S&T With New Orleans: The Devonte Graham Thread

[316Hornets]

These awards are meaningless. It's just a way for the NBA to toot it's own horn. Giving the award to a player from little ole Charlotte won't accomplish that. That's why we need a franchise changing talent to make them notice.

[LofJ]

These awards are meaningless. It's just a way for the NBA to toot it's own horn. Giving the award to a player from little ole Charlotte won't accomplish that. That's why we need a franchise changing talent to make them notice.

It would have been badass if all 3 finalists grew up in North Carolina, but nope...

[Liver_Pooty]

Dude goes from the d league essentially to averaging 18 a game and isn't in the final 3 for MIP. Lol. Ridiculous.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

I think that there is a perception that Graham's improvement is mostly from increased minutes. It ignores things like vastly improved shooting even against starting defenses rather than against the opposing benches.

I'm not shocked by this though.

[-Ian-]

Watch on YouTube

[JMAC3]

So was looking at our books for next summer and noticed something about Devonte that I did not really think about that will be super valuable. His cap hold is dumb low at just 2 million dollars meaning that we will be able to sign all our other free agents first and maximize our cap space before paying Graham.

Without getting perfect numbers involved. Lets say Hornets have 20 million in cap space next summer. With Graham cap hold they only 18 million, but what we can do is spend that entire 18 million and then sign Graham to whatever deal we see fit for him. Allowing us to go way over cap to build our payroll.

However the only downside to this is we might get someone else attempting to sign Graham to an offer sheet and be forced to make a decision to match the sheet. So we could save money on the actual deal by signing him to an extension, but that would eat up any potential cap space that we would have.

Personally I think it would be better to not give him an extension, but wait until the summer to maximize our cap space.

[James Gatz]

We can currently offer Graham a max extension of something like 4/56. That seems like a fair deal to me for someone who will be a fringe starter/top end 6th man. After this Hayward deal I think it makes sense to wait. If you look at all the teams with cap space next summer Graham would probably be at the bottom of the list especially since he's a RFA.

[DY_nasty]

We can currently offer Graham a max extension of something like 4/56. That seems like a fair deal to me for someone who will be a fringe starter/top end 6th man. After this Hayward deal I think it makes sense to wait. If you look at all the teams with cap space next summer Graham would probably be at the bottom of the list especially since he's a RFA.

I don't think we'll keep him in any scenario now and its frustrating tbh.

I just hope we get something good out of the inevitable trade to a contender.

[JMAC3]

We can currently offer Graham a max extension of something like 4/56. That seems like a fair deal to me for someone who will be a fringe starter/top end 6th man. After this Hayward deal I think it makes sense to wait. If you look at all the teams with cap space next summer Graham would probably be at the bottom of the list especially since he's a RFA.

I don't think we'll keep him in any scenario now and its frustrating tbh.

I just hope we get something good out of the inevitable trade to a contender.

Did you read my post about how his cap hold being so low basically makes keeping him twice as valuable.

Low cap holds are one thing that makes the first 5 picks of the second round more valuable then the last 5 picks of the first. Draymond low cap hold was part of the way the Warriors were able to build a dynasty along with Curry low salary.

For comparison purposes Graham as the 34th pick will have a 2 million cap hold vs Robert Williams the 27th pick in the same draft with a 10 million cap hold.

[-Ian-]

We can currently offer Graham a max extension of something like 4/56. That seems like a fair deal to me for someone who will be a fringe starter/top end 6th man. After this Hayward deal I think it makes sense to wait. If you look at all the teams with cap space next summer Graham would probably be at the bottom of the list especially since he's a RFA.

I don't think we'll keep him in any scenario now and its frustrating tbh.

I just hope we get something good out of the inevitable trade to a contender.

He can be our 6th man. Or he can play some SG on offense and PG on defense. I really want to see Devonte' become a Hornet for life.

[DY_nasty]

We can currently offer Graham a max extension of something like 4/56. That seems like a fair deal to me for someone who will be a fringe starter/top end 6th man. After this Hayward deal I think it makes sense to wait. If you look at all the teams with cap space next summer Graham would probably be at the bottom of the list especially since he's a RFA.

I don't think we'll keep him in any scenario now and its frustrating tbh.

I just hope we get something good out of the inevitable trade to a contender.

He can be our 6th man. Or he can play some SG on offense and PG on defense. I really want to see Devonte' become a Hornet for life.

I like him more than most. Even before he blew up last season.

I'm just not optimistic on our ability to keep the guy after drafting Ball AND signing Hayward. Our timeline is all jacked up now no matter which direction the team heads. If we're playing well, it doesn't make sense to ruin our flexibility by giving him an extension while Ball is set to improve and quality backups around the Kris Dunn tier can be picked up for cheap, two year deals. If we're not, then trading him for picks that *don't* need a pay day any time soon is the move.

if we do extend him, we're looking at graham and hayward as some kind of long-term pieces here and that's just.... its almost like giving up on ever trying to win more than 50 games

We can currently offer Graham a max extension of something like 4/56. That seems like a fair deal to me for someone who will be a fringe starter/top end 6th man. After this Hayward deal I think it makes sense to wait. If you look at all the teams with cap space next summer Graham would probably be at the bottom of the list especially since he's a RFA.

I don't think we'll keep him in any scenario now and its frustrating tbh.

I just hope we get something good out of the inevitable trade to a contender.

Did you read my post about how his cap hold being so low basically makes keeping him twice as valuable.

Low cap holds are one thing that makes the first 5 picks of the second round more valuable then the last 5 picks of the first. Draymond low cap hold was part of the way the Warriors were able to build a dynasty along with Curry low salary.

For comparison purposes Graham as the 34th pick will have a 2 million cap hold vs Robert Williams the 27th pick in the same draft with a 10 million cap hold.

i saw it, and that's how all second round picks that have value are treated for the most part. he's just worth more as a trade piece than he is to us cementing himself as a 6th man for a team that's firmly middle of the road. as soon as graham gets paid, his value to anyone but us falls through the floor.

what is a first round at best team going to do with a guy that is going to peak around lou will/mo williams territory?

[SWedd523]

I like him more than most. Even before he blew up last season.

I'm just not optimistic on our ability to keep the guy after drafting Ball AND signing Hayward. Our timeline is all jacked up now no matter which direction the team heads. If we're playing well, it doesn't make sense to ruin our flexibility by giving him an extension while Ball is set to improve and quality backups around the Kris Dunn tier can be picked up for cheap, two year deals. If we're not, then trading him for picks that *don't* need a pay day any time soon is the move.

We've been #twinning all offseason, but this is where we're going to disagree.

One of the positives to the Ball Draft is that (if he develops to anywhere between 75-100% of his "ceiling"), he will be a fantastic fit between Graham and Hayward.

Graham/Ball/Hayward... again, assuming Ball develops well... becomes one of the more talented starting guard lineups in the league.

Perhaps I'm higher on the Golden Graham than others, but he's shown to be perfectly capable of being a top 10-15ish guard in the league. He's really not that far from being a 20/8/5 guy and his impact as a first year starter wasn't really that far from All-Star Kemba.

That core can definitely be something good moving forward for a long time, assuming Miles steps in as the 3 after Hayward's contract or someone else is brought in to replace him

[JMAC3]

i saw it, and that's how all second round picks that have value are treated for the most part. he's just worth more as a trade piece than he is to us cementing himself as a 6th man for a team that's firmly middle of the road. as soon as graham gets paid, his value to anyone but us falls through the floor.

what is a first round at best team going to do with a guy that is going to peak around lou will/mo williams territory?

Sounds like we would just be chasing value if we trade him for picks. Why trade a young player on a good contract for a pick that may not work out? The only way that would make sense is if he is just a horrible fit next to Lamelo and honestly I do not think we know how they will mesh together until it happens. Having Graham's shooting between Ball and Hayward makes sense and it puts three guys on the floor that can average over 5 assists a game, those teams are harder to guard.

[wilson115]

He's coming off the bench sooner or later with GH and Melo around, unless we want PJ starting at center. Max projected at $54M/4 yrs. which looks reasonable even for a 6th man. Think he's staying.

[LofJ]

Devonte is our good luck charm, we can't trade him.

[JMAC3]

He's coming off the bench sooner or later with GH and Melo around, unless we want PJ starting at center. Max projected at $54M/4 yrs. which looks reasonable even for a 6th man. Think he's staying.

Will be interesting to see how the guards shake out.

Assuming Hayward is SF for next few years and Ball takes one of the guard slots. That leaves Rozier, Graham and Monk fighting for the other starting role and one fighting for the 6th man role.

I am not in a big rush to decide who fits what role until we see how they all mesh together.

[Chapelchilla]

I wouldn’t trade Graham either
He is a local kid made good and seems like a real leader

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

How well Devonte' and LaMelo can co-exist is TBD. I hope it works out.

[wilson115]

How well Devonte' and LaMelo can co-exist is TBD. I hope it works out.

I think they will on offense. It was brief but our best stretch last season had Tae off-the-ball with Cody Martin playmaking.

Over Martin’s previous five games, he is averaging 5.6 assists per game, adding 6.6 points, 3.8 rebounds, and 1.6 steals. He has been one of the more impactful Hornets as of late, resulting in him playing over 27 minutes per game since February 20th.

Graham is averaging 20.6 points per game over his past five games entering Monday, including 23-points in the Hornets’ 108-99 win over the Houston Rockets Saturday. Much of Graham’s recent renaissance is attributed to other playmakers on the floor finding him around the perimeter in his spots, notably Cody Martin. All four of Graham’s threes were assisted on Sunday.

“Yeah, Cody has been helping me and Terry out. I’ve been telling him to stay aggressive,” Devonte’ Graham told The Painted Lines. “I tell him all the time he needs to get to the paint because he’s a bigger guard. When he gets to the paint, we know he’s a good passer, so we stay ready because he can get us the ball to shoot. It’s helping us out for sure. I just tell him to stay in attack mode.”

https://thepaintedlines.com/cody-martins-playmaking-is-opening-up-a-whole-new-dimension-in-the-hornets-offense/

[MasterIchiro]

I'm excited to see what Devonte' can do as a #2 option with Hayward #1. Opposing teams swarmed and smothered him last season and his numbers tanked. Once again he won't be the focal point of a defense. He's gonna get some clean looks and be relieved of ballhandling. I think he's gonna be amazing.