Hawks (5) @ Knicks (4) - Playoffs Round 1 - Game 1 - SUNDAY May 23 - 7:00pm

[snadler]

Elf averaged 15mpg this month, after getting 19mpg in April, 23mpg in March, 27.5mpg in February & over 29mpg in January.

It's safe to say that Thibs recognizes that Elf is a problem for us.

Apparently he doesn't recognize it enough

Or being in that locker room he may have a different perspective on what dropping Elf from the rotation would mean...especially with everyone so accustomed to the roles that they have been filling. Not many people are going to argue that Elf doesn't suck, but what's best for the locker-room isn't always what's best for the NetRtg, and maybe this is one of those situations

I'm hopeful that that isn't the case and Thibs just didn't have the time between games to make that big of a change to the rotation without risking us falling out of the 4/5 match up and is currently getting everyone used to Burks or Quickley starting...but there could well be some morale/tactical reasoning that just can not be deciphered from the outside.

I appreciate you trying to defend thibs decision for starting Payton, but if you pay attention to what's been going on, nobody on the roster will say it publicly which speaks to the new culture, but it's pretty clear Payton isn't well liked on the floor or in the locker room. There are plenty of videos of Randle and RJ yelling at payton, there is video of Payton sulking on the bench, video of Payton sulking and not hustling on the floor.

[Gravy]

List of playoff experience between the two young teams

Derrick Rose - 2008-2015 Chi, 2017-18 Min
Reggie Bullock - 2013-14 Clippers 5 minutes, 2015-16 Pistons
Alec Burks- 2011-12, 2017-18 Utah, 2019-20 Philly
Taj Gibson - 2009-2015 Chi, 2016-17 OKC, 2017-18 Min
Nerlens Noel - 2018-19, 2019-20 OKC
Norvel Pelle - 2019-20 Phi 7 minutes
RJ Barrett
Julius Randle
Immanuel Quickley
Elfrid Payton
Obi Toppin
Kevin Knox
Frank Ntilikina
Mitchell Robinson
Theo Pinson  
Jared Harper

Hawks
Solomon Hill - 2013-14 2015-16 Ind, 2017-18 Pelicans, 2019-20 Heat
Danilo Gallinari - 2010-2012 Den, 2018-19 Clippers, 2019-20 OKC
Tony Snell - 2013-2015 Chi, 2016-2019 Mil
Lou Williams -2007-2009, 2010-2012 Phi 2013-14 Atl, 2014-15 Tor, 2016-17 Hou 2018-20 Clips
Clint Capela - 2014-2019 Hou
Kevin Huerter
Trae Young
John Collins
Onyeka Okongwu
Brandon Goodwin
Bogdan Bogdanović
Nathan Knight  
Skylar Mays  
Bruno Fernando
Cam Reddish
De'Andre Hunter
Kris Dunn

[cgf]

Apparently he doesn't recognize it enough

Or being in that locker room he may have a different perspective on what dropping Elf from the rotation would mean...especially with everyone so accustomed to the roles that they have been filling. Not many people are going to argue that Elf doesn't suck, but what's best for the locker-room isn't always what's best for the NetRtg, and maybe this is one of those situations

I'm hopeful that that isn't the case and Thibs just didn't have the time between games to make that big of a change to the rotation without risking us falling out of the 4/5 match up and is currently getting everyone used to Burks or Quickley starting...but there could well be some morale/tactical reasoning that just can not be deciphered from the outside.

I appreciate you trying to defend thibs decision for starting Payton, but if you pay attention to what's been going on, nobody on the roster will say it publicly which speaks to the new culture, but it's pretty clear Payton isn't well liked on the floor or in the locker room. There are plenty of videos of Randle and RJ yelling at payton, there is video of Payton sulking on the bench, video of Payton sulking and not hustling on the floor.

That doesn't mean they don't love him in the locker-room. I can speak with confidence about german football, where a number of my friends work as scouts or youth-team coaches and so I've gotten to share some beers with a number of high-level coaches in that sport. And they've told me about guys who fans & the press assumed weren't liked because they got into it with teammates on the pitch or seemed to sulk on the bench, but who were actually the most popular guys in their locker rooms...who guys whose teammates felt comfortable enough with to yell at each other in games & who "sulked" because of how disappointed in themselves they were for letting the team down. And I would be surprised if the same thing didn't happen in basketball.

I have no clue if that is or isn't the case with Payton, but those "signs" that you're referring to, don't tell us either way...and I certainly hope that's not the case, as it would mean Thibs taking advantage of this time he has to make a change, would be less likely.

[Nazrmohamed]

Elf averaged 15mpg this month, after getting 19mpg in April, 23mpg in March, 27.5mpg in February & over 29mpg in January.

It's safe to say that Thibs recognizes that Elf is a problem for us.

.




Apparently he doesn't recognize it enough

Has to be a contract thing. But my thing is, who tf is Elfrid Payton to have a starting stipulation in his contract?

Or maybe Thibs just way too superstitious. I guess it’s a matter of if it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

That's exactly what it is. I myself have those superstitions and it ain't healthy sometimes. I hate change and it's like whatever is happening it's working so don't ask questions. Maybe as bad as he is he takes up minutes Rose needs to rest. Also I am genuinely scared that Rose could start out hot and then get gassed at the wrong time and then if it's Peyton coming off the bench hes more of a caretaker who can't dig us out. Some nights Peyton will play well and then when he doesn't at least I know Rose and Quickley can perform heroics.
I often wonder how the hell we win games with Peyton............yet we do. So again, it's unhealthy cuz you won't know when it won't work, until it doesn't. Let's hope it's not now against Atlanta

But make no mistake, he cannot be here next season.

[F N 11]

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But the Knicks aren’t cool

People sleeping on our home court advantage. Knicks will be playing with extra energy and defense chants from jump.

[cgmw]

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But the Knicks aren’t cool

People sleeping on our home court advantage. Knicks will be playing with extra energy and defense chants from jump.

It’s so special and so different than anywhere else. Will be interesting with the limited capacity, but especially against teams like the Hawks who have (sorry, Atlanta) terrible arenas and/or absent fans, it’s just demoralizing to see what a real arena/fanbase sounds like.

I would have loved to host the three stooges from Brooklyn just to watch it sink in to their sensitive sensintive skin that New York really doesn’t give a single f*cking sh*t about them.

[Nazrmohamed]

I still say the x factor in this series is rj. If Rowan's on for most of the series, we win, if not, it will be tragic.

Well if he starts to falter it's up to Thibs to recognize it fast and early and get Burks into the game. Problem is RJ never starts out hot. He's more of a second half player and by then it's too late....if he doesn't get it going that is.

[Deeeez Knicks]

I still say the x factor in this series is rj. If Rowan's on for most of the series, we win, if not, it will be tragic.

Well if he starts to falter it's up to Thibs to recognize it fast and early and get Burks into the game. Problem is RJ never starts out hot. He's more of a second half player and by then it's too late....if he doesn't get it going that is.

It might just be a bad excuse, but i do feel like some of that is cause Payton is just a terrible PG and useless on offense. RJ always seems to turn it up when Payton heads to the bench in the 3rd. The extra spacing may help him more then anyone else.

[SelbyCobra]

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But the Knicks aren’t cool

Geez, that franchise is so disappointing. They've managed to assemble a trio of superstars against all odds and expectations, at a level that the league may have never seen before. Undeniably impressive work by the basketball people.

At the same time, their fanbase has remained moribund and pathetic. They were the upstart team of the NBA a couple of years ago, made the playoff in a shocker...and had the lowest attendance in the entire league. The organization literally is giving 50% off playoff tickets now, with three megastars leading them to one of the best records in the league, under the guise of "James Harden is taking care of the best fans in the world", yet when they're still not gone this afternoon as your tweet shows. The truth is revealed that Knicks fans - chastised as jealous or petty - have been right along that nobody cares about the Brooklyn Nets.

And drilling down even deeper, knowing Durant and Kyrie actively chose Brooklyn specifically because they knew it was a pathetic fanbase and irrelevant organization in NYC makes it that much more disappointing. Choosing to make top dollar with no pressure and no expectations playing for a relatively non-existent fanbase and media presence doesn't make me want to scream GOAT about those guys, despite their impressive on-court results.

[BBALLER4FR]

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[blueNorange]

i'm sort of scared of thibs rotation, while i do believe they plan on using frank in the rotation it also doesn't sound like payton is being benched. you also got to assume the rotation will be very tight, almost all the main guys will play 30+ minutes

randle/rj/bullock will get 40+ minutes
rose and burks will get 30+ minutes
taj and noel will split time


that's 7 players, obi will get like 3 minutes max making 8.

will thibs play more than 8? and if he does, is it iq vs frank?

i hope i'm wrong.

god dammit f payton.

[Chanel Bomber]

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But the Knicks aren’t cool

Geez, that franchise is so disappointing. They've managed to assemble a trio of superstars against all odds and expectations, at a level that the league may have never seen before. Undeniably impressive work by the basketball people.

At the same time, their fanbase has remained moribund and pathetic. They were the upstart team of the NBA a couple of years ago, made the playoff in a shocker...and had the lowest attendance in the entire league. The organization literally is giving 50% off playoff tickets now, with three megastars leading them to one of the best records in the league, under the guise of "James Harden is taking care of the best fans in the world", yet when they're still not gone this afternoon as your tweet shows. The truth is revealed that Knicks fans - chastised as jealous or petty - have been right along that nobody cares about the Brooklyn Nets.

And drilling down even deeper, knowing Durant and Kyrie actively chose Brooklyn specifically because they knew it was a pathetic fanbase and irrelevant organization in NYC makes it that much more disappointing. Choosing to make top dollar with no pressure and no expectations playing for a relatively non-existent fanbase and media presence doesn't make me want to scream GOAT about those guys, despite their impressive on-court results.

KD always takes the easy way out, and barks when people rightly point it out. That's why he went to Golden State, and that's why he was never coming to the Knicks. He doesn't want the pressure, yet he wants to be perceived as if he did. That's why he's so insecure and defensive.

I don't blame Kyrie because he grew up a Nets fan when they played in Jersey.

As for Harden, what he did to his teammates and coaches in Houston is flat-out unethical (in my view) and a complete beach move. Dude quit on his team.

I have no respect for that team or the manner in which they assembled their roster (not because of free agency but because of Harden forcing his trade in the way that he did). I would hate to root for that team if they were the Knicks. Outside of Kyrie (whose narcissism I also dislike), they have no soul and no charm.

[NYKat]

Payton having a bounce back series is all that’s missing from this season

[Dave DaButcher]

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But the Knicks aren’t cool

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[KnixtapeH20]

i'm sort of scared of thibs rotation, while i do believe they plan on using frank in the rotation it also doesn't sound like payton is being benched. you also got to assume the rotation will be very tight, almost all the main guys will play 30+ minutes

randle/rj/bullock will get 40+ minutes
rose and burks will get 30+ minutes
taj and noel will split time


that's 7 players, obi will get like 3 minutes max making 8.

will thibs play more than 8? and if he does, is it iq vs frank?

i hope i'm wrong.

god dammit f payton.

Payton is not getting a lot of minutes fam.. Hopefully it's not even more than the decending minutes hes been getting

[ITGM]

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[makeitstop]

Nate got fined $25K for saying the league wants NYK in the playoffs...

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[DaGawd]

Just copped tickets and a flight to atl.. gonna be repping for us at game 4

[stuporman]

Just copped tickets and a flight to atl.. gonna be rapping for us at game 4

[HarthorneWingo]

Thibs thinking about adding Frank to the rotation against ATL....

https://sny.tv/articles/knicks-tom-thibodeau-mix-up-pg-rotation-

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Of course. It would be malpractice not to. In fact, I've been saying this since the last time we played the Hawks until Trae went down with that ankle sprain. Now that Frank seems to be comfortable out there shooting 3s, there's no reason not to do this at the expense of Payton's and maybe even IQ's minutes. You never know how a rookie is going to respond to NBA playoff pressure. Plus, teams will have a defensive game plan for him.