rid of the FO, coach and move on...

[Ruzious]

Yeah, Indiana is moving up to the elite echelon in the East - especially with their 2 bigs - Turner and Sabonis - turning into outstanding players.

[Illmatic12]

Of course they want a long term fix, but what long term fix is available.

They have like 5-6 2nd round picks over the next two year. Not a big ask.
Also, they are sending out McLemore and his 5.5m salary. He is worse than Rivers.

The additional cost of Ariza over McLemore is about 4M. That is a huge upgrade and well worth a 2nd.

If they balk. Screw em. Somebody will gladly give us a top 45 pick and filler for Ariza.

Any non tax paying team can save us 5m in salary. We can the. Move Green/Morris to get the rest of the way if need be.


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We're talking about big Ern here. He's not playing 4D chess. He didn't go through all this trouble for a second rounder. He wants to do whatever he can to plug the holes in this sinking ship and earn another 1 year extension.

Admittedly I'm not sure what will happen at the deadline. If we're still on page to win 31 games at that point--I don't know how you just sit and watch it happen.

I would rather trade wall any where. i would like this team so much better as a beal pet project

You would get sick of "Beal eats" pretty quickly when he starts trying too hard to be a ballhandler and gets 5+ TOs a game dribbling off his foot.

However , given his age/contract Beal has an incredible amount of value as a #2, which is why the best move is to trade him to a team that is desperate for a second-option scorer.

[Donkey McDonkerton]

When the day comes where AD requests a trade, would Beal, Otto, and a #1 (or anything else) even come close?

[nate33]

Yeah, Indiana is moving up to the elite echelon in the East - especially with their 2 bigs - Turner and Sabonis - turning into outstanding players.

I listened to a Zach Lowe podcast recently. Lowe pointed out that Turner and Sabonis play the same position and can't really coexist effectively. He figures it's only a matter of time until Indy is forced to trade one of them. Sabonis is cheap for only 1 more year.

I wonder if Porter for Sabonis and filler would interest them? Or do it in the offseason with it just Porter straight up for Sabonis.

[nate33]

We're talking about big Ern here. He's not playing 4D chess. He didn't go through all this trouble for a second rounder. He wants to do whatever he can to plug the holes in this sinking ship and earn another 1 year extension.

Admittedly I'm not sure what will happen at the deadline. If we're still on page to win 31 games at that point--I don't know how you just sit and watch it happen.

I would rather trade wall any where. i would like this team so much better as a beal pet project

You would get sick of "Beal eats" pretty quickly when he starts trying too hard to be a ballhandler and gets 5+ TOs a game dribbling off his foot.

However , given his age/contract Beal has an incredible amount of value as a #2, which is why the best move is to trade him to a team that is desperate for a second-option scorer.

I agree that Beal as the primary ball handler isn't ideal. However I think he's gotten better and better at it, and it would go as poorly as it did last year (which wasn't all that poor). But let's not forget that there are other options than to replace Wall with Sato. Sato is a great glue guy and is totally unselfish, but he lacks the ability to bend a defense and thereby set up his teammates well. He's really not starting PG material. If you paired Beal with a somewhat average true PG instead of Wall, I think Beal would be okay. Imagine Beal alongside, say, Ricky Rubio, or Dennis Schroeder, or Terry Rozier. A competent guy like that would be enough to take some pressure off of Beal and allow him to thrive as a pure SG instead of as a combo guard.

[CntOutSmrtCrazy]

At this point best case scenario is we suck the rest of the season. This would hopefully get EG and Brooks the axe, net is a high pick in a draft, and Wall getting traded. I think we should hold onto Beal unless something great comes along as he’s still young and is a player who I believe game will age well. Keep at least the following players on the roster if you can:

-Beal
-Porter
-Sato
-Brown Jr.
-Bryant
-Dekker

Build through the draft, get a modern GM and coach in here, and hope we can nab a free agent once we cleanup the dumpster fire.

[Illmatic12]

I would rather trade wall any where. i would like this team so much better as a beal pet project

You would get sick of "Beal eats" pretty quickly when he starts trying too hard to be a ballhandler and gets 5+ TOs a game dribbling off his foot.

However , given his age/contract Beal has an incredible amount of value as a #2, which is why the best move is to trade him to a team that is desperate for a second-option scorer.

I agree that Beal as the primary ball handler isn't ideal. However I think he's gotten better and better at it, and it would go as poorly as it did last year (which wasn't all that poor). But let's not forget that there are other options than to replace Wall with Sato. Sato is a great glue guy and is totally unselfish, but he lacks the ability to bend a defense and thereby set up his teammates well. He's really not starting PG material. If you paired Beal with a somewhat average true PG instead of Wall, I think Beal would be okay. Imagine Beal alongside, say, Ricky Rubio, or Dennis Schroeder, or Terry Rozier. A competent guy like that would be enough to take some pressure off of Beal and allow him to thrive as a pure SG instead of as a combo guard.

Well that would require a series of additional moves (because moving Wall's salary alone wouldn't even clear up enough cap space to sign a Schroder or Rozier). And those guys don't really provide value off the ball either so that issue still remains. But sure, in the event that we had to build the offense around Beal I guess the team could get by with a slightly above average-type starter .

Still think the smart move is still to trade Beal though, as I don't think the roster around him would be good enough to convince him to sign an extension.

[gambitx777]

The issues isn't who gets us the most value, if that's the issues trade everyone and start over. The ruling of John's trade kicker plays in our favor because it would only be applied to this year he gets harder to move next year maybe? Unless we wanna take on guys like Anderson or Chandler. Which is a maybe. I think we need to move wall right now before he gets on that new deal and gets hurt.

[Dark Faze]

The issues isn't who gets us the most value, if that's the issues trade everyone and start over. The ruling of John's trade kicker plays in our favor because it would only be applied to this year he gets harder to love next year maybe? Unless we wanna take on guys like Anderson or Chandler. Which is a maybe. I think we need to move wall right now before he gets on that new deal and gets hurt.

we'd be stupid to think we can get much value outside of a late first or a second rounder + expirings at this point

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

The issues isn't who gets us the most value, if that's the issues trade everyone and start over. The ruling of John's trade kicker plays in our favor because it would only be applied to this year he gets harder to love next year maybe? Unless we wanna take on guys like Anderson or Chandler. Which is a maybe. I think we need to move wall right now before he gets on that new deal and gets hurt.

Don't ask my why, but I read easy to love .... and thought of THIS:

Watch on YouTube

I must be

I heard first courtesy of Starbucks

[gambitx777]

The issues isn't who gets us the most value, if that's the issues trade everyone and start over. The ruling of John's trade kicker plays in our favor because it would only be applied to this year he gets harder to love next year maybe? Unless we wanna take on guys like Anderson or Chandler. Which is a maybe. I think we need to move wall right now before he gets on that new deal and gets hurt.

we'd be stupid to think we can get much value outside of a late first or a second rounder + expirings at this point

In my opinion I'd be happy with an expiring and a second or late first. Or a useful player on a one years deal next year and a second or two or a late first . I don't want much for wall. I just wanna move on. Some times in life you gotta take the L to bounce back . It's ok to not get what he's worth when not having him here at all is probably worth more than he is worth anyway.

[gambitx777]

Let’s get a new coach and front office before trading Wall, Otto, of heaven forbid Brad. Let’s give these guys a chance, it’s very hard working for a bad organization for your entire career I would imagine. And no one should wants Ernie making any more decisions on personnel.

For sure, firing Ernie should be the next move this organization makes. It should have happened long ago, & it should happen today!

But, that doesn't affect whether any or all of those 3 guys should be traded.

It's time to start over. This generation of the Wiz is not going to win a title; it's not going to contend for a title, it's not going to pass Philly, Boston, Toronto, Milwaukee or even Indiana in the standings this year or any year soon. Those teams are all better than us, way better, & most of them are also younger than us & still improving from within.

But, as you say, it would be a disaster if it were Ernie who led this restart. So, in that sense, sure -- lets get "a new... front office before trading" any of them -- & then lets trade at least Wall & Beal forthwith.

I'm all for a new coach as well. Brooks adds no value whatever. But there is no coach that can turn back time, & no coach can change the value of our current personnel compared to those 5 teams I mention above.

I don't think it matters when we trade wall. I don't think trading wall is about what we get out of him it's about improving our locker room and cap situation. Just do it for what ever you can get. It might take a new GM to do if eg is set on wall. But def get new leadership before you either rebuild it retool around Beal

[gambitx777]

Dreaming at work today.
Wiz get : Randolph,Giles, Payton Johnson
King's get hill and a 2019 second from the pels
NO: John Wall

Gives them 3 all stars caliber players and probably gives them a top 5 back court in league. John Wall and holiday could absolutely play together if wall buys into being 3ed option and the pick and roll with Davis and to high iq passing guards would be nasty

We cut Johnson and randoplh sign Payton to a reasonable extension or something like that. And we got two young players and a hella lot of cap felx moving forward.

[trast66]

Let’s get a new coach and front office before trading Wall, Otto, of heaven forbid Brad. Let’s give these guys a chance, it’s very hard working for a bad organization for your entire career I would imagine. And no one should wants Ernie making any more decisions on personnel.

For sure, firing Ernie should be the next move this organization makes. It should have happened long ago, & it should happen today!

But, that doesn't affect whether any or all of those 3 guys should be traded.

It's time to start over. This generation of the Wiz is not going to win a title; it's not going to contend for a title, it's not going to pass Philly, Boston, Toronto, Milwaukee or even Indiana in the standings this year or any year soon. Those teams are all better than us, way better, & most of them are also younger than us & still improving from within.

But, as you say, it would be a disaster if it were Ernie who led this restart. So, in that sense, sure -- lets get "a new... front office before trading" any of them -- & then lets trade at least Wall & Beal forthwith.

I'm all for a new coach as well. Brooks adds no value whatever. But there is no coach that can turn back time, & no coach can change the value of our current personnel compared to those 5 teams I mention above.

The value of the personnel certainly does change if coach and FO change. Milwaukee was only one game better than us last year, then they got a competent coach. How many frogs has Brad Stevens turned into princes? Ujiri has been brilliant, that team is constructed well which gives each player higher value. Would Siakam developed here? No way. We need to hire people smarter than us at basketball to make these decisions.

[Eli Babak]

Dreaming at work today.
Wiz get : Randolph,Giles, Payton Johnson
King's get hill and a 2019 second from the pels
NO: John Wall

Gives them 3 all stars caliber players and probably gives them a top 5 back court in league. John Wall and holiday could absolutely play together if wall buys into being 3ed option and the pick and roll with Davis and to high iq passing guards would be nasty

We cut Johnson and randoplh sign Payton to a reasonable extension or something like that. And we got two young players and a hella lot of cap felx moving forward.

Why Sac would do this?

1) A 1st is needed in order to move Hill
2) Giles is a good prospect
3) Randolph is useless but right now they have no problem retaining him

**** this mess. I'm expecting a trade involving our 1st. Porter or Beal is gone in the next 8 months.

[popper]

It’s kind of obvious at this point that Wall and his agent have decided that Wall should stop playing defense in order to force a trade. As a result, TL can forget about any hope of playoff revenue. We’ll see about how much pain the franchise will suffer just to dump him, if that is even possible.

[gambitx777]

Dreaming at work today.
Wiz get : Randolph,Giles, Payton Johnson
King's get hill and a 2019 second from the pels
NO: John Wall

Gives them 3 all stars caliber players and probably gives them a top 5 back court in league. John Wall and holiday could absolutely play together if wall buys into being 3ed option and the pick and roll with Davis and to high iq passing guards would be nasty

We cut Johnson and randoplh sign Payton to a reasonable extension or something like that. And we got two young players and a hella lot of cap felx moving forward.

Why Sac would do this?

1) A 1st is needed in order to move Hill
2) Giles is a good prospect
3) Randolph is useless but right now they have no problem retaining him

**** this mess. I'm expecting a trade involving our 1st. Porter or Beal is gone in the next 8 months.

You can obviously dial it back skal instead of Giles and they are looking for something help . Hill plays good D and he only has a year left after this year. He doesn't hurt their long term cap. They have enough money coming off the books to not care. And they are a year or two away from attracting a big name to go with that good young core. And a second helps . They also don't play skal or Giles.

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

I’m totally in the minority here, I know. But given the likely low return for Wall, I’d love the Wiz to see what would happen if we could pair him with an actual NBA worthy coaching staff.

The next generation of Budz, Hopla, and Sam C.

A head coach with a scheme. A shooting coach. And a former point guard who doesn’t mind getting in his grill.

Park him in the film room. Show him the empty possessions, the chaos that ensues after his man beats him and he does his inept reach arounds, the inertia of the offense when he stands around off the ball resembling a potted plant.