Trade Talk (Part Eight)

[winforlose]

General question. Am I correct that because we did not have a first round draft pick in the 2021 NBA draft we must have one in the 2022 NBA draft by rule?

[SmokeyPaw]

We can trade the 2022 1st pick. Prior to the 2021 draft we couldnt since we wouldnt have a pick in two consecutive years. But after the draft we can since we have the 2023 pick. The rule looks forward, not backward.

[theGreatRC]

General question. Am I correct that because we did not have a first round draft pick in the 2021 NBA draft we must have one in the 2022 NBA draft by rule?

After the pick finally went to GSW, we can trade our pick in any trade we do in the future

[winforlose]

General question. Am I correct that because we did not have a first round draft pick in the 2021 NBA draft we must have one in the 2022 NBA draft by rule?

After the pick finally went to GSW, we can trade our pick in any trade we do in the future

Thank you, that sounds right.

[Klomp]

We can trade the 2022 1st pick. Prior to the 2021 draft we couldnt since we wouldnt have a pick in two consecutive years. But after the draft we can since we have the 2023 pick. The rule looks forward, not backward.

This is correct.Also worth noting thatif we say acquired an unprotected pick from another team, it would free the team up to trade both our 2022 and 2023 picks. Because the rule essentially is in place so that "a team can't trade a pick if there is any chance at all that it will leave the team without a first round pick in consecutive future drafts." This is why teams have started to do pick swaps in major trades. It skirts the issue and is allowed.

[Klomp]

Watch on YouTube

The stat about touches and dribbles per touch was really interesting to me. This video is 4 years old, but I can't imagine things changed that much.

[KGdaBom]

Watch on YouTube

The stat about touches and time per touch was really interesting to me. This video is 4 years old, but I can't imagine things changed that much.

Great vid. Thanks. To try to pretend that Jaden McDaniels is anywhere near him as a player just makes me shake my head.

[Klomp]

I thought people might want to hear this. It’s from the NBA Front Office Podcast.

“I know we’ve heard Simmons wants to be in California somewhere, and he’s all about that lifestyle. But if I’m Ben Simmons though, this may not be the worst thing if he ends up on the Timberwolves. Out of the spotlight, you’re on a franchise that has been down in the dumps for years and years and years now. You’re not going to make things any worse by coming there - in fact, if anything, your arrival, if they suddenly become a playoff team - guess what? You get to be the hero that helped lift this franchise up, and the expectations are not going to be as high. But in terms of getting his career back on track - I don’t think this is the worst outcome.”


“Karl-Anthony Towns has never said he wants to be traded, or anything like that. He’s been extremely loyal, and there has never even been buzz except from every other fanbase, who says KAT needs to go somewhere else. So if you’re the Wolves, you say, “yeah, we don’t even want to get it to that point.” We don’t want a Lillard situation, where maybe I’m sorta thinking about a trade. We don’t want that. Karl-Anthony towns, in Minnesota, is starting to feel a little like KG in Minnesota, where KG never wanted to leave! It’s something with Minnesota .. guys like it there! I know, it seems cold all the time .. and you, you’ve basically been a southern climate kind of guy for a longtime, I have been too, so we’re like, “yeah, Minnesota seems like, awful. It’s terrible in the winter!” But guys LOVE it there! Nobody ever wants to leave when they get there, so it’s one of those things where they’re doing something right. I’ve only been there twice in my life, and everybody was so nice, so that’s part of it too.

Here's a link to that discussion. Keith Smith was a former RealGM staff writer and I believe still posts on the forums, for those who didn't know.

Watch on YouTube

[Klomp]

I know they don't have the star power of a Lillard, but what about Memphis as the third team? Kyle Anderson would present some of the same skills Simmons brought Philadelphia, and they can choose a PG between Tyus Jones and the veteran Rondo. The other thing they have to dangle is Jaren Jackson Jr. I'm not exactly sure what his whole injury situation was last year, but I could see Memphis try to move on, and I could see the Sixers taking a chance and buying low on a pretty good talent. Plenty of picks would still be involved on our end. This could blend into the Beverley trade even.

[Baseline81]

Great vid. Thanks. To try to pretend that Jaden McDaniels is anywhere near him as a player just makes me shake my head.

Sorry, but you're the type of poster I cannot stand.

I've seen the back and forth between you and SO_MONEY. For the umpteenth time, it's never been a direct comparison between Simmons and McDaniels, but rather the cost-benefit analysis of such a trade that includes McDaniels.

[VeritasTri]

You can't be serious. Have you seen Ant with the ball in his hands when we need a basket? Ant operates like Harden or Wade. He creates his own shot at will. He doesn't need Simmons to set him up. Neither does Dlo. We need Ben to play down low and rebound like hell. We need him to drive and score from the spaced perimeter. Ben can be a great passer to cutters for easy baskets. We need Ben to play a very different role here than he has played before. He's not really a PG. He's a point forward. Big difference. The days of having a PG playing tic tac toe and running the show are mostly in the past. Can Ben succeed in the role he has to play here? I think he can. I'm just not willing to trade away our future to get him. For the right price...yes.

Harden has been around 11 assists a game the last 3 years, dont embarrass yourself by saying "Ant operates like Harden".

Hes good in ISO, thats not the same as running the offense or being a primary ball handler. Hes not good at creating for others in those situations and is only able to make basic reads and dumps off when his drives are stuffed up. Simmons is infinitely better than Dlo and especially Ant in terms of manipulating defenses and finding the open man for good shots, its not close. Theres still plenty of room to take advantage of Ants ability to get his own, but we should look to work with the strengths of all of our players.

Who gives a damn if players "need" a guy to set them up, its about getting good shots up for your team. So if a guy excels in getting good looks for others you take advantage of that skill. Sure Dlo COULD generate his own pull up mid range shot, but I would sure as hell rather have him taking an open spot up 3 with his feet set.

[jpatrick]

I know they don't have the star power of a Lillard, but what about Memphis as the third team? Kyle Anderson would present some of the same skills Simmons brought Philadelphia, and they can choose a PG between Tyus Jones and the veteran Rondo. The other thing they have to dangle is Jaren Jackson Jr. I'm not exactly sure what his whole injury situation was last year, but I could see Memphis try to move on, and I could see the Sixers taking a chance and buying low on a pretty good talent. Plenty of picks would still be involved on our end. This could blend into the Beverley trade even.

I don’t think Anderson would be enough of win-now piece but who knows. Anderson, Beasley, Anderson and several FRPs and swaps, maybe?

Unlike our previous front offices, I’m confident Rosas is calling every team in the league trying to pry pieces Philly wants. Lack of effort or creativity will not be a problem.

I look at San Antonio. Murray is a really good fit in Philly given his defensive and creation abilities. SA has a ton of guards too. The problem is SA wants Simmons for themselves.

[KGdaBom]

Great vid. Thanks. To try to pretend that Jaden McDaniels is anywhere near him as a player just makes me shake my head.

Sorry, but you're the type of poster I cannot stand.

I've seen the back and forth between you and SO_MONEY. For the umpteenth time, it's never been a direct comparison between Simmons and McDaniels, but rather the cost-benefit analysis of such a trade that includes McDaniels.

I'm sorry you can't stand me, but go back and look. He has been claiming the difference is minimal. It has been a direct comparison.

[IceManBK1]

we should resign vando and give Biyombo a vet min contract. Biyombo could be a solid contributor with 15-18 mins of PT. We'll have a solid bench if we decide to run it back.

Beverly
Beasley
Layman
Vanderbilt
Biyombo and Reid

Dlo
Edwards
Prince
McDaniels
Towns

Need both prince at McDaniels starting because our defense will be better yet we won't compromise that much offense cuz both prince and mcdaniels can shoot and give you at least 10ppg each. Prince and McDaniels will be guarding opposing teams' best guard and best big.

[Baseline81]

I'm sorry you can't stand me, but go back and look. He has been claiming the difference is minimal. It has been a direct comparison.

Please show me a post where SO_MONEY says McDaniels has or will have better stats than Simmons.

From my understanding, he's saying McDaniels can cover a lot of what Simmons brings but at a fraction of the cost ($2M vs. $33M). The dollar variance allows the Wolves better talent at other positions (e.g. Beasley and Gordon/Markkanen vs. minimum players).

[shrink]

Great vid. Thanks. To try to pretend that Jaden McDaniels is anywhere near him as a player just makes me shake my head.

Sorry, but you're the type of poster I cannot stand.

I've seen the back and forth between you and SO_MONEY. For the umpteenth time, it's never been a direct comparison between Simmons and McDaniels, but rather the cost-benefit analysis of such a trade that includes McDaniels.

I'm sorry you can't stand me, but go back and look. He has been claiming the difference is minimal. It has been a direct comparison.

Baseline is right. You have a recurring tendency to overstate or misrepresent what has been said, when you want to argue against a point. You aren’t the only one to do this, but it brings the quality of discussion down. If your position is legitimate (and it often is and I like reading your opinion), you should be able to represent it without dropping to a level where you misrepresent people you disagree with.

For the record, I don’t believe anyone has said, or is pretending, that McDaniels at 19 is “anywhere near” Simmons at age 25.

[Battletrigger]

**** man, you are like childs.

[shrink]

I'm sorry you can't stand me, but go back and look. He has been claiming the difference is minimal. It has been a direct comparison.

Please show me a post where SO_MONEY says McDaniels has or will have better stats than Simmons.

From my understanding, he's saying McDaniels can cover a lot of what Simmons brings but at a fraction of the cost ($2M vs. $33M). The dollar variance allows the Wolves better talent at other positions (e.g. Beasley and Gordon/Markkanen vs. minimum players).

.. and not give up future assets like draft picks to make the trade. Right.

I can see, and respect, how people would have differing views on this, and that’s cool. It’s a legitimate discussion. But I have gotten sick of people mischaracterizing each other’s words. We’re all Wolves fans here, and we can treat each other better than this.

[VeritasTri]

I'm sorry you can't stand me, but go back and look. He has been claiming the difference is minimal. It has been a direct comparison.

Please show me a post where SO_MONEY says McDaniels has or will have better stats than Simmons.

From my understanding, he's saying McDaniels can cover a lot of what Simmons brings but at a fraction of the cost ($2M vs. $33M). The dollar variance allows the Wolves better talent at other positions (e.g. Beasley and Gordon/Markkanen vs. minimum players).

"McDaniels can cover a lot of what Lebron does, why pay Lebron 20X as much for a couple pts/rebs/asts?"

Thats the logic SO_MONEY has used and it deserves ridicule. He makes the argument that their impact on the game/team/winning can be boiled down to nothing more than a couple raw stats and then minimizes the differential in those players.

Its like saying you would rather drive a Mustang in an F1 race because it costs 30k instead of 1.5M and the F1 car "only has a little more HP".

[Baseline81]

"McDaniels can cover a lot of what Lebron does, why pay Lebron 20X as much for a couple pts/rebs/asts?"

Thats the logic SO_MONEY has used and it deserves ridicule. He makes the argument that their impact on the game/team/winning can be boiled down to nothing more than a couple raw stats and then minimizes the differential in those players.

Its like saying you would rather drive a Mustang in an F1 race because it costs 30k instead of 1.5M and the F1 car "only has a little more HP".

Did he say the underline?

I understand your point, but you've used a rather poor analogy.