Nets Going Forward: Planning for Next Season

[ProspectPark]

Dude, he shot 35.3% from 3pt this year on 5.7 attempts per game, and that includes 36.4% from catch & shoot 3s, what are you on about with preferred spot? You're just focusing on the negatives because of stubbornness at this point, when nearly everyone here sees the value of Jrue. I get the point about the one year remaining on his deal, but as it has been stated before, GMs/front offices do their homework before signing off on the trade, and they won't do it unless they feel confident about Jrue being here long-term. And going by Jrue's character, someone who is a loyal, great guy by all accounts, who does a lot of community/charity work, he's definitely not a mercenary.

For $30 million, I don’t want someone whose barely league average in a good year.

I’m not saying he has to shoot like Harden, Klay, Beal, LaVine, Mitchell, or Booker....but for all assets and cap space it would take to get him, don’t you want someone a little more reliable?

3 point shooting is a side benefit with Jrue. you are bringing him in because he is the leagues best defender among non-bigs who is also a 2-way player who can drop 20+ on you in his sleep. its not like he is some scrub shooting 30% from deep on 2 attempts per game.

he is as elite as it get defensively and very good offensively. and he is exactly what we need.

Losing Allen hurts us defensively. Jrue Holiday can’t fix the Pelican’s problems on defense. They are a joke year in year out. What makes you think Holiday surrounded by Kyrie, Harris, KD, and DJ is going to have some sort of massive impact defensively for us?

[ProspectPark]

Since when is 35% from 3 on good volume bad? He's not a great shooter by any means but he's not the mediocre shooter either that you're painting him to be. He's also one of the best defenders in the league unlike those guys (except Klay). But Klay doesn't make $30 mill, he's on a $38 mill/yr contract.

I made a list of guards in the post above. Where would you rank him offensively? Is he in your top 10?

Jrue makes 26 million, not 30. and he is above quite a few guys on that list. he was 19/7/5 as a 3rd option

In 2021, when he hits free agency, he will be 31.5 years old. He will have over 10 years experience in the league. Giannis, LeBron, Kawhi, PG...etc all become free agents that year. He will definitely get $30 million over 4 years.

Your suggestion, similar to the BS Billy King used to pull is for us to sign an almost 32 year old undersized guard who can’t shoot to a 4 year $30 million contract.

Remember with or without Jrue, we are over the cap. In free agency, because we would have his Bird Rights, he would be the only option for us to sign. If he walks, we don’t get any additional cap space.

So under your plan, a scenario opens up where Jrue Holiday has all the leverage, and can hold us hostage in free agency. Do you really think Marks is going to put himself in that situation?

[ProspectPark]

The more I see these playoffs, the more I think the biggest key to our defense is going to be coaching. The 4 teams left absolutely have some great defenders on their team but more than anything, they're getting by with smart and super aggressive defense.

This isn't the cleanest trade but I wouldn't be shocked if we something like

Dinwiddie or LeVert
Allen
Prince
Musa

for

Holiday
Redick

We push hard for Mo Harkless with our MLE. Use our draft pick + minimums to grab some other wing defenders and a back up center. Redick obviously has some overlap with Harris but as a bench guy, I'll definitely gamble on having 2 insanely competitive and smart 45% 3PT shooters and let the coaches figure out how to stagger them. I think the only gamble here is unless we find a really solid backup C - we're betting on Claxton being able to play big minutes when DJ gets ran off the floor.

KD defensively is also a huge question mark. He's long enough and smart enough to still be REALLY good even if he lost a step or 2. If he buys in on that end - like Lebron did with the Lakers this year - it helps A LOT.

Kyrie/LeVert
Holiday/Redick
Harris/Harkless
KD/??
DJ/Claxton

Temple/TLC/Chiozza or Tyler as the emergency guys. We need to figure out KD's back up (hopefully a Crowder type player) especially since he probably misses at least 15-20 games or so but I think it's a pretty damn good balance of offense/defense with potential to legit make our offense unfair.

Harkless is probably the closest free agent to Jerami Grant and Jae Crowder. There are a lot of teams that have the full MLE and can offer him up to 4 years $40 million. Even if he got 3 years $25 million that’s still $10 million more than what we can offer.

Just out of curiosity, if we traded Prince and didn’t get a SF/PF in return...Over the next 2 seasons, KD will probably miss 40 games due to load management. There will be must win playoff games where KD picks up 2 early fouls. So in those situations, if we don’t have KD, and we’ve traded Prince, how would we fill the 48 minutes at the 4?

[ProspectPark]

A good defensive guard that's basically in the 20/5/5 club isn't some scrub. That 26 million a year is pretty much market value, look at what DLo makes and I would take Jrue over Dlo

Again bro you keep making straw man arguments. No one called Holiday a scrub. Tobias Harris, Al Horford, John Wall, Buddy Hield...None of these players are scrubs. The question is are they worth the ridiculous contracts they were signed to.

You can talk yourself into paying anyone the max if you try hard enough. Holiday at best isn’t even a top 20 guard in the NBA, and yet you not only want to trade Dinwiddie and Allen for him but then you also want to completely destroy our cap flexibility going forward.

I’m sure there were people in the 6ers front office that made the same arguments for Tobias Harris that you are making about Jrue Holiday.

Jrue Holiday is absolutely a top 20 guard in the league. He is a net positive on both ends of the floor. Some of the names that you listed over him are not better. Ricky Rubio? Eric Bledsoe? Matisse Thybulle???????????? Let's see how good Fred VanVleet is next season when he signs a huge deal with the Knicks and defenses are keying in on him. I don't buy the idea that Holiday is not among the leagues best guards at all.

Also, speaking of strawmen arguments, I'm not advocating a trade because of the cost (and also, I don't think New Orleans would trade for Spencer and Jarrett Allen when they have Ball and Hayes)....but I am just pushing back on this notion that Holiday is overpaid. He's not, that is fair market value. If you average 19/5/7 on good percentages in the NBA, you are going to be paid north of 25 million dollars. That's just the reality of the landscape. Now, in a post COVID economy, contracts may be scaled back going forward, but right now he's paid what he's worth.

I asked where would would you rank him among guards and then provided a list. Where did I say he’s better than everyone on that list? I even wrote “not in order” to avoid any confusion lol.

[ProspectPark]

Dinwiddie has everything we need to play the starting 2 next year:

-long, 6’6, high IQ, high energy, athletic
-can make catch and shoot 3’s (37% last year)
-can attack the basket, create his own shot, run in transition
-elite at running PnR (Top 5 last season)
-elite playmaking. Imagine all the easy looks KD, Kyrie, and Harris will get. Plus he’s great at throwing lobs to Allen and DJ
-long, quick, and athletic enough to guard 1-3
-already has chemistry with everyone on the team

Read on Twitter

Trading Dinwiddie for Holiday is a massive downgrade on offense. Jarrett Allen gives us more on defense than Jrue Holiday ever could.

Also Pels don’t need Dinwiddie or Allen so there is nothing stopping them from re-routing Dinwiddie to Philly and Jarrett Allen and his $4 million salary to Boston. So now two of our competitors just got stronger. This trade will never happen.

[Prokorov]

For $30 million, I don’t want someone whose barely league average in a good year.

I’m not saying he has to shoot like Harden, Klay, Beal, LaVine, Mitchell, or Booker....but for all assets and cap space it would take to get him, don’t you want someone a little more reliable?

3 point shooting is a side benefit with Jrue. you are bringing him in because he is the leagues best defender among non-bigs who is also a 2-way player who can drop 20+ on you in his sleep. its not like he is some scrub shooting 30% from deep on 2 attempts per game.

he is as elite as it get defensively and very good offensively. and he is exactly what we need.

Losing Allen hurts us defensively. Jrue Holiday can’t fix the Pelican’s problems on defense. They are a joke year in year out. What makes you think Holiday surrounded by Kyrie, Harris, KD, and DJ is going to have some sort of massive impact defensively for us?

Because he is so elite on that end. the pelicans would be even worse defensively without him. we know this because we he is off the floor they are even worse, by a large margin

[MrDollarBills]

Dinwiddie has everything we need to play the starting 2 next year:

-long, 6’6, high IQ, high energy, athletic
-can make catch and shoot 3’s (37% last year)
-can attack the basket, create his own shot, run in transition
-elite at running PnR (Top 5 last season)
-elite playmaking. Imagine all the easy looks KD, Kyrie, and Harris will get. Plus he’s great at throwing lobs to Allen and DJ
-long, quick, and athletic enough to guard 1-3
-already has chemistry with everyone on the team

Read on Twitter

Trading Dinwiddie for Holiday is a massive downgrade on offense. Jarrett Allen gives us more on defense than Jrue Holiday ever could.

Also Pels don’t need Dinwiddie or Allen so there is nothing stopping them from re-routing Dinwiddie to Philly and Jarrett Allen and his $4 million salary to Boston. So now two of our competitors just got stronger. This trade will never happen.

Your last point is what I've been saying. New Orleans has no reason to trade Holiday to us. We have nothing they want. They have Ball and Hayes on controlled deals. This whole argument is a waste of time.

Also, I'm advocating rolling the dice on the roster as is + MLE, #19 and vet min bargains. We have a ton of depth at every position. Why change it now? Our 2nd unit is dangerous.

[ProspectPark]

3 point shooting is a side benefit with Jrue. you are bringing him in because he is the leagues best defender among non-bigs who is also a 2-way player who can drop 20+ on you in his sleep. its not like he is some scrub shooting 30% from deep on 2 attempts per game.

he is as elite as it get defensively and very good offensively. and he is exactly what we need.

Losing Allen hurts us defensively. Jrue Holiday can’t fix the Pelican’s problems on defense. They are a joke year in year out. What makes you think Holiday surrounded by Kyrie, Harris, KD, and DJ is going to have some sort of massive impact defensively for us?

Because he is so elite on that end. the pelicans would be even worse defensively without him. we know this because we he is off the floor they are even worse, by a large margin

Do you agree that being able to close out on wide open shooters is a big part of defense in today’s NBA?

If Tatum or AD were open and 6’3 Jrue Holiday was running full speed to close out, how do you think that possession would end?

[ProspectPark]

What do you guys think of Glenn Robinson III for part of our MLE?

He played with Caris at Michigan
27 years old
6’6
220 lbs
3 level scorer (restricted area, mid range, 3s)
athletic

[Hello Brooklyn]

Oladipo wants out of Indiana. I think we should jump on it.

Dinwiddie, Lance Thomas, FRP to Pacers. They can have Musa too if they want.

Oladipo is a good defender and good shooter. Would fit well at the 2.

Kyrie
Oladipo
Harris
KD
Jordan

Levert as 6th man

[MGrand15]

Oladipo's had 1 efficient year in his 7 year career. He's coming off a major injury and looked awful in his time back. Wouldn't give up much for him.

[kamaze]

What do you guys think of Glenn Robinson III for part of our MLE?

He played with Caris at Michigan
27 years old
6’6
220 lbs
3 level scorer (restricted area, mid range, 3s)
athletic

I'm all for it. Whether it's him or Mo Harkless whos from Queens getting either would be great. Mo is 6'9 so he's got enough height to play next to DJ, Allen or even Durant since Nash said he would play him at center.

[ProspectPark]

Oladipo wants out of Indiana. I think we should jump on it.

Dinwiddie, Lance Thomas, FRP to Pacers. They can have Musa too if they want.

Oladipo is a good defender and good shooter. Would fit well at the 2.

Kyrie
Oladipo
Harris
KD
Jordan

Levert as 6th man

Dinwiddie is the perfect PG for us. 6’6, can shoot, can put the ball on the floor, super high IQ, great at running PnR and making plays for teammates, low maintenance, can guard 1-3, already has great chemistry with everyone on the team.

Trading him in my opinion would be a huge mistake. 6’6 point guards with his skill set and IQ are exactly what we will need deep in the playoffs.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Oladipo wants out of Indiana. I think we should jump on it.

Dinwiddie, Lance Thomas, FRP to Pacers. They can have Musa too if they want.

Oladipo is a good defender and good shooter. Would fit well at the 2.

Kyrie
Oladipo
Harris
KD
Jordan

Levert as 6th man

Dinwiddie is the perfect PG for us. 6’6, can shoot, can put the ball on the floor, super high IQ, great at running PnR and making plays for teammates, low maintenance, can guard 1-3, already has great chemistry with everyone on the team.

Trading him in my opinion would be a huge mistake. 6’6 point guards with his skill set and IQ are exactly what we will need deep in the playoffs.

Bad shooter and not good defensively up to this point.

Doesn't fit well with Kyrie or Levert.

I like him but I'm not sure he fits this team.

[vincecarter4pres]

Oladipo's had 1 efficient year in his 7 year career. He's coming off a major injury and looked awful in his time back. Wouldn't give up much for him.

Yup. The name recognition briefly excites the fan in me, then I say the same things you just did. I'd love Dipo here, but only on the ultra cheap. Like Prince and a pick and/or Rodi and use him as a rental and depending on how things go, offer him an extension in the summer.

[ProspectPark]

Oladipo wants out of Indiana. I think we should jump on it.

Dinwiddie, Lance Thomas, FRP to Pacers. They can have Musa too if they want.

Oladipo is a good defender and good shooter. Would fit well at the 2.

Kyrie
Oladipo
Harris
KD
Jordan

Levert as 6th man

Dinwiddie is the perfect PG for us. 6’6, can shoot, can put the ball on the floor, super high IQ, great at running PnR and making plays for teammates, low maintenance, can guard 1-3, already has great chemistry with everyone on the team.

Trading him in my opinion would be a huge mistake. 6’6 point guards with his skill set and IQ are exactly what we will need deep in the playoffs.

Bad shooter and not good defensively up to this point.

Doesn't fit well with Kyrie or Levert.

I like him but I'm not sure he fits this team.

Each of the last three seasons, he shot 37% on catch and shoot 3’s.

The thing with Dinwiddie is he takes twice as many off the dribble 3’s as catch and shoot 3’s. With less of an offensive load to carry, he could easily cut down on the off the dribble stuff.

There was a quote from him recently about this:

“With Kyrie and KD, if you’re telling me I get to come out here and pass to two phenomenal scorers and get 10 assists a game and maybe be in second gear a lot of times with my scoring, I’m fine,” he added. “If I average 14 and 10 and we win a title, but KD averages 35 and Ky averages 25 or whatever it would be, like, I’m good with that. I’m more than fine with that. That’s more in line with how I played the game growing up than it is a lot of the other spurts and seasons that I’ve put together since I’ve been older.”

[MrDollarBills]

Oladipo wants out of Indiana. I think we should jump on it.

Dinwiddie, Lance Thomas, FRP to Pacers. They can have Musa too if they want.

Oladipo is a good defender and good shooter. Would fit well at the 2.

Kyrie
Oladipo
Harris
KD
Jordan

Levert as 6th man

Why would the Pacers accept that package for Oladipo? Lance Thomas bro??? I don't even think Thomas is under contract with us once the offseason kicks in.

Also, they have Malcolm Brogdon, why trade for Spencer, who can just leave after next season anyway.

[MrDollarBills]

Oladipo's had 1 efficient year in his 7 year career. He's coming off a major injury and looked awful in his time back. Wouldn't give up much for him.

Yup. The name recognition briefly excites the fan in me, then I say the same things you just did. I'd love Dipo here, but only on the ultra cheap. Like Prince and a pick and/or Rodi and use him as a rental and depending on how things go, offer him an extension in the summer.

He didn't look good when he played in the bubble...I would stay clear.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Maybe you guys are right. Probably not worth it.

Was just throwing it out there. But hes been really shaky the past 2 years. Probably better to just keep Spencer and hope he can improve his shooting in the right system.

[TheNetsFan]

NOladipo.

If there's a Pacer that would fit well here that is looking for a way out, it's Turner.