ImageImageImageImageImage

Political Roundtable Part XXVI

Moderators: nate33, LyricalRico, montestewart

Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,492
And1: 5,506
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1141 » by Ruzious » Thu Sep 5, 2019 5:35 pm

daoneandonly wrote:Can respect your opinion, but the EC works, the people whining about it are doing so because their candidate lost, simply put

The Dems care about majority when it suits them, i.e. the popular vote. The majority of people don't make minimum wage, but let's more than double it for the few that do. The majority of people have an ID that can easily be used at the polls, but lets not mandate that for the 6% that dont.

I was taught as a kid - probably a thousand times - you vote because every vote counts. Looking at it objectively, the electoral college prevents the possibility of every vote counting. In Maryland, where I vote, it's probably more than 3 quarters Democrats, so there's literally zero chance that my vote for President in the general election will count. And the same thing for a Republican voting in a heavily Republican state - his/her/it's (jk) vote means nothing. If my logic there is flawed, please let me know why.
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
JWizmentality
RealGM
Posts: 13,495
And1: 4,505
Joined: Nov 21, 2004
Location: Cosmic Totality
   

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1142 » by JWizmentality » Thu Sep 5, 2019 6:45 pm

daoneandonly wrote:Can respect your opinion, but the EC works, the people whining about it are doing so because their candidate lost, simply put

The Dems care about majority when it suits them, i.e. the popular vote. The majority of people don't make minimum wage, but let's more than double it for the few that do. The majority of people have an ID that can easily be used at the polls, but lets not mandate that for the 6% that dont.


"We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that only the majoirty are created equal."
User avatar
pancakes3
General Manager
Posts: 7,816
And1: 1,170
Joined: Jul 27, 2003
Location: Virginia
Contact:

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1143 » by pancakes3 » Thu Sep 5, 2019 8:32 pm

News outlets and Trump are fixated on Dorian's alleged impact on Alabama but:

the US is now in an arms race with Russia after pulling out of a treaty banning mid-ranged ballistic missiles, and it's both surprising and not to find out that the US is the reason why.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/05/russia-will-make-new-missiles-putin-says.html
https://www.businessinsider.com/putin-offered-trump-chance-to-buy-russian-hypersonic-missiles-2019-9


Pence was pigheaded and tone deaf about Brexit during is IRISH visit. I have no idea why this administration supports Brexit, other than the idea that the global destabilization of other nations would be indirectly beneficial to the US.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/sep/05/mike-pence-ireland-shat-on-the-carpet


Trump's real estate lawyer decides to call it quits because apparently it's really hard to bring peace to the Middle East.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/09/jason-greenblatt-kushner-envoy-peace-plan-deal.html
Bullets -> Wizards
daoneandonly
General Manager
Posts: 8,440
And1: 1,301
Joined: May 27, 2004
Location: Masalaland
 

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1144 » by daoneandonly » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:24 pm

Ruzious wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Can respect your opinion, but the EC works, the people whining about it are doing so because their candidate lost, simply put

The Dems care about majority when it suits them, i.e. the popular vote. The majority of people don't make minimum wage, but let's more than double it for the few that do. The majority of people have an ID that can easily be used at the polls, but lets not mandate that for the 6% that dont.

I was taught as a kid - probably a thousand times - you vote because every vote counts. Looking at it objectively, the electoral college prevents the possibility of every vote counting. In Maryland, where I vote, it's probably more than 3 quarters Democrats, so there's literally zero chance that my vote for President in the general election will count. And the same thing for a Republican voting in a heavily Republican state - his/her/it's (jk) vote means nothing. If my logic there is flawed, please let me know why.


I hear you, i mean as a Republican in MD, I can probably say the same. But states like WY, Montana, ND, SD, they should have a say in who becomes President. They are afterall part if this country, it's not just a NY Cali market.

If not, then give more power to the states and less at the federal level.
daoneandonly
General Manager
Posts: 8,440
And1: 1,301
Joined: May 27, 2004
Location: Masalaland
 

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1145 » by daoneandonly » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:25 pm

How about this one? Will anyone chime in

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/obama-administration-student-loans-experts-113140861.html

Or should we just read waffle whine about where Pence stays overseas
Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,492
And1: 5,506
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1146 » by Ruzious » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:36 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Can respect your opinion, but the EC works, the people whining about it are doing so because their candidate lost, simply put

The Dems care about majority when it suits them, i.e. the popular vote. The majority of people don't make minimum wage, but let's more than double it for the few that do. The majority of people have an ID that can easily be used at the polls, but lets not mandate that for the 6% that dont.

I was taught as a kid - probably a thousand times - you vote because every vote counts. Looking at it objectively, the electoral college prevents the possibility of every vote counting. In Maryland, where I vote, it's probably more than 3 quarters Democrats, so there's literally zero chance that my vote for President in the general election will count. And the same thing for a Republican voting in a heavily Republican state - his/her/it's (jk) vote means nothing. If my logic there is flawed, please let me know why.


I hear you, i mean as a Republican in MD, I can probably say the same. But states like WY, Montana, ND, SD, they should have a say in who becomes President. They are afterall part if this country, it's not just a NY Cali market.

If not, then give more power to the states and less at the federal level.

Every individual in those states would have a say if there was NO electoral college - the same as everyone else in every other state. Everyone would be equal. Right? I mean... this is pretty basic stuff.
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,492
And1: 5,506
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1147 » by Ruzious » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:40 pm

daoneandonly wrote:How about this one? Will anyone chime in

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/obama-administration-student-loans-experts-113140861.html

Or should we just read waffle whine about where Pence stays overseas

Hey, if he screwed up, he screwed up. Is there something else you want me to say? I'll generally believe it if the WSJ says it, so I'm guessing it's true. Obama probably f'd up!!! Cool?
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
daoneandonly
General Manager
Posts: 8,440
And1: 1,301
Joined: May 27, 2004
Location: Masalaland
 

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1148 » by daoneandonly » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:42 pm

Ruzious wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:
Ruzious wrote:I was taught as a kid - probably a thousand times - you vote because every vote counts. Looking at it objectively, the electoral college prevents the possibility of every vote counting. In Maryland, where I vote, it's probably more than 3 quarters Democrats, so there's literally zero chance that my vote for President in the general election will count. And the same thing for a Republican voting in a heavily Republican state - his/her/it's (jk) vote means nothing. If my logic there is flawed, please let me know why.


I hear you, i mean as a Republican in MD, I can probably say the same. But states like WY, Montana, ND, SD, they should have a say in who becomes President. They are afterall part if this country, it's not just a NY Cali market.

If not, then give more power to the states and less at the federal level.

Every individual in those states would have a say if there was NO electoral college - the same as everyone else in every other state. Everyone would be equal. Right? I mean... this is pretty basic stuff.


But does everything work like that in America? I've been a broken record, but the tax system doesnt. It favors the lower income and super rich, leaving the middle class high and dry
daoneandonly
General Manager
Posts: 8,440
And1: 1,301
Joined: May 27, 2004
Location: Masalaland
 

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1149 » by daoneandonly » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:44 pm

Ruzious wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:How about this one? Will anyone chime in

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/obama-administration-student-loans-experts-113140861.html

Or should we just read waffle whine about where Pence stays overseas

Hey, if he screwed up, he screwed up. Is there something else you want me to say? I'll generally believe it if the WSJ says it, so I'm guessing it's true. Obama probably f'd up!!! Cool?


You know you're one of my fave posters Ruz, yeah all i was looking for, someone to acknowledge it and admit Obama has faults.
Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,492
And1: 5,506
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1150 » by Ruzious » Thu Sep 5, 2019 9:48 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:How about this one? Will anyone chime in

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/obama-administration-student-loans-experts-113140861.html

Or should we just read waffle whine about where Pence stays overseas

Hey, if he screwed up, he screwed up. Is there something else you want me to say? I'll generally believe it if the WSJ says it, so I'm guessing it's true. Obama probably f'd up!!! Cool?


You know you're one of my fave posters Ruz, yeah all i was looking for, someone to acknowledge it and admit Obama has faults.

Thanks man. He definitely should have worked harder to get things done in his first 2 years - when he had the opportunity - I was let down by him. After that, he didn't have much chance - Congress was out to block him at all costs.
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
User avatar
pancakes3
General Manager
Posts: 7,816
And1: 1,170
Joined: Jul 27, 2003
Location: Virginia
Contact:

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1151 » by pancakes3 » Fri Sep 6, 2019 12:35 am

::eyeroll::
Bullets -> Wizards
User avatar
gtn130
Analyst
Posts: 3,319
And1: 2,537
Joined: Mar 18, 2009

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1152 » by gtn130 » Fri Sep 6, 2019 1:44 am

That WSJ op-ed is laughable. Government-backed student loans didn't "eliminate" the private lenders - the private lenders never existed. The entire reason the government started backing student loans was to provide access to credit to people were presumably being denied by...private lenders.

The problem is that because everyone had nearly unlimited access to credit for tuition, all of these fraudulent for-profit degree mills popped up, and all of the legitimate institutions started quadrupling tuition costs, so now kids with art degrees have six figure debt while working at Starbucks because conventional wisdom has always been that getting a degree is the single path to financial success. People didn't consider that legitimately everyone in the higher education space is in the business of ripping off 18 year olds.

Student loans have been a massive policy failure, but the idea that it was some sort of fraudulent Obama accounting trick that victimized tax payers and the private sector is just standard WSJ op-ed nonsense. Like, of the people "victimized" by student loans - the group we're *not* going to talk about is the ****ing students?! Ok, lol.

And, of course, the implicit solution is to just turn everything over to the private sector so that 1/10th as many kids go to school, but private lenders get to make a little more money!

The solution is to address the cost of tuition. Period. But you're not going to hear that from the WSJ op-ed section because it's all a bunch of bull****.

Daonandonly, your corporate overlords are laughing at you.
daoneandonly
General Manager
Posts: 8,440
And1: 1,301
Joined: May 27, 2004
Location: Masalaland
 

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1153 » by daoneandonly » Fri Sep 6, 2019 11:00 am

pancakes3 wrote:::eyeroll::


gtn130 wrote:That WSJ op-ed is laughable. Government-backed student loans didn't "eliminate" the private lenders - the private lenders never existed. The entire reason the government started backing student loans was to provide access to credit to people were presumably being denied by...private lenders.

The problem is that because everyone had nearly unlimited access to credit for tuition, all of these fraudulent for-profit degree mills popped up, and all of the legitimate institutions started quadrupling tuition costs, so now kids with art degrees have six figure debt while working at Starbucks because conventional wisdom has always been that getting a degree is the single path to financial success. People didn't consider that legitimately everyone in the higher education space is in the business of ripping off 18 year olds.

Student loans have been a massive policy failure, but the idea that it was some sort of fraudulent Obama accounting trick that victimized tax payers and the private sector is just standard WSJ op-ed nonsense. Like, of the people "victimized" by student loans - the group we're *not* going to talk about is the ****ing students?! Ok, lol.

And, of course, the implicit solution is to just turn everything over to the private sector so that 1/10th as many kids go to school, but private lenders get to make a little more money!

The solution is to address the cost of tuition. Period. But you're not going to hear that from the WSJ op-ed section because it's all a bunch of bull****.

Daonandonly, your corporate overlords are laughing at you.


Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it
Ruzious
Forum Mod
Forum Mod
Posts: 38,492
And1: 5,506
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1154 » by Ruzious » Fri Sep 6, 2019 12:42 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
pancakes3 wrote:::eyeroll::


gtn130 wrote:That WSJ op-ed is laughable. Government-backed student loans didn't "eliminate" the private lenders - the private lenders never existed. The entire reason the government started backing student loans was to provide access to credit to people were presumably being denied by...private lenders.

The problem is that because everyone had nearly unlimited access to credit for tuition, all of these fraudulent for-profit degree mills popped up, and all of the legitimate institutions started quadrupling tuition costs, so now kids with art degrees have six figure debt while working at Starbucks because conventional wisdom has always been that getting a degree is the single path to financial success. People didn't consider that legitimately everyone in the higher education space is in the business of ripping off 18 year olds.

Student loans have been a massive policy failure, but the idea that it was some sort of fraudulent Obama accounting trick that victimized tax payers and the private sector is just standard WSJ op-ed nonsense. Like, of the people "victimized" by student loans - the group we're *not* going to talk about is the ****ing students?! Ok, lol.

And, of course, the implicit solution is to just turn everything over to the private sector so that 1/10th as many kids go to school, but private lenders get to make a little more money!

The solution is to address the cost of tuition. Period. But you're not going to hear that from the WSJ op-ed section because it's all a bunch of bull****.

Daonandonly, your corporate overlords are laughing at you.


Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it

It's not Obama vs Trump; it's every President in US history vs. Trump. There's never been a President that comes anywhere near the lies and distortions of Trump. Do you really not see that? You should - considering how everyone in the Bush family seems to.

Anyway, something like this seems to happen every day.
Read on Twitter
"Look, you never know when you may need to borrow a cup of sugar, maybe some milk or a handgun" - Dan C. from Texas
JWizmentality
RealGM
Posts: 13,495
And1: 4,505
Joined: Nov 21, 2004
Location: Cosmic Totality
   

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1155 » by JWizmentality » Fri Sep 6, 2019 12:58 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
pancakes3 wrote:::eyeroll::


gtn130 wrote:That WSJ op-ed is laughable. Government-backed student loans didn't "eliminate" the private lenders - the private lenders never existed. The entire reason the government started backing student loans was to provide access to credit to people were presumably being denied by...private lenders.

The problem is that because everyone had nearly unlimited access to credit for tuition, all of these fraudulent for-profit degree mills popped up, and all of the legitimate institutions started quadrupling tuition costs, so now kids with art degrees have six figure debt while working at Starbucks because conventional wisdom has always been that getting a degree is the single path to financial success. People didn't consider that legitimately everyone in the higher education space is in the business of ripping off 18 year olds.

Student loans have been a massive policy failure, but the idea that it was some sort of fraudulent Obama accounting trick that victimized tax payers and the private sector is just standard WSJ op-ed nonsense. Like, of the people "victimized" by student loans - the group we're *not* going to talk about is the ****ing students?! Ok, lol.

And, of course, the implicit solution is to just turn everything over to the private sector so that 1/10th as many kids go to school, but private lenders get to make a little more money!

The solution is to address the cost of tuition. Period. But you're not going to hear that from the WSJ op-ed section because it's all a bunch of bull****.

Daonandonly, your corporate overlords are laughing at you.


Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it


Nobody here has EVER claimed Obama was perfect. And you, absolutely have no knowledge of the article you just posted do you? You probably didn't even read the damn thing. You're so infantile.
daoneandonly
General Manager
Posts: 8,440
And1: 1,301
Joined: May 27, 2004
Location: Masalaland
 

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1156 » by daoneandonly » Fri Sep 6, 2019 1:03 pm

JWizmentality wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:
pancakes3 wrote:::eyeroll::


gtn130 wrote:That WSJ op-ed is laughable. Government-backed student loans didn't "eliminate" the private lenders - the private lenders never existed. The entire reason the government started backing student loans was to provide access to credit to people were presumably being denied by...private lenders.

The problem is that because everyone had nearly unlimited access to credit for tuition, all of these fraudulent for-profit degree mills popped up, and all of the legitimate institutions started quadrupling tuition costs, so now kids with art degrees have six figure debt while working at Starbucks because conventional wisdom has always been that getting a degree is the single path to financial success. People didn't consider that legitimately everyone in the higher education space is in the business of ripping off 18 year olds.

Student loans have been a massive policy failure, but the idea that it was some sort of fraudulent Obama accounting trick that victimized tax payers and the private sector is just standard WSJ op-ed nonsense. Like, of the people "victimized" by student loans - the group we're *not* going to talk about is the ****ing students?! Ok, lol.

And, of course, the implicit solution is to just turn everything over to the private sector so that 1/10th as many kids go to school, but private lenders get to make a little more money!

The solution is to address the cost of tuition. Period. But you're not going to hear that from the WSJ op-ed section because it's all a bunch of bull****.

Daonandonly, your corporate overlords are laughing at you.


Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it


Nobody here has EVER claimed Obama was perfect. And you, absolutely have no knowledge of the article you just posted do you? You probably didn't even read the damn thing. You're so infantile.


More name calling from people who criticize Trump from doing so, grow up. I did read it, so go ahead and just blurt insults, it's a good way to hide behind actual facts.
JWizmentality
RealGM
Posts: 13,495
And1: 4,505
Joined: Nov 21, 2004
Location: Cosmic Totality
   

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1157 » by JWizmentality » Fri Sep 6, 2019 1:54 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
JWizmentality wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:


Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it


Nobody here has EVER claimed Obama was perfect. And you, absolutely have no knowledge of the article you just posted do you? You probably didn't even read the damn thing. You're so infantile.


More name calling from people who criticize Trump from doing so, grow up. I did read it, so go ahead and just blurt insults, it's a good way to hide behind actual facts.


Nah dude, all you read was "Obama bad" Arrrgg!! That's the limit of your mental capacity. I'm not doc. I'll call an idiot an idiot. If there's one thing you conservatives taught me over the past two years is that ya'll are unapologetically ignorant. You wouldn't know a fact if it came and bit you in the arse.
dobrojim
RealGM
Posts: 13,412
And1: 1,295
Joined: Sep 16, 2004

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1158 » by dobrojim » Fri Sep 6, 2019 2:42 pm

daoneandonly wrote:
JWizmentality wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:


Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it


Nobody here has EVER claimed Obama was perfect. And you, absolutely have no knowledge of the article you just posted do you? You probably didn't even read the damn thing. You're so infantile.


More name calling from people who criticize Trump from doing so, grow up. I did read it, so go ahead and just blurt insults, it's a good way to hide behind actual facts.


Just curious what actual facts you're talking about (lower bolded part)

The right has no leg to stand on when it comes to accusing the left of being unable to criticize
one of their own. Trump's time in office has been ample demonstration of that.

Trump has been utterly corrupt in so many ways it's ridiculous. And yet the argument
on one side of the D party has been don't bother to impeach because you couldn't get 20/52
Republican senators to vote for conviction.
A lot of what we call 'thought' is just mental activity
User avatar
gtn130
Analyst
Posts: 3,319
And1: 2,537
Joined: Mar 18, 2009

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1159 » by gtn130 » Fri Sep 6, 2019 3:03 pm

daoneandonly wrote:Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it


Dude, they're obfuscating the issue by politicizing it to make you mad and get you focusing on the wrong things. The objective of the article is to frame the student loans problem as a failure to include private lenders because Obama did some FRAUD, and you should be MAD about the FRAUD *but also* start supporting the idea that private lenders need more representation, more handouts, and more tax breaks because of that damn OBAMA FRAUD.

This is how right wing media works, man. It's insidious. This is the entire point I'm trying to make: you get all fired up about a bunch of wedge issues and random partisan bull**** and it always inevitably winds up serving billionaires one way or another and at the expense of students, sick people, poor people, minorities and so on.

You're being scammed. You're being tricked. You vehemently support Trump, a conman, because of this exact type of garbage.
JWizmentality
RealGM
Posts: 13,495
And1: 4,505
Joined: Nov 21, 2004
Location: Cosmic Totality
   

Re: Political Roundtable Part XXVI 

Post#1160 » by JWizmentality » Fri Sep 6, 2019 3:19 pm

gtn130 wrote:
daoneandonly wrote:Yup Obama does no wrong, Dems do no wrong, even when it's written out in proof, 97.94% of the left deny or ignore it


Dude, they're obfuscating the issue by politicizing it to make you mad and get you focusing on the wrong things. The objective of the article is to frame the student loans problem as a failure to include private lenders because Obama did some FRAUD, and you should be MAD about the FRAUD *but also* start supporting the idea that private lenders need more representation, more handouts, and more tax breaks because of that damn OBAMA FRAUD.

This is how right wing media works, man. It's insidious. This is the entire point I'm trying to make: you get all fired up about a bunch of wedge issues and random partisan bull**** and it always inevitably winds up serving billionaires one way or another and at the expense of students, sick people, poor people, minorities and so on.

You're being scammed. You're being tricked. You vehemently support Trump, a conman, because of this exact type of garbage.


And I'll just leave this here, although I know he probably won't bother to read it and do some research on his own.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/federal-student-loan-forgiveness-program-rejects-almost-everyone-again/ar-AAGRHL9?ocid=ientp

Return to Washington Wizards