Revisiting the infamous Ainge/King trade

[[EverGreen]]

It's been discussed ad nauseam on this forum, but in light of this summer, is it possible that the Nets might actually end up winning the trade?

I'm a firm believer that winners and losers of trades are somewhat subjective, but more specifically they change over time. Often at the time of trades the knee jerk reaction fails to look at the long term implication of trades.

The trade in question is often discussed as one of the biggest heists of all time. Brooklyn got a short term rental of Pierce and KG (who never really meshed with the existing roster) and the Celtics got a bundle of high lotto picks. Enough said right?

The implication of this summer is that the Nets are in a better place to compete for a Championship than Boston.
Ainge was 'hamstrung' with a war chest full of valuable assets that he would have been foolish to trade away below market value and the Celtics have been caught rebuilding while contending which hasn't really worked out in Championship success.
note: I'm not bashing Ainge here. I agree with all his moves, he's just been in a difficult position.

On the other hand, the Nets had nothing. They fired King and hired Sean Marks who has made some long time savvy moves, mostly around taking on dead salary and looking to clear it in the future, sprinkled with some nice trades (D'LO) and some nice late round draft picks (Allen, Hollis-Jefferson and LeVert). Now that they've added Kyrie and KD, if they win a championship next season, I think they might have actually won the trade.

[brackdan70]

Lol. No.

[brackdan70]

You realize KD will not play next season right?

[Green89]

We had one of the biggest advantages in acquiring those picks, and every GM would have envied Ainge's position. The assets we had should have netted us a superstar. In the end, we didn't get one, but I still wouldn't use that to say we lost the trade. More like the Nets recovered quicker from their disadvantageous position, than we capitalized on our advantageous one.

[[EverGreen]]

You realize KD will not play next season right?

Of course. He'll play the season after though and he's still on of the best players in the league who doesn't rely only on athleticism. I'd love to have KD on that deal.
When I referred to next season, I mean the one after this year, as in, we are already in the 2019/20 season.

[SuperDeluxe]

If the Nets won the trade, then this would be a good time to bring Billy King in for a job interview. Let's move quickly before other teams notice he's still available.

[Bleeding Green]

You realize KD will not play next season right?

Of course. He'll play the season after though and he's still on of the best players in the league who doesn't rely only on athleticism. I'd love to have KD on that deal.
When I referred to next season, I mean the one after this year, as in, we are already in the 2019/20 season.

Every player relies on athleticism. Show me the players who came back from an achilles injury and were the same. When he jumps now he has a certain amount of lift. When he comes back he will have less lift, it will affect every part of his game.

But yes, Nets have done a great job under Marks. If we're already talking about the 2020-21 season I don't know how you can have a real opinion, so much is up in the air. How many people two seasons ago thought the Celtics would have Kemba Walker and Enes Kanter?

[gocelts]

Everyone forgot the nets were a team for like 5 years while we were in the playoffs...while we were rebuilding.

Nets have nothing from that trade. We still have Tatum and Brown.

There's really nothing to discuss.

[Grahf]

People talking about that trade now as if Tatum and Brown don’t exist anymore.

I don’t believe the Nets are winning anything with their core. Achilles tear is a two-year injury at least, and there’s really no way to know if KD will be an all star level player when he comes back. The longer he takes to recover, the more likely it becomes that Kyrie does his cancer routine and blows up the franchise.

[SmartWentCrazy]

This is a dumb thread. 1 season of Pierce and 1.5 seasons of Garnet and Jarrett Allen is not better than Brown, Tatum and two seasons of Kyrie.

Brooklyn recovered really well, but that trade still sucked. Also, Brooklyn wont win a title with KD.

[celticfan42487]

Brooklyn didn't get anything from the trade.

The only thing they have is they're in NY so they have an incredibly unfair advantage that is solely responsible for why they are able to recover from such disasters.

Put them in CHA right now and if they made the same trade their franchise would be on the verge of shutting down by now.

[claycarver]

If the Nets won the trade, then this would be a good time to bring Billy King in for a job interview. Let's move quickly before other teams notice he's still available.

I'm too lazy to start multiple burner accounts to And1 this post to death, but you should know I thought about it.

[SuperDeluxe]

If the Nets won the trade, then this would be a good time to bring Billy King in for a job interview. Let's move quickly before other teams notice he's still available.

I'm too lazy to start multiple burner accounts to And1 this post to death, but you should know I thought about it.

Yes, we need to do something. Fire Ainge!

[Froob]

It’s crazy to think anyone would give up so much for Pierce and KG after they looked pretty much toast after the Knicks series lol.

Needed a lot more from Deron Williams and he sucked. Maybe if he had delivered and Brook doesn’t go down who knows.

[Celtics_History_Lesson]

A lottery pick for giving them Pierce.

A lottery pick for giving them Garnett.

A lottery pick for being willing to take on the money, and attitude problem, of Gerald Wallace.



The Nets could have kept all those picks, and still run their long plan of clearing cap-room.

Their "win" now is a guy who can't walk and someone who hates every person who has ever been on a team next to him.


Celtics still have Tatum, trade asset J Brown, Langford.


When Brokelyn gives away D Lillard so they can have G Wallace. When they give away Favors and a high pick so they can have problem Deron Williams, and then pay him to go away. When they give away the only useful Plumlee for close to useless and very undersized Rondae Hollis-Jefferson and then give Rondae Hollis-Jefferson away. When they give away many draft picks for Joe Johnson's giant contract. When they give away half a decade of draft picks to rent some quality Celtics for a few months. Not a lot of winning there.


Durant and Erving have been winning recently when riding coattails. Durant and Irvin will have to ride the coattails of Dzanan Musa in a few years if they want to win again.

Win the trade? The Nets could have Tatum, J Murray, M Bridges as well as their current roster, minus D Jordan and G Temple. That would be more of what winning is.



What is next?

Memphis won the Jeff Green trades with Boston. They have Ja Morant, they won the trade.


Did Chris Wallace and Billy King ever trade with each other? That would be like a three-point shooting competition between ben Simmons and J Noah.

[Ed Pinkney]

They clearly lost the trade by a significant margin, they gave up three high lotto picks and the 17th pick in another draft and got basically nothing for it. But luck plays into it somewhat, because the drafts they gave those picks up in did not have any obvious superstars at the top of it so they are not now looking at a LeBron/Davis/Duncan etc type on the Celtics.

However they got themselves into a very good position due to some smart hires, some smart trades and draft selections, and clearing two max cap slots in the New York market where the Knicks are still a train-wreck. Good on them, but that has nothing to do with winning or losing the trade really does it? The trade might have sent them in that direction, but it was a specific pathway they chose to take.

Boston could have done the same thing, cleared their cap sheet and generated two max slots, developed a plucky young team that at least made the playoffs (barely and in a weak conference), and the chances of them signing two All NBA level free agents would have been pretty close to zero.

It is basically because they are in New York. It will be the exact same thing if the Lakers get Leonard.

[vct33]

Misleading title. LOL. I thought this was about Ainge being traded to the Kings with Brad Lohaus for Joe Klein and Ed Pinkney. That was quite devestating for me at the time.

[DarkAzcura]

They didn’t win the trade because they happen to be doing well right now for completely unrelated reasons.

[Slax]

If the Nets won the trade, then this would be a good time to bring Billy King in for a job interview. Let's move quickly before other teams notice he's still available.

I'm too lazy to start multiple burner accounts to And1 this post to death, but you should know I thought about it.

Maybe I'm your burner account, because I and1'd the heck out of that post.

[brackdan70]

Everyone forgot the nets were a team for like 5 years while we were in the playoffs...while we were rebuilding.

Nets have nothing from that trade. We still have Tatum and Brown.

There's really nothing to discuss.

And Langford