RS 20/21 - Mavs @ Wizards (Sat. 7PM EST)

[Bob8]

@deb

Probably you're right and i overvalue Melli because i see him play a lot of time, but i can assicure you that in Europe he had a lot of respect when he played for Milano.

Don't look too much at the stats, in Europe is very hard to make monster stats.
Kyle Hines is a EL legend and he averaged 8points and 4 rebound in his Championship seasons...Luka is Luka and he averaged 16+5+4 in his MVP season.

I see that deb already succeeded in bringing you to a more reasonable position. I will simply recap by saying:
1) It's pointless to use the time of Melli at Fenerbahce as an argument here. Maxi is one year younger and cracked the rotation as an NBA player already as a rookie in the 2017-18 season, while Nico stayed in Europe and went to a Euroleague contender. Before that season as Bob8 clarified, they did put out similar stats in the German BBL (which was my point).
2) I am a European basketball fan, you need not tell me how Euroleague is a different caliber. Be that as it may ACB is arguably the 2nd best league in Europe and Maxi had a very strong season in Spain as 23 year old https://www.basketball-reference.com/international/players/maxi-kleber-1.html. If Maxi had stayed in Europe he would have been for sure a highly coveted Euroleague player, his only issue were always injuries. I have nothing but love for Nico (I am Italian and proud of his achievements) but I think that we should not expect too much out of him.


EDIT: I mixed up Bob8 with deb originally. My mistake: apologies to both

We agree it's very unlikely that Melli can do much in Nba now. It's probably too late for him. But watching him playing it's obvious Melli is better offensive player than Kleber. Kleber's more or less only skill is shooting open 3s. And even in that segment Melli was much better in his last 4 years in Europe.
Kleber is a player, who fits in Nba more than in Euroleague, Melli on the other hand is perfect Pf for Europe, but is probably not good enough offensive player to make up for his lack of defensive skills in Nba. I don't believe Melli can be as good as Kleber in Nba, but similarly I don't believe Kleber could have been as good as Melli in Euroleague.

The most impressive thing about Melli is, how quick he fit in Mavs roster.

[41Dirk41]

We talked about Nico too much...0/7 tonight hahahahahaha

First rule about Melli Club Is : You don't talk about Melli Club.
Second rule about Melli Club : You DO NOT talk about Melli Club.

[DrPampiloni]

We agree it's very unlikely that Melli can do much in Nba now. It's probably too late for him. But watching him playing it's obvious Melli is better offensive player than Kleber. Kleber's more or less only skill is shooting open 3s. And even in that segment Melli was much better in his last 4 years in Europe.
Kleber is a player, who fits in Nba more than in Euroleague, Melli on the other hand is perfect Pf for Europe, but is probably not good enough offensive player to make up for his lack of defensive skills in Nba. I don't believe Melli can be as good as Kleber in Nba, but similarly I don't believe Kleber could have been as good as Melli in Euroleague.

The most impressive thing about Melli is, how quick he fit in Mavs roster.

One thing I don't understand is how you do not account for athletic ability when you say that Melli is clearly better offensively. He will never be able to finish above the rim, which is very important for his position in the NBA. Anyway I love what I see regarding effort and team play for now.

[Bob8]

We agree it's very unlikely that Melli can do much in Nba now. It's probably too late for him. But watching him playing it's obvious Melli is better offensive player than Kleber. Kleber's more or less only skill is shooting open 3s. And even in that segment Melli was much better in his last 4 years in Europe.
Kleber is a player, who fits in Nba more than in Euroleague, Melli on the other hand is perfect Pf for Europe, but is probably not good enough offensive player to make up for his lack of defensive skills in Nba. I don't believe Melli can be as good as Kleber in Nba, but similarly I don't believe Kleber could have been as good as Melli in Euroleague.

The most impressive thing about Melli is, how quick he fit in Mavs roster.

One thing I don't understand is how you do not account for athletic ability when you say that Melli is clearly better offensively. He will never be able to finish above the rim, which is very important for his position in the NBA. Anyway I love what I see regarding effort and team play for now.

Not able to finish above the rim was knock on Luka too. How many times is Kleber doing that?

Melli biggest problem at the moment is his self confidence, energy is there, desire is there, but not being important piece of the team for so long time is having consequences for his self confidence. I don't know how soon can he get that feelings back, I hope soon, because he really can help this team, if he can make some shots. Without shooting his value is just a lot lower.

[DrPampiloni]

We agree it's very unlikely that Melli can do much in Nba now. It's probably too late for him. But watching him playing it's obvious Melli is better offensive player than Kleber. Kleber's more or less only skill is shooting open 3s. And even in that segment Melli was much better in his last 4 years in Europe.
Kleber is a player, who fits in Nba more than in Euroleague, Melli on the other hand is perfect Pf for Europe, but is probably not good enough offensive player to make up for his lack of defensive skills in Nba. I don't believe Melli can be as good as Kleber in Nba, but similarly I don't believe Kleber could have been as good as Melli in Euroleague.

The most impressive thing about Melli is, how quick he fit in Mavs roster.

One thing I don't understand is how you do not account for athletic ability when you say that Melli is clearly better offensively. He will never be able to finish above the rim, which is very important for his position in the NBA. Anyway I love what I see regarding effort and team play for now.

Not able to finish above the rim was knock on Luka too. How many times is Kleber doing that?

Melli biggest problem at the moment is his self confidence, energy is there, desire is there, but not being important piece of the team for so long time is having consequences for his self confidence. I don't know how soon can he get that feelings back, I hope soon, because he really can help this team, if he can make some shots. Without shooting his value is just a lot lower.

Literally hundreds of times:

Watch on YouTube

The comparison with Luka makes no sense. I am talking playing off-ball, rolling, connecting on alley-oops while absorbing contact around the rim.

I think getting accustomed to the NBA 3-pt line is down-played as an obstacle. Even Luka, the prodigy that he is, is finally achieving only it in his 3rd year.

[Bob8]

One thing I don't understand is how you do not account for athletic ability when you say that Melli is clearly better offensively. He will never be able to finish above the rim, which is very important for his position in the NBA. Anyway I love what I see regarding effort and team play for now.

Not able to finish above the rim was knock on Luka too. How many times is Kleber doing that?

Melli biggest problem at the moment is his self confidence, energy is there, desire is there, but not being important piece of the team for so long time is having consequences for his self confidence. I don't know how soon can he get that feelings back, I hope soon, because he really can help this team, if he can make some shots. Without shooting his value is just a lot lower.

Literally hundreds of times:

Watch on YouTube

The comparison with Luka makes no sense. I am talking playing off-ball, rolling, connecting on alley-oops while absorbing contact around the rim.

I think getting accustomed to the NBA 3-pt line is down-played as an obstacle. Even Luka, the prodigy that he is, is finally achieving only it in his 3rd year.

Kleber is making 0.6 2PT shots this year and averaging 1FT, so I kinda doubt that finishing above the rim is important part of his game.

Luka's % for 3 was similarly bad in Europe too.