2021 Playoff and Offseason Speculation - the playoffs. PLAYOFFS????

[Mulhollanddrive]

On exposed form I would still want that 2nd star to go with that young core.

Booker, Paul, Ayton, Bridges allows them all to play their ideal roles, hopefully Sarver is willing to rotate that Paul contract into another after our rookies are extended.

[Slim Charless]

SGA is the other one that has an argument, but he can't really hit the 3 and isn't a very good defender, so I'd probably still have Ayton ahead of him.

I think people would be far more disappointed had we taken Bagley, Bamba, WCJ, JJJ or even Shai over him. And we had taken so many busts when there were way better players in the draft taken after, that I'm glad we got such a good player and not one of those other guys.

Sure, I wanted Doncic, and I did have Trae ranked 3rd, but I have moved on from the Doncic stuff and think Trae also has his weaknesses,though he is even much better than I expected.

Yeah. He was the only other guy that had a case, but like you said much worse defensively and his percentages are all down across the board as well.

JJJ was doing good before his injury but even then I still had Ayton as a better player as he was getting more boards and just as many points while being again, a superior defender.

I think we have to come to terms that he won't be Luka, but if he can become a constant all NBA defensive team guy while adding in the occasional DPOY- I call that a win.

If we can get a guy that can put up a (MUCH) better scoring version of 01-05 Ben Wallace with the added bonus of being able to harass guards, I might even call that better than Trae.

Well, an "occasional DPOY" is a pretty tall order. If he can be an occasional all defensive 1st or 2nd team and be a 12 board, high efficient offensive player, and possibly avg 20+ points within a few seasons as well as be able to stretch the floor, I'd be happy. If he can average 3+ assists that would be nice too.

Yeah that came out wrong lol. I'd be fine with that though I think he can and will go for more boards then that. It was talked about in the game thread but his ability to switch and cover guards in space in incredibly useful and can be a game changer in this new NBA.

Even the Denver announcers mentioned it last night. There's not too many bigs that can cover that kind of space really, I'd say AD and Siakam off the top of my head.

[Revived]

I think that’s a given at this point.

Ayton probably gets a Saric type contract at best. Maybe a lil more at $10M-$11M/yr at the most. I don’t think he will have that big a market either, most teams with cap space when he hits free agency already have Cs that are better.

After the Andrew Wiggins debacle, I think most teams are done paying max deals to top overall draft picks for their “potential” and not their actual performance.

I think that he will get and deserves a bigger contract than Saric.

Personally I think that $72M/4 years would be a fair contract for both sides and I would extend his contract this summer at that price. $18M per year is what Myles Turner is getting, and I think he is as good as Turner.

Turner is a better shot blocker and 3p shooter, but Ayton is a better rebounder and better scorer in the paint...so all in all for now I think they have about the same value in the league.

I would give him more money per year IF he makes a leap in some area before the end of this season, and that is a real possibility, but I need to see it. In that case $90M/4 years would makes sense and we would avoid to go to RFA.

Obviously I would not give Ayton the max or anything close to the max, that is not even a serious option at this point.

Who knows how much these guys will make halfway through their rookie contracts? Ayton is probably near top 5 in the rookie class right now. After last year RAPTOR projected his 5 year value to be $135, or about $27 million a year.

I have no idea what he will make. I wouldn't guess right now either because I have no idea what he will look like after another 140-145 games. He's only played in about 110 so far...and will probably make more improvements in his next 145 than he has in his first 110, and he's made vast improvements already.

$27 million seems kind of like a lot, but it probably won't be that much in 2 years...it's also what Steven Adams makes this year. The guys who make more than that are Embiid, Jokic, Towns, Drummond and Gobert. Vucevic is at $26. So right now his value should probably be less than that. There are not really any other bigger name Cs out there though...a guy like Myles Turner, who isn't nearly as good, who averaged 13 and 7 in his 4th year, makes $18 million a year.

We can’t wait 145 more games from Ayton to decide on how much to pay him though. He’s up for a contract extension 5 months from now. Seeing as how he’s someone who didn’t wait a year to get paid by the league and instead illegally accepted $$ in college, I don’t think he’s someone that will wait a year for his extension. He will want an offer this summer and my guess is the Suns will have one on the table for him if he’s still on the roster then. Whether he accepts or not is up in the air but I highly doubt he’s earned a max extension offer based on the games and maturity (suspension) he’s shown thus far in his career. Looking around at the roster makeup of other teams, there’s not any other teams that will be competing for Ayton’s services by making him a max offer in RFA either and I think his agent may be well aware of it. Probably in Ayton’s best interest to re-sign for whatever contract is offered by James Jones.

Don’t know if Ayton is the type of player to have the drive to improve after signing his 2nd deal either. He’s already said that his only goal in the NBA is to be good enough to somehow secure a 2nd contract in the NBA.

[Saberestar]

I think that he will get and deserves a bigger contract than Saric.

Personally I think that $72M/4 years would be a fair contract for both sides and I would extend his contract this summer at that price. $18M per year is what Myles Turner is getting, and I think he is as good as Turner.

Turner is a better shot blocker and 3p shooter, but Ayton is a better rebounder and better scorer in the paint...so all in all for now I think they have about the same value in the league.

I would give him more money per year IF he makes a leap in some area before the end of this season, and that is a real possibility, but I need to see it. In that case $90M/4 years would makes sense and we would avoid to go to RFA.

Obviously I would not give Ayton the max or anything close to the max, that is not even a serious option at this point.

Who knows how much these guys will make halfway through their rookie contracts? Ayton is probably near top 5 in the rookie class right now. After last year RAPTOR projected his 5 year value to be $135, or about $27 million a year.

I have no idea what he will make. I wouldn't guess right now either because I have no idea what he will look like after another 140-145 games. He's only played in about 110 so far...and will probably make more improvements in his next 145 than he has in his first 110, and he's made vast improvements already.

$27 million seems kind of like a lot, but it probably won't be that much in 2 years...it's also what Steven Adams makes this year. The guys who make more than that are Embiid, Jokic, Towns, Drummond and Gobert. Vucevic is at $26. So right now his value should probably be less than that. There are not really any other bigger name Cs out there though...a guy like Myles Turner, who isn't nearly as good, who averaged 13 and 7 in his 4th year, makes $18 million a year.

We can’t wait 145 more games from Ayton to decide on how much to pay him though. He’s up for a contract extension 5 months from now. Seeing as how he’s someone who didn’t wait a year to get paid by the league and instead illegally accepted $$ in college, I don’t think he’s someone that will wait a year for his extension. He will want an offer this summer and my guess is the Suns will have one on the table for him if he’s still on the roster then. Whether he accepts or not is up in the air but I highly doubt he’s earned a max extension offer based on the games and maturity (suspension) he’s shown thus far in his career. Looking around at the roster makeup of other teams, there’s not any other teams that will be competing for Ayton’s services by making him a max offer in RFA either and I think his agent may be well aware of it. Probably in Ayton’s best interest to re-sign for whatever contract is offered by James Jones.

Don’t know if Ayton is the type of player to have the drive to improve after signing his 2nd deal either. He’s already said that his only goal in the NBA is to be good enough to somehow secure a 2nd contract in the NBA.

You watched his game against the Nuggets, he played a terrific game on both sides of the court against one of the best teams in the league.

He is not consistent enough yet, but teams know that he can make that type of game on any game. They need to prepare their defensive system to stop Ayton around the rim and that is pretty valuable.

Then you add his improved defense and his age and you can not put a lowball offer next summer.

Do you think seriously that $40M / 4 years would be an ok offer? To me that would be an insult to him and his agent.

[Saberestar]

Read on Twitter

This is clear sign of having smart, high basketball IQ players on our roster.

[dremill24]

Its also a clear sign of something that will regress to the mean.

[irish22022]

Ayton getting a saric type contract? Lol keep dreaming. He's gonna get paid a lot, whether you like it or not. Not max, but he's gonna pull in a huge contract and he will absolutely be the most overpaid player on our team. In the range of 30 mil a year.

[sunsbg]

Hopefully both Ayton and Bridges get paid in the low 20M range. Anything less is unlikely.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Well have a lot of time to figure out their contracts and hopefully some playoffs games too and that's where you really define value.

Look at a guy like Harrell who absolutely lost money after a bad playoff run where as a guys like Grant and even Rondo raised their price tags.

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[bhawk]

Well have a lot of time to figure out their contracts and hopefully some playoffs games too and that's where you really define value.

Look at a guy like Harrell who absolutely lost money after a bad playoff run where as a guys like Grant and even Rondo raised their price tags.

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The question for me is can we afford to keep all of our players? Given current trajectories, should we be worried about the future salary cap? Will Bridges, Ayton and to a certain extent Cam Johnson outplay this team? Who draws the short stick?

[wheezy]

Put me in the camp of wanting to wait on the DA/Bridges extensions until CP3 is off the books. I get that they probably want long term security, but those cap holds are likely to be way under what they're are going to be getting 1st year of their extensions right?

[Revived]

Who knows how much these guys will make halfway through their rookie contracts? Ayton is probably near top 5 in the rookie class right now. After last year RAPTOR projected his 5 year value to be $135, or about $27 million a year.

I have no idea what he will make. I wouldn't guess right now either because I have no idea what he will look like after another 140-145 games. He's only played in about 110 so far...and will probably make more improvements in his next 145 than he has in his first 110, and he's made vast improvements already.

$27 million seems kind of like a lot, but it probably won't be that much in 2 years...it's also what Steven Adams makes this year. The guys who make more than that are Embiid, Jokic, Towns, Drummond and Gobert. Vucevic is at $26. So right now his value should probably be less than that. There are not really any other bigger name Cs out there though...a guy like Myles Turner, who isn't nearly as good, who averaged 13 and 7 in his 4th year, makes $18 million a year.

We can’t wait 145 more games from Ayton to decide on how much to pay him though. He’s up for a contract extension 5 months from now. Seeing as how he’s someone who didn’t wait a year to get paid by the league and instead illegally accepted $$ in college, I don’t think he’s someone that will wait a year for his extension. He will want an offer this summer and my guess is the Suns will have one on the table for him if he’s still on the roster then. Whether he accepts or not is up in the air but I highly doubt he’s earned a max extension offer based on the games and maturity (suspension) he’s shown thus far in his career. Looking around at the roster makeup of other teams, there’s not any other teams that will be competing for Ayton’s services by making him a max offer in RFA either and I think his agent may be well aware of it. Probably in Ayton’s best interest to re-sign for whatever contract is offered by James Jones.

Don’t know if Ayton is the type of player to have the drive to improve after signing his 2nd deal either. He’s already said that his only goal in the NBA is to be good enough to somehow secure a 2nd contract in the NBA.

You watched his game against the Nuggets, he played a terrific game on both sides of the court against one of the best teams in the league.

He is not consistent enough yet, but teams know that he can make that type of game on any game. They need to prepare their defensive system to stop Ayton around the rim and that is pretty valuable.

Then you add his improved defense and his age and you can not put a lowball offer next summer.

Do you think seriously that $40M / 4 years would be an ok offer? To me that would be an insult to him and his agent.

It’s more than what Montez Harrell got.

He was great defensively in the Denver game but can he do it consistently or only against Jokic? For some weird reason he averages career highs all across the board against Denver.

And again, based on his personality and interviews he’s done thus far, do you think Ayton is the type of player to stay driven after getting a 2nd contract or be complacent after it? He’s said before that his only goal in the league is to somehow earn a second contract after his rookie deal is up.

[bwgood77]

Yeah. He was the only other guy that had a case, but like you said much worse defensively and his percentages are all down across the board as well.

JJJ was doing good before his injury but even then I still had Ayton as a better player as he was getting more boards and just as many points while being again, a superior defender.

I think we have to come to terms that he won't be Luka, but if he can become a constant all NBA defensive team guy while adding in the occasional DPOY- I call that a win.

If we can get a guy that can put up a (MUCH) better scoring version of 01-05 Ben Wallace with the added bonus of being able to harass guards, I might even call that better than Trae.

Well, an "occasional DPOY" is a pretty tall order. If he can be an occasional all defensive 1st or 2nd team and be a 12 board, high efficient offensive player, and possibly avg 20+ points within a few seasons as well as be able to stretch the floor, I'd be happy. If he can average 3+ assists that would be nice too.

Yeah that came out wrong lol. I'd be fine with that though I think he can and will go for more boards then that. It was talked about in the game thread but his ability to switch and cover guards in space in incredibly useful and can be a game changer in this new NBA.

Even the Denver announcers mentioned it last night. There's not too many bigs that can cover that kind of space really, I'd say AD and Siakam off the top of my head.

And Giannis...he is probably the best defensive player in the league. Not sure Ayton gets to his level, but no one really does.

I think he's great on the perimeter and switching, keeping his hands up, and way better at sliding in the middle of the paint for help D finally, and he his keeping his arms up which make it tough for the offensive guy and he can avoid fouls...sure guys score, but it's not nearly as easy. He still gets called on ticky tack fouls.

The main thing is staying engaged and continuing to improve. I think he will certainly do the latter.

[SuperSunsFan]

can leo and his team plant an inception in Bezos' brain that he really wants to buy the suns and win a championship and is willing to pay any money to accomplish it.

[bwgood77]

I think that he will get and deserves a bigger contract than Saric.

Personally I think that $72M/4 years would be a fair contract for both sides and I would extend his contract this summer at that price. $18M per year is what Myles Turner is getting, and I think he is as good as Turner.

Turner is a better shot blocker and 3p shooter, but Ayton is a better rebounder and better scorer in the paint...so all in all for now I think they have about the same value in the league.

I would give him more money per year IF he makes a leap in some area before the end of this season, and that is a real possibility, but I need to see it. In that case $90M/4 years would makes sense and we would avoid to go to RFA.

Obviously I would not give Ayton the max or anything close to the max, that is not even a serious option at this point.

Who knows how much these guys will make halfway through their rookie contracts? Ayton is probably near top 5 in the rookie class right now. After last year RAPTOR projected his 5 year value to be $135, or about $27 million a year.

I have no idea what he will make. I wouldn't guess right now either because I have no idea what he will look like after another 140-145 games. He's only played in about 110 so far...and will probably make more improvements in his next 145 than he has in his first 110, and he's made vast improvements already.

$27 million seems kind of like a lot, but it probably won't be that much in 2 years...it's also what Steven Adams makes this year. The guys who make more than that are Embiid, Jokic, Towns, Drummond and Gobert. Vucevic is at $26. So right now his value should probably be less than that. There are not really any other bigger name Cs out there though...a guy like Myles Turner, who isn't nearly as good, who averaged 13 and 7 in his 4th year, makes $18 million a year.

We can’t wait 145 more games from Ayton to decide on how much to pay him though. He’s up for a contract extension 5 months from now. Seeing as how he’s someone who didn’t wait a year to get paid by the league and instead illegally accepted $$ in college, I don’t think he’s someone that will wait a year for his extension. He will want an offer this summer and my guess is the Suns will have one on the table for him if he’s still on the roster then. Whether he accepts or not is up in the air but I highly doubt he’s earned a max extension offer based on the games and maturity (suspension) he’s shown thus far in his career. Looking around at the roster makeup of other teams, there’s not any other teams that will be competing for Ayton’s services by making him a max offer in RFA either and I think his agent may be well aware of it. Probably in Ayton’s best interest to re-sign for whatever contract is offered by James Jones.

Don’t know if Ayton is the type of player to have the drive to improve after signing his 2nd deal either. He’s already said that his only goal in the NBA is to be good enough to somehow secure a 2nd contract in the NBA.

We can wait. It's not like he can go elsewhere, but we may be able to get him for cheaper on an extension. If he is demanding a max, we an wait it out. We can always match anything.

Ayton is so laid back he's they type I think would not hold grudges and would want to stay with the Suns and comfort anyway.

Same goes for Bridges.

I'd still offer an extension around 5/110 and work from there and maybe go to 5/125.

Oh, also, he never accepted money in college. That ended up being a bogus report. Someone (Mark Schlabach) believed a rumored FBI wiretap had incriminating info...some other asst coach who paid off others was indicted tried to make a deal and throw that against the wall...it ended out this didn't exist and there was no payoff. It was just some guy making something up.

There were no wiretaps, no money trail, nothing, or they would have indicted Sean Miller. They got all the big names that summer...Pitino among others..even the Duke coach I believe, but nothing against Sean Miller or anything on Ayton.

[bwgood77]

Its also a clear sign of something that will regress to the mean.

Paul is great at it though and likely coaches others on what they need to do to be successful in this regard, so I imagine it will be higher than others.

[bwgood77]

Ayton getting a saric type contract? Lol keep dreaming. He's gonna get paid a lot, whether you like it or not. Not max, but he's gonna pull in a huge contract and he will absolutely be the most overpaid player on our team. In the range of 30 mil a year.

Yeah, he isn't being genuine, or doesn't watch, and hasn't been a fan...so I wouldn't put much weight into arguing against it.

[Slim Charless]

Well, an "occasional DPOY" is a pretty tall order. If he can be an occasional all defensive 1st or 2nd team and be a 12 board, high efficient offensive player, and possibly avg 20+ points within a few seasons as well as be able to stretch the floor, I'd be happy. If he can average 3+ assists that would be nice too.

Yeah that came out wrong lol. I'd be fine with that though I think he can and will go for more boards then that. It was talked about in the game thread but his ability to switch and cover guards in space in incredibly useful and can be a game changer in this new NBA.

Even the Denver announcers mentioned it last night. There's not too many bigs that can cover that kind of space really, I'd say AD and Siakam off the top of my head.

And Giannis...he is probably the best defensive player in the league. Not sure Ayton gets to his level, but no one really does.

I think he's great on the perimeter and switching, keeping his hands up, and way better at sliding in the middle of the paint for help D finally, and he his keeping his arms up which make it tough for the offensive guy and he can avoid fouls...sure guys score, but it's not nearly as easy. He still gets called on ticky tack fouls.

The main thing is staying engaged and continuing to improve. I think he will certainly do the latter.

Yes, Giannis too. I'd also add Bam Adebayo. Point being though there's not alot of guys that are equally adapt in the paint as they are on the perimeter.

[bwgood77]

Hopefully both Ayton and Bridges get paid in the low 20M range. Anything less is unlikely.

It will likely be a bit more if they continue to get better...especially if the cap goes up, but the cap may remain stagnant since they kept it stagnant when it should have gone down.

This gives the team more leverage. They don't strike me as much as demaning maxes...I don't even think they demand as much as Oubre would have had he stayed.

They seem more like guys who would just want to get a deal made and put it behind them. I wouldn't low ball them but offer fair deals.

I think they only for sure maxes will be Trae and Doncic and with those #s, I don't think they can argue they should get more...their agents....maybe they get something similar to SGA or a little more. Hopefully SGA doesn't get a max...OKC can certainly afford it.

[bwgood77]

Well have a lot of time to figure out their contracts and hopefully some playoffs games too and that's where you really define value.

Look at a guy like Harrell who absolutely lost money after a bad playoff run where as a guys like Grant and even Rondo raised their price tags.

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The question for me is can we afford to keep all of our players? Given current trajectories, should we be worried about the future salary cap? Will Bridges, Ayton and to a certain extent Cam Johnson outplay this team? Who draws the short stick?

Yes, with Paul coming off when their extensions kick in, that is $45 coming off. Lets say Ayton and Bridges even go up to a combined $50 a year. This will go up from $18 the previous year combined.

So $32 million more. And even if those guys avg $25 on a contract, it likely starts lower with raises.

So we would actually shave money with Paul expiring and even going up all the way to $25 each...and have leftover to go after a PG or re-sign Paul..maybe sign Rubio.

Then Crowder and Saric exprire ($19 million) when Cam is up for extension. Oh, and Carter, so that's like $23 total coming off.

Then hopefully we have a core of Booker, Bridges, Cam and Ayton and a few guys on rookie contracts...Jalen Smith and whoever we draft next summer.

Then probably our 22 pick conveys to OKC (hopefully) if we make the playoffs and we get our first rounders going forward.

Then maybe we have some cheaper players like Payne and Saric.