2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 3)

[Richard4444]

They can choose their G League teams or they would have to participate of the G League draft?

I guess they choose it. I trust shams

Read on Twitter

?s=20

I did some research. Technically they will not play in G-League but for a California new team that will play10-12 exhibitions games against GLeague teams and international matches.

[moocow007]

They can choose their G League teams or they would have to participate of the G League draft?

I guess they choose it. I trust shams

Read on Twitter

?s=20

I did some research. Technically they will not play in G-League but for a California new team that will play10-12 exhibitions games against GLeague teams and international matches.

This is basically a domestic version of what LaMelo Ball did. You're not allowed to declare for the NBA Draft but nothing says you can't "showcase" elsewhere instead of going to college. You get to pretty much dictate your own terms and do what you think is right instead of having to cowtail to college programs that put heavy restrictions on what you can and can't do, minutes, roles, money, etc. I'm sure that he'll have significant preferential treatment.

[moocow007]

Another thing that really bothers me is the dude apparently got a bone bruise in his foot and just left the team and the country without saying a word to anybody. His teammates didn't know he left, his coaches didn't know he left, they found out about it through the media. Obviously his camp instructed him to just pack and leave. Then soon after that he's a co-owner of the team?

There's just too much selfishness, branding, marketing and business priorities that comes with him and that family that I just don't like.

The great Bulls teams of the Jordan era as well as the Bad Boys Pistons had some of the biggest and most selfish **** and pricks in the history of the game. Ultimately if the guy can play in the NBA and help his team win I don't honestly care if he's an axe murderer, a bigot, cross dresser, whatever...that **** isn't what the Knicks need him for. So the question is, can LaMelo Ball help the Knicks team win and become what they have been trying to become for over 2 decades...at least better than anyone else in this draft. I mean that's the reality of it and the bottom line. We're not picking for the boy scouts here. IF (and who know if he is the most impactful player) Ball is the best guy then you take him. Most professional athletes are primadonnas. Him not risking things and thinking about his NBA career is not really different than most of the rest of these top guys. Why do you think Wiseman decided not to fight it? Cole Anthony didn't exactly rush back either. None of these guys do. Lebron James, if he wasn't allowed to jump straight form HS probably would have done the same thing.

[robillionaire]

The level of competition on this california team will be much higher, the g-league and international teams will be tougher than a lot of these pushover college teams. Not only that your teammates will be better and could overshadow you. So it's a risk, either you play great and it's good for your draft stock or you don't dominate and it could hurt. Basically like how lamelo is projected #1 and hampton may not be in the top 10 now. But espn recruiting had Hampton the 5th best prospect and LaMelo was 21st

[moocow007]

The level of competition on this california team will be much higher, the g-league and international teams will be tougher than a lot of these pushover college teams. Not only that your teammates will be better and could overshadow you. So it's a risk, either you play great and it's good for your draft stock or you don't dominate and it could hurt. Basically like how lamelo is projected #1 and hampton may not be in the top 10 now. But espn recruiting had Hampton the 5th best prospect and LaMelo was 21st

The main benefit is that your camp basically has carte blanche. The same way the team in Europe, the same way the team in Australia...they opened their doors to Ball cause they wanted to publicity and the name to help drive things beyond winning games. I'm sure the understanding is that Ball will absolutely be the star, he will absolutely get the focus, he can do whatever he wants to do. When you get dumped into a big college program you are fighting a more rigid and restrictive system and against likely an equally big ego (most top college head coaches). Don't have that if you're joining the Ilwara Hawks or this new Cali team. And then there's the endorsement deals that can kick in right away and not wait until after you've left college.

[moocow007]

I certainly do like Vanfleet and would welcome him on this team. However I certainly don't want to give him a max contract - and I think that's exactly what it would take to bring him over.

Yeah the only way I'd give him a max contract is if Pascal Siakam, Masai Ujiri and half the Raptor team comes with him to NY.

I would sign VanVleet and then draft Okongwu, assuming we have the 6th pick.
Those would be two fine additions.

I definitely am a huge fan of Okongwu and would be fine with VF. But the contract has to be reasonable cause you still need to build a team around these guys or with these guys are major components. One of the biggest mistakes past Knick teams have done is overpaying players and not being finally smart which then resulted in their weakened ability to build a team.

[moocow007]

Colleges make a fortune off of basketball and essentially off these top talents while the players themselves are restricted from profiting even a dime from it. That is the reason why players are doing this and that's the reason why it appears that the NBA will end up going back to allowing HS players to declare for the draft. The only way to stop this is for colleges to allow players to sign endorsement deals and/or otherwise profit from their talent while in school. Do that and I'm sure a LOT of players will actually want to go to college. In fact, it may actually even help keep players in college. Right or wrong, that's the reality of it. No reason why young (mostly) black men should not be profiting while rich (mostly white run) institutions make fortunes off of them.

[Deeeez Knicks]

The level of competition on this california team will be much higher, the g-league and international teams will be tougher than a lot of these pushover college teams. Not only that your teammates will be better and could overshadow you. So it's a risk, either you play great and it's good for your draft stock or you don't dominate and it could hurt. Basically like how lamelo is projected #1 and hampton may not be in the top 10 now. But espn recruiting had Hampton the 5th best prospect and LaMelo was 21st

The main benefit is that your camp basically has carte blanche. The same way the team in Europe, the same way the team in Australia...they opened their doors to Ball cause they wanted to publicity and the name to help drive things beyond winning games. I'm sure the understanding is that Ball will absolutely be the star, he will absolutely get the focus, he can do whatever he wants to do. When you get dumped into a big college program you are fighting a more rigid and restrictive system and against likely an equally big ego (most top college head coaches). Don't have that if you're joining the Ilwara Hawks or this new Cali team. And then there's the endorsement deals that can kick in right away and not wait until after you've left college.

It probably depends on the situation. For top prospects like Zion they will be great no matter what and probably better off. Some kids may do well.

Not sure how it works, but if they are automatically entered in the draft after year 1 is where it could hurt if they need a lot more development time. You see a lot of players raise their stocks in their soph, junior, senior years and get better if they are in the right situation. But if they are forced into the draft and not ready, could get lost in the mix. But really, it happens in college too.

Just all depends on kids getting good advice

[moocow007]

This young man says the Knicks select Haliburton at 6 and that he has a high ceiling.

Watch on YouTube

This young man needs to either watch the player more thoroughly or look at getting a better prescription on his corrective eyewear. What was his opinion of Jarrett Culver? A guy that can put up triple doubles in the NBA (as some has said) or a guy that can put up triple singles as what he appears to be?

Do you disagree on Haliburton? Or all of it?

My opinion of Haliburton is that his NBA potential is not that of a starting PG. I don't think his ball skills and passing skills are of the caliber that NBA points have. Nor does he have the type of speed, explosiveness and fluidity for an high end NBA point. Net result is limited ceiling.

He does appear to have high BBIQ. He appears to be mature. He's also mostly very fundamentally sound. His shooting, while a bit odd, can probably work well enough so that we're at least talking about someone that can viably be taking 3-4 of them a game and probably making about 37-38% of them. This indicates that he probably has a high floor.

If the goal is to play it safe and find a potential solid rotational player, then sure. But is that really what the Knicks need? Not IMHO.

By no means is he useless and I do believe that he can play in the NBA, but I don't see him as a guy that I would want to have as the starting PG on my team unless I have someone like Lebron James or James Harden that my offense can run through. For the Knicks? Nah. He'll end up being not much better than Elfrid Payton from an overall impact standpoint (not skill standpoint). Not enough of a ceiling. Not enough of the potential to move the needle to any great degree. And not enough of a system or a team that he would benefit from fitting into here.

I'm looking for a guy that can potentially be an impact player in the NBA on a team that is basically dying for high end talent (the Knicks). I see Haliburton as more of a 6th man type in the NBA. Someone like a Shaun Livingston in his mid-career prime? Maybe a Jason Terry type guy. Jordan Clarkson if he decides to focus on himself lol? That level of player.

Again, not bad by any means, but not great either. If the Knicks pick him it'll be like thinking you spotted a quarter in the cushions only to realize that it was a nickle. Reminds me of that scene in Monty Pythons the Holy Grail, where the Knights were glad simply to make it through the frozen wastes of Nador by eating Robin's minstrels. That level of rejoicing.

And yes, I can obviously be wrong. But that's my opinion watching him play and trying to picture what he can do in the NBA. It's not just about college stats or how well his team is doing for me. Have seen way to many "college stars" not being able to make the (sizable) transition once they hit the NBA. College points and NBA points? There's a river between them.

[jvsimonetti0514]

I wonder the if the NCAA allowed players to make money off their likeness that be incentive enough for kids to decide to school? I think that wouldn't be enough to get kids to go back.

[moocow007]

I wonder the if the NCAA allowed players to make money off their likeness that be incentive enough for kids to decide to school? I think that wouldn't be enough to get kids to go back.

I think what would be necessary is for the NCAA to allow players minimally to sign endorsement deals or other business dealings while in school...like any other student attending that college would be allowed to do (like famous none athletic celebrities who are in college do all the time)...or they figure out some sort of revenue sharing. All these guys are on full paid scholarships. Scholarships wouldn't be taken away from a none student athlete if he/she makes a million right? No reason why athletes would be any different. Now if a student not on an athletic scholarship don't meet academic requirements to maintain that scholarship then they have that scholarship taken away and, if they want to stay at the school, they'll have to pay for their own college tuition. Same with these athletes. If they fail to meet general academic requirements for scholarships then they would lose it and be forced to pay their own tuition which, obviously, if they are allowed to earn money off of themselves wouldn't be a problem. Schools would still make a fortune (even if, in a rev share situation it'll be a little less). Players would make what they are worth. Everyone would be happy.

[moocow007]

Watch on YouTube

Y’all like Ayo? Just declared.

That's one weird ass shot lol. It's like the leg version of LaMelo's Ball's shooting form.

[HEZI]

Another thing that really bothers me is the dude apparently got a bone bruise in his foot and just left the team and the country without saying a word to anybody. His teammates didn't know he left, his coaches didn't know he left, they found out about it through the media. Obviously his camp instructed him to just pack and leave. Then soon after that he's a co-owner of the team?

There's just too much selfishness, branding, marketing and business priorities that comes with him and that family that I just don't like.

The great Bulls teams of the Jordan era as well as the Bad Boys Pistons had some of the biggest and most selfish **** and pricks in the history of the game. Ultimately if the guy can play in the NBA and help his team win I don't honestly care if he's an axe murderer, a bigot, cross dresser, whatever...that **** isn't what the Knicks need him for. So the question is, can LaMelo Ball help the Knicks team win and become what they have been trying to become for over 2 decades...at least better than anyone else in this draft. I mean that's the reality of it and the bottom line. We're not picking for the boy scouts here. IF (and who know if he is the most impactful player) Ball is the best guy then you take him. Most professional athletes are primadonnas. Him not risking things and thinking about his NBA career is not really different than most of the rest of these top guys. Why do you think Wiseman decided not to fight it? Cole Anthony didn't exactly rush back either. None of these guys do. Lebron James, if he wasn't allowed to jump straight form HS probably would have done the same thing.

Ok so you are basically ignoring how all of his red flags could actually contribute to the reasons why the Knicks won't become that and might in fact just continue with being a joke and a circus for clowns that let their personal ego's become bigger than the team. From the self centered personality to the glaring weaknesses in his game there are major red flags with him that I'm not looking to just sweep under the rug. He's not that good of a prospect to do so

[HEZI]

Ball / Barrett / Randle is such an awful mix I would hate to actually find out how awful it is the hard way

[Oscirus]

Ball / Barrett / Randle is such an awful mix I would hate to actually find out how awful it is the hard way

Robinson would stay glued to the bench in foul trouble

[jvsimonetti0514]

I wonder the if the NCAA allowed players to make money off their likeness that be incentive enough for kids to decide to school? I think that wouldn't be enough to get kids to go back.

I think what would be necessary is for the NCAA to allow players minimally to sign endorsement deals or other business dealings while in school...like any other student attending that college would be allowed to do (like famous none athletic celebrities who are in college do all the time)...or they figure out some sort of revenue sharing. All these guys are on full paid scholarships. Scholarships wouldn't be taken away from a none student athlete if he/she makes a million right? No reason why athletes would be any different. Now if a student not on an athletic scholarship don't meet academic requirements to maintain that scholarship then they have that scholarship taken away and, if they want to stay at the school, they'll have to pay for their own college tuition. Same with these athletes. If they fail to meet general academic requirements for scholarships then they would lose it and be forced to pay their own tuition which, obviously, if they are allowed to earn money off of themselves wouldn't be a problem. Schools would still make a fortune (even if, in a rev share situation it'll be a little less). Players would make what they are worth. Everyone would be happy.

It's amazing a scam that they figured out a way to treat student athletes differently than any other student. You know they're paying the students that work in the labs on campus. Even if you have the most innovated lab in the world it's not close to being as profitable as their sports teams. The scholarship as their payment is much weaker of an argument when it comes to college basketball cuz most top athletes leave after one year. At least the football kids stay 3/4 years because of NFL rules so many people degrees but it doesn't make it that much better. I'm sure keeping amateur status was important one time but that's gone now.

[RHODEY]

Another thing that really bothers me is the dude apparently got a bone bruise in his foot and just left the team and the country without saying a word to anybody. His teammates didn't know he left, his coaches didn't know he left, they found out about it through the media. Obviously his camp instructed him to just pack and leave. Then soon after that he's a co-owner of the team?

There's just too much selfishness, branding, marketing and business priorities that comes with him and that family that I just don't like.

The great Bulls teams of the Jordan era as well as the Bad Boys Pistons had some of the biggest and most selfish **** and pricks in the history of the game. Ultimately if the guy can play in the NBA and help his team win I don't honestly care if he's an axe murderer, a bigot, cross dresser, whatever...that **** isn't what the Knicks need him for. So the question is, can LaMelo Ball help the Knicks team win and become what they have been trying to become for over 2 decades...at least better than anyone else in this draft. I mean that's the reality of it and the bottom line. We're not picking for the boy scouts here. IF (and who know if he is the most impactful player) Ball is the best guy then you take him. Most professional athletes are primadonnas. Him not risking things and thinking about his NBA career is not really different than most of the rest of these top guys. Why do you think Wiseman decided not to fight it? Cole Anthony didn't exactly rush back either. None of these guys do. Lebron James, if he wasn't allowed to jump straight form HS probably would have done the same thing.

Ok so you are basically ignoring how all of his red flags could actually contribute to the reasons why the Knicks won't become that and might in fact just continue with being a joke and a circus for clowns that let their personal ego's become bigger than the team. From the self centered personality to the glaring weaknesses in his game there are major red flags with him that I'm not looking to just sweep under the rug. He's not that good of a prospect to do so

I look at Lamelo like this

Playmaking/Passing - Possibly great
Shooting - Bad now but could improve into a strength
Defense, Bad now - doubtful it improves into a strength
Then you add the baggage and it gets hazy


But still the ceiling is still probably the highest. I prefer Hayes but if we get LaMelo I just hold my breath and hope he hits that ceiling.

[RHODEY]

I certainly do like Vanfleet and would welcome him on this team. However I certainly don't want to give him a max contract - and I think that's exactly what it would take to bring him over.

Yeah the only way I'd give him a max contract is if Pascal Siakam, Masai Ujiri and half the Raptor team comes with him to NY.

I would sign VanVleet and then draft Okongwu, assuming we have the 6th pick.
Those would be two fine additions.

I prefer to use that max money for someone like Ingram if they were to somehow become available.

[robillionaire]

Ball / Barrett / Randle is such an awful mix I would hate to actually find out how awful it is the hard way

awful enough to get us jalen green next year hopefully

i think they should bench randle use him as a 6th man and draft or sign some sort of stretch 4 that would open things up for everyone better

[jvsimonetti0514]

Another thing that really bothers me is the dude apparently got a bone bruise in his foot and just left the team and the country without saying a word to anybody. His teammates didn't know he left, his coaches didn't know he left, they found out about it through the media. Obviously his camp instructed him to just pack and leave. Then soon after that he's a co-owner of the team?

There's just too much selfishness, branding, marketing and business priorities that comes with him and that family that I just don't like.

The great Bulls teams of the Jordan era as well as the Bad Boys Pistons had some of the biggest and most selfish **** and pricks in the history of the game. Ultimately if the guy can play in the NBA and help his team win I don't honestly care if he's an axe murderer, a bigot, cross dresser, whatever...that **** isn't what the Knicks need him for. So the question is, can LaMelo Ball help the Knicks team win and become what they have been trying to become for over 2 decades...at least better than anyone else in this draft. I mean that's the reality of it and the bottom line. We're not picking for the boy scouts here. IF (and who know if he is the most impactful player) Ball is the best guy then you take him. Most professional athletes are primadonnas. Him not risking things and thinking about his NBA career is not really different than most of the rest of these top guys. Why do you think Wiseman decided not to fight it? Cole Anthony didn't exactly rush back either. None of these guys do. Lebron James, if he wasn't allowed to jump straight form HS probably would have done the same thing.

Ok so you are basically ignoring how all of his red flags could actually contribute to the reasons why the Knicks won't become that and might in fact just continue with being a joke and a circus for clowns that let their personal ego's become bigger than the team. From the self centered personality to the glaring weaknesses in his game there are major red flags with him that I'm not looking to just sweep under the rug. He's not that good of a prospect to do so

Honestly, I'd be more worried about the injury keeping him out than him not saying bye after 12 games. His brother has been pretty injury prone his few years in the league. He also bought the team to keep everyone paid during the pandemic and that says more about his character than the irish goodbye does.