Hal’s Draft Thread

[ICeeYou]

I liked the Edwards pick well enough at the time, but.. Thybulle was a much safer pick, higher floor.. would have been better in hindsight. Danny got a little too cute. Were we trying to shave salary to max Kemba that year?

Loved the Grant pick, this year was disappointing.

Pretty clearly, the had Romeo in their pocket and decided that Romeo projected into a similar role but was a better prospect. So they did the sensible thing and capitalized on the interest in Thybulle to turn him into two college players they felt could come in and contribute as role guys with NBA ready bodies in Carsen and Grant.

I think that basically though, these are the types of guys who have a chance to become rotation players and so far it’s not really panned out for either player. Like most second round late first rounders though, they still hold some potential.

I know it’s fun to make jokes about end of the bench guys but they are both guys another organization would pick up thinking they could slot them into the roles the Celtics thought they could play.

Carsen Edwards with an NBA-ready body?

Absolutely. He’s short but has plus NBA athleticism. He’s fast, quick, and pretty explosive finishing.

He’s been bad defensively and his shot hasn’t really translated but for his size he’s a very good athlete.

[winsomme2]

Pretty clearly, the had Romeo in their pocket and decided that Romeo projected into a similar role but was a better prospect. So they did the sensible thing and capitalized on the interest in Thybulle to turn him into two college players they felt could come in and contribute as role guys with NBA ready bodies in Carsen and Grant.

I think that basically though, these are the types of guys who have a chance to become rotation players and so far it’s not really panned out for either player. Like most second round late first rounders though, they still hold some potential.

I know it’s fun to make jokes about end of the bench guys but they are both guys another organization would pick up thinking they could slot them into the roles the Celtics thought they could play.

Carsen Edwards with an NBA-ready body?

Absolutely. He’s short but has plus NBA athleticism. He’s fast, quick, and pretty explosive finishing.

He’s been bad defensively and his shot hasn’t really translated but for his size he’s a very good athlete.

The shooting is everything. It's why he got drafted. and he just can't make threes.

[cloverleaf]

Pretty clearly, the had Romeo in their pocket and decided that Romeo projected into a similar role but was a better prospect. So they did the sensible thing and capitalized on the interest in Thybulle to turn him into two college players they felt could come in and contribute as role guys with NBA ready bodies in Carsen and Grant.

I think that basically though, these are the types of guys who have a chance to become rotation players and so far it’s not really panned out for either player. Like most second round late first rounders though, they still hold some potential.

I know it’s fun to make jokes about end of the bench guys but they are both guys another organization would pick up thinking they could slot them into the roles the Celtics thought they could play.

Carsen Edwards with an NBA-ready body?

Absolutely. He’s short but has plus NBA athleticism. He’s fast, quick, and pretty explosive finishing.

He’s been bad defensively and his shot hasn’t really translated but for his size he’s a very good athlete.

I'd say he has an under-6' league-ready body. He tied for the worst DRtg on the team this year at 116 and had far and away the worst DBPM at -1.9. Just plays way too short for the modern, switching D. (On the offensive side, his .527 TS% was #20 out of 22 players on the team, in part due to his 2nd-behind-Kemba rate of 8.2 3PAs at a .286 clip.)

[ICeeYou]

Carsen Edwards with an NBA-ready body?

Absolutely. He’s short but has plus NBA athleticism. He’s fast, quick, and pretty explosive finishing.

He’s been bad defensively and his shot hasn’t really translated but for his size he’s a very good athlete.

I'd say he has an under-6' league-ready body. He tied for the worst DRtg on the team this year at 116 and had far and away the worst DBPM at -1.9. Just plays way too short for the modern, switching D. (On the offensive side, his .527 TS% was #20 out of 22 players on the team, in part due to his 2nd-behind-Kemba rate of 8.2 3PAs at a .286 clip.)

He’s short but he’s actually got good length. 6’ with a 6’6” wingspan and rock solid at 200 lbs out of college.

He, however, hasn’t been able to put those tools to good use defensively. He fouls a lot and doesn’t anticipate well. He hasn’t been good defensively whatsoever but I’m sure the thinking was that he had some potential there to complement his spark plug scoring.

It hasn’t happened but he’s one of those guys that probably kicks around the league and eventually finds a home. Maybe not, and probably never gonna happen in Boston, but he could be useful somewhere still.

[BostonCouchGM]

I don't expect Edwards back.

you mean you don't believe in 5'11 shooting guards that cant make shots or pass??

lol, it's funny how apologists like to pretend that drafting is so hard and it's essentially a crap shoot and 2nd rounders are mostly worthless. Yes, it can be tricky because you can't measure a player's heart, how they'll respond to coaching, their work ethic or whether they're a knucklehead or not. But you CAN measure their size, length, speed, athleticism and at the bare minimum, make sure they have the requisite blend of those traits for the position they play. If you just do that you'll mitigate most draft mistakes. Skills like shooting, rebounding and defense can be taught or worked on. BBIQ, size and length can not. I personally think Thybulle is incredibly overrated as a defender. He's more of an opportunistic defender with good anticipation and is very active so he gets lots of steals and forces turnovers. But on man isn't anything special. I don't mind passing on him given what we already had at the 2/3. I DO mind the Williams and Edwards picks instead of many others. Those two picks will be felt for years. Trading last year's #30 pick when half a dozen guys I loved were still on the board hurts a lot. Trading #16 in this year's draft will only add to the misery. It's been a really bad few seasons. Thankfully Pritchard and Nesmith were great picks or we'd be the Wizards or Kings.

[return2glory]

Edwards is a disappointment.. Can’t remember what we were trying to do with the cap, but we would’ve been better off keeping the 1st and drafting Thybulle..

Not sure what they’ve been hoping for from Waters - that he’d learn to play undersized? He’s a legitimately gifted point, he’s just small.

The grass isn’t always greener.. and the second round just isn’t a reliable place to find talent - no team can do it consistently.

At the time of the draft, Carsen was looked upon as a steal and he excelled in summer league too. So a few years later he looks like he isn’t a great pick. Oh well, what more do you want? Some players fail to meet expectations. When it’s a #1 pick it’s a disaster. When it’s a second round pick, who the $&#@ really cares?

So Thybulle is a little better. He’s still a jag that doesn’t move the needle at all in the big picture. So Brandon Clarke had a better rookie year than Grant. He still doesn’t make a difference in whether or not this team wins a title.

The thought process behind that draft was sound and it didn’t work out perfectly. Honestly, Ainge could have given those picks away and it wouldn’t change a thing. Phoenix drafted Alex Len, Jackson, Dragon Bender etc. and so many other busts and then made one trade for Chris Paul and are in the finals and favorites to win it all.

The big picture is that we have 2 young studs on the verge of a legit 4-5 year runand the team needs to bring in the right pieces. Late first round draft picks and second rounders are great when you get lucky and land a guy like Jokic or Green but 99% of the time they flame out.

Edwards was great coming out of Purdue. He had an amazing tournament too. The Celtics weren't a good fit. Celtics tried to turn a 5'11 shooting first PG into a SG. Huge mistake, especially when we had a 6'0 PG in Kemba. To make matters worst, Ainge drafted 5'10 Waters and they paired them together. Edwards had little chance in Boston to succeed.

I'm hoping Edwards catches on with another team and has a solid career.

At this point, Boston needs to move on from Waters, Edwards, Semi and even Tacko. I thought Tacko would have gotten more of a chance last season but it didn't happen.

[Hal14]

Potential target with pick 45.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

He is a really good defender. Solid rebounder also and an underrated passer. But he can't shoot or else he would be a 1st rounder.

Exactly. All of these guys have flaws. None of them are perfect. Hell, Scottie Barnes is the consensus no. 6 pick in the draft and he's a SF who's a worse shooter than Jones.

You have to just look at the whole package and pick the best player available at 45 who fits our needs. Herb Jones might be that guy.

If he was a really good shooter, he'd probably be a lottery pick. As it is now, he could be a really good pick at 45. Love his defense, really like his passing, good rebounder and really good with dribble drives moves and finishes inside. 35% from 3 isn't bad - NBA league average is 36%.

We could do much worse with this pick than Herb Jones. 6'7" with a 7'0" wingspan. Won SEC Player of the year and SEC Defensive player of the year. And he played all 4 yrs of college so he's more seasoned and ready to contribute right away rather than being a development project.

[Hal14]

Yeah, I’ve heard the same. Brad/Ime don’t want any more young guys that can’t contribute.

Pretty easily could open up spots by moving on from Waters and Edwards, no?

I agree that we don't want a roster filled with players who can't play, but lets move on from the ones that we know can't contribute instead of wasting more draft picks.

If looking to draft and stash, perhaps give this guy some consideration.

Watch on YouTube

I like Rokas, but he' a a very similar player to Madar, except Madar is an inch shorter but put up overall better stats this season than Rokas, and Madar is also a better defender. I think another NBA team who doesn't already have another young PG with similar skill set would be very wise to draft Rokas in the 2nd round.

[Hal14]

1. Tatum
2. Brown
3. Horford
4. Smart
5. Thompson
6. Parker
7. Rob
8. Grant
9. Romeo
10. Nesmith
11. Pritchard
12. Edwards

That leaves 3 spots on the active roster barring a trade. Maybe, maybe the Celtics can do a 2 for 1 or 3 for 1 trade centered on Thompson.

But for the sake of discussion, let’s assume Thompson, Grant and Edwards are back. That would mean the #45 takes up 1 of 3 spots left. If you wanted to bring Yam over you would only have roster space for 1 free agent.

13. Yam
14. MLE free agent/Fournier
15. #45 pick

Maybe if you flip Thompson and Carsen for a player or pure space, sure. But then you’re out a veteran possibly. I don’t see this team as needing 8-9 roster spots for developing young players.

-I'd say a 90% chance either Thompson or Time Lord gets traded.
-Smart might get traded
-Edwards (hopefully) either gets traded or if no one will take him in a trade we just cut him
-Hopefully either Grant or Parker, 1 of them either gets traded or cut
-Romeo or Nesmith might also be packaged up in a trade for a veteran/star player too

There's a lot of uncertainty with the roster. What is certain is:

while we do want to add veterans rather than young draft picks, the fact is that:

a) even teams who are in "win now" mode, teams who are contenders very rarely ever trade away ALL of their picks in a given draft. The 45h pick is literally the only pick we have this draft. It's just not smart to trade all of your picks in a given draft. Even if you're the defending NBA champs, you need to keep a pipeline of young talent flowing into the organization in order to stay competitive long term

b) this is a VERY deep draft. Case in point, Moses Wright IMO is actually a slightly better pick than Kai Jones yet Jones is projected to go in the 10-18 range and Wright is projected to go in the 44-54 range. Jalen Suggs is basically the same player is Jaden Springer yet Suggs is projected top 4 pick and many have Springer going in the 25-30 range. Santi Aldama is arguably a top 20 player in this class but he's projected to go in the 45-55 range. Joe Wieskamp IMO is slightly better prospect than Corey Kispert yet Kispert is the no. 10 ranked player according to Jay Bilas and Wieskamp is rated 65th according to some sites. Wieskamp is basically a Duncan Robinson clone with more athleticism. And Robinson was a starter and 15 PPG scorer last year for the eastern conference champs Heat. Wieskamp is one of 5-7 players in this draft who could be available at 45 who could all potentially be starters on this celtics team within the next 2-3 yrs.

As wisonme said, it'll likely be both, not either/or. We'll have a few open roster spots. 1 of them will probably be for the 45th pick and the others can be for veterans. And like wisonme also mentioned, that's the nice thing about 2nd round picks is you don't have to give them a contract if they don't earn a roster spot in summer league/training camp so you've got nothing to lose - but everything to gain if they turn out to be the next Duncan Robinson.

[ICeeYou]

1. Tatum
2. Brown
3. Horford
4. Smart
5. Thompson
6. Parker
7. Rob
8. Grant
9. Romeo
10. Nesmith
11. Pritchard
12. Edwards

That leaves 3 spots on the active roster barring a trade. Maybe, maybe the Celtics can do a 2 for 1 or 3 for 1 trade centered on Thompson.

But for the sake of discussion, let’s assume Thompson, Grant and Edwards are back. That would mean the #45 takes up 1 of 3 spots left. If you wanted to bring Yam over you would only have roster space for 1 free agent.

13. Yam
14. MLE free agent/Fournier
15. #45 pick

Maybe if you flip Thompson and Carsen for a player or pure space, sure. But then you’re out a veteran possibly. I don’t see this team as needing 8-9 roster spots for developing young players.

-I'd say a 90% chance either Thompson or Time Lord gets traded.
-Smart might get traded
-Edwards (hopefully) either gets traded or if no one will take him in a trade we just cut him
-Hopefully either Grant or Parker, 1 of them either gets traded or cut
-Romeo or Nesmith might also be packaged up in a trade for a veteran/star player too

There's a lot of uncertainty with the roster. What is certain is:

while we do want to add veterans rather than young draft picks, the fact is that:

a) even teams who are in "win now" mode, teams who are contenders very rarely ever trade away ALL of their picks in a given draft. The 45h pick is literally the only pick we have this draft. It's just not smart to trade all of your picks in a given draft. Even if you're the defending NBA champs, you need to keep a pipeline of young talent flowing into the organization in order to stay competitive long term

b) this is a VERY deep draft. Case in point, Moses Wright IMO is actually a slightly better pick than Kai Jones yet Jones is projected to go in the 10-18 range and Wright is projected to go in the 44-54 range. Jalen Suggs is basically the same player is Jaden Springer yet Suggs is projected top 4 pick and many have Springer going in the 25-30 range. Santi Aldama is arguably a top 20 player in this class but he's projected to go in the 45-55 range. Joe Wieskamp IMO is slightly better prospect than Corey Kispert yet Kispert is the no. 10 ranked player according to Jay Bilas and Wieskamp is rated 65th according to some sites. Wieskamp is basically a Duncan Robinson clone with more athleticism. And Robinson was a starter and 15 PPG scorer last year for the eastern conference champs Heat. Wieskamp is one of 5-7 players in this draft who could be available at 45 who could all potentially be starters on this celtics team within the next 2-3 yrs.

As wisonme said, it'll likely be both, not either/or. We'll have a few open roster spots. 1 of them will probably be for the 45th pick and the others can be for veterans. And like wisonme also mentioned, that's the nice thing about 2nd round picks is you don't have to give them a contract if they don't earn a roster spot in summer league/training camp so you've got nothing to lose - but everything to gain if they turn out to be the next Duncan Robinson.

We shall see on player movement on the roster. My point is pretty simple: the Celtics have enough young players on the roster to develop. If some of those young players are traded, it’s worth it to bring #45 onto the roster. If not, then I’d prefer to stash a player in Europe and add veterans to fill roster spots.

I’ve watched some tape on the second round guys and they look like what we often see in the second round. Guys with potential but with question marks in certain key areas.

Wieskamp seems like a savvy guy with a nice shot but can he defend and does he have the size athleticism to hang in switch heavy defenses against a variety of NBA athletes. Moses Wright looks like a very good athlete until you ask him to defend quickness in the PnR and then he looks like barbecue chicken.

So sure, if the Celtics end up moving off a couple young guys, prioritize bringing in one of these type of guys. If not, find the most talented guy overseas and stash him.

[winsomme2]

How are we feeling about Terrence Shannon?

Seems like he checks a lot of boxes and his draft stock is all over the place so he definitely could be there at 45.

[winsomme2]

1. Tatum
2. Brown
3. Horford
4. Smart
5. Thompson
6. Parker
7. Rob
8. Grant
9. Romeo
10. Nesmith
11. Pritchard
12. Edwards

That leaves 3 spots on the active roster barring a trade. Maybe, maybe the Celtics can do a 2 for 1 or 3 for 1 trade centered on Thompson.

But for the sake of discussion, let’s assume Thompson, Grant and Edwards are back. That would mean the #45 takes up 1 of 3 spots left. If you wanted to bring Yam over you would only have roster space for 1 free agent.

13. Yam
14. MLE free agent/Fournier
15. #45 pick

Maybe if you flip Thompson and Carsen for a player or pure space, sure. But then you’re out a veteran possibly. I don’t see this team as needing 8-9 roster spots for developing young players.

-I'd say a 90% chance either Thompson or Time Lord gets traded.
-Smart might get traded
-Edwards (hopefully) either gets traded or if no one will take him in a trade we just cut him
-Hopefully either Grant or Parker, 1 of them either gets traded or cut
-Romeo or Nesmith might also be packaged up in a trade for a veteran/star player too

There's a lot of uncertainty with the roster. What is certain is:

while we do want to add veterans rather than young draft picks, the fact is that:

a) even teams who are in "win now" mode, teams who are contenders very rarely ever trade away ALL of their picks in a given draft. The 45h pick is literally the only pick we have this draft. It's just not smart to trade all of your picks in a given draft. Even if you're the defending NBA champs, you need to keep a pipeline of young talent flowing into the organization in order to stay competitive long term

b) this is a VERY deep draft. Case in point, Moses Wright IMO is actually a slightly better pick than Kai Jones yet Jones is projected to go in the 10-18 range and Wright is projected to go in the 44-54 range. Jalen Suggs is basically the same player is Jaden Springer yet Suggs is projected top 4 pick and many have Springer going in the 25-30 range. Santi Aldama is arguably a top 20 player in this class but he's projected to go in the 45-55 range. Joe Wieskamp IMO is slightly better prospect than Corey Kispert yet Kispert is the no. 10 ranked player according to Jay Bilas and Wieskamp is rated 65th according to some sites. Wieskamp is basically a Duncan Robinson clone with more athleticism. And Robinson was a starter and 15 PPG scorer last year for the eastern conference champs Heat. Wieskamp is one of 5-7 players in this draft who could be available at 45 who could all potentially be starters on this celtics team within the next 2-3 yrs.

As wisonme said, it'll likely be both, not either/or. We'll have a few open roster spots. 1 of them will probably be for the 45th pick and the others can be for veterans. And like wisonme also mentioned, that's the nice thing about 2nd round picks is you don't have to give them a contract if they don't earn a roster spot in summer league/training camp so you've got nothing to lose - but everything to gain if they turn out to be the next Duncan Robinson.

We shall see on player movement on the roster. My point is pretty simple: the Celtics have enough young players on the roster to develop. If some of those young players are traded, it’s worth it to bring #45 onto the roster. If not, then I’d prefer to stash a player in Europe and add veterans to fill roster spots.

I’ve watched some tape on the second round guys and they look like what we often see in the second round. Guys with potential but with question marks in certain key areas.

Wieskamp seems like a savvy guy with a nice shot but can he defend and does he have the size athleticism to hang in switch heavy defenses against a variety of NBA athletes. Moses Wright looks like a very good athlete until you ask him to defend quickness in the PnR and then he looks like barbecue chicken.

So sure, if the Celtics end up moving off a couple young guys, prioritize bringing in one of these type of guys. If not, find the most talented guy overseas and stash him.

But you are including players that really should be moved because they just are not working out.

Honestly, the young players we are developing right now are:

RWill
Langofrd
Pritchard
Nesmith

We should let Yam and 45 play it out this summer. The rest should be moved.

[winsomme2]

Also, the observation you are making about the second round guys this year IMO is what we usually say about the players taken in the 20-30 range.

This year we are saying that about like a solid 40 players. So that gets us deep into the second round where I feel like you are usually drafting complete fliers.

This year we are looking at players who have concrete translatable skills with legit potential for more.

Like:

Boston
Brown
Wieskamp
Grimes
Jones
Christopher

These are first round talent guys that are looking at getting picked in the second round this year

[ICeeYou]

-I'd say a 90% chance either Thompson or Time Lord gets traded.
-Smart might get traded
-Edwards (hopefully) either gets traded or if no one will take him in a trade we just cut him
-Hopefully either Grant or Parker, 1 of them either gets traded or cut
-Romeo or Nesmith might also be packaged up in a trade for a veteran/star player too

There's a lot of uncertainty with the roster. What is certain is:

while we do want to add veterans rather than young draft picks, the fact is that:

a) even teams who are in "win now" mode, teams who are contenders very rarely ever trade away ALL of their picks in a given draft. The 45h pick is literally the only pick we have this draft. It's just not smart to trade all of your picks in a given draft. Even if you're the defending NBA champs, you need to keep a pipeline of young talent flowing into the organization in order to stay competitive long term

b) this is a VERY deep draft. Case in point, Moses Wright IMO is actually a slightly better pick than Kai Jones yet Jones is projected to go in the 10-18 range and Wright is projected to go in the 44-54 range. Jalen Suggs is basically the same player is Jaden Springer yet Suggs is projected top 4 pick and many have Springer going in the 25-30 range. Santi Aldama is arguably a top 20 player in this class but he's projected to go in the 45-55 range. Joe Wieskamp IMO is slightly better prospect than Corey Kispert yet Kispert is the no. 10 ranked player according to Jay Bilas and Wieskamp is rated 65th according to some sites. Wieskamp is basically a Duncan Robinson clone with more athleticism. And Robinson was a starter and 15 PPG scorer last year for the eastern conference champs Heat. Wieskamp is one of 5-7 players in this draft who could be available at 45 who could all potentially be starters on this celtics team within the next 2-3 yrs.

As wisonme said, it'll likely be both, not either/or. We'll have a few open roster spots. 1 of them will probably be for the 45th pick and the others can be for veterans. And like wisonme also mentioned, that's the nice thing about 2nd round picks is you don't have to give them a contract if they don't earn a roster spot in summer league/training camp so you've got nothing to lose - but everything to gain if they turn out to be the next Duncan Robinson.

We shall see on player movement on the roster. My point is pretty simple: the Celtics have enough young players on the roster to develop. If some of those young players are traded, it’s worth it to bring #45 onto the roster. If not, then I’d prefer to stash a player in Europe and add veterans to fill roster spots.

I’ve watched some tape on the second round guys and they look like what we often see in the second round. Guys with potential but with question marks in certain key areas.

Wieskamp seems like a savvy guy with a nice shot but can he defend and does he have the size athleticism to hang in switch heavy defenses against a variety of NBA athletes. Moses Wright looks like a very good athlete until you ask him to defend quickness in the PnR and then he looks like barbecue chicken.

So sure, if the Celtics end up moving off a couple young guys, prioritize bringing in one of these type of guys. If not, find the most talented guy overseas and stash him.

But you are including players that really should be moved because they just are not working out.

Honestly, the young players we are developing right now are:

RWill
Langofrd
Pritchard
Nesmith

We should let Yam and 45 play it out this summer. The rest should be moved.

I’ll explain it again.

The Celtics have these young players on guaranteed contracts:

1. Pritchard
2. Rob
3. Langford
4. Nesmith
5. Grant
6. Carsen
7. Moses Brown

Then they have Yam who they might bring over which would make 8.

IF you don’t bring Yam over and trade away Edwards, you still have 6 out of 15 spots already dedicated to young players.

So, again, if they have 6 young guys on the roster, I want 9 veterans. Pretty simple math here fellas.

What you’re saying is that you’re going to dump 3 of those young guys and not bring Yam over. In that case, sure, add #45 to the roster.

Since I can’t assume that will happen and it’s not super likely they dump 3 of them (while leaving Yam overseas) I’d prefer a draft and stash.

[Hal14]

How are we feeling about Terrence Shannon?

Seems like he checks a lot of boxes and his draft stock is all over the place so he definitely could be there at 45.

He just withdrew from the draft: https://therookiewire.usatoday.com/2021/07/07/texas-tech-terrence-shannon-withdraw-nba-draft/

[Andrew McCeltic]

I’m actually not high on this draft at the top - a ton of talent, but Mobley, Green and Kuminga have more risk than you usually want that high. Mobley might be too thin, Kuminga and Green are raw, and there’s no precedent for how G-League prospects translate to the pros. If anything, there’s a record of fringe players dominating in AAA even more than they did in college.

[winsomme2]

We shall see on player movement on the roster. My point is pretty simple: the Celtics have enough young players on the roster to develop. If some of those young players are traded, it’s worth it to bring #45 onto the roster. If not, then I’d prefer to stash a player in Europe and add veterans to fill roster spots.

I’ve watched some tape on the second round guys and they look like what we often see in the second round. Guys with potential but with question marks in certain key areas.

Wieskamp seems like a savvy guy with a nice shot but can he defend and does he have the size athleticism to hang in switch heavy defenses against a variety of NBA athletes. Moses Wright looks like a very good athlete until you ask him to defend quickness in the PnR and then he looks like barbecue chicken.

So sure, if the Celtics end up moving off a couple young guys, prioritize bringing in one of these type of guys. If not, find the most talented guy overseas and stash him.

But you are including players that really should be moved because they just are not working out.

Honestly, the young players we are developing right now are:

RWill
Langofrd
Pritchard
Nesmith

We should let Yam and 45 play it out this summer. The rest should be moved.

I’ll explain it again.

The Celtics have these young players on guaranteed contracts:

1. Pritchard
2. Rob
3. Langford
4. Nesmith
5. Grant
6. Carsen
7. Moses Brown

Then they have Yam who they might bring over which would make 8.

IF you don’t bring Yam over and trade away Edwards, you still have 6 out of 15 spots already dedicated to young players.

So, again, if they have 6 young guys on the roster, I want 9 veterans. Pretty simple math here fellas.

What you’re saying is that you’re going to dump 3 of those young guys and not bring Yam over. In that case, sure, add #45 to the roster.

Since I can’t assume that will happen and it’s not super likely they dump 3 of them (while leaving Yam overseas) I’d prefer a draft and stash.

Sure if nothing happens, there will potentially be a roster crunch.

I think what many are saying is that we need to aggressively move on from players who are creating this crunch.

They are not in many people's opinion "developing players" for our team. They are potentially putting us in a position where we waste an asset like this pick....which is what we are actually disagreeing about here.

how deep this draft is...

[ICeeYou]

But you are including players that really should be moved because they just are not working out.

Honestly, the young players we are developing right now are:

RWill
Langofrd
Pritchard
Nesmith

We should let Yam and 45 play it out this summer. The rest should be moved.

I’ll explain it again.

The Celtics have these young players on guaranteed contracts:

1. Pritchard
2. Rob
3. Langford
4. Nesmith
5. Grant
6. Carsen
7. Moses Brown

Then they have Yam who they might bring over which would make 8.

IF you don’t bring Yam over and trade away Edwards, you still have 6 out of 15 spots already dedicated to young players.

So, again, if they have 6 young guys on the roster, I want 9 veterans. Pretty simple math here fellas.

What you’re saying is that you’re going to dump 3 of those young guys and not bring Yam over. In that case, sure, add #45 to the roster.

Since I can’t assume that will happen and it’s not super likely they dump 3 of them (while leaving Yam overseas) I’d prefer a draft and stash.

Sure if nothing happens, there will potentially be a roster crunch.

I think what many are saying is that we need to aggressively move on from players who are creating this crunch.

They are not in many people's opinion "developing players" for our team. They are potentially putting us in a position where we waste an asset like this pick....which is what we are actually disagreeing about here.

how deep this draft is...

The 45th pick even in a deep draft isn’t much of an asset and drafting and stashing doesn’t equal “wasting” the asset either.

People can advocate dumping Carsen and Grant in one breath and then talk about the 45th pick being an asset make me chuckle. It usually takes guys drafted in the 20-60 range several years to prove they belong and can contribute.

So the jury is still out on Carsen and Grant. Even if they’re out, you still have Moses and Yam.

The roster crunch is very much real. And having more than a third of the roster being young, unproven players handicaps this team’s ceiling. You can actually bring in upside guys with some experience in the league using the vet minimum or MLE.

Look at someone like Cam Payne as an example. These are the types of opportunities you could be passing up by focusing exclusively on the draft.

[winsomme2]

I’ll explain it again.

The Celtics have these young players on guaranteed contracts:

1. Pritchard
2. Rob
3. Langford
4. Nesmith
5. Grant
6. Carsen
7. Moses Brown

Then they have Yam who they might bring over which would make 8.

IF you don’t bring Yam over and trade away Edwards, you still have 6 out of 15 spots already dedicated to young players.

So, again, if they have 6 young guys on the roster, I want 9 veterans. Pretty simple math here fellas.

What you’re saying is that you’re going to dump 3 of those young guys and not bring Yam over. In that case, sure, add #45 to the roster.

Since I can’t assume that will happen and it’s not super likely they dump 3 of them (while leaving Yam overseas) I’d prefer a draft and stash.

Sure if nothing happens, there will potentially be a roster crunch.

I think what many are saying is that we need to aggressively move on from players who are creating this crunch.

They are not in many people's opinion "developing players" for our team. They are potentially putting us in a position where we waste an asset like this pick....which is what we are actually disagreeing about here.

how deep this draft is...

The 45th pick even in a deep draft isn’t much of an asset and drafting and stashing doesn’t equal “wasting” the asset either.

People can advocate dumping Carsen and Grant in one breath and then talk about the 45th pick being an asset make me chuckle. It usually takes guys drafted in the 20-60 range several years to prove they belong and can contribute.

So the jury is still out on Carsen and Grant. Even if they’re out, you still have Moses and Yam.

The roster crunch is very much real. And having more than a third of the roster being young, unproven players handicaps this team’s ceiling. You can actually bring in upside guys with some experience in the league using the vet minimum or MLE.

Look at someone like Cam Payne as an example. These are the types of opportunities you could be passing up by focusing exclusively on the draft.

These are the things we disagree on.

IMO the jury is not out on Grant and Carsen.

It is IMO wasting the pick if you stash someone overseas instead of picking someone higher on your draft just because you have a roster crunch created by non-contributing players.

You saying that the 45th pick isn't much of an asset and that gets us right back the whole crux of this debate. You are looking at this draft just like any other draft. Many here including myself are seeing first round talent available deep into the second round.

[playa-hater]

Also, the observation you are making about the second round guys this year IMO is what we usually say about the players taken in the 20-30 range.

This year we are saying that about like a solid 40 players. So that gets us deep into the second round where I feel like you are usually drafting complete fliers.

This year we are looking at players who have concrete translatable skills with legit potential for more.

Like:

Boston
Brown
Wieskamp
Grimes
Jones
Christopher

These are first round talent guys that are looking at getting picked in the second round this year

exactly this. Talent is too good to "stash"