Future Free Agent Thread

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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1941 » by GobertReport » Thu Apr 16, 2020 2:23 pm

babyjax13 wrote:Should be doing homework...instead, here is an offseason plan:

Trade:
Utah trades/Philadelphia receives: Bojan Bogdanovic, Mike Conley, Ed Davis ($57 million)
Philadelphia trades/Utah receives: Tobias Harris, Al Horford, Furkan Korkmaz, 2020 OKC 1st (22), 2021 NYK 2nd ($63 million)
Harris is a more dynamic offensive player than Bogey, but less of a pure shooter. I'd love to have both, and Harris has a big contract, but I really think he'd be the perfect third banana on this team. Horford's contract is really bad, but we get some cost controlled contracts in return to balance it out a bit. I also think that he offers some really nice depth, and that he could be flipped at the deadline if we wanted.

Free agency:
Bring back Clarkson
MLE: can't use the whole thing to avoid the luxury tax, but bring back Mudiay

Draft
22: Landro Bolmaro
24: Tyler Bey (or Patrick Williams, if available)

Depth Chart
Gobert 34/Horford 14/Bradley
Harris 32/Niang 8/Horford 8/Bey
Ingles 26/O'neale 16/Niang 6/Bolmaro
O'neale 8/Clarkson 24/Korkmaz 16/Tucker
Mitchell 34/Mudiay 14

I think we'd have one of the better second units in the league, and we'd have some tremendous talent in the gleague (Bolmaro/Tucker/Bradley/Brantley/Oni). I think your goal in this case is to be the third best team in the Western Conference (we would be) and have a chance to beat one of the LA teams either if a) you get hot, or b) they have an injury to a rotation player. I don't feel like our current roster could, but this one might.


I just hate that Horford contract, I think we may need a bit more sweetener or just swap Harris for Conley.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1942 » by babyjax13 » Fri Apr 17, 2020 8:52 am

I've really been trying to find a trade for Conley, and ultimately I think the one that makes the most sense is with Chicago. I wanted OPJ at the deadline when Chicago traded for him. He's obviously been injured a lot, but looked like his old self when he got back at the tail end of the season. I also like Thad Young, one of the few people who can disrupt LeBron, etc.

Jazz trade/Bulls receive: Mike Conley, Ed Davis
Bulls trades/Jazz receive: Otto Porter Jr., Thaddeus Young

Start Mitchell at point guard, and have the best three point shooting team in the league by far:

Gobert 34/???/Bradley
Bogdanovic 20/Young 20/Niang 8
Porter Jr. 28/Ingles 10/Bogdanovic 10
Ingles 14/Royce 24/Clarkson 10
Mitchell 34/Clarkson 14

OPJ is a career 40% shooter, and I think he'd have a breakout year on our team. I've said for several years that he's my candidate for MIP. Injuries have derailed that, but I think he can scale up his volume a bit and remain extremely efficient.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1943 » by babyjax13 » Mon Apr 20, 2020 5:38 am

I did a deep dive on our defense, and I really think we need to replace at least one of our negative positional defenders with a positive one. The only positive defenders we have are Rudy Gobert, Royce O'neale, Tony Bradley, and Joe Ingles. Somehow Rudy makes up for the shortcomings of the entire team, but one of Conley/Bogdanovic/Niang/Mudiay/Clarkson needs to be replaced. If we do that, we will easily be a top 10 defensive team again. My guy says the easiest to replace is Niang, but was the biggest problem (but maybe his uptick in play will mean he is a neutral rather than negative defender next season). Mudiay's minutes were effectively replaced by Clarkson, who is a better defender, and a much, much better offensive player.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1944 » by Catchall » Mon Apr 20, 2020 3:42 pm

babyjax13 wrote:I did a deep dive on our defense, and I really think we need to replace at least one of our negative positional defenders with a positive one. The only positive defenders we have are Rudy Gobert, Royce O'neale, Tony Bradley, and Joe Ingles. Somehow Rudy makes up for the shortcomings of the entire team, but one of Conley/Bogdanovic/Niang/Mudiay/Clarkson needs to be replaced. If we do that, we will easily be a top 10 defensive team again. My guy says the easiest to replace is Niang, but was the biggest problem (but maybe his uptick in play will mean he is a neutral rather than negative defender next season). Mudiay's minutes were effectively replaced by Clarkson, who is a better defender, and a much, much better offensive player.


A team can usually cover up for one weak defender, but not two on the floor at the same time. It's a problem we have when Conley and Bogdanovic play together (they play well off each other offensively though), and it's the reason that Royce has to be on the floor normally if we play Mike and Bogey. We need Royce's toughness and his rebounding.

A solution would be to play Mike off the bench, tbh, but that doesn't play well politically for the front office, who probably wants to assert his trade value.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1945 » by babyjax13 » Mon Apr 20, 2020 7:37 pm

Catchall wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:I did a deep dive on our defense, and I really think we need to replace at least one of our negative positional defenders with a positive one. The only positive defenders we have are Rudy Gobert, Royce O'neale, Tony Bradley, and Joe Ingles. Somehow Rudy makes up for the shortcomings of the entire team, but one of Conley/Bogdanovic/Niang/Mudiay/Clarkson needs to be replaced. If we do that, we will easily be a top 10 defensive team again. My guy says the easiest to replace is Niang, but was the biggest problem (but maybe his uptick in play will mean he is a neutral rather than negative defender next season). Mudiay's minutes were effectively replaced by Clarkson, who is a better defender, and a much, much better offensive player.


A team can usually cover up for one weak defender, but not two on the floor at the same time. It's a problem we have when Conley and Bogdanovic play together (they play well off each other offensively though), and it's the reason that Royce has to be on the floor normally if we play Mike and Bogey. We need Royce's toughness and his rebounding.

A solution would be to play Mike off the bench, tbh, but that doesn't play well politically for the front office, who probably wants to assert his trade value.


Rudy can and has covered for two just fine, but three is a bit too much. Mitchell is - by RAPTOR - the worst defender of the bunch. I think that improves if he gets switched to point guard.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1946 » by babyjax13 » Tue Apr 21, 2020 7:46 am

RAPTOR ratings have Larry Nance as one of the better defenders at power forward and a plus offensive player (pretty rare to have someone who is a positive on both sides at power forward). I wonder what it would take to get him? Could we get him in some kind of three way where another team takes Conley? The same goes for Christian Wood, and Davis Bertans almost does it as well. I think I'd offer Bojan for Bertans...
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1947 » by babyjax13 » Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:49 am

babyjax13 wrote:RAPTOR ratings have Larry Nance as one of the better defenders at power forward and a plus offensive player (pretty rare to have someone who is a positive on both sides at power forward). I wonder what it would take to get him? Could we get him in some kind of three way where another team takes Conley? The same goes for Christian Wood, and Davis Bertans almost does it as well. I think I'd offer Bojan for Bertans...


Took a different shot at it, I kind of like this, and I think all teams would at least consider it?

Utah trades: Bojan Bogdanovic, Ed Davis, 2024 CLE 2nd
Utah receives: Terrence Ross, Larry Nance Jr.
Utah takes a hit on offense, but restores its defensive identity by adding two solid positional defenders that are still even on offense. Ross' FG% dipped this season, but I'd be willing to take the bet that he restores that as a peripheral option on offense - which he would be with Mitchell/Conley/Gobert/Clarkson. Utah also does the underrated thing by restoring the Clarkson/Nance combo. This is also the requisite yearly Utah-Cleveland trade.

Cleveland trades: Larry Nance Jr., (possibly McKinney as filler, goes to either team...doesn't really matter)
Cleveland receives: Al Farouq-Aminu, Ed Davis, 15, 2024 CLE 2nd
Cleveland turns Nance into some bad contracts and a mid first. They also get their future second back.

Orlando trades: Terrence Ross, Al-Farouq Aminu, 15
Orlando receives: Bojan Bogdanovic
Orlando both massively upgrades its scoring and dumps bad money. Ross was likely a bit miscast in his role this season, so I'm not going to pretend that his contract is terrible (I think it is about even value), but Aminu's clearly is very, very bad.


Jazz depth chart:
Gobert/Bradley
Nance/O'neale/Niang
Ross/Ingles
Mitchell/Clarkson
Conley/Mitchell

Use part of the MLE on a center, and I think we'd have a well-balanced team next year. Upside isn't tremendous, but I do think it is higher than this season's team. We'd certainly have a top 5 defense, and likely still a top 10 offense.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1948 » by babyjax13 » Tue May 5, 2020 9:39 pm

With a potentially falling salary cap and lost revenue, I think this is an offseason where we could see the Jazz try to dump salary. I think that could mean moving both Conley/Davis and just getting role players back.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1949 » by Inigo Montoya » Thu May 7, 2020 6:33 pm

babyjax13 wrote:With a potentially falling salary cap and lost revenue, I think this is an offseason where we could see the Jazz try to dump salary. I think that could mean moving both Conley/Davis and just getting role players back.

I'm not dumping the NBA H-O-R-S-E champion for some role players. We should cash in.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1950 » by KqWIN » Thu May 7, 2020 8:35 pm

Moving off of Conley and Davis means trading draft picks to do so. Both players have negative value. Unfortunately, the Jazz already used their draft picks to get Conley so I can't see it happening. There's nothing left to trade. The Conley move will continue to do damage to this franchise for years to come. If the Jazz weren't media darlings, it would already be considered one of the worst moves in recent history.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1951 » by babyjax13 » Thu May 7, 2020 8:53 pm

KqWIN wrote:Moving off of Conley and Davis means trading draft picks to do so. Both players have negative value. Unfortunately, the Jazz already used their draft picks to get Conley so I can't see it happening. There's nothing left to trade. The Conley move will continue to do damage to this franchise for years to come. If the Jazz weren't media darlings, it would already be considered one of the worst moves in recent history.


I think we'd do okay in a potential trade. This got decent feedback on the TnT board

Utah trades: Conley, 2 2nds, cash
Utah receives: Thaddeus Young, Tomas Satoransky

Chicago trades: Thaddeus Young, Tomas Satoransky, Cristiano Felicio
Chicago receives: Mike Conley

Detroit trades: nothing
Detroit receives: Cristiano Felicio, 2 2nds, cash
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1952 » by babyjax13 » Sun May 10, 2020 3:11 am

I'm kind of curious about Kyle Guy (2way player for Sac last season).
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1953 » by babyjax13 » Wed Jun 3, 2020 8:25 am

Utah trades: Bojan Bogdanovic, Royce O'neale
Philadelphia trades: Tobias Harris, 2020 OKC 1st (22), 2021 NYK 2nd

Utah gets the more dynamic but overpaid player and a first round pick + early 2nd in 2021 to help offset the loss of O'neale. This trade doesn't affect their committed salaries too much going forward (about a $6 million/year difference).

Philly cuts committed salary by a small amount, but it is for a scorching shooter and one of the best 3+D players in the league in O'neale.

Grab Justin Holiday with the MLE, resign Jordan Clarkson...see if we can somehow flip Conley, but if not still roll with him. I think that would be a team that is a bit better than we are now (maybe a 3 or 4 win pace better) that would have the potential to upset an LA team and be better than Houston. Although with Bogey we might already be better than Houston.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1954 » by Catchall » Wed Jun 3, 2020 7:49 pm

babyjax13 wrote:Utah trades: Bojan Bogdanovic, Royce O'neale
Philadelphia trades: Tobias Harris, 2020 OKC 1st (22), 2021 NYK 2nd

Utah gets the more dynamic but overpaid player and a first round pick + early 2nd in 2021 to help offset the loss of O'neale. This trade doesn't affect their committed salaries too much going forward (about a $6 million/year difference).

Philly cuts committed salary by a small amount, but it is for a scorching shooter and one of the best 3+D players in the league in O'neale.

Grab Justin Holiday with the MLE, resign Jordan Clarkson...see if we can somehow flip Conley, but if not still roll with him. I think that would be a team that is a bit better than we are now (maybe a 3 or 4 win pace better) that would have the potential to upset an LA team and be better than Houston. Although with Bogey we might already be better than Houston.


Bogey is a better contract than Tobias. Royce is a good contract too. I don't see why the Jazz would entertain this.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1955 » by babyjax13 » Wed Jun 3, 2020 8:14 pm

Catchall wrote:
babyjax13 wrote:Utah trades: Bojan Bogdanovic, Royce O'neale
Philadelphia trades: Tobias Harris, 2020 OKC 1st (22), 2021 NYK 2nd

Utah gets the more dynamic but overpaid player and a first round pick + early 2nd in 2021 to help offset the loss of O'neale. This trade doesn't affect their committed salaries too much going forward (about a $6 million/year difference).

Philly cuts committed salary by a small amount, but it is for a scorching shooter and one of the best 3+D players in the league in O'neale.

Grab Justin Holiday with the MLE, resign Jordan Clarkson...see if we can somehow flip Conley, but if not still roll with him. I think that would be a team that is a bit better than we are now (maybe a 3 or 4 win pace better) that would have the potential to upset an LA team and be better than Houston. Although with Bogey we might already be better than Houston.


Bogey is a better contract than Tobias. Royce is a good contract too. I don't see why the Jazz would entertain this.


At some point you need to consolidate for better talent. Harris is a better player.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1956 » by ChiroMike » Tue Jun 23, 2020 5:22 pm

What do you guys think about using the mle on Marc Gasol? Would Gasol sign for the mle and would he come to Utah?
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1957 » by babyjax13 » Tue Jun 23, 2020 8:28 pm

ChiroMike wrote:What do you guys think about using the mle on Marc Gasol? Would Gasol sign for the mle and would he come to Utah?


I think it would be great, I think the MLE is what he will be looking for, but I also think he'll want to go to a contender. LAC seems like an obvious fit.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1958 » by babyjax13 » Tue Jul 7, 2020 12:07 am

Utah trades: Mike Conley, 2020 UTA 1st (24)
Chicago trades: Otto Porter Jr., 2021 CHI 2nd

Follow up/or part of the same:
Utah trades: 2021 CHI 2nd
Philadelphia trades: 2020 NYK 2nd (36)

Move down a bit in a draft that may have more variance than normal, drop some salary, get a player who is more impactful when healthy and would give us some more rebounding/defense in addition to elite shooting.
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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1959 » by sipclip » Tue Jul 7, 2020 2:50 pm

This is an absolute non starter with the 1st rd pick thrown in. We need to stop with the stupid trading 1sts for future free agents. It has set this franchise back forever.

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Re: Future Free Agent Thread 

Post#1960 » by Inigo Montoya » Tue Jul 7, 2020 4:38 pm

sipclip wrote:This is an absolute non starter with the 1st rd pick thrown in. We need to stop with the stupid trading 1sts for future free agents. It has set this franchise back forever.

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I tend to agree. If we have to trade 1sts, at least do it for a real game-changer. Porter will not change the fortunes of this team.
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