Official Speculation Thread ‘18-19’: XX: Year of the Vuc

[orlando1214]

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I feel bad for Mozgov, or at least as much as I can for a guy making that much money. I'm sure it's been a frustrating year for him as far as basketball goes. He's been a true pro the whole time though and I love how he's always cheering for the guys from the bench in his blue blazer.

[drsd]

Dwight is a top 10 centre of all time.

Seriously?

Yes.

Where on this list do you place Howard???
Specifically, which of the top-10 Centers below is Howard better than to make a top-10 list?

Yao Ming
Dikembe Mutombo
Artis Gilmore
Bob Lanier
Bill Walton
Walt Bellamy
Alonzo Mourning
Nate Thurmond
Robert Parish
Bob McAdoo
Neil Johnston
Dave Cowens
Wes Unselde
Willis Reed
Patrick Ewing
Moses Malone
David Robinson
Hakeem Olajuwon
Elvin Hayes
George Mikan
Shaquille O’Neal
Wilt Chamberlain
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Bill Russell

Colored in green is my top-10 Centers. I would have Howard ranked in the Alonzo Mourning / Nate Thurmond range, meaning he is top-20 ever, but not top-10 ever. Still, Howard is a sure Hall of Famer.


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[drsd]

A recent report has the Magic over 100 ppg over their last 6. It is better than that.

Orlando has averaged 116.5 ppg over their last 6 games. That is NBA elite. Keeping this up, the Magic will win a lot of games!


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[Skin]

This is what happens when Skin can't find anything bad to say about Vuc.....and has to have someone to bitch about. I have an idea, focus your energy on specifically how bad Jerian Grant has been for this team.

Evan and Vuc still have low trade value and we're basking in medicority. Let me know if that changes.

Your posts are basking in mediocrity.
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And1 for making me laugh.

They say that when you stoop to personal attacks that you've lost the battle. I can accept that from you.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Evan and Vuc still have low trade value and we're basking in medicority. Let me know if that changes.

Your posts are basking in mediocrity.
Sent from my VS501 using RealGM mobile app

And1 for making me laugh.

They say that when you stoop to personal attacks that you've lost the battle. I can accept that from you.

You had to have had a chance for there to be a battle. I absolutely destroyed your claim about Fournier

[OrlandO]

Seriously?

Yes.

Where on this list do you place Howard???
Specifically, which of the top-10 Centers below is Howard better than to make a top-10 list?

Yao Ming
Dikembe Mutombo
Artis Gilmore
Bob Lanier
Bill Walton
Walt Bellamy
Alonzo Mourning
Nate Thurmond
Robert Parish
Bob McAdoo
Neil Johnston
Dave Cowens
Wes Unselde
Willis Reed
Patrick Ewing
Moses Malone
David Robinson
Hakeem Olajuwon
Elvin Hayes
George Mikan
Shaquille O’Neal
Wilt Chamberlain
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Bill Russell

Colored in green is my top-10 Centers. I would have Howard ranked in the Alonzo Mourning / Nate Thurmond range, meaning he is top-20 ever, but not top-10 ever. Still, Howard is a sure Hall of Famer.


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No love for Ben Wallace?

[basketballRob]

Wonder if the Magic sign anyone tomorrow on the first day 10 day contracts are allowed. They may have to waive someone. I don't know too much about Cam Payne other than I think he was injured.

[rcklsscognition]

What are the odds of a 10-day making it through the other 3 or 4 other PGs we have on the roster, no matter how much we think they suck? I doubt anything fun happens like that. I want some Linsanity, either him, or some other scrub that becomes an overnight sensation. The real reason is I'm pissed Luka is 2nd in the NBA in all-star voting and he's not on our team.

[CZ Eddie]

No love for Ben Wallace?

Ben never aspired to be anything other than a high-end role player.
And he was damn good at it for the most part of his career.

[MoMM]

Seriously?

Yes.

Where on this list do you place Howard???
Specifically, which of the top-10 Centers below is Howard better than to make a top-10 list?

Yao Ming
Dikembe Mutombo
Artis Gilmore
Bob Lanier
Bill Walton
Walt Bellamy
Alonzo Mourning
Nate Thurmond
Robert Parish
Bob McAdoo
Neil Johnston
Dave Cowens
Wes Unselde
Willis Reed
Patrick Ewing
Moses Malone
David Robinson
Hakeem Olajuwon
Elvin Hayes
George Mikan
Shaquille O’Neal
Wilt Chamberlain
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Bill Russell

Colored in green is my top-10 Centers. I would have Howard ranked in the Alonzo Mourning / Nate Thurmond range, meaning he is top-20 ever, but not top-10 ever. Still, Howard is a sure Hall of Famer.


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I didn't see most of the blue ones, so I won't talk about most of them:
- Alonzo: I think that D12 is higher
- Dikembe: not sure, he had a great and long career, he wasn't that good in terms of offense, but he was really good in defense and played against much better centers.
- Ming: short career, so D12 gets the nod.

Also, there are some current players that probably will be better than D12: AD, Embiid, Jokic and perhaps even Gobert.

I'd add Arvydas Sabonis to the list above D12 too.

Perhaps we can have a Tier 1 with Two-Way centers, then a 2nd tier One-Way (D12, Gobert, Dikembe and perhaps demote Ewing) and a 3rd tier after that.

[Bergmaniac]

Wonder if the Magic sign anyone tomorrow on the first day 10 day contracts are allowed. They may have to waive someone. I don't know too much about Cam Payne other than I think he was injured.

He might well be the worst player in the league. Worse than Grant.

[basketballRob]

Wonder if the Magic sign anyone tomorrow on the first day 10 day contracts are allowed. They may have to waive someone. I don't know too much about Cam Payne other than I think he was injured.

He might well be the worst player in the league. Worse than Grant.

I think they're going to move or waive Brooks too.

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[NavalAviator94]

This is antiquated thinking in the modern NBA. For Bamba to be a top center in the modern era, he will need to learn to play away from the basket at both ends of the floor. Gobert was a liability in the playoffs because he was so useless away from the basket, and Deandre Jordan's game has never really correlated to wins above what his teammates would have gotten with an average center. That's because if a modern NBA center wants to be more than a role player, he has to be able to play both in the paint and at the 3 point line on both ends.

As to the time and place to learn things not being in the middle of games, I would say 1) the rare exception to this is high first-round picks for development and assessment reasons, and 2) he's not very good close to the basket either, so he would be learning something at an inconvenient time one way or another.

Now, if you want to say that he should be benched all together (which I think would be the popular opinion if he weren't a recent high draft pick), I wouldn't mind sending him to Lakeland for a month, but I would still want him working on a complete game, not the limited one that you are suggesting.

Gobert averaged 19 PPG on 66 TS% last year in the playoffs. His efficiency went up to 69 TS% vs the rockets. I believe the only person that got flack that series on the Jazz was DMitchel because he has a horrendous 45% TS%, shooting 36% overall and 25% from three on 20 shots a game. Stats taken from here.

In regards to Mo Bamba not being good close to the basket, that's not really true. He has better paint touch shooting percentage than the following rookies (although is post % is worse than many).

Jaren Jackson Jr
Wendel Carter Jr
Marvin Bagley
Harry Giles

The only center Rookie he's worse than is Ayton, who is phenomal in the post.

Coincedentally, Bamba has a worse Catch & Shoot % than

Jaren Jackson Jr
Wendel Carter Jr
Marvin Bagley
Harry Giles
Ayton

Stats take from here

You don't need advanced post moves in the NBA to score in the paint and still put up decent points (we had this guy named Dwight Howard, don't know if you watched him play). Also, I just want to point out that you mentioned Vuc shoots 3's. Vuc also shoots 4x as many 2 as 3s. Bamba? It's 2x1. Bamba is straight up chucking them on something he's bad at (Catch & Shoot).

Conclusion - Bamba sucks offensively and should stick with be owning the paint area and gobbling offensive rebounds and put backs. Long term he should continue taking occasional 3s and working on his game, but in a way that doesn't sabotage himself. I rest my case.

When I look at the data in the link you provided, here's what I see, which isn't pretty compared to his rookie peers.

- Post shooting % Bamba: 30% Ayton 54% Jackson 51.7%
- Drive FG% Bamba: 20% Ayton 80 Jackson 56.5

You could argue that some of those guys are getting more minutes but as a percentage they are doing it much more efficiently and with greater frequency. Bamba isn't capable of playing more minutes without fowling. That will hopefully get better as the season goes on.

I think many of us agree that there is a player in there but it's going to take 3-4 years for him to be able to play effectively, leveraging his unique body/length.

[Catledge]

In regards to Mo Bamba not being good close to the basket, that's not really true. He has better paint touch shooting percentage than the following rookies (although is post % is worse than many).

Jaren Jackson Jr
Wendel Carter Jr
Marvin Bagley
Harry Giles

The only center Rookie he's worse than is Ayton, who is phenomal in the post.

That's hardly persuasive evidence considering that none of those guys is having a standout rookie year, and I don't know what games you are watching, but Bamba looks extremely uncomfortable playing a physical game. It seems outlandish to call that the thing he is good.

Conclusion - Bamba sucks offensively and should stick with be owning the paint area and gobbling offensive rebounds and put backs. Long term he should continue taking occasional 3s and working on his game, but in a way that doesn't sabotage himself. I rest my case.

People made similar statements about how Oladipo, Gordon, and Vooch should limit their games. Dipo should stop trying to handle the ball and accept being an off-the-ball player--and then he went on to break out as a playmaking guard. Vooch shouldn't shoot jumpers because he needs to focus on being close to the basket--and then he breaks out the same year he turns into a legit three-point threat. Gordon should accept that he's just a cutter and offensive rebounder on offense--and now he is showing steady development of an all-around offensive game.

None of those guys "sabotaged" himself by growing his game, and Mo's game will not be sabotaged by whether he takes .5 3FGA/game or 1.5 3FGA/game.

[Catledge]

double post

[Catledge]

Triple. Damn.

[NotACat]

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I wonder if this would allow our team to get the medical exemption for more cap space?

[OrlandO]

No love for Ben Wallace?

Ben never aspired to be anything other than a high-end role player.
And he was damn good at it for the most part of his career.

He was a lot more than a role player.... 4x all star, 4x DPOY, 5x All Defensive 1st team, 2x rebound leader, 1x blocks leader, and most importantly the centerpiece to a championship team's entire identity....

[JBSouthpaw]

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I wonder if this would allow our team to get the medical exemption for more cap space?

that is the 1st thing that popped into my head too.

[rcklsscognition]

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I wonder if this would allow our team to get the medical exemption for more cap space?

that is the 1st thing that popped into my head too.

The team's selected replacement player may be signed for a maximum salary of either 50% of the injured player's salary, or the mid-level exception for a non-luxury tax paying team, whichever is less. Since this exception is dependent on a player being seriously injured, it requires an NBA-assigned physician to verify the extent of the injury. An example of this exception in action is when the Portland Trailblazers used it to sign replacement players when number one draft pick Greg Oden went down with multiple knee injuries. The new Collective Bargaining Agreement allows a team to sign a replacement player for only one year, down from five years under the previous CBA.