Giannis Thread - 2 Time MVP - The Contract discussions

[Pachinko_]

That said, he’d be a dominant center, but does he want to do that?

Well that would kill his main advantage on offense, which is that he can dribble past any defender anywhere near his size. Which is basically what forces the double/triple teams. If he starts with ball at the low post then his fast & low dribble basically doesnt matter.

Unless we're talking about a modern type centre, which is really not a centre anyway.

[paulpressey25]

That said, he’d be a dominant center, but does he want to do that?

Well that would kill his main advantage on offense, which is that he can dribble past any defender anywhere near his size. Which is basically what forces the double/triple teams. If he starts with ball at the low post then his fast & low dribble basically doesnt matter.

Unless we're talking about a modern type centre, which is really not a centre anyway.

Put him in the low block. He’s unstoppable now as it is. Still wouldn’t prevent him from doing his coast to coast one man fast breaks.

I think we’ve learned having him sit and dribble, dribble, shoot a three or drive works against about 80% of the teams in the league, except the ones we need to beat in the playoffs.

[Pachinko_]

Put him in the low block. He’s unstoppable now as it is. Still wouldn’t prevent him from doing his coast to coast one man fast breaks.

If you do that, the other team can stop Giannis with a 6'3 40 year old.
You don't believe me? Watch

Watch on YouTube

When you finish watching i think your conclusion will be the same as it's been last 3-4 years:
"Giannis needs to work on his (insert pretty much any half court skill here)"

If he doesn't have room to blow past somebody he's pretty much harmless, he starts with the turnaround bricks or trying to push through people or pass through half the defense. If you put him in the low post his available space shrinks. That's why we're forcing everyone to become shooters, to buy Giannis some space.

[Beorn]

Dancing around the IRREFUTABLE fact that Greek development coaches are better than Americans.

If this was true, we would have produced at least 1 Euroleague-level player who is under 30 in the last few years.

[Pachinko_]

Dancing around the IRREFUTABLE fact that Greek development coaches are better than Americans.

If this was true, we would have produced at least 1 Euroleague-level player who is under 30 in the last few years.

Well you have to adjust for the quality of the talent pool of course, coaches are working with kids who smoke from 6 and are bald by 8

[Fotis St]

Dancing around the IRREFUTABLE fact that Greek development coaches are better than Americans.

If this was true, we would have produced at least 1 Euroleague-level player who is under 30 in the last few years.

3 Major Problems with Greek Coaches

1. They create too coachable players

2. Almost zero plan body - muscle development

3. No playing time for 18-23 , they believe 23 is young

[Sigra]

The kid grew 2-3 inches since that rookie year vid from 2013. And he’s put on massive muscle.

His body is just different.The shot mechanics aren’t the same, because his bones aren’t the same.

Exactly. 100% true.

And it looks like his main problem is related to position of his back. Not hands, not legs.
Look at position of his spine when he miss and when he hit 3 pointers. I can say each time when I see him shoot is it going in or out. If he is bent backwards he miss. If his spine is upright he doesn't miss. Same with free throws actually.

He grew and lost that spin balance in the process. Not sure how to fix it now.

That said, he’d be a dominant center, but does he want to do that?

That is another issue. I think he doesn't want that. Unfortunately.

[Fotis St]

In 2013 a NBA reporter asked Giannis if there is a Greek player that believes he can play in the NBA... he answered " Yes, there is Charalambopoulos " .... well you know what happened to this player ?... he signed with Panathinaikos a 5 year contract with Panathinaikos who was at the top 4-6 Clubs in Europe. He never got minutes, never really cracked into the rotation, he regressed as a player , he got fat, and he was basically a bench warmer till now. He was superior to Giannis in Basketball fundamentals at the age of 18 but he should have shipped to the NBA. Thats not new, it happens all the time. He was a player like Ingles , that was basically his floor at the age of 18. We will never now how good he could become. EU - Greek system is a mess, basically its like the best teams "drafting" No1-8 ... there is no draft system here and talented kids get lost at top clubs benches

[giannis and 1]

I sometimes go back to this video and think to myself... "What in the hell happened here?" His shot was so fluid. Damn you, Kidd.

Watch on YouTube

The thing I don't understand/agree with is when people say that Kidd did irreparable damage to his shot. Like how is that possible? Did he give him some cursed potion or something? Why can't he just go back to his old form? Sounds like bs to me.

(not picking on you either, unless you're one of the people that believe it)

Why can't he just go back to his old form? Are you serious? When somebody starts **** with your muscle memory and drilling other principles and motions into your habits, your brain learns these things. It can't just forget and go back to the "old way."

Well then based on that logic they can drill that **** back and re-learn the old way over time....

[giannis and 1]

The kid grew 2-3 inches since that rookie year vid from 2013. And he’s put on massive muscle.

His body is just different.The shot mechanics aren’t the same, because his bones aren’t the same.

That said, he’d be a dominant center, but does he want to do that?

This explanation makes more sense

[skones]

The thing I don't understand/agree with is when people say that Kidd did irreparable damage to his shot. Like how is that possible? Did he give him some cursed potion or something? Why can't he just go back to his old form? Sounds like bs to me.

(not picking on you either, unless you're one of the people that believe it)

Why can't he just go back to his old form? Are you serious? When somebody starts **** with your muscle memory and drilling other principles and motions into your habits, your brain learns these things. It can't just forget and go back to the "old way."

Well then based on that logic they can drill that **** back and re-learn the old way over time....

Consider how long it's taken him to improve with his current janky jumper, and then consider how long it'd likely take for them to tear it down entirely, start from scratch, and then drill in that repetition. It's not something that happens over night. It takes a considerable amount of repetition.

Whatever they do, they need to do something.

[giannis and 1]

Why can't he just go back to his old form? Are you serious? When somebody starts **** with your muscle memory and drilling other principles and motions into your habits, your brain learns these things. It can't just forget and go back to the "old way."

Well then based on that logic they can drill that **** back and re-learn the old way over time....

Consider how long it's taken him to improve with his current janky jumper, and then consider how long it'd likely take for them to tear it down entirely, start from scratch, and then drill in that repetition. It's not something that happens over night. It takes a considerable amount of repetition.

Whatever they do, they need to do something.

I don't have a problem with that. How long would it take 2-3 years? Even if he goes backwards before getting better would it really be THAT much worse than his shooting now?

[KidA24]

As someone who grew up shooting thousands of jumpers because I was scrawny and couldn't dribble for squat, this breakdown made a ton of sense.

His shot is really, really broken. Start at about 4:45.

Watch on YouTube

[FlagsFlyForever]

Giannis has significantly improved as a shooter since his rookie season. Giannis' rookie season 34.7 3P% was an outlier. Combining his FIBA/summer league/preseason/postseason as a rookie, his 3P% was 25%. During his rookie season, he shot 10.5% on jumpers between 10-16 feet and 22.0% on two pointers 16+ feet. Those are both by far the worst percentages of his career. He had the lowest FG% on mid range shots in the entire league as a rookie.

[MissKhriddleton]

Read on Twitter

[Mirotic12]

If this was true, we would have produced at least 1 Euroleague-level player who is under 30 in the last few years.

Ioannis Papapetrou
Georgios Papagiannis
Dinos Mitoglou

all established as EuroLeague rotation players in the last few years, and all under 30.

Thanasis Antetkounmpo also, although now he's a bench NBA player. But also under 30.

Antonis Koniaris was in Olympiacos' rotation last season, although he didn't do anything, but he was a rotation player and under 30. Who knows about Vassilis Charalampopoulos, but if he ever stays healthy, he will be in a EuroLeague rotation - he's under 30 and developed in the last few years.

Lefteris Bochoridis
Giannoulis Larentzakis

both have a chance to be in rotations of Panathinaikos and Olympiacos this year and both are under 30.

Dimitris Agravanis was a rotation player in Olympiacos, and he's in EuroCup now, but he can obviously play in EuroLeague. He's under 30.

Georgios Kalaitzakis and Alexandros Nikolaidis look like they are clearly going to be EuroLeague level players - both are way under 30.

Hell, even someone like Ioannis Athinaiou was in Olympiacos' rotation in the last few years, and under 30 at the time.

And since we are talking about Greek coaches, they also developed Sasha Vezenkov, who is under 30 and a EuroLeague rotation player of just the last few years. They also developed Aleksej Pokusevski that's probably going to be a first round NBA draft pick this year, etc.

And if we add in very young prospects (under 18), then you have Lefteris Mantzoukas, that is considered to be the biggest talent under the age of 18 in all of Europe.

[jakecronus8]

Read on Twitter

Trying not to overreact but this is...not good?

[JayMKE]

Read on Twitter

ummmm wtf

[HaroldinGMinor]

Who are the 9 people he follows?

[Mirotic12]

In 2013 a NBA reporter asked Giannis if there is a Greek player that believes he can play in the NBA... he answered " Yes, there is Charalambopoulos " .... well you know what happened to this player ?... he signed with Panathinaikos a 5 year contract with Panathinaikos who was at the top 4-6 Clubs in Europe. He never got minutes, never really cracked into the rotation, he regressed as a player , he got fat, and he was basically a bench warmer till now. He was superior to Giannis in Basketball fundamentals at the age of 18 but he should have shipped to the NBA. Thats not new, it happens all the time. He was a player like Ingles , that was basically his floor at the age of 18. We will never now how good he could become. EU - Greek system is a mess, basically its like the best teams "drafting" No1-8 ... there is no draft system here and talented kids get lost at top clubs benches

Except that's not at all why he didn't develop further. That's just all made up conjecture. The simple fact is that Charalampopulos hasn't succeeded as a player yet because he has been injured for years and years. He literally has had a major injury every season of his career.

So your argument would be like claiming that the US basketball system can't properly develop basketball players because guys like Penny Hardaway, Tracy McGrady, and Grant Hill never reached near to their potential.

Charalampopulous is injured for years and years now, that is why his career hasn't gone anywhere. It had absolutely zero to do with him being on Panathinaikos, at age 16 or whatever. And the fact remains, if he just stays healthy for a couple of seasons, he will be playing in EuroLeague. Even now with serious injuries every season of his career, he's still on Olympiacos' active roster.

In fact, the same things happened to Antonis Koniaris and Lefteris Bochoridis. They suffered numerous major injuries in their late teens and early 20s. That's why they are fighting to make the rotations in Olympiacos and Panathinaikos now. Because so many serious injuries early in their career stunted their growth so much.

It had nothing at all to do with them signing contracts with Panathinaikos when they were youngsters. Signing a contract with Panathinaikos as a young player does not automatically mean that player must endure numerous major injuries.