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OT: The Official COVID/Omicron Variant+ thread

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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#281 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Sep 8, 2021 3:41 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:
BKlutch wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:

A classic. Most people...

After the lesson, of course, he steps right in the big steaming pile o' shīt.


First off, post more often

One of the core distinctions politically are which politicians/parties/administrations defer to actual peer-reviewed scientific research and which don't. Then you can draw a line between who is bias fitting their POV and who is letting their policy be guided by facts.

Because a pandemic is a moving target the single-minded people amongst the population and the politicans will hone in on a single point of information and extrapolate the whole to prove their pre-determined conclusions. It wouldn't matter to them if the source is good or if the data point is fact or fiction, simply that it fits their narrative.

One of the reasons I step on toes is because I'm usually fighting against over-simplications because:

(1) Solutions are complex
(2) We rarely get what we want when we want it anyway
(3) You have to go through points A, B and C to get to D-Z
(4) Real change or progress is a moving target and context shifts

and we are in a civilization now that for the most part has lost the capacity to juggle multiple pieces of information simultaneously while being capable of handling paradox and the grey zones where there are no immediate and easy solutions to a problem

People generally want the simplest explanation and that now often means the explanation that satisfies their emotional bias. A lower ability to process data leads to delusions that THEIR explanation obeys the rule of Occam's Razor (the simplest explanation is often the best one). What those so inclined overlook is that you usually have to wade through data, some of it possibly conflicting, in order to distill the findings and arrive at that simplest explanation.

IOW, our society is too lazy to absorb actual research and prefers whatever fits their emotional POV.

So, yes, the data on MRNA vaccines is vast and quite authoritative, but if you want to bury your head in the sand and cherry pick for objections you can and you will. The reality is there are always outliers and anomalies in any large data set and the data set we have now on those vaccines is massive. It will continue to yield informative insights for years to come and guide future research and policy, but it will shift too as the viruses mutate.

Covid has overwhelmed the thinking capacity of the majority of the world and it is harder to find good information when lazy people spread whatever social media meme they stumble across.

I feel Biden has done a good job. There's always room for improvements I suppose, but from what I can see those improvements require a population that is willing to learn and evolve their thinking. At this point, only tragedy will move those impervious to facts and even then maybe not at all.


Real high stress situations bring out the stupid in society and people.
The USA (not the only country) was well primed to embrace stupidity before Covid; Covid just makes it worse.
Years of economic hardship for certain segments of the country for 30 years and basically, sort of everyone for 12 years, have really set things on the edge.
For the right wing, this anxiety expresses itself in fear, hyper nationalism, racism, and other populist claptrap.
For what is left of the left in this country (not very much, since neither of the two political parties is left wing) this expresses itself in the feeding frenzy of trying to find the most "pure" version in cancel culture etc. The left basically eats itself.
The right wing already does it's own purity thing via Christian right wing politics, and wedge issues like gun rights and abortion.

All this stuff is the sign of a broken, corrupted culture and political system. Mainly, the issue is wealth disparity, expressed American-style. Because Fascism always looks different in every country. Trump left, the fascist mind set remains. And it ain't only among right wingers.

Weimar America.

All this division fits the oligarchical ruling class of this country just fine. Status quo = making money. Don't disrupt it. They won't die in droves from the pandemic. That's for proles.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#282 » by DaGawd » Wed Sep 8, 2021 3:50 pm

Spree2Houston wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
Just curious. Did you post this because you believe it is truthful or not?

I believe it. I try not to really post in threads like this one because of how strong the opinions are on both sides. For me personally as a black man unfortunately I have a strong distrust of our government/media. But that’s a whole nother convo.


As a black man myself I don’t trust it either. My sister-in-law took Moderna and developed hyper thyroid a month after her 2nd shot. Now my brother and sister-in-law are struggling to have children because of her thyroid. Don’t ever feel bad about not taking it. There’s truth on both sides.

I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#283 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Sep 8, 2021 4:17 pm

DaGawd wrote:
Spree2Houston wrote:
DaGawd wrote:I believe it. I try not to really post in threads like this one because of how strong the opinions are on both sides. For me personally as a black man unfortunately I have a strong distrust of our government/media. But that’s a whole nother convo.


As a black man myself I don’t trust it either. My sister-in-law took Moderna and developed hyper thyroid a month after her 2nd shot. Now my brother and sister-in-law are struggling to have children because of her thyroid. Don’t ever feel bad about not taking it. There’s truth on both sides.

I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand


I know two dozen people of various ethnicities who have taken both shots. The are distributed among age groups as well. Zero issues.

Let's all play the anecdotal evidence game.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#284 » by Spree2Houston » Wed Sep 8, 2021 4:47 pm

thebuzzardman wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
Spree2Houston wrote:
As a black man myself I don’t trust it either. My sister-in-law took Moderna and developed hyper thyroid a month after her 2nd shot. Now my brother and sister-in-law are struggling to have children because of her thyroid. Don’t ever feel bad about not taking it. There’s truth on both sides.

I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand


I know two dozen people of various ethnicities who have taken both shots. The are distributed among age groups as well. Zero issues.

Let's all play the anecdotal evidence game.


True. Really large sample size there
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#285 » by iLLmatic860 » Wed Sep 8, 2021 4:55 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:Florida setting the record for stupid. DeSantis should be put on trial

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter


This is why I mask up everywhere public indoors. Florida is the land of the clueless

Florida resident here. I’m glad I got my shot today. I know I shuldve been done it but with the way Desantis has handled covid. It has become pretty normal for everyone to be wreckless. Floridans been living like their Isnt a virus for over a year. now.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#286 » by Capn'O » Wed Sep 8, 2021 4:56 pm

j4remi wrote:Anyway, this is both my attempt to get people to stop conflating government and science. They aren't one in the same and peer-review is a valuable tool in picking out the bad info from the good.


Wonderful post. Highlighting this section as it really gets to the meat of it.

I do think that for a lot of people outside of scientific disciplines it's very difficult to identify where the line between government and science lies and do that research of peer reviewed articles. Especially with groups that have been taken advantage of in the past for government "research." I have a lot of family in science (never caught the bug myself so to speak) and even for me it's tough to go through (news) articles and figure out where they're actually quoting research and whether they're doing it accurately.

It's not an easy one to see. Without that kind of technical acumen, it's easy to end up conflating all presented information as having some sort of equal weight or even add weight to approaches that are not being advocated by "the gov" (aka CDC in this case) for its own sake.

But yes, the TL;DR version of your post is that the vaccines are the best defense because the science says so, not Anthony Faucci (though he also does) or any other political leader.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#287 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Sep 8, 2021 5:10 pm

iLLmatic860 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:Florida setting the record for stupid. DeSantis should be put on trial

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter


This is why I mask up everywhere public indoors. Florida is the land of the clueless

Florida resident here. I’m glad I got my shot today. I know I shuldve been done it but with the way Desantis has handled covid. It has become pretty normal for everyone to be wreckless. Floridans been living like their Isnt a virus for over a year. now.


You're aross the bay from me so you know how it is. This is an alternate reality. I mee people here who tell me the statistics are plummeting when they are actually skyrocketing. They tell me covid was created to put Trump out of power. Or whatever stupid thought they have. Some of them don't even know what Delta is.

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I see more middle aged black people masked up now than white people. I had some dumb Albanian guy telling me covid was being spread by poor blacks and in the same breath he said that's why the health club full of unmasked (mostly white) people is not likely to have any covid in the air (because covid is in the hood).

All I can say is mask up man. Vaccine or not, wear it in close quarters and public spaces indoors, because FL is going to be the leader in breakthrough infections with the way people recklessly spread it here.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#288 » by 3toheadmelo » Wed Sep 8, 2021 5:10 pm

DaGawd wrote:
Spree2Houston wrote:
DaGawd wrote:I believe it. I try not to really post in threads like this one because of how strong the opinions are on both sides. For me personally as a black man unfortunately I have a strong distrust of our government/media. But that’s a whole nother convo.


As a black man myself I don’t trust it either. My sister-in-law took Moderna and developed hyper thyroid a month after her 2nd shot. Now my brother and sister-in-law are struggling to have children because of her thyroid. Don’t ever feel bad about not taking it. There’s truth on both sides.

I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand

she must've missed a routine screening cause it's scientifically impossible for the vaccine to cause cancer. it can't change your DNA.

with that being said the vaccine def has some risks since some people developed blood clots and myocarditis. this risk is pretty rare though. i personally rather take the risk with the vaccine than take the risk of catching covid and it's long term effects.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#289 » by thebuzzardman » Wed Sep 8, 2021 5:27 pm

Spree2Houston wrote:
thebuzzardman wrote:
DaGawd wrote:I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand


I know two dozen people of various ethnicities who have taken both shots. The are distributed among age groups as well. Zero issues.

Let's all play the anecdotal evidence game.


True. Really large sample size there


Almost as large as two people having medical issues
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#290 » by DaGawd » Wed Sep 8, 2021 5:31 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
Spree2Houston wrote:
As a black man myself I don’t trust it either. My sister-in-law took Moderna and developed hyper thyroid a month after her 2nd shot. Now my brother and sister-in-law are struggling to have children because of her thyroid. Don’t ever feel bad about not taking it. There’s truth on both sides.

I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand

she must've missed a routine screening cause it's scientifically impossible for the vaccine to cause cancer. it can't change your DNA.

with that being said the vaccine def has some risks since some people developed blood clots and myocarditis. this risk is pretty rare though. i personally rather take the risk with the vaccine than take the risk of catching covid and it's long term effects.

I really don’t know it’s just strange how quickly it’s developed. She’s stable right now and I continue to pray she over comes it but it definitely made me think.

I may get the shot at some point but right now I’m good with wearing my mask and living healthy as a means to fight getting seriously ill from covid. Working out, moderating my fast food in take etc
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#291 » by 3toheadmelo » Wed Sep 8, 2021 5:49 pm

DaGawd wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand

she must've missed a routine screening cause it's scientifically impossible for the vaccine to cause cancer. it can't change your DNA.

with that being said the vaccine def has some risks since some people developed blood clots and myocarditis. this risk is pretty rare though. i personally rather take the risk with the vaccine than take the risk of catching covid and it's long term effects.

I really don’t know it’s just strange how quickly it’s developed. She’s stable right now and I continue to pray she over comes it but it definitely made me think.

I may get the shot at some point but right now I’m good with wearing my mask and living healthy as a means to fight getting seriously ill from covid. Working out, moderating my fast food in take etc

cancer sucks. my uncle discovered he had cancer like in stage 4 out of nowhere a couple years ago too. i hope your cousin in law beats cancer bro.

the scary thing about COVID is that its been sending healthy people to the ICU. thats why I said fk that I’m getting the vaccine lol. i respect your decision though. its good you’re staying masked up and staying healthy.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#292 » by Jeff Van Gully » Wed Sep 8, 2021 5:58 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
Spree2Houston wrote:
As a black man myself I don’t trust it either. My sister-in-law took Moderna and developed hyper thyroid a month after her 2nd shot. Now my brother and sister-in-law are struggling to have children because of her thyroid. Don’t ever feel bad about not taking it. There’s truth on both sides.

I have a similar situation.. my cousin in law got vaccinated maybe 2 months ago. Shortly after that all of a sudden she developed a cancer that her doctor is just now finding. She’s in stage 4 at the moment and she goes to the doctor somewhat regularly so it’s baffling they didn’t find any signs of this before hand

she must've missed a routine screening cause it's scientifically impossible for the vaccine to cause cancer. it can't change your DNA.

with that being said the vaccine def has some risks since some people developed blood clots and myocarditis. this risk is pretty rare though. i personally rather take the risk with the vaccine than take the risk of catching covid and it's long term effects.


dagawd,

first and foremost, my sincerest best wishes to your cousin and your entire family. i've spent my entire adult life (nearly 20 years now) in healthcare and academia. my first "real" job was at memorial sloan-kettering cancer center. i was there for 6 years on the nursing units as frontline support staff. i've lived the fight. so, love and strength to all of you. i don't know what happened with the vaccine and your cousin. i just want to offer the viewpoint that correlation is not necessarily indicatve of causality. i watched cancer come for everyone for years. there's no rhyme or reason. we talk about risk factors, as we should. but uncontrolled cell division (cancer) happens for myriad undeterminable reasons. i watched healthy young people show up and die. one of them was a peer of mine. same age. healthy. athletic. we would kick it. i lent DVD copies of the wire. we would talk about the show until one day he took a turn and was gone. all i could do was cry with his family. this kind of thing was basically a daily occurrence.

also a black man here. i don't trust the government either. no one in my family does. we have no reason to. and i appreciate remi and cap taking the time to point out that the government and science are not the same thing. the irony is that our government not only didn't develop the vaccines. their role this time last year was to just purchase and distribute them, and we see they willfully did an inadequate job of that. if anyone was anti-vax in 2020, it was the US government led by a president who for one reason or another fed into the distrust. that distrust is a unifying factor among americans from many walks of life and political backgrounds.

the video you shared of the woman identifying as a healthcare worker (i don't think she said nurse directly) is one person's account of purely anecdotal observation. ironically, florida's COVID rates are so out of control the data is hard to track. so i find it concerning to rely on what she is saying without any corroborating data. for now, that plays as just a conversation and opportunity for confirmation bias.

while our government did allow vaccines to be used for emergency disease control, it still took until just a week or so ago for any vaccine to be FDA approved. that should tell you that the government was not hasty in putting a stamp on it. this was the fastest they could get it done under global pandemic circumstances. i trusted available data and my own background in health sciences (including anatomy, physiology, microbiology, etc.) to accept a virus vaccine last december the same way i do with flu shots every fall. (flu shots update continuously to reflect mutations.)

we have more than enough trustworthy scientific data from multiple sources, public AND private, showing that americans from every walk of life are dying from COVID-19 and not a COVID-19 vaccine. breakthrough infections happen, but nowhere near the rate and severity of taking rona to the face unvaccinated. if anything, vaccinated people don't know how many infefctions were prevented by their participation in basic immunology.

there is a risk associated with any intervention. evidence shows that the far greater risk in this case is to get (and spread) COVID-19.

thank you for resisting the desire to stay quiet. i find the position in the video very concerning, as she is not just anti-vaccine but promoting other interventions. but i am glad that you chose to share and engage. and i am again thinking of you and your fam.

sincerely,
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#293 » by j4remi » Wed Sep 8, 2021 6:21 pm

Capn'O wrote:
j4remi wrote:Anyway, this is both my attempt to get people to stop conflating government and science. They aren't one in the same and peer-review is a valuable tool in picking out the bad info from the good.


Wonderful post. Highlighting this section as it really gets to the meat of it.

I do think that for a lot of people outside of scientific disciplines it's very difficult to identify where the line between government and science lies and do that research of peer reviewed articles. I have a lot of family in science (never caught the bug myself so to speak) and even for me it's tough to go through (news) articles and figure out where they're actually quoting research and whether they're doing it accurately. Especially with groups that have been taken advantage of in the past for government "research."

It's not an easy one to see. Without that kind of technical acumen, it's easy to end up conflating all presented information as having some sort of equal weight or even add weight to approaches that are not being advocated by "the gov" (aka CDC in this case) for its own sake.

But yes, the TL;DR version of your post is that the vaccines are the best defense because the science says so, not Anthony Faucci (though he also does) or any other political leader.


Great succinct way to put it at the conclusion.

And 100% agree that without some technical acumen, it can be tough to discern between reputable sources, bad sources, factual reporting, and editorializing (especially in this blogger era imo). I've been working at a health sciences library for over a decade and spent the past 6 working on resource selection directly...so I'm spoiled to have access to everything and to have reviewed a lot of sources and publishing processes in that span. I have zero doubt that I'd be susceptible to a lot of the faux-science out there if I didn't have a place adjacent to the research and publishing. I'm still out of my depths when this stuff gets deep enough into the weeds. If I didn't know about concepts like predatory publishers, pre-prints, and how to use certain databases; I'd feel lost in this era of mass information with little to no curation from most sources.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#294 » by Capn'O » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:12 pm

j4remi wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
j4remi wrote:Anyway, this is both my attempt to get people to stop conflating government and science. They aren't one in the same and peer-review is a valuable tool in picking out the bad info from the good.


Wonderful post. Highlighting this section as it really gets to the meat of it.

I do think that for a lot of people outside of scientific disciplines it's very difficult to identify where the line between government and science lies and do that research of peer reviewed articles. I have a lot of family in science (never caught the bug myself so to speak) and even for me it's tough to go through (news) articles and figure out where they're actually quoting research and whether they're doing it accurately. Especially with groups that have been taken advantage of in the past for government "research."

It's not an easy one to see. Without that kind of technical acumen, it's easy to end up conflating all presented information as having some sort of equal weight or even add weight to approaches that are not being advocated by "the gov" (aka CDC in this case) for its own sake.

But yes, the TL;DR version of your post is that the vaccines are the best defense because the science says so, not Anthony Faucci (though he also does) or any other political leader.


Great succinct way to put it at the conclusion.

And 100% agree that without some technical acumen, it can be tough to discern between reputable sources, bad sources, factual reporting, and editorializing (especially in this blogger era imo). I've been working at a health sciences library for over a decade and spent the past 6 working on resource selection directly...so I'm spoiled to have access to everything and to have reviewed a lot of sources and publishing processes in that span. I have zero doubt that I'd be susceptible to a lot of the faux-science out there if I didn't have a place adjacent to the research and publishing. I'm still out of my depths when this stuff gets deep enough into the weeds. If I didn't know about concepts like predatory publishers, pre-prints, and how to use certain databases; I'd feel lost in this era of mass information with little to no curation from most sources.


Totally. The papers themselves are Greek to me which is why I go fishing for news summaries.

Searching news for good information is just so frustrating. Just these past few weeks, trying to decide whether my daughter should enter kindergarten (OMG :o ) remote or in person I had a hell of a time finding the critical piece of information of why hospitalizations of children have been up so much with Delta. I finally found a news article published in a paper from Sydney, Australia that summarized Delta data well and clearly presented findings showing that the spike was primarily attributable to increased contagion and not increased virulence with children. So we're giving it a go figuring their risk is low and we're vaccinated. And it sounds like vaccine authorization for kids is just around the bend.

But... that's a really, really important piece of information that's just buried. And I don't think most people have the acumen or resources to even ask that question let alone suss out what answers actually make sense from a list of search results.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#295 » by moocow007 » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:21 pm

Clyde_Style wrote:
iLLmatic860 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:Florida setting the record for stupid. DeSantis should be put on trial

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter


This is why I mask up everywhere public indoors. Florida is the land of the clueless

Florida resident here. I’m glad I got my shot today. I know I shuldve been done it but with the way Desantis has handled covid. It has become pretty normal for everyone to be wreckless. Floridans been living like their Isnt a virus for over a year. now.


You're aross the bay from me so you know how it is. This is an alternate reality. I mee people here who tell me the statistics are plummeting when they are actually skyrocketing. They tell me covid was created to put Trump out of power. Or whatever stupid thought they have. Some of them don't even know what Delta is.

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I see more middle aged black people masked up now than white people. I had some dumb Albanian guy telling me covid was being spread by poor blacks and in the same breath he said that's why the health club full of unmasked (mostly white) people is not likely to have any covid in the air (because covid is in the hood).

All I can say is mask up man. Vaccine or not, wear it in close quarters and public spaces indoors, because FL is going to be the leader in breakthrough infections with the way people recklessly spread it here.


Well it was either the poor blacks or the Chinese right lol? You're Albanian friend is obviously an idiot. I still have people by me look at me like I have a 3rd eye on my forehead and avoid me lol. And I live in a pretty affluent white area where you would think they'd be "smarter than that" right? Nope.

This is a good watch (The Point episode by Chris Cilliza):


FYI...I went to a local Fireman's fair over the weekend. Me and my family were one of the few people that actually wore masks (oddly the vast majority of mask wearers in what was a predominantly white attended fair were us so called "minorities"...asians, blacks and hispanics). And yet you should see the looks on these unmasked white parents faces pulling their unmasked kids away from me when I walked by (with my mask on) LOL (i.e. China virus). I even see this on the train where whites (not blacks or hispanics) will avoid the area I sit in.

PS: I've never ever been to China and haven't been to Taiwan in over 30 years...not to mention my English (both spoken and written) is better than probably 90% of the white population. And yet...

People are **** in the head. Honestly. :lol:
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#296 » by DOT » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:31 pm

Capn'O wrote:
j4remi wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
Wonderful post. Highlighting this section as it really gets to the meat of it.

I do think that for a lot of people outside of scientific disciplines it's very difficult to identify where the line between government and science lies and do that research of peer reviewed articles. I have a lot of family in science (never caught the bug myself so to speak) and even for me it's tough to go through (news) articles and figure out where they're actually quoting research and whether they're doing it accurately. Especially with groups that have been taken advantage of in the past for government "research."

It's not an easy one to see. Without that kind of technical acumen, it's easy to end up conflating all presented information as having some sort of equal weight or even add weight to approaches that are not being advocated by "the gov" (aka CDC in this case) for its own sake.

But yes, the TL;DR version of your post is that the vaccines are the best defense because the science says so, not Anthony Faucci (though he also does) or any other political leader.


Great succinct way to put it at the conclusion.

And 100% agree that without some technical acumen, it can be tough to discern between reputable sources, bad sources, factual reporting, and editorializing (especially in this blogger era imo). I've been working at a health sciences library for over a decade and spent the past 6 working on resource selection directly...so I'm spoiled to have access to everything and to have reviewed a lot of sources and publishing processes in that span. I have zero doubt that I'd be susceptible to a lot of the faux-science out there if I didn't have a place adjacent to the research and publishing. I'm still out of my depths when this stuff gets deep enough into the weeds. If I didn't know about concepts like predatory publishers, pre-prints, and how to use certain databases; I'd feel lost in this era of mass information with little to no curation from most sources.


Totally. The papers themselves are Greek to me which is why I go fishing for news summaries.

Searching news for good information is just so frustrating. Just these past few weeks, trying to decide whether my daughter should enter kindergarten (OMG :o ) remote or in person I had a hell of a time finding the critical piece of information of why hospitalizations of children have been up so much with Delta. I finally found a news article published in a paper from Sydney, Australia that summarized Delta data well and clearly presented findings showing that the spike was primarily attributable to increased contagion and not increased virulence with children. So we're giving it a go figuring their risk is low and we're vaccinated. And it sounds like authorization for kids is just around the bend.

But... that's a really, really important piece of information that's just buried. And I don't think most people have the acumen or resources to even ask that question let alone suss out what answers actually make sense from a list of search results.

I think part of it is that our education system just kinda sucks, but another part of it is, it's significantly easier to put out misinformation than it is to disprove it. Like that Mark Twain quote, a lie travels halfway around the world while the truth puts on its shoes or whatever

The big issue is, that for the people spreading misinformation, they don't have to convince anyone they're right, just that there's some doubt. Personally, I don't know many people who say they know for sure the vaccine is bad, just that they don't know if it is or isn't, which is a victory for the anti-vax crowd

Known moon criminal HBomberguy did a video a while back about vaccines and why people are hesitant to take them. It's pretty long and mostly deals with the original "vaccines cause autism" doctor and how f*cked up his study was (like, they would have the parents of autistic kids sign off on procedures which are normally fine for adults, like colonoscopies, but are extremely dangerous for children, especially in some cases toddlers), and how he didn't even find anything, but he ties it in to Covid towards the end.

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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#297 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:31 pm

moocow007 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
iLLmatic860 wrote:Florida resident here. I’m glad I got my shot today. I know I shuldve been done it but with the way Desantis has handled covid. It has become pretty normal for everyone to be wreckless. Floridans been living like their Isnt a virus for over a year. now.


You're aross the bay from me so you know how it is. This is an alternate reality. I mee people here who tell me the statistics are plummeting when they are actually skyrocketing. They tell me covid was created to put Trump out of power. Or whatever stupid thought they have. Some of them don't even know what Delta is.

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I see more middle aged black people masked up now than white people. I had some dumb Albanian guy telling me covid was being spread by poor blacks and in the same breath he said that's why the health club full of unmasked (mostly white) people is not likely to have any covid in the air (because covid is in the hood).

All I can say is mask up man. Vaccine or not, wear it in close quarters and public spaces indoors, because FL is going to be the leader in breakthrough infections with the way people recklessly spread it here.


Well it was either the poor blacks or the Chinese right lol? You're Albanian friend is obviously an idiot. I still have people by me look at me like I have a 3rd eye on my forehead and avoid me lol. And I live in a pretty affluent white area where you would think they'd be "smarter than that" right? Nope.

This is a good watch (The Point episode by Chris Cilliza):


FYI...I went to a local Fireman's fair over the weekend. Me and my family were one of the few people that actually wore masks (oddly the vast majority of mask wearers in what was a predominantly white attended fair were us so called "minorities"...asians, blacks and hispanics). And yet you should see the looks on these unmasked white parents faces pulling their unmasked kids away from me when I walked by (with my mask on) LOL (i.e. China virus). I even see this on the train where whites (not blacks or hispanics) will avoid the area I sit in.

PS: I've never ever been to China and haven't been to Taiwan in over 30 years...not to mention my English (both spoken and written) is better than probably 90% of the white population. And yet...

People are **** in the head. Honestly. :lol:


P.S. The Albanian reference has nothing to do with Wingo. There just happens to be clusters of Albanians here, some of whom happen to be thick as a brick.

Trump and Covid were the double whammy that ripped away all pretensions of tolerance. So many white people are clearly craving their own separate white spaces to function in. If they are rich enough they have gates or they live in gated communities and have their own private security force. And if they are poor they can't have that separation so what you get is mean white rednecks just acting out. I hear them openly bitch about losing their majority and how this is a white nation and they're pissed about losing control. And these are the less well-off ones for gawd's sake. And they say it around me because I'm white and don't realize I'm a multi-cultural mole from NYC
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#298 » by Jeff Van Gully » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:37 pm

moocow007 wrote:
Clyde_Style wrote:
iLLmatic860 wrote:Florida resident here. I’m glad I got my shot today. I know I shuldve been done it but with the way Desantis has handled covid. It has become pretty normal for everyone to be wreckless. Floridans been living like their Isnt a virus for over a year. now.


You're aross the bay from me so you know how it is. This is an alternate reality. I mee people here who tell me the statistics are plummeting when they are actually skyrocketing. They tell me covid was created to put Trump out of power. Or whatever stupid thought they have. Some of them don't even know what Delta is.

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I see more middle aged black people masked up now than white people. I had some dumb Albanian guy telling me covid was being spread by poor blacks and in the same breath he said that's why the health club full of unmasked (mostly white) people is not likely to have any covid in the air (because covid is in the hood).

All I can say is mask up man. Vaccine or not, wear it in close quarters and public spaces indoors, because FL is going to be the leader in breakthrough infections with the way people recklessly spread it here.


Well it was either the poor blacks or the Chinese right lol? You're Albanian friend is obviously an idiot. I still have people by me look at me like I have a 3rd eye on my forehead and avoid me lol. And I live in a pretty affluent white area where you would think they'd be "smarter than that" right? Nope.

This is a good watch (The Point episode by Chris Cilliza):


FYI...I went to a local Fireman's fair over the weekend. Me and my family were one of the few people that actually wore masks (oddly the vast majority of mask wearers in what was a predominantly white attended fair were us so called "minorities"...asians, blacks and hispanics). And yet you should see the looks on these unmasked white parents faces pulling their unmasked kids away from me when I walked by (with my mask on) LOL (i.e. China virus). I even see this on the train where whites (not blacks or hispanics) will avoid the area I sit in.

PS: I've never ever been to China and haven't been to Taiwan in over 30 years...not to mention my English (both spoken and written) is better than probably 90% of the white population. And yet...

People are **** in the head. Honestly. :lol:


it's **** up that you still have to go through that bull, moo. i'm sorry, man. as a fellow minority, i stand in solidarity. **** pisses me off. it takes a lot to get me off my square, but there it is.

it's amazing how the manipulation of biases leads to these things that go beyond self-harming ignorance. people not protecting themselves because of racism still pose harm to the rest of us.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#299 » by Capn'O » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:39 pm

moocow007 wrote:...


I'll preface and end this with, I'm sorry that happened Moo. That's **** up.

Your story reminds me of a Flight of the Conchords episode "Drive By" where a fruit stand owner (Aziz Ansari) starts harassing the main characters because they're New Zealanders. At the end, he learns that he's been confusing Australia with New Zealand and that they don't like Australians either and he apologizes profusely and befriends them. The obvious role reversal being that Ansari is of Indian descent and likely often gets the pejorative assumption that he's from one of the surrounding Muslim countries.

So I'm reading your story like, not only are these people racist but they're not even doing it right.

Anyway, I'm sorry that happened Moo. That's **** up.
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Re: OT: The Official COVID/Delta Variant+ thread 

Post#300 » by Clyde_Style » Wed Sep 8, 2021 7:41 pm

K-DOT wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
j4remi wrote:
Great succinct way to put it at the conclusion.

And 100% agree that without some technical acumen, it can be tough to discern between reputable sources, bad sources, factual reporting, and editorializing (especially in this blogger era imo). I've been working at a health sciences library for over a decade and spent the past 6 working on resource selection directly...so I'm spoiled to have access to everything and to have reviewed a lot of sources and publishing processes in that span. I have zero doubt that I'd be susceptible to a lot of the faux-science out there if I didn't have a place adjacent to the research and publishing. I'm still out of my depths when this stuff gets deep enough into the weeds. If I didn't know about concepts like predatory publishers, pre-prints, and how to use certain databases; I'd feel lost in this era of mass information with little to no curation from most sources.


Totally. The papers themselves are Greek to me which is why I go fishing for news summaries.

Searching news for good information is just so frustrating. Just these past few weeks, trying to decide whether my daughter should enter kindergarten (OMG :o ) remote or in person I had a hell of a time finding the critical piece of information of why hospitalizations of children have been up so much with Delta. I finally found a news article published in a paper from Sydney, Australia that summarized Delta data well and clearly presented findings showing that the spike was primarily attributable to increased contagion and not increased virulence with children. So we're giving it a go figuring their risk is low and we're vaccinated. And it sounds like authorization for kids is just around the bend.

But... that's a really, really important piece of information that's just buried. And I don't think most people have the acumen or resources to even ask that question let alone suss out what answers actually make sense from a list of search results.

I think part of it is that our education system just kinda sucks, but another part of it is, it's significantly easier to put out misinformation than it is to disprove it. Like that Mark Twain quote, a lie travels halfway around the world while the truth puts on its shoes or whatever

The big issue is, that for the people spreading misinformation, they don't have to convince anyone they're right, just that there's some doubt. Personally, I don't know many people who say they know for sure the vaccine is bad, just that they don't know if it is or isn't, which is a victory for the anti-vax crowd

Known moon criminal HBomberguy did a video a while back about vaccines and why people are hesitant to take them. It's pretty long and mostly deals with the original "vaccines cause autism" doctor and how f*cked up his study was (like, they would have the parents of autistic kids sign off on procedures which are normally fine for adults, like colonoscopies, but are extremely dangerous for children, especially in some cases toddlers), and how he didn't even find anything, but he ties it in to Covid towards the end.



It's a whole other tangent, but one of the primary reasons people concoct conspiracy theories is they make bank on it. It's basically monetizing eyeballs and clicks for them. They literally DGAF that they're lying. Most of the people who do the videos are hustlers who figured out how to get their piece of the internet pie. Some of them retire on the books they sell. Or like Dr. Mercola on the products they hawk. He's a very dangerous person.

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