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The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III

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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#581 » by AirP. » Fri May 24, 2019 2:02 pm

kio80 wrote:Image

He rather play with pigs then put up a shot.


This picture says nothing about Simmons' workouts or lack of workouts. You don't have to be sleeping for your recovery in between workouts.

Yes, it would be way better for fans to see Simmons in a picture with the Noah basketball system in the background. I don't see any reason for an NBA player not to be utilizing a system like that.

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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#582 » by Simmons25 » Fri May 24, 2019 2:27 pm

Tomjas wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:
Tomjas wrote:Please explain how playing in a World Cup can hurt his development


Players don't typically add new elements to their game while they're still in competition.

By playing in games this summer, Ben is encroaching on time needed in the gym to implement new skill.


That’s not how it works in any sport that I have played

Practice + games is infinitely more valuable than practice alone


I'm an Aussie and I didn't even want Ben playing for Australia in the off-season. He is going to get absolutely nothing out of scrimmages and then beating up over undersized, under talented guys from Lithuania and Senegal. Then probably France or Germany or Venezuela or China until finally meeting Spain or the US in the semis and watching him struggling to score again when he plays against decent players with coaches.

He should have done what Thon Maker did and made himself not available so he can work on his game in the off-season.

It's more about his brand than anything else. He posts more on social media in China than he does in the US and Australia. Wished China a Happy New Year... but Australia Day? Nothing. He knows where the money is coming from.... and China having the world cup is all about his brand.

But the worst smell of all about the entire thing (As if having his brother as his shooting coach wasn't bad enough) was that by some random amazing coincidence Ben's godfather was announced as the Australian National team assistant coach a few weeks ago. :noway: Definitely got that job on merit right. :lol:

Smells of Nepotism everywhere he goes. Family and money over improving his talent. He should do what REAL shooting coaches say you should do. Rebuild the shot from scratch and no scrimmages for 3 months whilst it is being rebuilt... to rebuild that muscle memory and so that the player doesn't fall back into old habits. This was the year Ben desperately needed to do that... and instead he is just going to scrimmage and reinforce the bad shot he has. Makes me sick.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#583 » by BullyKing » Fri May 24, 2019 2:38 pm

Maybe Ben will actually take 3s and jumpers in these low pressure games? I'm sure he has taken thousands of them in the gym but the current issue is an unwillingness to actually try it in games and get over the embarrassment of missing.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#584 » by hookshot199 » Fri May 24, 2019 2:51 pm

Kobblehead wrote:You're talking about Ben gaining game experience.

We're talking about Ben adding new elements to his game.

The latter is far more important in this specific instance. It's far more important for Ben to come back with a pull-up mid-range game or acceptable setshot from three point range, than it is for him to just continue to get a feel for the game by playing.


I was going to post something positive about Ben after watching how Toronto has taken Giannis out of his game.
I have no problem with Ben taking some down time. But if he's not going to develop a shot this summer, that creates
problems for the organization. It's an absolute must.

I hope he's working with Brand and Brown and that they've set targets for him. If not, that's irresponsible on their
parts.

What I was going to say is that Ben plays better on-ball defense than Giannis. He needs to bulk up and increase his
upper body before he can finish around the basket like Giannis.

Ben turns 23 in July. Giannis turns 25 in December. Ben has completed his second season, Giannis his sixth.

So I'm optimistic that Ben can take the next step, but this Aussie national team report is disturbing.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#585 » by Bum Adebayo » Fri May 24, 2019 3:13 pm

BTW, it is funny hearing the comparisons with Giannis non shooting. Hello guys? Giannis was 2/3 from three, imagine a game where Simmons shots 2/3 from three, this place would go nuts, but it's Giannis and can't shoot wtf, he shoots WAYYYY better than Simmons and it's not even close.
That being said, I'm willing to give him 1 more season to prove me wrong, maybe he finally gets it and tries harder to improve.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#586 » by 76ciology » Fri May 24, 2019 6:02 pm

PhillyFan11 wrote:
Bum Adebayo wrote:
PLO wrote:
Simmons general floor game outside of his terrible shooting is awesome: he's certainly a far superior passer and probably a better set-up man than Giannis in a playoff context. Giannis limits are probably being seen in this series - he's basically being contained as a scorer by the far smaller, if incredible, Kawhi, and that's Giannis main selling point as an attacker, his scoring ability.

If Simmons just gets the semblance of a half-court scoring game his far superior feel for the game will probably carry him past Giannis' limits as a player, despite what the blogboys say. Simmons just has a far higher IQ right now than Giannis ever will as a player.

The fact this is even a conversation is a big plus in Simmon's favor TBH.


Of course, Simmons was born more talented, Giannis has worked much harder to offset not having the basketball IQ that Simmons has, we all know that, we know that the only reason Simmons is a top 30 player is ONLY because of his ridiculous talent, top 5 talent who is only a top 30 player, not much merit in that.


Oh my god we have a 22 year old that is ONLY a top 30 player. Woe is us! Start the process back over, we’re screwed!

Honest question: how many of those top 30 guys do you think are also under 25?


Whats the basis for top 30 nba player? bleacherreport?
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#587 » by PhillyFan11 » Fri May 24, 2019 7:54 pm

76ciology wrote:
PhillyFan11 wrote:
Bum Adebayo wrote:
Of course, Simmons was born more talented, Giannis has worked much harder to offset not having the basketball IQ that Simmons has, we all know that, we know that the only reason Simmons is a top 30 player is ONLY because of his ridiculous talent, top 5 talent who is only a top 30 player, not much merit in that.


Oh my god we have a 22 year old that is ONLY a top 30 player. Woe is us! Start the process back over, we’re screwed!

Honest question: how many of those top 30 guys do you think are also under 25?


Whats the basis for top 30 nba player? bleacherreport?


Whatever you want it to be...I was just quoting the person who made it seem like being a top 30 player is a bad thing.

For the record, I don’t think it would be hard to argue that Ben isn’t top 30. Top 50 for sure, but 30 may be stretching it. Even then, the # of guys under 25 on that list ranked higher than Ben? Gotta be less than 10...and Ben hasn’t even turned 23 yet.

This board would have run Kawhi and Giannias (and a whole lot more guys) out of town because they weren’t good enough their 1st 2 years. Hell, Steph went to college for 3 years and didn’t put up 20 PPG until his 4th year in the league.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#588 » by PhillyPhilly » Fri May 24, 2019 8:39 pm

BullyKing wrote:Maybe Ben will actually take 3s and jumpers in these low pressure games? I'm sure he has taken thousands of them in the gym but the current issue is an unwillingness to actually try it in games and get over the embarrassment of missing.


Is there any point in taking threes with a broken shot though? The current form and release are just terrible. No point wasting possesions on a shot that will never be good enough. Imo he needs to rebuild that thing before he joins Australia and then practice the new shot In the camp and In the games.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#589 » by Simmons25 » Sat May 25, 2019 1:33 am

Bum Adebayo wrote:BTW, it is funny hearing the comparisons with Giannis non shooting. Hello guys? Giannis was 2/3 from three, imagine a game where Simmons shots 2/3 from three, this place would go nuts, but it's Giannis and can't shoot wtf, he shoots WAYYYY better than Simmons and it's not even close.
That being said, I'm willing to give him 1 more season to prove me wrong, maybe he finally gets it and tries harder to improve.


To be fair Giannis is shooting 27% from 3 his entire career and is almost a career worst 25% from 3 this season. The guy is just a horrible shooter but keeps on taking them anyway. That's why they are leaving him wide open. Ben I wish would at least take them but I understand in a way why he doesn't... he is hardly the #1 man on offense like Giannis is.

The difference between Giannis and Ben though is that Ben has point guard skills and plays like one... Giannis doesn't so Giannis needs to score if he has the ball in his hand otherwise he is useless. Giannis also has the keys to that team to do whatever the hell he wants... he is the Alpha. Ben is not the Alpha... Joel is and the team is set up around Joel. You can argue over whether that is long term a good thing or not.

I think Ben would be better off at a team where he was the #1 option and the team offense is built around him but that ain't going to happen. End of the day he still needs a jumper because as Giannis is proving it doesn't matter how good you are getting to the basket... if you can't shoot you just end up costing the team.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#590 » by Tomjas » Sat May 25, 2019 6:32 am

Simmons25 wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:
Players don't typically add new elements to their game while they're still in competition.

By playing in games this summer, Ben is encroaching on time needed in the gym to implement new skill.


That’s not how it works in any sport that I have played

Practice + games is infinitely more valuable than practice alone


I'm an Aussie and I didn't even want Ben playing for Australia in the off-season. He is going to get absolutely nothing out of scrimmages and then beating up over undersized, under talented guys from Lithuania and Senegal. Then probably France or Germany or Venezuela or China until finally meeting Spain or the US in the semis and watching him struggling to score again when he plays against decent players with coaches.

He should have done what Thon Maker did and made himself not available so he can work on his game in the off-season.

It's more about his brand than anything else. He posts more on social media in China than he does in the US and Australia. Wished China a Happy New Year... but Australia Day? Nothing. He knows where the money is coming from.... and China having the world cup is all about his brand.

But the worst smell of all about the entire thing (As if having his brother as his shooting coach wasn't bad enough) was that by some random amazing coincidence Ben's godfather was announced as the Australian National team assistant coach a few weeks ago. :noway: Definitely got that job on merit right. :lol:

Smells of Nepotism everywhere he goes. Family and money over improving his talent. He should do what REAL shooting coaches say you should do. Rebuild the shot from scratch and no scrimmages for 3 months whilst it is being rebuilt... to rebuild that muscle memory and so that the player doesn't fall back into old habits. This was the year Ben desperately needed to do that... and instead he is just going to scrimmage and reinforce the bad shot he has. Makes me sick.


Scrimmages don’t mean jack as there’s no pressure

I used to be a pro in another sport - basically the equivalent of minor leagues so a nobody in real terms

However, I would like to think that I have a fair handle on what it takes to become the best as I played with some who made it

Talent is a prerequisite as is work ethic and I think it’s fair to say that Simmons has both as he wouldn’t be where he is today without either

However, once you reach a certain level, 90% (at least) of any sport is played between the ears

Simmons has more than 2 months to practice before he goes into camp with Australia and that’s more than enough to cure a flaring elbow if he puts the work in

The only question is whether his practice will hold up under pressure and a WC is a far better indicator than a scrimmage
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#591 » by Simmons25 » Sat May 25, 2019 9:53 am

Tomjas wrote:
Simmons25 wrote:
Tomjas wrote:
That’s not how it works in any sport that I have played

Practice + games is infinitely more valuable than practice alone


I'm an Aussie and I didn't even want Ben playing for Australia in the off-season. He is going to get absolutely nothing out of scrimmages and then beating up over undersized, under talented guys from Lithuania and Senegal. Then probably France or Germany or Venezuela or China until finally meeting Spain or the US in the semis and watching him struggling to score again when he plays against decent players with coaches.

He should have done what Thon Maker did and made himself not available so he can work on his game in the off-season.

It's more about his brand than anything else. He posts more on social media in China than he does in the US and Australia. Wished China a Happy New Year... but Australia Day? Nothing. He knows where the money is coming from.... and China having the world cup is all about his brand.

But the worst smell of all about the entire thing (As if having his brother as his shooting coach wasn't bad enough) was that by some random amazing coincidence Ben's godfather was announced as the Australian National team assistant coach a few weeks ago. :noway: Definitely got that job on merit right. :lol:

Smells of Nepotism everywhere he goes. Family and money over improving his talent. He should do what REAL shooting coaches say you should do. Rebuild the shot from scratch and no scrimmages for 3 months whilst it is being rebuilt... to rebuild that muscle memory and so that the player doesn't fall back into old habits. This was the year Ben desperately needed to do that... and instead he is just going to scrimmage and reinforce the bad shot he has. Makes me sick.


Scrimmages don’t mean jack as there’s no pressure

I used to be a pro in another sport - basically the equivalent of minor leagues so a nobody in real terms

However, I would like to think that I have a fair handle on what it takes to become the best as I played with some who made it

Talent is a prerequisite as is work ethic and I think it’s fair to say that Simmons has both as he wouldn’t be where he is today without either

However, once you reach a certain level, 90% (at least) of any sport is played between the ears

Simmons has more than 2 months to practice before he goes into camp with Australia and that’s more than enough to cure a flaring elbow if he puts the work in

The only question is whether his practice will hold up under pressure and a WC is a far better indicator than a scrimmage


With all due respect... you aren't a former College/NBA basketballer so I will prefer to take the advice of the hired gun NBA shooting coach that turned Tatum, Beal, Embiid and co into decent shooters.... and who says you most definitely do not scrimmage or even go shooting with mates for 3 months during a shot rebuild.

I'd feel much better if Simmons was with someone like Drew Hanlen than spending time working out with his godfather who happened to be the assistant coach at LSU when Simmons shot completely disappeared and his brother who has been shooting with him since he was changing his nappies.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#592 » by AirP. » Fri May 31, 2019 1:12 pm

Simmons25 wrote:With all due respect... you aren't a former College/NBA basketballer so I will prefer to take the advice of the hired gun NBA shooting coach that turned Tatum, Beal, Embiid and co into decent shooters.... and who says you most definitely do not scrimmage or even go shooting with mates for 3 months during a shot rebuild.

I'd feel much better if Simmons was with someone like Drew Hanlen than spending time working out with his godfather who happened to be the assistant coach at LSU when Simmons shot completely disappeared and his brother who has been shooting with him since he was changing his nappies.


Right, rebuilding a shot is tough because you're fighting against your body's current muscle memory to go away what feels right to create new muscle memory for your shot(and hopefully make the old way not feel comfortable). If you mix in scrims/games you're more then likely going to do what feels "right" which may be the old shoot form. Once you "retrain" your muscles and feel comfortable shooting correctly, then you go into scrims/games to gain the confidence to utilize your new shot.

It's taken Pascal Siakam 2 years of hard work and wanting to get better shooting the ball to get "good" shooting, you can see the progression in his shot his first 3 years in the NBA, 7 3pt attempts making 1(14%), 2nd year shooting 132 of them making 22% then this year shooting 214 making 37% of them.

Confidence, which is huge at any level, to me is just making sure your mind doesn't mess with your muscle memory. Practice enough can create confidence, doing well in games can create confidence.

Jimmy Butler locked himself into a gym one summer and worked on his game, sure he was a solid roleplayer at that point, but he created the confidence in his abilities to have them translate the next season and became an all-star for the first time.

All in all, Ben Simmons has to put in the work to become a better shooter. Ben is gifted, you can see the work he puts in on his body and his conditioning, I don't know how much work he really puts in on his skills, there's a minimum amount all players put in, does he put more then that to become the player he could be or is he somewhat content with what he is and where his life is at. He seems to have a great life, his drive to become better may not be all that high.

Nick Nurse on Pascal and his shooting from a post game in the FInals(last night)...

Read on Twitter
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#593 » by Bum Adebayo » Fri May 31, 2019 2:48 pm

AirP. wrote:
Simmons25 wrote:With all due respect... you aren't a former College/NBA basketballer so I will prefer to take the advice of the hired gun NBA shooting coach that turned Tatum, Beal, Embiid and co into decent shooters.... and who says you most definitely do not scrimmage or even go shooting with mates for 3 months during a shot rebuild.

I'd feel much better if Simmons was with someone like Drew Hanlen than spending time working out with his godfather who happened to be the assistant coach at LSU when Simmons shot completely disappeared and his brother who has been shooting with him since he was changing his nappies.


Right, rebuilding a shot is tough because you're fighting against your body's current muscle memory to go away what feels right to create new muscle memory for your shot(and hopefully make the old way not feel comfortable). If you mix in scrims/games you're more then likely going to do what feels "right" which may be the old shoot form. Once you "retrain" your muscles and feel comfortable shooting correctly, then you go into scrims/games to gain the confidence to utilize your new shot.

It's taken Pascal Siakam 2 years of hard work and wanting to get better shooting the ball to get "good" shooting, you can see the progression in his shot his first 3 years in the NBA, 7 3pt attempts making 1(14%), 2nd year shooting 132 of them making 22% then this year shooting 214 making 37% of them.

Confidence, which is huge at any level, to me is just making sure your mind doesn't mess with your muscle memory. Practice enough can create confidence, doing well in games can create confidence.

Jimmy Butler locked himself into a gym one summer and worked on his game, sure he was a solid roleplayer at that point, but he created the confidence in his abilities to have them translate the next season and became an all-star for the first time.

All in all, Ben Simmons has to put in the work to become a better shooter. Ben is gifted, you can see the work he puts in on his body and his conditioning, I don't know how much work he really puts in on his skills, there's a minimum amount all players put in, does he put more then that to become the player he could be or is he somewhat content with what he is and where his life is at. He seems to have a great life, his drive to become better may not be all that high.

Nick Nurse on Pascal and his shooting from a post game in the FInals(last night)...

Read on Twitter


But you can see there is also progression in the number of attempted 3pt shots. You don't practice for years in the gym while not shooting in games for like 5 years, then the next year you come with a solid jump shot, this is not how it works. You need to do both, practice in gym and also shoot in games. The problem with Simmons is that there is a regression from High School to NBA, he was a better shooter in HS, this is the main issue here, and he was shooting more 3pt shots in HS.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#594 » by rzzzzz » Fri May 31, 2019 4:09 pm

Simmons25 wrote: if Simmons was with someone like Drew Hanlen


Bingo! anybody with some scent of expertise or greatness about them. this kid is just too damn talented not to push himself. i hate to say it, but the one promising impulse towards development that he's shown was his interest in working with Magic Johnson. of course, then we lose him to the Lakers. (hmmm, a three way with Ben going to LA, the Lakers young talent and picks going to NO and AD coming to us is kind of intriguing.)
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#595 » by the_process » Fri May 31, 2019 4:36 pm

rzzzzz wrote:
Simmons25 wrote: if Simmons was with someone like Drew Hanlen


Bingo! anybody with some scent of expertise or greatness about them. this kid is just too damn talented not to push himself. i hate to say it, but the one promising impulse towards development that he's shown was his interest in working with Magic Johnson. of course, then we lose him to the Lakers. (hmmm, a three way with Ben going to LA, the Lakers young talent and picks going to NO and AD coming to us is kind of intriguing.)


LA would cut the Sixers out and take AD for themselves. But I agree it’s time to explore the market for Ben.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#596 » by Stanford » Fri May 31, 2019 4:38 pm

I guess you guys didn't get the memo. Drew Hanlen has been cancelled.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#597 » by Rastas » Fri May 31, 2019 4:50 pm

[quote="Stanford"]I guess you guys didn't get the memo. Drew Hanlen has been cancelled.[/quote

Wait till they get the next memo - which tells them next offseason is an Olympic year :lol:
Try telling them to wait till 21 to notice a significant improvement in shooting.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#598 » by Stanford » Sat Jun 1, 2019 12:32 pm

Read on Twitter


Ben is done playing with pigs.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#599 » by youngcrev » Sat Jun 1, 2019 2:07 pm

Stanford wrote:
Read on Twitter


Ben is done playing with pigs.


Just a little nibble on that left hand and he'll finally be forced to switch to become 50/40/90 guy.
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Re: The Ben Simmons Megathread - Part III 

Post#600 » by kio80 » Sat Jun 1, 2019 2:13 pm

Stanford wrote:
Read on Twitter


Ben is done playing with pigs.


Ben taking the pigs home


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