2020 NBA Draft Prospects: Thread II

[KGdaBom]

You guys are selling Ball short. His shot isn’t broken beyond repair. He has touch on his shot that his brother never had. He has great instincts for the game despite how poor of coaching he has had. If Vanterpool is still here next season he would be a great trainer for Ball. The weight room will do wonders for him as well. He is a Rubio level passer with potential scoring ability that would only make him that much more dangerous than Rubio could ever dream. Not to mention he is a great rebounder and cutter off the ball. He has the highest potential in this draft in my eyes. If he is actually 6’8” and still growing he is that much more intriguing.

How can you watch him shoot even one time and think that after 16 years of learning that shot ingrained in his DNA that it is salvageable

Because I can look at the context of his shooting and his touch on his release and see how it could improve.

His shot is completely and irrevocably BROKEN. Seriously how can you look at him shoot and not realize that?

[KGdaBom]

Jaylen Brown (California)
2P%: .482 (8.1 2PA)
3P%: .294 (3.0 3PA)
FG%: .431 (11.1 FGA)
FT%: .654 (6.4 FTA)

Anthony Edwards (Georgia)
2P%: .504 (8.1 2PA)
3P%: .294 (7.7 3PA)
FG%: .402 (15.8 FGA)
FT%: .772 (5.3 FTA)

In Jaylen Brown's first four years in the league, he has yet to shoot below .341 3P% (.371 career). I am beginning to buy into Edwards' percentages being low due to what was asked of him on a bad team. Put him around better players and his numbers may very well rise.

I remember Zach LaVine was an awfully bad decision-maker as a rookie playing out of position at PG. But those experiences helped him to develop into a quality SG. I wonder whether Edwards can follow the same path, gain experience as a lead ballhandler, main option in offense in Georgia, develop a killer instinct, and be an efficient scorer in NBA.

I attempted to make this same argument right after the lottery. Edwards has about 10 games where he could not hit the side of a barn and it translated to his shooting all over the court, not just from the 3pt range. I saw further evidence in the fact that the Bulldogs were completely out of those games. You could tell that teams were targeting Edwards defensively. Coming into a situation with DLo and Towns where he is not the offensive focal point, should bring out the best in his game. The responsibility falls upon him to learn how to find quality shots in the proper flow of the game versus just jacking up long threes. I still believe Edwards is going to be special. He's built for the NBA.

Good chance we draft him so I hope you're right.

[KGdaBom]

Coming into a situation with DLo and Towns where he is not the offensive focal point, should bring out the best in his game. The responsibility falls upon him to learn how to find quality shots in the proper flow of the game versus just jacking up long threes. I still believe Edwards is going to be special. He's built for the NBA.

Maybe so. But I worry that the threat is real that he could simply be a Tyreke Evans.....a Dion Waiters.....a Lance Stephenson.....a JR Smith. How do we feel if one of those is the outcome?

Tyreke Evans actually looked pretty good at first. Did he win ROY? Regardless I would not feel good if the outcome of our #1 pick wasn't better than those guys.

[KGdaBom]

Supposedly intelligent people, for some reason that eludes me, think Ball is good. I'm just going to write it off to temporary insanity or mass hypnosis.

Not just those two too. Vecenie and Wasserman also have him a top their personal draft boards.

Despite his love here, I can’t think of a single reputable draft analyst that has Wiseman ranked #1.

I still think trade is the most likely result. It’s going to be a long few months till draft day (whenever that will actually be).

Oct 16

Or has there been talk of delaying it?

They scheduled the draft for 10/16/20 when they expected the season to start in Early December or at least by Christmas. Now talk is early January or maybe MLK/Civil Rights day.

[Mattya]

How can you watch him shoot even one time and think that after 16 years of learning that shot ingrained in his DNA that it is salvageable

Because I can look at the context of his shooting and his touch on his release and see how it could improve.

His shot is completely and irrevocably BROKEN. Seriously how can you look at him shoot and not realize that?

Nobody takes you serious when you post like this.

[Mattya]

Brandon Clarke made his shots at a very high level coming in to the league. IIRC he was at 70+%.
Maybe that was mostly due to his great shot selection.
Edit: I looked it up. 69%.
His NBA shooting line
62% 36% 76% 64% EFG.

Get back to me when LaMelo does better than that.

Again this disingenuous dunking is shooting stuff. Clarke shot 25% over 3 years from 3 in college and 62% at the line. That is while being a spot up shooter after 3 years of development. Lamelo takes significantly more difficult shots as an offense creator. If Lamelo improves his shooting his offense will be infinitely more valuable than Clarke’s offense.

Shots are shots. They either go in or they don't. To make them from close is a good skill because many players are not good at making them from close. Since the league awards a bonus point for shots that go in from further away 33% shooting on 3s is as good as 50% shooting on twos. They give those extra credit in the EFG% which gauges shooting efficiency. Clarke in the NBA has a 64% EFG. He is a super efficient scorer in the NBA just like he was in college.

Blah blah blah we are talking about floor spacing. You do this all the time derailing discussion about shooting potential and players who primarily dunk. Stop wasting everyone’s time.

[KGdaBom]

Because I can look at the context of his shooting and his touch on his release and see how it could improve.

His shot is completely and irrevocably BROKEN. Seriously how can you look at him shoot and not realize that?

Nobody takes you serious when you post like this.

I think many do because it is flat out true on this. I've never seen worse form on a supposedly top draft prospect. He's among the worst looking shots I have seen in my 50 years of watching the NBA. I'm not trying to troll or anything. I'm giving an honest assessment of what I see.

[KGdaBom]

Again this disingenuous dunking is shooting stuff. Clarke shot 25% over 3 years from 3 in college and 62% at the line. That is while being a spot up shooter after 3 years of development. Lamelo takes significantly more difficult shots as an offense creator. If Lamelo improves his shooting his offense will be infinitely more valuable than Clarke’s offense.

Shots are shots. They either go in or they don't. To make them from close is a good skill because many players are not good at making them from close. Since the league awards a bonus point for shots that go in from further away 33% shooting on 3s is as good as 50% shooting on twos. They give those extra credit in the EFG% which gauges shooting efficiency. Clarke in the NBA has a 64% EFG. He is a super efficient scorer in the NBA just like he was in college.

Blah blah blah we are talking about floor spacing. You do this all the time derailing discussion about shooting potential and players who primarily dunk. Stop wasting everyone’s time.

Now you're just being a total and complete jerk. Shots go in or they don't. When they don't go in no points are put on the scoreboard. If you think that doesn't matter I don't know what to say. I know it's en vogue to not care about being able to make shots from in close, but believe it or not that still matters. I was right about Clarke. I will be right about Okongwu and Ball.

Until you realize that shooting efficiently from all parts of the court matters you are wasting my time and everybody elses.

[Mattya]

His shot is completely and irrevocably BROKEN. Seriously how can you look at him shoot and not realize that?

Nobody takes you serious when you post like this.

I think many do because it is flat out true on this. I've never seen worse form on a supposedly top draft prospect. He's among the worst looking shots I have seen in my 50 years of watching the NBA. I'm not trying to troll or anything. I'm giving an honest assessment of what I see.

You can’t speak in absolutes and say you are just giving an opinion. Like I said nobody takes crap like that seriously.

Even using your own bunk logic on Clarke’s shooting you are discrediting his own improvement as a shooter because of your horrible logic on floor spacing and dunking. It is a giant mess of logic.

[KGdaBom]

Nobody takes you serious when you post like this.

I think many do because it is flat out true on this. I've never seen worse form on a supposedly top draft prospect. He's among the worst looking shots I have seen in my 50 years of watching the NBA. I'm not trying to troll or anything. I'm giving an honest assessment of what I see.

You can’t speak in absolutes and say you are just giving an opinion. Like I said nobody takes crap like that seriously.

Even using your own bunk logic on Clarke’s shooting you are discrediting his own improvement as a shooter because of your horrible logic on floor spacing and dunking. It is a giant mess of logic.

I'm not discrediting Clarke one iota. I wish he was on our team. He did improve even more than I expected from the line and 3 (but 3 was only about 1 shot per game). He didn't need to shoot threes and he was still very efficient. Unless you expect us to get way more possessions than our opponents winning and losing is going to come down to who scores most efficiently.

I stand by my arguments for Clarke during last years pre-draft conversation. Shooting should be taken into consideration from all places on the court. If a player shoots 70% he's a good shooter whether he's getting them all on drives to the hoop, dunks, alley oops or 3s. Now if his volume is only one or two shots a game it doesn't do much good. I get that.

[Mattya]

I think many do because it is flat out true on this. I've never seen worse form on a supposedly top draft prospect. He's among the worst looking shots I have seen in my 50 years of watching the NBA. I'm not trying to troll or anything. I'm giving an honest assessment of what I see.

You can’t speak in absolutes and say you are just giving an opinion. Like I said nobody takes crap like that seriously.

Even using your own bunk logic on Clarke’s shooting you are discrediting his own improvement as a shooter because of your horrible logic on floor spacing and dunking. It is a giant mess of logic.

I'm not discrediting Clarke one iota. I wish he was on our team. He did improve even more than I expected from the line and 3 (but 3 was only about 1 shot per game). He didn't need to shoot threes and he was still very efficient. Unless you expect us to get way more possessions than our opponents winning and losing is going to come down to who scores most efficiently.

Congratulations you derailed the topic.

[KGdaBom]

You can’t speak in absolutes and say you are just giving an opinion. Like I said nobody takes crap like that seriously.

Even using your own bunk logic on Clarke’s shooting you are discrediting his own improvement as a shooter because of your horrible logic on floor spacing and dunking. It is a giant mess of logic.

I'm not discrediting Clarke one iota. I wish he was on our team. He did improve even more than I expected from the line and 3 (but 3 was only about 1 shot per game). He didn't need to shoot threes and he was still very efficient. Unless you expect us to get way more possessions than our opponents winning and losing is going to come down to who scores most efficiently.

Congratulations you derailed the topic.

Nope I'm using the example of Clarke in relation to this topic 2020 NBA draft prospects. I'm showing the kind of efficiency that will help our team. Ball is ridiculously inefficient as a shooter. Maybe his passing skills will help our other players be more efficient. Okongwu and Wiseman are going to be very efficient scorers. Will they get enough shot volume to matter? Will they clog the lane and hurt the scoring efficiency of the rest of our players. Will Edwards shoot a lot better as a pro than he did as a collegian? My point is we should be looking for players that will score efficiently and limit our opponents from scoring efficiently. I'm totally on topic.

[Mattya]

I'm not discrediting Clarke one iota. I wish he was on our team. He did improve even more than I expected from the line and 3 (but 3 was only about 1 shot per game). He didn't need to shoot threes and he was still very efficient. Unless you expect us to get way more possessions than our opponents winning and losing is going to come down to who scores most efficiently.

Congratulations you derailed the topic.

Nope I'm using the example of Clarke in relation to this topic 2020 NBA draft prospects. I'm showing the kind of efficiency that will help our team. Ball is ridiculously inefficient as a shooter. Maybe his passing skills will help our other players be more efficient. Okongwu and Wiseman are going to be very efficient scorers. Will they get enough shot volume to matter? Will they clog the lane and hurt the scoring efficiency of the rest of our players. Will Edwards shoot a lot better as a pro than he did as a collegian? My point is we should be looking for players that will score efficiently and limit our opponents from scoring efficiently. I'm totally on topic.

Nope. Clarke isn’t in the 2020 draft, isn’t relatable to Ball, dunking isn’t the same as 3 point shooting. Everything you said here is a complete mess.

[KGdaBom]

Congratulations you derailed the topic.

Nope I'm using the example of Clarke in relation to this topic 2020 NBA draft prospects. I'm showing the kind of efficiency that will help our team. Ball is ridiculously inefficient as a shooter. Maybe his passing skills will help our other players be more efficient. Okongwu and Wiseman are going to be very efficient scorers. Will they get enough shot volume to matter? Will they clog the lane and hurt the scoring efficiency of the rest of our players. Will Edwards shoot a lot better as a pro than he did as a collegian? My point is we should be looking for players that will score efficiently and limit our opponents from scoring efficiently. I'm totally on topic.

Nope. Clarke isn’t in the 2020 draft, isn’t relatable to Ball, dunking isn’t the same as 3 point shooting. Everything you said here is a complete mess.

You're desperately trying to win. Clarke is the Anti-Ball. The two players could hardly be more different. Clarke is the kind of player I believe will help us win. Ball isn't. I want players more like Clarke. Okongwu and Wiseman are two examples I gave. If you still can't see the relevance then your reading comprehension needs some work.

[Mattya]

Nope I'm using the example of Clarke in relation to this topic 2020 NBA draft prospects. I'm showing the kind of efficiency that will help our team. Ball is ridiculously inefficient as a shooter. Maybe his passing skills will help our other players be more efficient. Okongwu and Wiseman are going to be very efficient scorers. Will they get enough shot volume to matter? Will they clog the lane and hurt the scoring efficiency of the rest of our players. Will Edwards shoot a lot better as a pro than he did as a collegian? My point is we should be looking for players that will score efficiently and limit our opponents from scoring efficiently. I'm totally on topic.

Nope. Clarke isn’t in the 2020 draft, isn’t relatable to Ball, dunking isn’t the same as 3 point shooting. Everything you said here is a complete mess.

You're desperately trying to win. Clarke is the Anti-Ball. The two players could hardly be more different. Clarke is the kind of player I believe will help us win. Ball isn't. I want players more like Clarke. Okongwu and Wiseman are two examples I gave. If you still can't see the relevance then your reading comprehension needs some work.

Win what? I want nothing to do with your stupid troll logic.

[Jedzz]

Jaylen Brown (California)
2P%: .482 (8.1 2PA)
3P%: .294 (3.0 3PA)
FG%: .431 (11.1 FGA)
FT%: .654 (6.4 FTA)

Anthony Edwards (Georgia)
2P%: .504 (8.1 2PA)
3P%: .294 (7.7 3PA)
FG%: .402 (15.8 FGA)
FT%: .772 (5.3 FTA)

In Jaylen Brown's first four years in the league, he has yet to shoot below .341 3P% (.371 career). I am beginning to buy into Edwards' percentages being low due to what was asked of him on a bad team. Put him around better players and his numbers may very well rise.

I remember Zach LaVine was an awfully bad decision-maker as a rookie playing out of position at PG. But those experiences helped him to develop into a quality SG. I wonder whether Edwards can follow the same path, gain experience as a lead ballhandler, main option in offense in Georgia, develop a killer instinct, and be an efficient scorer in NBA.

I attempted to make this same argument right after the lottery. Edwards has about 10 games where he could not hit the side of a barn and it translated to his shooting all over the court, not just from the 3pt range. I saw further evidence in the fact that the Bulldogs were completely out of those games. You could tell that teams were targeting Edwards defensively. Coming into a situation with DLo and Towns where he is not the offensive focal point, should bring out the best in his game. The responsibility falls upon him to learn how to find quality shots in the proper flow of the game versus just jacking up long threes. I still believe Edwards is going to be special. He's built for the NBA.

When you attempted to make this same argument right after the lottery, how did it go?

To me it sounds like a few guys really trying to talk themselves into this player with whatever they can dream up. Saying that playing with Dlo and Towns "should bring out the best in his game" is kind of a stretch guess, no? Culver didn't instantly improve his shooting because Towns, Wiggins and others were taking the heat off him. In fact his shot fell off the wagon. Free throws as well. Will the pair of Dlo and Towns be different? I can't say yay or nay and won't. But I do know that Beasley just finally got to a team that would start him and allow him to stay warm shooting and it looked like a great and positive thing for this team. Now we are going to throw another ill equipped shooter into the mix to cool everyone off again ala Wiggins? Here comes the on again off again Wolves again if this happens.

Remember when people claimed Culver had a good chance to improve over his college shot? Culver should have been able to pick his spots better and improve that shot, right? I think it means it will take a few years before he's shooting positively, at least consistently. Doesn't mean he won't have a hot game or two. Wiggins had those a few times a season too. Just sure hope he does it from minor bench minutes until he's fully ready.

Who knows right now how he is going to handle playing off ball waiting to be involved by a pass or no pass. "He's built for the nba" you said. I will say this, it is pretty rare for the Timberwolves to even have a chance at drafting a hyped player that already looks like he's grown out of his kiddie suit.

[Little Digger]

Anybody who consistently watched Edwards play for Georgia knows this guy is as lazy as they come..Watch what happens to him after he gets his guaranteed millions..

I predict by 28 , Edwards will be 313lbs and playing for the Ukraine Lions..

[Jedzz]

Anybody who consistently watched Edwards play for Georgia knows this guy is as lazy as they come..Watch what happens to him after he gets his guaranteed millions..

I predict by 28 , Edwards will be 313lbs and playing for the Ukraine Lions..

Well just reading around here I haven't heard such a description. Yours is the first of this taint. Is this sarcasm or brutal honest truth? I haven't watched all his games to know.

[Little Digger]

Anybody who consistently watched Edwards play for Georgia knows this guy is as lazy as they come..Watch what happens to him after he gets his guaranteed millions..

I predict by 28 , Edwards will be 313lbs and playing for the Ukraine Lions..

Well just reading around here I haven't heard such a description. Yours is the first of this taint. Is this sarcasm or brutal honest truth? I haven't watched all his games to know.

cold stone truth..there were multiple games where had no interest at all in rebounding , defending or driving/creating..In fact in one game, Edwards never once went for a rebound (I’ve never seen that before ) ..he still ended up with 2 that fell in his lap..

This kid has amazing talent..I’ve seen the flashes..Maybe he turns it on after getting his money..I seriously doubt it but he’s more than capable..

I sure wouldn’t be a happy camper if he goes 2nd overall..

[Jedzz]

That's what we need, as much truth on these players we can get. We'll see how these others that are already dreaming about him take this side of the story.