Who are we even trying to build around?

[WargamesX]

We are where Philly was before they drafted Embiid. We need to keep trying to hit in the lottery

Were really not tho... they capitalized on the lottery system of old where there was more incentive to finish the worst you can and have pretty good chances at a top 3 pick (and largely might be the reason why the system is different now). We can follow that model but the odds are drastically different now and being the worst team in the league is no longer a guaranteed pick of the cream of the crop in the draft. In addition to that we aren’t actually actively trying to put out the worst product we can... we’ll maybe we are idk how else to explain why we seem to be putting together rosters better suited for 90s style basketball while everyone else is bombs away from 3 at decent clips

That’s fair but the new option then is to try and acquire multiple 1st rounders. Basically to increase your odds in the more flat lined lottery as well as to hopefully get a good player that drops. Randle or RJ (more likely Randle) could get that for us. The fit is bad between as well.

The smart move is the Knicks need to trade one of them. Randle won’t get you 4 first rounders but he is definitely worth 1.

[3toheadmelo]

Don’t see why he can’t fit on a contender. The guy is a scoring machine, plays defense now, and a great facilitator. If guys like Sabonis and Jokic can have big roles on playoffs teams then so can Randle. He basically does the same things as them.

Prejudice is all. Randle plays a similar style to Sabonis with better defence. Put him with a star backcourt player and defensive 5 and he can contend.

So Knicks get a star back court player and we're fine.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

Imagine how good a team could be if they had Anthony Davis, Jrue Holiday and Julius Randle



Randle been a loser his entire career, and he's still a loser now, putting up empty stats like a madman, how is he any different than Andre Drummond? I know one difference actually, and it's that Drummond actually got his team to the playoffs a couple times.


Wanting to build around Randle is the most Knick thing ever, imagine we win the lottery and Cade has to play off the ball cause it's Randles team

Imagine how good a team would be with Christian Wood, John Wall and James Harden.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Prejudice is all. Randle plays a similar style to Sabonis with better defence. Put him with a star backcourt player and defensive 5 and he can contend.

So Knicks get a star back court player and we're fine.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

Imagine how good a team could be if they had Anthony Davis, Jrue Holiday and Julius Randle



Randle been a loser his entire career, and he's still a loser now, putting up empty stats like a madman, how is he any different than Andre Drummond? I know one difference actually, and it's that Drummond actually got his team to the playoffs a couple times.


Wanting to build around Randle is the most Knick thing ever, imagine we win the lottery and Cade has to play off the ball cause it's Randles team

Imagine how good a team would be with Christian Wood, John Wall and James Harden.

The Rockets and their fans aren't talking about giving Wood a max and making him their franchise player, imagine how crazy it would be if people wanted to build around Wood

[3toheadmelo]

Imagine how good a team could be if they had Anthony Davis, Jrue Holiday and Julius Randle



Randle been a loser his entire career, and he's still a loser now, putting up empty stats like a madman, how is he any different than Andre Drummond? I know one difference actually, and it's that Drummond actually got his team to the playoffs a couple times.


Wanting to build around Randle is the most Knick thing ever, imagine we win the lottery and Cade has to play off the ball cause it's Randles team

Imagine how good a team would be with Christian Wood, John Wall and James Harden.

The Rockets and their fans aren't talking about giving Wood a max and making him their franchise player, imagine how crazy it would be if people wanted to build around Wood

Wood is so bad Harden said **** this I’m out

But fr nobody here is acting like Randle is like a franchise player. He’s just a good young piece to keep around. Our front court isn’t really the Knicks problems... it’s our guards.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Imagine how good a team would be with Christian Wood, John Wall and James Harden.

The Rockets and their fans aren't talking about giving Wood a max and making him their franchise player, imagine how crazy it would be if people wanted to build around Wood

Wood is so bad Harden said **** this I’m out

But fr nobody here is acting like Randle is like a franchise player. He’s just a good young piece to keep around. Our front court isn’t really the Knicks problems... it’s our guards.

Nah, Harden just wanted to be with Little Mountain and go to Starlets & Sue's Rendezvous when they reopen.

Come on man, there's people talking about maxing out Julius in the trade Payton or Randle thread, that is nuts. If we had better guards Randles stats would drop and he'd have to take more threes as the ball would be in their hands more. If we were to draft Cade or Suggs, how do you think that's going to work, do you really think Randle should have the ball even half as much as he has it now?

[3toheadmelo]

The Rockets and their fans aren't talking about giving Wood a max and making him their franchise player, imagine how crazy it would be if people wanted to build around Wood

Wood is so bad Harden said **** this I’m out

But fr nobody here is acting like Randle is like a franchise player. He’s just a good young piece to keep around. Our front court isn’t really the Knicks problems... it’s our guards.

Nah, Harden just wanted to be with Little Mountain and go to Starlets & Sue's Rendezvous when they reopen.

Come on man, there's people talking about maxing out Julius in the trade Payton or Randle thread, that is nuts. If we had better guards Randles stats would drop and he'd have to take more threes as the ball would be in their hands more. If we were to draft Cade or Suggs, how do you think that's going to work, do you really think Randle should have the ball even half as much as he has it now?

You don’t have to relegate Randle as a spot up shooter with better guards. He can set picks and roll to the rim or pick and pop. Cut to the rim, etc. We don’t see much of that cause our guards suck.

I still think you’re over exaggerating the usage with Randle though. Your boy Wood actually has basically the same usage as Randle even though he plays next to Wall and Harden lol. Wood’s is 27.4 while Randle is 27.7. Randle’s usage is actually the same as the last 3 years (27.8, 27.6, 27.7). If anything this just shows how much his game has grown, while basically getting the same amount of touches the last couple of years.

[god shammgod]

sue's rendezvous been closed for years

[NoDopeOnSundays]

Wood is so bad Harden said **** this I’m out

But fr nobody here is acting like Randle is like a franchise player. He’s just a good young piece to keep around. Our front court isn’t really the Knicks problems... it’s our guards.

Nah, Harden just wanted to be with Little Mountain and go to Starlets & Sue's Rendezvous when they reopen.

Come on man, there's people talking about maxing out Julius in the trade Payton or Randle thread, that is nuts. If we had better guards Randles stats would drop and he'd have to take more threes as the ball would be in their hands more. If we were to draft Cade or Suggs, how do you think that's going to work, do you really think Randle should have the ball even half as much as he has it now?

You don’t have to relegate Randle as a spot up shooter with better guards. He can set picks and roll to the rim or pick and pop. Cut to the rim, etc. We don’t see much of that cause our guards suck.

I still think you’re over exaggerating the usage with Randle though. Your boy Wood actually has basically the same usage as Randle even though he plays next to Wall and Harden lol. Wood’s is 27.4 while Randle is 27.7. Randle’s usage is actually the same as the last 3 years (27.8, 27.6, 27.7). If anything this just shows how much his game has grown, while basically getting the same amount of touches the last couple of years.

You do need him to shoot if there's better guards, because they will have the ball more and the man in the dunkers spot will still be Mitch. It's a spacing issue no matter how you cut it, that is also why he's on the ball so much, because he's not a great shooter you put the ball in his hands which makes sense, the problem is how often that happens and how often he dominates plays. If he's setting screens, what is Mitch doing? A more modern offense would be Mitch setting screens for the ball handler with Obi in the corner, you know it, and I know it too. If Randle were a 7 footer and could play C full time then his style of play could work since he'd drag the opposing C out the lane, but he doesn't and can't protect the rim either.



Wood is a finisher, he's not initiating offense or handling the ball much, when Wood gets the ball it's usually in a scoring position so his usage is high as a result, for example 74% of Wood's offense is assisted, 46% of Randle's is assisted. Let's be real, Randle gets the ball in the frontcourt more than Joel Embiid, he touches the ball more than LeBron and Curry, it's not an exaggeration to say he's ball dominant, going by usage only tells you how the play ended, in between that Randle is dominating the ball at superstar levels. Do you really think a player like that can function within an offense, and defer to rookies? hell no, if we got lucky and drafted Cade or Suggs they better be ready to play off the ball too You can make it about Wood being my boy, but I'd never want to build a team around Wood as a franchise player, you want us to build around Randle as though he's a centerpiece talent

[3toheadmelo]

Nah, Harden just wanted to be with Little Mountain and go to Starlets & Sue's Rendezvous when they reopen.

Come on man, there's people talking about maxing out Julius in the trade Payton or Randle thread, that is nuts. If we had better guards Randles stats would drop and he'd have to take more threes as the ball would be in their hands more. If we were to draft Cade or Suggs, how do you think that's going to work, do you really think Randle should have the ball even half as much as he has it now?

You don’t have to relegate Randle as a spot up shooter with better guards. He can set picks and roll to the rim or pick and pop. Cut to the rim, etc. We don’t see much of that cause our guards suck.

I still think you’re over exaggerating the usage with Randle though. Your boy Wood actually has basically the same usage as Randle even though he plays next to Wall and Harden lol. Wood’s is 27.4 while Randle is 27.7. Randle’s usage is actually the same as the last 3 years (27.8, 27.6, 27.7). If anything this just shows how much his game has grown, while basically getting the same amount of touches the last couple of years.

You do need him to shoot if there's better guards, because they will have the ball more and the man in the dunkers spot will still be Mitch. It's a spacing issue no matter how you cut it, that is also why he's on the ball so much, because he's not a great shooter you put the ball in his hands which makes sense, the problem is how often that happens and how often he dominates plays. If he's setting screens, what is Mitch doing? A more modern offense would be Mitch setting screens for the ball handler with Obi in the corner, you know it, and I know it too. If Randle were a 7 footer and could play C full time then his style of play could work since he'd drag the opposing C out the lane, but he doesn't and can't protect the rim either.



Wood is a finisher, he's not initiating offense or handling the ball much, when Wood gets the ball it's usually in a scoring position so his usage is high as a result, for example 74% of Wood's offense is assisted, 46% of Randle's is assisted. Let's be real, Randle gets the ball in the frontcourt more than Joel Embiid, he touches the ball more than LeBron and Curry, it's not an exaggeration to say he's ball dominant, going by usage only tells you how the play ended, in between that Randle is dominating the ball at superstar levels. Do you really think a player like that can function within an offense, and defer to rookies? hell no, if we got lucky and drafted Cade or Suggs they better be ready to play off the ball too You can make it about Wood being my boy, but I'd never want to build a team around Wood as a franchise player, you want us to build around Randle as though he's a centerpiece talent

And why do you think Wood’s offense is mostly assisted? Cause he has better guards around him. Literally my whole point.

Wood is a much worse shooter than Randle by the way. Shooting just 27% from 3 while Randle is shooting 34% from 3. So Wood would make our spacing even worse lol

But how am I saying to build around Randle like he’s our center piece talent? By saying we need guards who can shoot? You not making sense bro

[NoDopeOnSundays]

You don’t have to relegate Randle as a spot up shooter with better guards. He can set picks and roll to the rim or pick and pop. Cut to the rim, etc. We don’t see much of that cause our guards suck.

I still think you’re over exaggerating the usage with Randle though. Your boy Wood actually has basically the same usage as Randle even though he plays next to Wall and Harden lol. Wood’s is 27.4 while Randle is 27.7. Randle’s usage is actually the same as the last 3 years (27.8, 27.6, 27.7). If anything this just shows how much his game has grown, while basically getting the same amount of touches the last couple of years.

You do need him to shoot if there's better guards, because they will have the ball more and the man in the dunkers spot will still be Mitch. It's a spacing issue no matter how you cut it, that is also why he's on the ball so much, because he's not a great shooter you put the ball in his hands which makes sense, the problem is how often that happens and how often he dominates plays. If he's setting screens, what is Mitch doing? A more modern offense would be Mitch setting screens for the ball handler with Obi in the corner, you know it, and I know it too. If Randle were a 7 footer and could play C full time then his style of play could work since he'd drag the opposing C out the lane, but he doesn't and can't protect the rim either.



Wood is a finisher, he's not initiating offense or handling the ball much, when Wood gets the ball it's usually in a scoring position so his usage is high as a result, for example 74% of Wood's offense is assisted, 46% of Randle's is assisted. Let's be real, Randle gets the ball in the frontcourt more than Joel Embiid, he touches the ball more than LeBron and Curry, it's not an exaggeration to say he's ball dominant, going by usage only tells you how the play ended, in between that Randle is dominating the ball at superstar levels. Do you really think a player like that can function within an offense, and defer to rookies? hell no, if we got lucky and drafted Cade or Suggs they better be ready to play off the ball too You can make it about Wood being my boy, but I'd never want to build a team around Wood as a franchise player, you want us to build around Randle as though he's a centerpiece talent

And why do you think Wood’s offense is mostly assisted? Cause he has better guards around him. Literally my whole point.

Wood is a much worse shooter than Randle by the way. Shooting just 27% from 3 while Randle is shooting 34% from 3. So Wood would make our spacing even worse lol

But how am I saying to build around Randle like he’s our center piece talent? By saying we need guards who can shoot? You not making sense bro

That doesn't hold any water, in Detroit with worse guards Wood was assisted 75% of his offense, he's a finisher. On the flipside, in New Orleans with Holiday and better teammates only 54% of Randle's offense was assisted, he put up even better stats with them when AD was out and they still didn't want him back.



Woods isn't shooting well now, but it's how many games into the season? If he's sub 30 by the end of the season then you can get at me about it, but this early? Come on man. We gonna act like you don't want to build around Randle???????? You gonna do me like that too???????

[3toheadmelo]

You do need him to shoot if there's better guards, because they will have the ball more and the man in the dunkers spot will still be Mitch. It's a spacing issue no matter how you cut it, that is also why he's on the ball so much, because he's not a great shooter you put the ball in his hands which makes sense, the problem is how often that happens and how often he dominates plays. If he's setting screens, what is Mitch doing? A more modern offense would be Mitch setting screens for the ball handler with Obi in the corner, you know it, and I know it too. If Randle were a 7 footer and could play C full time then his style of play could work since he'd drag the opposing C out the lane, but he doesn't and can't protect the rim either.



Wood is a finisher, he's not initiating offense or handling the ball much, when Wood gets the ball it's usually in a scoring position so his usage is high as a result, for example 74% of Wood's offense is assisted, 46% of Randle's is assisted. Let's be real, Randle gets the ball in the frontcourt more than Joel Embiid, he touches the ball more than LeBron and Curry, it's not an exaggeration to say he's ball dominant, going by usage only tells you how the play ended, in between that Randle is dominating the ball at superstar levels. Do you really think a player like that can function within an offense, and defer to rookies? hell no, if we got lucky and drafted Cade or Suggs they better be ready to play off the ball too You can make it about Wood being my boy, but I'd never want to build a team around Wood as a franchise player, you want us to build around Randle as though he's a centerpiece talent

And why do you think Wood’s offense is mostly assisted? Cause he has better guards around him. Literally my whole point.

Wood is a much worse shooter than Randle by the way. Shooting just 27% from 3 while Randle is shooting 34% from 3. So Wood would make our spacing even worse lol

But how am I saying to build around Randle like he’s our center piece talent? By saying we need guards who can shoot? You not making sense bro

That doesn't hold any water, in Detroit with worse guards Wood was assisted 75% of his offense, he's a finisher. On the flipside, in New Orleans with Holiday and better teammates only 54% of Randle's offense was assisted, he put up even better stats with them when AD was out and they still didn't want him back.



Woods isn't shooting well now, but it's how many games into the season? If he's sub 30 by the end of the season then you can get at me about it, but this early? Come on man. We gonna act like you don't want to build around Randle???????? You gonna do me like that too???????

You’re forgetting Randle played a lot of minutes next to bums like Payton and Etwuan Moore. So it wasn’t like he was next to Holiday all of the time.

Wood was playing next to guys like D Rose and Bruce Brown who would be the best guards on the Knicks.

How come Christian Wood is literally on a different team every single season? Hmm..

It’s fair I come at you early cause you been coming at me since preseason lol

But again, adding better guards who can shoot isn’t necessarily building around Randle. We need those guards regardless of Randle. Am I lying?

[GettinitDone]

I have faith in RJ, he seems dedicated to and serious enough with the game that he wants to be best player he can be. He plays hard but not necessarily smart, and he can figure out how to do latter only by experience, which may not come until year 3 or 4. It's patience game with RJ.

If we trade him I think he quickly takes off to All Star level like Ingram. There's always more pressure to live up to your potential/ expectations on the team that drafted you than on other teams that didn't.

[NoDopeOnSundays]

And why do you think Wood’s offense is mostly assisted? Cause he has better guards around him. Literally my whole point.

Wood is a much worse shooter than Randle by the way. Shooting just 27% from 3 while Randle is shooting 34% from 3. So Wood would make our spacing even worse lol

But how am I saying to build around Randle like he’s our center piece talent? By saying we need guards who can shoot? You not making sense bro

That doesn't hold any water, in Detroit with worse guards Wood was assisted 75% of his offense, he's a finisher. On the flipside, in New Orleans with Holiday and better teammates only 54% of Randle's offense was assisted, he put up even better stats with them when AD was out and they still didn't want him back.



Woods isn't shooting well now, but it's how many games into the season? If he's sub 30 by the end of the season then you can get at me about it, but this early? Come on man. We gonna act like you don't want to build around Randle???????? You gonna do me like that too???????

You’re forgetting Randle played a lot of minutes next to bums like Payton and Etwuan Moore. So it wasn’t like he was next to Holiday all of the time.

Wood was playing next to guys like D Rose and Bruce Brown who would be the best guards on the Knicks.

How come Christian Wood is literally on a different team every single season? Hmm..

It’s fair I come at you early cause you been coming at me since preseason lol

But again, adding better guards who can shoot isn’t necessarily building around Randle. We need those guards regardless of Randle. Am I lying?

He started 49 games, a good amount of those came with AD & Jrue together with him, he put up great numbers 23/9/4. Those 2 players are better than anyone on the Knicks.


I'm not coming at you, just Randle, you my guy, we agree on virtually everything except this. I want the Knicks to be successful, if we draft a better player than RJ and RJ gets in the way of that player, I'd want RJ gone. I put the Knicks above the player, obviously that would change a little if we lucked into a generational player. We need better guards, but realistically how do you think Randle would take going from being number 1, to number 3 in ball handling duties? Do you think he'd be as effective getting moved off the ball like that when his whole career has been on ball, and the elephant in the room is that if he's screening and rolling to the rim, what is Mitch doing?

[3toheadmelo]

That doesn't hold any water, in Detroit with worse guards Wood was assisted 75% of his offense, he's a finisher. On the flipside, in New Orleans with Holiday and better teammates only 54% of Randle's offense was assisted, he put up even better stats with them when AD was out and they still didn't want him back.



Woods isn't shooting well now, but it's how many games into the season? If he's sub 30 by the end of the season then you can get at me about it, but this early? Come on man. We gonna act like you don't want to build around Randle???????? You gonna do me like that too???????

You’re forgetting Randle played a lot of minutes next to bums like Payton and Etwuan Moore. So it wasn’t like he was next to Holiday all of the time.

Wood was playing next to guys like D Rose and Bruce Brown who would be the best guards on the Knicks.

How come Christian Wood is literally on a different team every single season? Hmm..

It’s fair I come at you early cause you been coming at me since preseason lol

But again, adding better guards who can shoot isn’t necessarily building around Randle. We need those guards regardless of Randle. Am I lying?

He started 49 games, a good amount of those came with AD & Jrue together with him, he put up great numbers 23/9/4. Those 2 players are better than anyone on the Knicks.


I'm not coming at you, just Randle, you my guy, we agree on virtually everything except this. I want the Knicks to be successful, if we draft a better player than RJ and RJ gets in the way of that player, I'd want RJ gone. I put the Knicks above the player, obviously that would change a little if we lucked into a generational player. We need better guards, but realistically how do you think Randle would take going from being number 1, to number 3 in ball handling duties? Do you think he'd be as effective getting moved off the ball like that when his whole career has been on ball, and the elephant in the room is that if he's screening and rolling to the rim, what is Mitch doing?

I know, you’re still my guy too.

I just think you’re over reacting about Randle’s ball dominance imo. Yes I think he would still be effective playing off the ball sometimes. I just saw your other post in the other thread, 35% from catch and shoot 3’s isn’t bad at all.

If Randle is rolling to the rim then Mitch better get out of his way lol. Or he can even screen other players so Randle can have more room rolling to the rim. But Randle can still do pick and pops too.

Randle never even had opportunities to play off the ball really so maybe the Knicks should get some better guards and we can see who’s right.

[BrOnXKing1]

Considering that Payton can do no wrong and continues to play heavy minutes despite playing poorly in most games, I think he is the guy they are trying to build around

[prophet_of_rage]

Don’t see why he can’t fit on a contender. The guy is a scoring machine, plays defense now, and a great facilitator. If guys like Sabonis and Jokic can have big roles on playoffs teams then so can Randle. He basically does the same things as them.

Prejudice is all. Randle plays a similar style to Sabonis with better defence. Put him with a star backcourt player and defensive 5 and he can contend.

So Knicks get a star back court player and we're fine.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

Imagine how good a team could be if they had Anthony Davis, Jrue Holiday and Julius Randle



Randle been a loser his entire career, and he's still a loser now, putting up empty stats like a madman, how is he any different than Andre Drummond? I know one difference actually, and it's that Drummond actually got his team to the playoffs a couple times.


Wanting to build around Randle is the most Knick thing ever, imagine we win the lottery and Cade has to play off the ball cause it's Randles team

Judging a player based on his bench role two years ago would be the most Knicksfanian thing ever. I mean that AD never won anything in NO either. Whatever happened to him?

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[TheGreenArrow]

NoDopeOnSundays is doing god’s work folks!!!!

Randle Must Go!!!!!!!!!

[prophet_of_rage]

You do need him to shoot if there's better guards, because they will have the ball more and the man in the dunkers spot will still be Mitch. It's a spacing issue no matter how you cut it, that is also why he's on the ball so much, because he's not a great shooter you put the ball in his hands which makes sense, the problem is how often that happens and how often he dominates plays. If he's setting screens, what is Mitch doing? A more modern offense would be Mitch setting screens for the ball handler with Obi in the corner, you know it, and I know it too. If Randle were a 7 footer and could play C full time then his style of play could work since he'd drag the opposing C out the lane, but he doesn't and can't protect the rim either.



Wood is a finisher, he's not initiating offense or handling the ball much, when Wood gets the ball it's usually in a scoring position so his usage is high as a result, for example 74% of Wood's offense is assisted, 46% of Randle's is assisted. Let's be real, Randle gets the ball in the frontcourt more than Joel Embiid, he touches the ball more than LeBron and Curry, it's not an exaggeration to say he's ball dominant, going by usage only tells you how the play ended, in between that Randle is dominating the ball at superstar levels. Do you really think a player like that can function within an offense, and defer to rookies? hell no, if we got lucky and drafted Cade or Suggs they better be ready to play off the ball too You can make it about Wood being my boy, but I'd never want to build a team around Wood as a franchise player, you want us to build around Randle as though he's a centerpiece talent

And why do you think Wood’s offense is mostly assisted? Cause he has better guards around him. Literally my whole point.

Wood is a much worse shooter than Randle by the way. Shooting just 27% from 3 while Randle is shooting 34% from 3. So Wood would make our spacing even worse lol

But how am I saying to build around Randle like he’s our center piece talent? By saying we need guards who can shoot? You not making sense bro

That doesn't hold any water, in Detroit with worse guards Wood was assisted 75% of his offense, he's a finisher. On the flipside, in New Orleans with Holiday and better teammates only 54% of Randle's offense was assisted, he put up even better stats with them when AD was out and they still didn't want him back.



Woods isn't shooting well now, but it's how many games into the season? If he's sub 30 by the end of the season then you can get at me about it, but this early? Come on man. We gonna act like you don't want to build around Randle???????? You gonna do me like that too???????

With a good guard you can just run Villanova's 4 out motion. Randle plays slot to elbow opposite the dunker. He can dive, set pin downs, screen and roll, post ... so can Mitch and the guard has all the space in the world.

It isn't difficult to create space with talent.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

[louisorr]

There is no "who" are we trying to build around. The answer is "what". As in future picks. We have two good pieces right now, Mitch is our best. He's an impact player. Rj is the other. when he's on, he's a good player. When he's off he at least won't hang his head and will affect the game positively with D and boards and getting to the stripe. Neither though, is a guy you "build around". Obi and IQ we hope for. Everyone else is an NBA vagabond.

[NYC_Browns]

At this point in time, I don't know what the Knicks are doing!