Hawks (5) @ Knicks (4) - Playoffs Round 1 - Game 1 - SUNDAY May 23 - 7:00pm

[GONYK]

Yeah, that might be it. I will take Frank going 1 for 4 in 10min or whatever if he is playing great defense and slowing down Trae. Think everyone can agree there has been times Frank has hesitated and we will need Frank to at least take those open shots.

teams have advanced stats as well. They know frank is in the 90% percentile in C&S 3's. So at minimum he wont be guarded like Payton out there. Teams just don't leave him wide open like they do Payton.

If he's out there with Rose/RJ/Randle or Burks/RJ/Randle

hopefully you can just park him in the corner and he can hit the occasional 3 when the defense collapses. The one thing at least we dont have to worry about is Frank driving recklessly to the basket like Payton and getting blocked and starting a fast break...because Frank doesn't drive to the basket

Frank might be able to shoot teams into defending him, but they don't respect his shot when he checks in. His guy is often helping in the paint.

I just don't think this is true. The defender may help, but they don't leave Frank more than a step away.

They don't treat him like Payton at all. Frank's man doesn't just play free safety.

[HerSports85]

If it’s their plan to double team Randle the entire series, that’s even more reason to start Frank. They’ll just leave Payton open. He’s a non threat offensively.

Teams leave Frank wide open too.

Their choice, but at least Frank will make them pay by hitting the open 3

[cgf]

teams have advanced stats as well. They know frank is in the 90% percentile in C&S 3's. So at minimum he wont be guarded like Payton out there. Teams just don't leave him wide open like they do Payton.

If he's out there with Rose/RJ/Randle or Burks/RJ/Randle

hopefully you can just park him in the corner and he can hit the occasional 3 when the defense collapses. The one thing at least we dont have to worry about is Frank driving recklessly to the basket like Payton and getting blocked and starting a fast break...because Frank doesn't drive to the basket

Frank might be able to shoot teams into defending him, but they don't respect his shot when he checks in. His guy is often helping in the paint.

I just don't think this is true. The defender may help, but they don't leave Frank more than a step away.

They don't treat him like Payton at all. Frank's man doesn't just play free safety.

Pull up some all possessions videos on youtube. Frank will be in the corner & his guy will be 10 feet away.

[F N 11]

Lmao Knicks defense Tailor made for this. I ain’t never seen so many no foul calls on those body contact stuff initiated by offense.

[cgf]

Just as an example

Watch on YouTube

- CP3 is by the elbow with 1 foot almost inthe orange
- Frank makes the assist because Bridges is 6 feet away trying to cover both knicks
- Paul is in the post and slips before closing out to frank

This is also why I'm not sure what to make Frank's 3pt rate, has any of the 23 he has made had anybody even close to contesting the shot? Or have all of Frank's 3s this year been basically practice-3s?

[GONYK]

Frank might be able to shoot teams into defending him, but they don't respect his shot when he checks in. His guy is often helping in the paint.

I just don't think this is true. The defender may help, but they don't leave Frank more than a step away.

They don't treat him like Payton at all. Frank's man doesn't just play free safety.

Pull up some all possessions videos on youtube. Frank will be in the corner & his guy will be 10 feet away.

All teams keep a defender in the paint when the ball is on the opposite side. But Frank's defender never stays further away than they can recover from in one pass.

65% of Frank's shots have a defender within 6 feet.

Want to guess what that number is for Elfrid?

Spoiler:

17% of his FGs, 4% of his 3's

Payton's man is often not on the same side of the floor. They just follow Randle around.

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFClassicNFClassic

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

[cgf]

I just don't think this is true. The defender may help, but they don't leave Frank more than a step away.

They don't treat him like Payton at all. Frank's man doesn't just play free safety.

Pull up some all possessions videos on youtube. Frank will be in the corner & his guy will be 10 feet away.

All teams keep a defender in the paint when the ball is on the opposite side. But Frank's defender never stays further away than they can recover from in one pass. 65% of Frank's shots have a defender within 6 feet.

Want to guess what that number is for Elfrid?

Payton's man is often not on the same side of the floor. They just follow Randle around.

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFClassicNFClassic

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

[K_ick_God]

It’s almost like a Q-Anon thing that we are all waiting for Frank to claim the starting point guard job *beginning* in the playoffs.

[GONYK]

Pull up some all possessions videos on youtube. Frank will be in the corner & his guy will be 10 feet away.

All teams keep a defender in the paint when the ball is on the opposite side. But Frank's defender never stays further away than they can recover from in one pass. 65% of Frank's shots have a defender within 6 feet.

Want to guess what that number is for Elfrid?

Payton's man is often not on the same side of the floor. They just follow Randle around.

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFClassicNFClassic

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

All of those defenders never got more than one pass away to recover. Even Chris Paul stayed close enough to recover and contest.

They don't treat him like Elf.

Once again, 65% of Frank's shots are at least moderately contested.

17% of Elf's shots are moderately contested.

Only 4% of Elf's 3 pt attempts have a defender within 6 ft.

28% of Frank's 3's have a defender within 6 ft.

How can you say the defense treats Elf and Frank the same with that kind of disparity?

[3toheadmelo]

Pull up some all possessions videos on youtube. Frank will be in the corner & his guy will be 10 feet away.

All teams keep a defender in the paint when the ball is on the opposite side. But Frank's defender never stays further away than they can recover from in one pass. 65% of Frank's shots have a defender within 6 feet.

Want to guess what that number is for Elfrid?

Payton's man is often not on the same side of the floor. They just follow Randle around.

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFClassicNFClassic

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

yeah you are better off starting IQ or Burks.

[GONYK]

It’s almost like a Q-Anon thing that we are all waiting for Frank to claim the starting point guard job *beginning* in the playoffs.

Don't need him to start at all. Just need Elf not to play.

[cgf]

All teams keep a defender in the paint when the ball is on the opposite side. But Frank's defender never stays further away than they can recover from in one pass. 65% of Frank's shots have a defender within 6 feet.

Want to guess what that number is for Elfrid?

Payton's man is often not on the same side of the floor. They just follow Randle around.

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFClassicNFClassic

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

All of those defenders never got more than one pass away to recover. Even Chris Paul stayed close enough to recover and contest.

They don't treat him like Elf.

Once again, 65% of Frank's shots are at least moderately contested.

17% of Elf's shots are moderately contested.

Only 4% of Elf's 3 pt attempts have a defender within 6 ft.

28% of Frank's 3's have a defender within 6 ft.

How can you say the defense treat Elf and Frank the same?

Fair, saying they're the same was just hyperbole on my part.

But I stand by my point that Frank isn't respected as a shooter either and is in no way a solution to Julius getting doubled. Despite having a better 3pt rate, he simply does not get anywhere near the kind of respect/attention that Barrett, Bullock, Burks & Quickley do.


EDIT:
Wait a minute, I didn't ever say Frank & Elf were the same...did I?

[cgf]

All teams keep a defender in the paint when the ball is on the opposite side. But Frank's defender never stays further away than they can recover from in one pass. 65% of Frank's shots have a defender within 6 feet.

Want to guess what that number is for Elfrid?

Payton's man is often not on the same side of the floor. They just follow Randle around.

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFClassicNFClassic

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=NFHBallNFHBall

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

yeah you are better off starting IQ or Burks.

That's what I'm hoping for. Start Burks (or IQ) with RJ, Reggie, Julius & Nerlens; bring Rose, IQ (or Burks) & Taj off the bench, with the odd cameo from Obi or Frank.

[HarthorneWingo]

No, I was the one who pointed out that you Prophet_of_rage uses strawmen to derail good discussions and troll others.
Are you in fact Rage-0-matic, angry man?

So did you correct Clyde when he referred to faucet of sausage and say different guy? I'll wait.

Sent from my SM-N970W using Tapatalk

Are you saying you're the Faucet of Sausage, too?

Rage-O-Matic

[GONYK]

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

All of those defenders never got more than one pass away to recover. Even Chris Paul stayed close enough to recover and contest.

They don't treat him like Elf.

Once again, 65% of Frank's shots are at least moderately contested.

17% of Elf's shots are moderately contested.

Only 4% of Elf's 3 pt attempts have a defender within 6 ft.

28% of Frank's 3's have a defender within 6 ft.

How can you say the defense treat Elf and Frank the same?

Fair, saying they're the same was just hyperbole on my part.

But I stand by my point that Frank isn't respected as a shooter either and is in no way a solution to Julius getting doubled. Despite having a better 3pt rate, he simply does not get anywhere near the kind of respect/attention that Barrett, Bullock, Burks & Quickley do.

I agree that the defense doesn't treat Frank like one of our top 6 scorers. I'm not saying Frank should play over any of them either. I want Burks to start at PG.

I think they respect Frank like a league average 3pt shooter. No more, no less. That is a monumental improvement to our spacing if you give Frank Elfrid's 10-15 mins though.

[cgf]

All of those defenders never got more than one pass away to recover. Even Chris Paul stayed close enough to recover and contest.

They don't treat him like Elf.

Once again, 65% of Frank's shots are at least moderately contested.

17% of Elf's shots are moderately contested.

Only 4% of Elf's 3 pt attempts have a defender within 6 ft.

28% of Frank's 3's have a defender within 6 ft.

How can you say the defense treat Elf and Frank the same?

Fair, saying they're the same was just hyperbole on my part.

But I stand by my point that Frank isn't respected as a shooter either and is in no way a solution to Julius getting doubled. Despite having a better 3pt rate, he simply does not get anywhere near the kind of respect/attention that Barrett, Bullock, Burks & Quickley do.

I agree that the defense doesn't treat Frank like one of our top 6 scorers. I'm not saying Frank should play over any of them either. I want Burks to start at PG.

I think they respect Frank like a league average 3pt shooter. No more, no less. That is a monumental improvement to our spacing if you give Frank Elfrid's 10-15 mins though.

I don't like being this guy, cause I want Frank to be successful, but that's not true. Looking at all possession vids for guys who shoot just 37-38% (aka within 1% of league average), but do so on significant enough volume to force teams to respect their shots, they don't get the kind of space that Frank does.

I think frank has the shot to become a Bullock kind of guy...but smart/good teams just don't treat him like the player we wish he was/think he can become. He's obviously not elf, but he's just not respected as a shooter yet.

[Im Coming Home]

Just look at those. Detroit...the dumbest of those teams...was the only one that actually guarded frank like he was a threat. Everyone else was leaving him on his own to help in the paint. Elf is a unique brand of awful, but that doesn't mean Frank is respected as a shooter...and he's not going to make anyone second-guess doubling Julius.

All of those defenders never got more than one pass away to recover. Even Chris Paul stayed close enough to recover and contest.

They don't treat him like Elf.

Once again, 65% of Frank's shots are at least moderately contested.

17% of Elf's shots are moderately contested.

Only 4% of Elf's 3 pt attempts have a defender within 6 ft.

28% of Frank's 3's have a defender within 6 ft.

How can you say the defense treat Elf and Frank the same?

Fair, saying they're the same was just hyperbole on my part.

But I stand by my point that Frank isn't respected as a shooter either and is in no way a solution to Julius getting doubled. Despite having a better 3pt rate, he simply does not get anywhere near the kind of respect/attention that Barrett, Bullock, Burks & Quickley do.


EDIT:
Wait a minute, I didn't ever say Frank & Elf were the same...did I?

They'll start respecting Franks 3 mid-game when he starts hitting 2 or 3 of them and they can't double Julius anymore..

[cgf]

All of those defenders never got more than one pass away to recover. Even Chris Paul stayed close enough to recover and contest.

They don't treat him like Elf.

Once again, 65% of Frank's shots are at least moderately contested.

17% of Elf's shots are moderately contested.

Only 4% of Elf's 3 pt attempts have a defender within 6 ft.

28% of Frank's 3's have a defender within 6 ft.

How can you say the defense treat Elf and Frank the same?

Fair, saying they're the same was just hyperbole on my part.

But I stand by my point that Frank isn't respected as a shooter either and is in no way a solution to Julius getting doubled. Despite having a better 3pt rate, he simply does not get anywhere near the kind of respect/attention that Barrett, Bullock, Burks & Quickley do.


EDIT:
Wait a minute, I didn't ever say Frank & Elf were the same...did I?

They'll start respecting Franks 3 mid-game when he starts hitting 2 or 3 of them and they can't double Julius anymore..

Or they'll start giving him the full Elf after he shanks his first one & gets scared Frank took 48 3s all season, that's a minuscule sample size.

Either way, my point was that they don't respect him yet, not that it's impossible for Frank to ever earn that respect.

[Davis18]

I don't think anyone is advocating Frank to be starting PG in playoffs.
I just want Frank to get Payton's playing time.

[Clyde_Style]

Frank has cornrows now. He will reveal his new Randlesque powers in the playoffs.