Gobert has to be the most overrated perennial DPOY contender in recent history

[The_Hater]

There is a mountain of evidence out there in this day and age that supports how great Gobert is as a defender. This isn’t 1988 when people would just go on their perception and the eye test.

As for the ‘the joker destroys him’ crowd. Who doesn’t the joker destroy? Is this really the best argument tou have? If they put Gobert against James Harden, that wouldn’t go very well either.

[kuclas]

Gobert is a very good player. He’s elite defensively. He’s a winning player that allows the other jazz players

Trade Gobert for KAT. Will Minnesota record be better? Will Utah record be better?

Defense does still matter in this league especially the center position.

[_qubik]

Like everybody else some players have really bad matchups... If you point out those particular cases on Gobert then you have to do it on everybody else that is a top defender. His overall defense is by far the best in the league, nobody impacts the game on the defensive end of the floor like him. Another overreaction after one game. Predictable.

Not saying they are better, but I see no nightmare matchuolp for defenders like Bam, Simmons, Smart. If Smart and Simmons can bother every perimeter player, and Bam hardly is destroyed by center, even though he is a bit undersized. The point is, all top dogs demolish Gobert more often than not, he isnt primed to guard AD, Embiid or Jokic. And whats the point in being labelled the best defender when you cant defend the best players of your position

[_qubik]

Bruh, how hard is it to understand that a team with a top 3 defensive rating where you have the starting lineup of Mitchell-below average defender/Conley-average/Bojan-below average/Royce-30 to 40 ranked nba defender HAS to have a transcendent DPOY in order to have that top 3 defensive rating?

Why are people here such prisoners of the moment? I'd rather say they're not, they just have their own ugly little agendas so they pretend to be prisoners of the moment to push those agendas. It's really sad to see, people don't want to observe the beautiful truth happening on the basketball courts, they just wanna push false narratives that might benefit their guy. And for what?

The Jazz cant have success in the playoffs, so the transcendent defender is just a regular season thing, and the guy gets praise as the best defender or something like that. Gobert is just a specialist. A very good one, but when things matter he cant hsve the same impact against the guys he will need to guard in his whole carreer. Unless he or them change teams, he will go against AD and Jokic in the PO, and will be cooked again and again

[Zombiesonics]

he's a great defender and specifically exceeds during the regular season where his motor really shines while protecting the paint vs avg teams. The only issue with him is scalability, or how much he can impact the game deeper in the playoffs versus more versatile + talented opponents.

[_qubik]

That's like saying LeBron is an overrated defender because Durant dropped over 30 ppg on elite efficiency against him in the Finals multiple times...

There is no defense against scoring juggernauts when they are in the zone... Maybe there are more ideal defenders in the league in terms or matching up to certain guys (like Marc Gasol against Embiid) but that doesn't make Gobert overrated...

Common, Lebron is the offensive lifeline of his team, he is 36 and never was labeled as the best defender on the league. He is good and smart when he it id needed. The point with Gobert is that he cant guard the top dogs, AD, Embiid and Jokic. Not saying he needs to let them score a small amount of points. But he should make their games harder, take some shots, make them get to uncomfortable spots, but he is just getting cooked again and again. He will need to go against AD and Jokic in any PO he appears, not Embiid, the Jazz wont make the Finals with him if nothing spectafular happens. If he cant guard them, it will be very hard to win

[BFitzMoney]

Rudy is a role player, doesn’t move the needle. Not really worth more than the mle. The eye test clearly shows how he gets exposed against skilled big men, no matter what the analytics on some excel spreadsheet show

You might wanna take a break from posting for a little while after this one. I hate to even respond to such willful ignorance but the mle? come on man. Virtually every team in the league would be scrambling to get him if he became available. Not worth more than the mle .. ok buddy.

[BFitzMoney]

If you can't even guard your own man, you are a potential liability, no matter what you achieve in team defense.

This is where you're wrong. if you can't play team defense, you're a liability. Guarding your man is far less important. The biggest question is if you can effectively run the defensive scheme that your coach has you running.

If you can't even guard your own man, you are a potential liability, no matter what you achieve in team defense.
If you can't even play team defense, you are a potential liability, no matter what achieve in man-on-man defense.
And if I was in the playoffs, I would be very worried if my best defender was being abused for 7 games by his own man.

So you thought it was a good idea to post the exact same completely wrong idea twice.

So he's getting paid all that money for his offense right?

[HartfordWhalers]

Thread is ridiculous.

If you cannot see Gobert's defensive impact, you have an issue following what is happening in basketball games. Or maybe have just seen so little and an aberration at that? Either way, Gobert is highly impactful.

[CelticsLV]

He's elite until playoffs start. Just look at opponents ORtg in playoffs in comparison to regular season with Gobert on/off. Last 2 playoffs Gobert has pretty much been a catastrophe.

[dhsilv2]

He's elite until playoffs start.

and then he's still elite?

[dhsilv2]

Rudy is a role player, doesn’t move the needle. Not really worth more than the mle. The eye test clearly shows how he gets exposed against skilled big men, no matter what the analytics on some excel spreadsheet show

You might wanna take a break from posting for a little while after this one. I hate to even respond to such willful ignorance but the mle? come on man. Virtually every team in the league would be scrambling to get him if he became available. Not worth more than the mle .. ok buddy.

Google Ken M and then reread that post.

[Pharmcat]

Jazz DRTG since Gobert became their starter (don't forget Utah plays in the WC where most of the elite offenses reside):

2016: 7th
2017: 3rd
2018: 2nd
2019: 2nd
2020: 13th
2021: 3rd

2020 is the outlier as Utah was straight basura defensively outside of Gobert, they didn't even have a backup center ffs (108.3 DRTG Gobert on, 114.6 DRTG Gobert off). There were also some internal team issues last season with Gobert reportedly checking out mentally due to frustration with his offensive role. Then the whole coronavirus thing. But they've moved passed that and Gobert's Jazz are back to being a top 3 defensive team

So if you concede 2020 was an outlier, then Gobert essentially guarantees you a floor of top 10 defense (more likely top 3). I'd say that makes him a pretty elite defensive anchor

pfft...

you and your "numbers". Don't you know advanced metrics have no place here? Little Johnny just saw Embiid go off, so ergo Gobert SUCKS. Eyes don't lie!

and how many finals appearances have they had in those 6 years? thats the thing these stat geeks in the front office who just look and fap to excel spreadsheets all day long dont realize, there is more to the game than numbers they have invented just to be part of the basketball experience

[Pharmcat]

Spoiler:

So this is the level of intelligent discussion that I was preventing? Bro memes with dogs? Go home millennial.

Yeah, you can’t have an intelligent discussion with flat earthers, anti vax ppl, guys who deny the significance of statistical analysis in 2021, so you gotta ridicule them

I dont deny stats? My position is that they have too much influence on the game. Thats different than just blowing them off. My problem with stats is they dont take into account the whole picture (game flow, injuries, how the refs are calling that particular game, the side effect of spamming 3s (i.e. putting your defense at risk due to long rebounds and quick transition for the other team up the floor), etc).

[kan_t]

I love how the “eye test” is used against Gobert yet almost every game I see players flat out avoiding the paint because Rudy is there.

The funny thing is that if you know defense, he should pass your "eye test". Defense is much more than just man-to-man. The Jazz whole defensive scheme is built around him by not giving him help on protecting the paint. His length and discipline allow him to be the best at altering player's shot around him. This is the aspect casual fans always overlook when people talk about defense but coaches would notice.

[nikster]

Jazz DRTG since Gobert became their starter (don't forget Utah plays in the WC where most of the elite offenses reside):

2016: 7th
2017: 3rd
2018: 2nd
2019: 2nd
2020: 13th
2021: 3rd

2020 is the outlier as Utah was straight basura defensively outside of Gobert, they didn't even have a backup center ffs (108.3 DRTG Gobert on, 114.6 DRTG Gobert off). There were also some internal team issues last season with Gobert reportedly checking out mentally due to frustration with his offensive role. Then the whole coronavirus thing. But they've moved passed that and Gobert's Jazz are back to being a top 3 defensive team

So if you concede 2020 was an outlier, then Gobert essentially guarantees you a floor of top 10 defense (more likely top 3). I'd say that makes him a pretty elite defensive anchor

pfft...

you and your "numbers". Don't you know advanced metrics have no place here? Little Johnny just saw Embiid go off, so ergo Gobert SUCKS. Eyes don't lie!

and how many finals appearances have they had in those 6 years? thats the thing these stat geeks in the front office who just look and fap to excel spreadsheets all day long dont realize, there is more to the game than numbers they have invented just to be part of the basketball experience

I guess everyone outside of Lebron led teams and the warriors is garbage

[HeartBreakKid]

Jazz DRTG since Gobert became their starter (don't forget Utah plays in the WC where most of the elite offenses reside):

2016: 7th
2017: 3rd
2018: 2nd
2019: 2nd
2020: 13th
2021: 3rd

2020 is the outlier as Utah was straight basura defensively outside of Gobert, they didn't even have a backup center ffs (108.3 DRTG Gobert on, 114.6 DRTG Gobert off). There were also some internal team issues last season with Gobert reportedly checking out mentally due to frustration with his offensive role. Then the whole coronavirus thing. But they've moved passed that and Gobert's Jazz are back to being a top 3 defensive team

So if you concede 2020 was an outlier, then Gobert essentially guarantees you a floor of top 10 defense (more likely top 3). I'd say that makes him a pretty elite defensive anchor

pfft...

you and your "numbers". Don't you know advanced metrics have no place here? Little Johnny just saw Embiid go off, so ergo Gobert SUCKS. Eyes don't lie!

and how many finals appearances have they had in those 6 years? thats the thing these stat geeks in the front office who just look and fap to excel spreadsheets all day long dont realize, there is more to the game than numbers they have invented just to be part of the basketball experience

I mean they lose primarily because their offense is lacking...

Also, in what world is someone a geek for recognizing how good a teams defense is lmao. What are you, a jock?

How many rings you got btw?

[Tykross]

If Gobert is overrated all defensive players are overrated too !

https://www.thespax.com/nba/the-multi-season-defensive-dominance-of-rudy-gobert/

[Alatan]

I think it’s D Mitchell who’s even more overrated, can’t believe he almost won rookie of the year, almost, but he never did, he again thinks he did, like how he thought he beat the 76ers.


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Lol, you are still upset about it. To be fair its not like Simmons is playing any better.

[goober]

Embiid totally destroyed Gobert 1 on 1 /green font

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