China cancels NBA stuff / Silver issues statement (pg1) /Ongoing discussion...

[clyde21]

As usual, if not ranting about your pet peeves, you're distorting the issue and displaying your ignorance. No surprise there.

speaking of ignorance, save us your drive by one liners that add nothing to the discussion.

You think you have added to the discussion with your rants? You are more ignorant than first appeared.

i'm ignorant because I am highlighting people were more outraged over a trans bathroom issue than what's happening in Xinjuang and the hypocrisy behind calls of 'freedom' for HK?

go away.

[RRyder823]

Freedom of speech is not a cornerstone to every society, merely a free one.

It should be. Sadly the 1st amendment is incredibly unique around the world

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[xAIRNESSx]

The Chinese government is so childish. Such an insecure reaction by them.

Basically taking their ball and going home.

[MemphisX]

Our journalists being imprisoned, disappearing? There are degrees of what's happening.

uhh...yes? look at what we did to Julian Assange, Chelsea Manning and Eric Snowden

Folks really in USA fairy tale land.

[Arman_tanzarian]

My biggest issue with all of this when it comes to the NBA is how much they brag about how progressive they are. Look at Rachel Nichols and the Charlotte bathroom thing, Steve Kerr blasting the NFL for bowing down to their audience because of the anthem thing and bragging at how progressive the NBA is on these kind of issues.

But there Rachel Nichols in China doing her show. There Steve Kerr staying silent on the issue. It's also not like this is some under the radar issue either, or it's a brand new one that just started with the HK stuff.

Forgive for not buying the excuse, "oh I just don't know enough about the subject to comment" when I have to hear all the time about how progressive and woke you are on social issues. It just so happens that when it is on a subject that can cost you big time money, that is when you are quiet on the subject. But if it's a subject that can get you a ton of retweets and social popularity points, no hesitation to say something. All this stuff is just fake virtue signaling in my opinion.

Rachel and Steve =/= NBA. In a clash between morality and money, money usually wins.

NBA takes away all star game from Charlotte because of trans bathroom bill. While at the same time talking to Dubai trying to maybe set up a connection so maybe they can get games there. Homosexuality is illegal in UAE.

I mean if that isn't the definition of hypocrisy and virtue signaling, I don't know what is then.

It's all for marketing and could also be financially motivated; like a majority of the companies that put a rainbow flag up for a month — it's good for business depending on the market you serve. Again, my advice: Don't ever put too much loyalty in a brand. A lot of these companies that seem to be doing things for the betterment of society actually are driven by money and ulterior motives. And when money and morality clash, money usually wins.

[Duke4life831]

Rachel and Steve =/= NBA. In a clash between morality and money, money usually wins.

NBA takes away all star game from Charlotte because of trans bathroom bill. While at the same time talking to Dubai trying to maybe set up a connection so maybe they can get games there. Homosexuality is illegal in UAE.

I mean if that isn't the definition of hypocrisy and virtue signaling, I don't know what is then.

It's all for marketing and could also be financially motivated; like a majority of the companies that put a rainbow flag up for a month — it's good for business depending on the market you serve. Again, my advice: Don't ever put too much loyalty in a brand. A lot of these companies that seem to be doing things for the betterment of society actually are driven by money and ulterior motives. And when money and morality clash, money usually wins.

Oh I agree 100%. I didn't actually believe that the NBA was the truly progressive institution. I'm just having a jolly time sitting back watching the light being shine on how they're just like every other corporation.

[E-Balla]

The problem is even if we take your premise, "Imperialism is bad and all other arguments must flow from this," the conclusion you draw is not compatible with your starting premise.

I was talking Western imperialism actually. Just got tired of typing the extra word there. At the end of the day the people should choose for themselves in an ideal world but the world isn't ideal. Right now American defense of HK comes off like a defense of European world power. Plus like I said what's the end goal with getting involved here?

Rule: Imperialism is bad and all other arguments must flow from this
Assumption #1: Territorial borders must revert to pre-Imperialist lines (I assume we're just ignoring that at some point, Imperialism had to occur to create these giant territories in the first place, it seems arbitrary to say anything pre-Qing is off limits, but whatever, pre-Western Imperialism borders by your rules)
Assumption #2: Any government aided by Imperialist countries is illegitimate

We then can only conclude
1. Hong Kong belongs to "China"
2. The last government unaided by Imperialists in its establishment as government of China is the KMT
3. The KMT were violently overthrown by the CPC who were aided by Imperialist interests (Soviets)

We can only conclude that Hong Kong, and China, rightfully belong to the government of Taiwan.

And not that it matters, since we don't actually care what the people actually living in Hong Kong think, but I bet they'd vote to join Taiwan in a heartbeat over PRC.

If they wanted to that's on them. I think Taiwan should be allowed freedom too but I wholly recognize that's me projecting my own Western ideals onto Chinese people. My whole position was I don't feel it's my place to pick a side between Chinese authoritarianism and Western imperialism. You won't get a defense of Xi here.

[alebaba]

People reading propaganda and thinking its facts.....Put up some real sources not some lame articles or just shut up about it...

[eminence]

speaking of ignorance, save us your drive by one liners that add nothing to the discussion.

You think you have added to the discussion with your rants? You are more ignorant than first appeared.

i'm ignorant because I am highlighting people were more outraged over a trans bathroom issue than what's happening in Xinjuang and the hypocrisy behind calls of 'freedom' for HK?

go away.

Maybe people were 'more' outraged because they felt their outrage could help with some issues and not others.

[Buckeye-NBAFan]

Plus like I said what's the end goal with getting involved here?

Well that was my original point before you took us down this rabbit hole of Imperialism. Morey's just a private American citizen. There is no getting involved. For all we know, he was eating a bowl of after dinner ice cream suffering the net trying to keep up on world affairs and he accidentally hit the like button, then deleted it. He might feel that way, but there's no evidence this was part of some vast government conspiracy paid for by Soros and CNN to overthrow Trump and pin it on the Chinese.

And now a $4,000,000,000 NBA Chinese venture is cancelled (for now, they'll bring it back at some point I assume).

[clyde21]

You think you have added to the discussion with your rants? You are more ignorant than first appeared.

i'm ignorant because I am highlighting people were more outraged over a trans bathroom issue than what's happening in Xinjuang and the hypocrisy behind calls of 'freedom' for HK?

go away.

Maybe people were 'more' outraged because they felt their outrage could help with some issues and not others.

sorry, that's not how it works. the NBA doesn't get to pretend it's socially woke and progressive on the trans bathroom nonsense while simultaneously playing basketball 20 minutes from where China is committing mass genocide.

[JeepCSC]

I can almost hear E-balla apologizing for his thoughts on humans being free, wicked Western imperialist.

[eminence]

i'm ignorant because I am highlighting people were more outraged over a trans bathroom issue than what's happening in Xinjuang and the hypocrisy behind calls of 'freedom' for HK?

go away.

Maybe people were 'more' outraged because they felt their outrage could help with some issues and not others.

sorry, that's not how it works. the NBA doesn't get to pretend it's socially woke and progressive on the trans bathroom nonsense while simultaneously playing basketball 20 minutes from where China is committing mass genocide.

I mean, what are you expecting here? They're a corporation that hits at a slightly above average rate when it comes to social issues, not the vanguard of the revolution, lol.

[Pan Jia Yuan]

People reading propaganda and thinking its facts.....Put up some real sources not some lame articles or just shut up about it...

Real sources?
You mean, like myself?
Okay, here we go:
Couple of years ago I did a 3-month internship for the German and English version of China Today in Beijing.
What we were not allowed to mention let alone really write about:
- Tiananmen Square protests (mention it and you go to prison, period)
- anything freedom of speech related
- any comparisons between China and the West
- any suppresion of religious minorities
- any local/regional uproars that the military fought against (there are THOUSANDS every year)
- anything critical towards China

I studied political science at the time and actually tried to analyze the development of China in a neutral way. I suggested (in a draft of an article) that it would add to China's stability if they allowed freedom of speech instead of controlling it. You cannot imagine how my editor-in-chief looked at me reading the draft.

I wrote an article about a photographer who was also taking pictures of monks in Tibet and how beautiful those were - scratch that. Monks in Tibet? No, we can't write about them.

We had an article about suicide numbers in China and it was only allowed because it showed a positive development. Like, there have been 250k suicides last year but bc the government is uber great there were only 220k this year.

Every public or private newspaper/magazine suffers from direct censorship. But public magazines took it a step further and showed evey piss poor condition or development in a glorious way. People in Shanghai rely on welfare supermarkets to survive? Wow, how great is it that there a welfare supermarkets.

At the time I also found out that Google cooperates with the CCP to uncover dissidents.

What I was surprised about? That they were to dumb to follow me buying weed in front of the Worker's Stadium every Wednesday night. It was about the same price as in Europe and pretty good.

[clyde21]

Maybe people were 'more' outraged because they felt their outrage could help with some issues and not others.

sorry, that's not how it works. the NBA doesn't get to pretend it's socially woke and progressive on the trans bathroom nonsense while simultaneously playing basketball 20 minutes from where China is committing mass genocide.

I mean, what are you expecting here? They're a corporation that hits at a slightly above average rate when it comes to social issues, not the vanguard of the revolution, lol.

expecting people not to pretend that the NBA cares about freedom or human rights, and expect people to temper their hypocrisy when the US has also been just as guilty of many, many, many human rights violations themselves.

[bongmarley]

Enes Kanter has **** all over the Turkish government on Twitter for forever and angered Turkey so much he can never go back. Not a word said

[lakerz12]

sorry, that's not how it works. the NBA doesn't get to pretend it's socially woke and progressive on the trans bathroom nonsense while simultaneously playing basketball 20 minutes from where China is committing mass genocide.

I mean, what are you expecting here? They're a corporation that hits at a slightly above average rate when it comes to social issues, not the vanguard of the revolution, lol.

expecting people not to pretend that the NBA cares about freedom or human rights, and expect people to temper their hypocrisy when the US has also been just as guilty of many, many, many human rights violations themselves.

Maybe Silver and the NBA secretly like establishment China because their "progressive" views actually line up quite well with communism.

It's not like "progressives" are big on personal freedom. They want bigger government, more government control, etc. All things that China has.

If you pressed Silver he'd probably prefer some type of communism. A more benevolent version maybe.

[eminence]

sorry, that's not how it works. the NBA doesn't get to pretend it's socially woke and progressive on the trans bathroom nonsense while simultaneously playing basketball 20 minutes from where China is committing mass genocide.

I mean, what are you expecting here? They're a corporation that hits at a slightly above average rate when it comes to social issues, not the vanguard of the revolution, lol.

expecting people not to pretend that the NBA cares about freedom or human rights, and expect people to temper their hypocrisy when the US has also been just as guilty of many, many, many human rights violations themselves.

Folks can be pleased when a corporation (or other entity) that one would normally expect to do actively poorly on such an issue outperforms expectations. And a person is not a hypocrite just because the government of the country they live in does something against their individual values.

[Benedict_Boozer]

How about stfu and work on zero issues except to provide the fans a good product that's free of political BS? I used to be able to enjoy that.

Amen to this. Sports is supposed to be an enjoyable distraction.

So much for that!


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[clyde21]

I mean, what are you expecting here? They're a corporation that hits at a slightly above average rate when it comes to social issues, not the vanguard of the revolution, lol.

expecting people not to pretend that the NBA cares about freedom or human rights, and expect people to temper their hypocrisy when the US has also been just as guilty of many, many, many human rights violations themselves.

Folks can be pleased when a corporation (or other entity) that one would normally expect to do actively poorly on such an issue outperforms expectations. And a person is not a hypocrite just because the government of the country they live in does something against their individual values.

well, when they expect the NBA to pull out of China because of 'human rights' and 'freedom' violations, from a country that is literally jailing whistleblowers, has the highest rate of non-violent crime incarceration in the world, is currently slaughtering civilians in 8 different countries the Middle East and Africa, sponsors/funds a 2/3rds of the world's dictators...it's kind of rings hollow to start bitching about HK as some sort of violation that we just can't overlook.