The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread

[Dr Spaceman]

Dude just relax. You’re going to ruin Luka for the rest of us. This is going to be like Kobe where his fans were so aggressive and delusional that the backlash actually caused him to be underrated.

If Luka is that level of player he will prove it going forward. But overreacting to 25 freaking games is just silly and does no one any good. Sit back and enjoy the ride.

[Colbinii]

Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.

I can see Harden having a strong argument. Can't see him below 2nd is a premature and not fair to Harden.

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I’d probably put harden 4th behind lebron if i were to guess how the voters would vote. Rockets team record is not great and people are probably not as surprised or amazed with hardens insane output as before because he’s been doing it for a while now.

Sure, but that shouldn't result in a "Can't see him below 2nd"; that implies it is a 2-horse race.

[bran muffin]

Harden and Luka are close enough in the MVP race that their teams' records will serve as the tie-breaker at the end of the season.

Giannis is still the clear front-runner. LeBron should be a distant 4th mostly because he plays on the same team as a Top 5 MVP candidate in Anthony Davis.

[Dupp]

I can see Harden having a strong argument. Can't see him below 2nd is a premature and not fair to Harden.

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I’d probably put harden 4th behind lebron if i were to guess how the voters would vote. Rockets team record is not great and people are probably not as surprised or amazed with hardens insane output as before because he’s been doing it for a while now.

Sure, but that shouldn't result in a "Can't see him below 2nd"; that implies it is a 2-horse race.

Well I think it’s a 4 horse race for starters I just think at this stage luka is clearly second.

I think harden may struggle a bit in voting this season relative to what he deserves. Voter fatigue could come into play but more so the rockets so so team record will be a big factor. I think the fact the rockets have done so well as a team in recent years will be factored in but not the fact that his cast is actually pretty bad this season in comparison to the two previous seasons.


Lebron has the narrative and I think people want to vote fore him. But unless the lakers seperate themselves in the win column from the bucks I can’t see it. Especially with Davis playing so well.

I think giannis at 1 Speaks for itself.


Luka and the mavs have and are far exceeding expectations which does come into play in voting. Then you have an efficient 30 point triple double running a great offense. There’s a lot of narrative for donic. I definitely see him ahead of harden right now somewhat comfortably.

[Dupp]

Harden and Luka are close enough in the MVP race that their teams' records will serve as the tie-breaker at the end of the season.

I think harden and the rockets were expected to win a lot more games so I actually think that’ll be a huge factor. Most probably didn’t have the mavs in the playoffs. So if records are close that’ll be a huge advantage to luka.

[limbo]

Luka is already #2 in my GOAT rankings

[Colbinii]

Luka is already #2 in my GOAT rankings

I had him #1 last year.

Slow to the party.

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[Texas Chuck]

Dude just relax. You’re going to ruin Luka for the rest of us. This is going to be like Kobe where his fans were so aggressive and delusional that the backlash actually caused him to be underrated.

If Luka is that level of player he will prove it going forward. But overreacting to 25 freaking games is just silly and does no one any good. Sit back and enjoy the ride.

Dr Spaceman is a well-known early adopter. So if he's telling someone to slow down, that guy is clearly careening out of control.

Here's my problem as a 40 year fan of the team he's on:

When it was clear Dallas was going to get a high pick I started having Luka dreams, but then they lose the coin flop and didn't move up(Mavs have only moved down in the lotto their entire history ) I moved on and tried to tell myself well Mo Bamba won't be too bad....

Then somehow a miracle happened and 3 franchises just lost their absolute minds and Dallas got him. I was so hyped that day--I'm glad the search function doesn't work here because I'm sure I made an absolute fool of myself.

But then I told myself that I was going to have reasonable expectations. I wasn't going to overreact to a great game or great month or whatever. But I'll admit it was very hard. It wasn't that he was great as a rookie, though he was great for a rookie. It was that you couldn't help but see how far ahead of everyone else he was in understanding basketball. Hadn't seen anything like in in Dallas since Kidd but this guy could also score in ways Kidd could never dream of. But I still tried to temper my expectations.

Then this year has happened. He's so incredible and yet I'm already taking it for granted like it's year 9 of Dirk or something. I don't know what his ceiling is and I don't even care. I'm just so glad I'm here for it. And it's happening for my little team. The Mavericks have had one great player their entire history. Oh we got a taste of Nash and we got Kidd too early and too late and Tarpley looked on his way and Aquirre was a professional scorer, but only one truly great player. And he leaves and a new one arrives.

I'm not here for Lebron comparisons. And he's not better than Giannis or Lebron or Harden right now. But he's really good and he's so freaking entertaining and so joyous. I know someday this joy will probably leave him. But I hope not. I hope not. I hope not.

[mysticOscar]

Dude just relax. You’re going to ruin Luka for the rest of us. This is going to be like Kobe where his fans were so aggressive and delusional that the backlash actually caused him to be underrated.

If Luka is that level of player he will prove it going forward. But overreacting to 25 freaking games is just silly and does no one any good. Sit back and enjoy the ride.

Dr Spaceman is a well-known early adopter. So if he's telling someone to slow down, that guy is clearly careening out of control.

Here's my problem as a 40 year fan of the team he's on:

When it was clear Dallas was going to get a high pick I started having Luka dreams, but then they lose the coin flop and didn't move up(Mavs have only moved down in the lotto their entire history ) I moved on and tried to tell myself well Mo Bamba won't be too bad....

Then somehow a miracle happened and 3 franchises just lost their absolute minds and Dallas got him. I was so hyped that day--I'm glad the search function doesn't work here because I'm sure I made an absolute fool of myself.

But then I told myself that I was going to have reasonable expectations. I wasn't going to overreact to a great game or great month or whatever. But I'll admit it was very hard. It wasn't that he was great as a rookie, though he was great for a rookie. It was that you couldn't help but see how far ahead of everyone else he was in understanding basketball. Hadn't seen anything like in in Dallas since Kidd but this guy could also score in ways Kidd could never dream of. But I still tried to temper my expectations.

Then this year has happened. He's so incredible and yet I'm already taking it for granted like it's year 9 of Dirk or something. I don't know what his ceiling is and I don't even care. I'm just so glad I'm here for it. And it's happening for my little team. The Mavericks have had one great player their entire history. Oh we got a taste of Nash and we got Kidd too early and too late and Tarpley looked on his way and Aquirre was a professional scorer, but only one truly great player. And he leaves and a new one arrives.

I'm not here for Lebron comparisons. And he's not better than Giannis or Lebron or Harden right now. But he's really good and he's so freaking entertaining and so joyous. I know someday this joy will probably leave him. But I hope not. I hope not. I hope not.

Enjoy Luka, his a real talent and the maturity for some1 his age is something special. If he has a bit of luck, he can really take that mavs team somewhere in the next few years

[limbo]

Texas Chuck, stop fraternizing with Rockets fans!

[Texas Chuck]

Texas Chuck, stop fraternizing with Rockets fans!

Relax, he's not from Miami.

[Mos_Heat]

That ankle sprain looked pretty bad.

[GSP]

Luka the past 2 years (specially if this Mavs bench play continues) prolly has deeper support than Dirk ever had. And most of Dirks prime his 2nd option was average Jason Terry......and Dirk still made the pickandpop with him more deadly than any play of that era besides Nash/Amare pickandroll.

Kp has his faults offensively but hes still a stretch big, has some skill and can clearly develop more. Hes already a great defensive player which is far more than u can say for Jet who was one of the worst perimeter defenders in the Nba for a while

Yeah that's... a massive overreaction. It's not going to age well.

Well prolly not last years but this year's Mavs team is def better than any supporting cast Dirk ever had. They just dont have as many popular big name players so ppl underrated how good guys like Kleber, Brunson, Dfs, Powell, Wright etc. Healthy Kp is better than 02/03 Nash for best teammate Dirk has had too. Nash was an albatross on defense and not the overall offensive player hed be in his prime later

Ending the Bucks 18 win streak on the road almost beat the Heat with Luka out too. Lost by 4 in Ot and they were down 4 with Luka in the game before he left. Not even just this small sample size. The play with Luka off the court has been consistent all year. Theyre definitely far better defensively without having to hide him all the time. Hes obviously a special talent on offense tho with how much he raises their ceiling

[MyUniBroDavis]

DRAFTED HIM IN THE SECOND ROUND AND NOW IM LEADING THE LEAGUE

[Dr Spaceman]

Luka the past 2 years (specially if this Mavs bench play continues) prolly has deeper support than Dirk ever had. And most of Dirks prime his 2nd option was average Jason Terry......and Dirk still made the pickandpop with him more deadly than any play of that era besides Nash/Amare pickandroll.

Kp has his faults offensively but hes still a stretch big, has some skill and can clearly develop more. Hes already a great defensive player which is far more than u can say for Jet who was one of the worst perimeter defenders in the Nba for a while

Yeah that's... a massive overreaction. It's not going to age well.

Well prolly not last years but this year's Mavs team is def better than any supporting cast Dirk ever had. They just dont have as many popular big name players so ppl underrated how good guys like Kleber, Brunson, Dfs, Powell, Wright etc. Healthy Kp is better than 02/03 Nash for best teammate Dirk has had too. Nash was an albatross on defense and not the overall offensive player hed be in his prime later

Ending the Bucks 18 win streak on the road almost beat the Heat with Luka out too. Lost by 4 in Ot and they were down 4 with Luka in the game before he left. Not even just this small sample size. The play with Luka off the court has been consistent all year. Theyre definitely far better defensively without having to hide him all the time. Hes obviously a special talent on offense tho with how much he raises their ceiling

They’re not better than the 2011 team. That 11 team was wild with strong defenders at every position and extreme depth to the point they could lose a key rotation player for the playoffs and didn’t even suffer a drop off. Chandler and Kidd were borderline top 15 players in the league that season and then could bring offense off the bench with their super subs in Terry and Barea. The current cast is great and underrated but it doesn’t compare to extremely high IQ veterans who play within their roles and knock down shots and defend at an elite level.

Maxi Klieber is really good though. We already know a big man who can stretch the floor and defend at a high level is one of the most valuable pieces in basketball. Powell has that classic Dallas roll man gravity. They have shooters all around the perimeter and even Hardaway JR has been great for them. It’s not the best supporting cast but it is an insane amount of weapons for a pick and roll lead guard to work with.

[GSP]

Yeah that's... a massive overreaction. It's not going to age well.

Well prolly not last years but this year's Mavs team is def better than any supporting cast Dirk ever had. They just dont have as many popular big name players so ppl underrated how good guys like Kleber, Brunson, Dfs, Powell, Wright etc. Healthy Kp is better than 02/03 Nash for best teammate Dirk has had too. Nash was an albatross on defense and not the overall offensive player hed be in his prime later

Ending the Bucks 18 win streak on the road almost beat the Heat with Luka out too. Lost by 4 in Ot and they were down 4 with Luka in the game before he left. Not even just this small sample size. The play with Luka off the court has been consistent all year. Theyre definitely far better defensively without having to hide him all the time. Hes obviously a special talent on offense tho with how much he raises their ceiling

They’re not better than the 2011 team. That 11 team was wild with strong defenders at every position and extreme depth to the point they could lose a key rotation player for the playoffs and didn’t even suffer a drop off. Chandler and Kidd were borderline top 15 players in the league that season and then could bring offense off the bench with their super subs in Terry and Barea. The current cast is great and underrated but it doesn’t compare to extremely high IQ veterans who play within their roles and knock down shots and defend at an elite level.

Maxi Klieber is really good though. We already know a big man who can stretch the floor and defend at a high level is one of the most valuable pieces in basketball. Powell has that classic Dallas roll man gravity. They have shooters all around the perimeter and even Hardaway JR has been great for them. It’s not the best supporting cast but it is an insane amount of weapons for a pick and roll lead guard to work with.

The 11 team was a better defensive supporting cast for sure but there's a grand canyon gap on the offensive side of the floor. The 11 team was the same one that went 2-7 and -5.9 Mov without Dirk and couldn't score 80pts at home and put up a 90 ORTG against the worst defense in the league in the Raptors fielding Demar/Aj/Bayless/Kleiza/Dorsey. And Caron played 3 of those games without Dirk, didn't win a single one. One of their only wins was against the all-time bad Cavs team. They were legitimately at best a bottom 5 offense without Dirk

Also the 11 team didn't have strong defender at Sg unless we're cheating and putting Kidd in both guard spots. Stevenson was decent at best and Jet was terrible defensively like always and they had to hide him in their zones behind Kidd/Matrix all year. They didn't have a strong Pf on defense either (not counting Dirk obviously), certainly hope you're not mentioning one of Brian Cardinal or retirement Peja who got played off the court against Okc/Miami as one of them

Kidd, Marion, Chandler, Haywood were the only top defenders on the team behind Dirk. I'm actually gonna wait awhile for Kps health too to definitively say the defense of 11 was much better because him, Dfs and Kleber have the potential to be as strong or stronger defenders than those guys

Also the offense without Luka on the court has been good enough to challenge for the best offense in the league. U could say theyve been playing over their heads but theres no denying the offense is significantly better than 11 Mavs without Dirk. Its not even debatable. He just raises their ceiling even higher which is very impressive. And the pickandroll options he has is true which is why Jalen Brunson might be the most underrated guard in the league. He's been looking like a mini Deron Williams out there with the weapons he has

Kidd/Chandler as borderline top 15 guys seems insane to me

Lebron, Wade, Dirk, Kd, Kobe, Westbrook, Gasol, Bosh, Dwight, Manu, Kg, Ray, Pierce, Rose, Cp3, Nash, Horford, Aldridge, Millsap, Duncan, Iggy, Deng, Conley, Zbo, Marc, Bogut, Odom

That's 25+ right there who were definitely better than either

[TheBonzaiEffect]

Yeah that's... a massive overreaction. It's not going to age well.

Well prolly not last years but this year's Mavs team is def better than any supporting cast Dirk ever had. They just dont have as many popular big name players so ppl underrated how good guys like Kleber, Brunson, Dfs, Powell, Wright etc. Healthy Kp is better than 02/03 Nash for best teammate Dirk has had too. Nash was an albatross on defense and not the overall offensive player hed be in his prime later

Ending the Bucks 18 win streak on the road almost beat the Heat with Luka out too. Lost by 4 in Ot and they were down 4 with Luka in the game before he left. Not even just this small sample size. The play with Luka off the court has been consistent all year. Theyre definitely far better defensively without having to hide him all the time. Hes obviously a special talent on offense tho with how much he raises their ceiling

They’re not better than the 2011 team. That 11 team was wild with strong defenders at every position and extreme depth to the point they could lose a key rotation player for the playoffs and didn’t even suffer a drop off. Chandler and Kidd were borderline top 15 players in the league that season and then could bring offense off the bench with their super subs in Terry and Barea. The current cast is great and underrated but it doesn’t compare to extremely high IQ veterans who play within their roles and knock down shots and defend at an elite level.

Maxi Klieber is really good though. We already know a big man who can stretch the floor and defend at a high level is one of the most valuable pieces in basketball. Powell has that classic Dallas roll man gravity. They have shooters all around the perimeter and even Hardaway JR has been great for them. It’s not the best supporting cast but it is an insane amount of weapons for a pick and roll lead guard to work with.

WTF. Kidd averaged 8/8/4 on 36% (50% TS), and a 14 PER...

I mean I loved Kidd's D and savvy. But that's one of the most insane things I've ever read on RealGM. Neither Kidd nor Chandler were even top 40 players that year...

[Colbinii]

Well prolly not last years but this year's Mavs team is def better than any supporting cast Dirk ever had. They just dont have as many popular big name players so ppl underrated how good guys like Kleber, Brunson, Dfs, Powell, Wright etc. Healthy Kp is better than 02/03 Nash for best teammate Dirk has had too. Nash was an albatross on defense and not the overall offensive player hed be in his prime later

Ending the Bucks 18 win streak on the road almost beat the Heat with Luka out too. Lost by 4 in Ot and they were down 4 with Luka in the game before he left. Not even just this small sample size. The play with Luka off the court has been consistent all year. Theyre definitely far better defensively without having to hide him all the time. Hes obviously a special talent on offense tho with how much he raises their ceiling

They’re not better than the 2011 team. That 11 team was wild with strong defenders at every position and extreme depth to the point they could lose a key rotation player for the playoffs and didn’t even suffer a drop off. Chandler and Kidd were borderline top 15 players in the league that season and then could bring offense off the bench with their super subs in Terry and Barea. The current cast is great and underrated but it doesn’t compare to extremely high IQ veterans who play within their roles and knock down shots and defend at an elite level.

Maxi Klieber is really good though. We already know a big man who can stretch the floor and defend at a high level is one of the most valuable pieces in basketball. Powell has that classic Dallas roll man gravity. They have shooters all around the perimeter and even Hardaway JR has been great for them. It’s not the best supporting cast but it is an insane amount of weapons for a pick and roll lead guard to work with.

WTF. Kidd averaged 8/8/4 on 36% (50% TS), and a 14 PER...

I mean I loved Kidd's D and savvy. But that's one of the most insane things I've ever read on RealGM. Neither Kidd nor Chandler were even top 40 players that year...

Kidd was amazing in the post-season though.

In Round 1 he outplayed everyone on the Blazers [not a good team but had LMA].

In round 2 he couldn't hit a shot to save his life but he was as good or better than any non-Kobe Laker.

In Round 3 he outplayed Russell Westbrook.

As for Chandler, I think he is a bit more difficult to conclude him being a top 15 player. He did win 2012 DPOY and played better defense in the 2011 post-season than 2012.

I also think we could look at the 2011 season and say "I would rather have Chandler next to Dirk than LaMarcus Aldrdige, Kevin Love or Blake Griffin". I probably take Kidd over Westbrook as well in that regard.
Does this make Kidd and Chandler top 15 players? No.
Does it make Kidd and Chandler top 15 fits or picks next to Dirk? I can see an argument.

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[Dr Spaceman]

Luka has the best inside out dribble this side of Kemba Walker. It’s ridiculous how he just wastes people with that move and is one of the best secret weapons in the league qnd why he clears space for the step back so easily.

[thekdog34]

He seems to take a lot of 3s for a guy who isn't a very good 3pt shooter?