Russell Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years.

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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#101 » by Loneshot » Sun Oct 31, 2021 9:26 pm

GreatWhiteStiff wrote:
Loneshot wrote:Many won't admit that OP is on point because of their KD bias and that they can't comprehend how a dude who averages a triple double can be a negative to your team. It's almost as if most fans only watch Westbrook highlights and never see how bad he disrupts the rhythm in the game.


Is this a troll post? Like it's satire right or something, right?


Why would it be? Westbrook does not play well off ball and cannot stretch the floor. He is an amazing athlete, though he becomes ineffective when teams start playing more strategically in the playoffs.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#102 » by Sedale Threatt » Sun Oct 31, 2021 9:31 pm

I just can't believe the Thunder drafted MVPs in three straight drafts and have zero to show for it.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#103 » by iLLmatic860 » Sun Oct 31, 2021 9:44 pm

Based on this thread. If Bron wins a ring with Russ. He is the undisputed GOAT
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#104 » by hardenASG13 » Sun Oct 31, 2021 10:59 pm

Murray_17 wrote:
hardenASG13 wrote:
Murray_17 wrote:
Westbrook had a bigger usg% than peak KD while they played together... if that doesn't tell you anything you're delusional.

That team had bad luck, yes, but alot of the problems there were the same that you can see around all Westbrook career: Guy just take too much/many stupid shots


That was true through 2012, but westbrook was incredible from 2013-2016. If you factor in their "shooting guard", andre roberson, in the tail end of the westbrook/KD era couldnt dribble a ball in the halfcourt, wasnt guarded, and averaged 1apg in 30 minutes and the usage for Russ was justified. Combine it with their coaching from brooks and donavan, where they basically didnt have any cohesive offense (hard to do with 3 non shooter and a sg who literally couldnt dribble while guarded or attempt a shot off a dribble) and it was easy to see why Russ' usage was so high.

I understand why Westbrook had a high USG%, there is no way to justify him having one that is higher than Kevin Durant.

Just so we understand, Westbrook even had a bigger usg% than KD the season KD was MVP, that's just NUTS


KD just wasnt as aggressive. He shouldve been, i agree.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#105 » by Yoshun » Mon Nov 1, 2021 12:33 am

It wasn't Westbrook that kept KD from being MJ, it was KD, and MJ, if that makes sense. I say that as a huge KD fan.

It wasn't just MJ's skill and work ethic that made him great, it was his drive. Winning was next to breathing for MJ. Every aspect of his life was competitive. He lives to win and wins to live.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#106 » by JN61 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 12:39 am

iLLmatic860 wrote:Based on this thread. If Bron wins a ring with Russ. He is the undisputed GOAT

Westbrook might need a few more rings to catch Jordan. Winning one doesn't make him as one.
Pennebaker wrote:And Bird did it while being a defensive liability. But he also made All-Defensive teams, which was another controversial issue regarding Bird and votes.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#107 » by iLLmatic860 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 12:41 am

JN61 wrote:
iLLmatic860 wrote:Based on this thread. If Bron wins a ring with Russ. He is the undisputed GOAT

Westbrook might need a few more rings to catch Jordan. Winning one doesn't make him as one.

You know what I meant
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#108 » by Murray_17 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 5:14 am

og15 wrote:Why wouldn't that be justifiable when he's the point guard? Usage as a stat is not just about shots attempted



Because outside of shots attempted the only thing counted for usg% is TOV, Minutes played and FT attempts.

PGs have the ball more time in their hands, but usg% rate only considers the time you finished a play, so basically Westbrook called his own number more than it was necessary. If this is true there are 4 options for him having a bigger USG%:

1. he's having a ton of Turnovers
2. he's taking more shots
3. he's playing sustantial more time than KD
4. combinations of 1,2 and 3.

All 4 options are awful, we can compare this with PGs who also are limited when playing off ball, like Chris Paul, who had an USG% of 25% while on the most efficient offense of all time with Harden.

JN61 wrote:
I'm not sure if you know how usage works. When you have less offensive threats on your team as an offensive player, especially as scorer + playmaker, your usage should be naturally higher than player who plays with several offensive threats on the floor at any given time. Curry has no playmaking responsibilities, especially during that era.


This would be a great argument if you could see real reductions in Westbrook usg% across his career, but in his OKC years his usage was similar with KD/Harden and with KD on solo and shoot to stratospheric level without KD. Westbrook posted an stupid usage of 34% with Paul George and Carmelo "still 3rd option in his mind" Anthony.

He had a bigger usg% than Paul George too while in OKC and had the third biggest usage of his career with the rockets.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#110 » by Pennebaker » Mon Nov 1, 2021 5:44 am

Russ was +25 today. Led the Lakers.

I like how people are pretending that Westbrook is a cancer on the order of Kevin Durant or Kyrie Irving. No, unlike those two Westbrook actually has friends and people that like him. Durant and Kyrie only have eachother.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#111 » by og15 » Mon Nov 1, 2021 6:54 am

Murray_17 wrote:
og15 wrote:Why wouldn't that be justifiable when he's the point guard? Usage as a stat is not just about shots attempted



Because outside of shots attempted the only thing counted for usg% is TOV, Minutes played and FT attempts.

PGs have the ball more time in their hands, but usg% rate only considers the time you finished a play, so basically Westbrook called his own number more than it was necessary. If this is true there are 4 options for him having a bigger USG%:

1. he's having a ton of Turnovers
2. he's taking more shots
3. he's playing sustantial more time than KD
4. combinations of 1,2 and 3.

All 4 options are awful, we can compare this with PGs who also are limited when playing off ball, like Chris Paul, who had an USG% of 25% while on the most efficient offense of all time with Harden.

JN61 wrote:
I'm not sure if you know how usage works. When you have less offensive threats on your team as an offensive player, especially as scorer + playmaker, your usage should be naturally higher than player who plays with several offensive threats on the floor at any given time. Curry has no playmaking responsibilities, especially during that era.


This would be a great argument if you could see real reductions in Westbrook usg% across his career, but in his OKC years his usage was similar with KD/Harden and with KD on solo and shoot to stratospheric level without KD. Westbrook posted an stupid usage of 34% with Paul George and Carmelo "still 3rd option in his mind" Anthony.

He had a bigger usg% than Paul George too while in OKC and had the third biggest usage of his career with the rockets.
I know how usage rate works, but that's my whole point.

The point guard as the primary ball handler finishing more plays than the SF is not really out of the ordinary, and in this case we are talking about a 1% difference.

I'm not saying Russ plays a smart game, but setting up the offense, bringing the ball up more often and being on a team that needed him to score. Averaging more turnovers (15-16 only 0.7 more) while doubling up the assists and having 1% higher usage rating is not a bad outcome.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#112 » by God Squad » Mon Nov 1, 2021 7:19 am

Sedale Threatt wrote:I just can't believe the Thunder drafted MVPs in three straight drafts and have zero to show for it.

Don't forget Serge Ibaka. They're the definition of a franchise than blew it.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#113 » by God Squad » Mon Nov 1, 2021 7:22 am

Pennebaker wrote:Russ was +25 today. Led the Lakers.

I like how people are pretending that Westbrook is a cancer on the order of Kevin Durant or Kyrie Irving. No, unlike those two Westbrook actually has friends and people that like him. Durant and Kyrie only have eachother.

It was against the Rockets FFS. See you next game where Russ shoots 4-16 and has 7 turnovers.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#114 » by BadWolf » Mon Nov 1, 2021 7:55 am

It was pretty obvious from the start that Russ will be the scapegoat for anything that goes wrong with Lakers this year. Actually a brilliant move for Lebron and AD, it's not their fault if they don't succeed. And if they win it all with Russ, plenty of people will put them on pedestal.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#115 » by trickshot » Mon Nov 1, 2021 8:34 am

BadWolf wrote:It was pretty obvious from the start that Russ will be the scapegoat for anything that goes wrong with Lakers this year. Actually a brilliant move for Lebron and AD, it's not their fault if they don't succeed. And if they win it all with Russ, plenty of people will put them on pedestal.

To keep it real this just looks like getting the excuses in early. At least wait to see if he flops in the playoffs. He might actually surprise everyone this year. If he does flop, well, he'll deserve criticism. They already won without him but most importantly Westbrook has never needed Lebron or AD to put up below par postseason performances. It was always one thing or another, teammates, covid or injury etc.

Meanwhile all the players he's compared with get killed for playoff lows where they put in better performances but their teams fell short. He has been the beneficiary of low expectations but you can't get a pass every year, especially not after joining a title winning core. If it doesn't work out Lebron and AD will also get flack for trading for him, which says a lot because we're talking about a former MVP.

On the more positive side the last few games have shown promise that he can make them better even with all his errors.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#116 » by Jabroni Lames » Mon Nov 1, 2021 9:14 am

Sedale Threatt wrote:I just can't believe the Thunder drafted MVPs in three straight drafts and have zero to show for it.


Sam Presti is RealGM’s favourite GOAT GM. Always so much future “potential”.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#117 » by art_tatum » Mon Nov 1, 2021 9:24 am

Westbrook has his holes but he is a MVP level talent, with only minor fall off.
The Lakers have no excuse with 3 all NBA 1st team players and two former MVPs still at the end of their prime.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#118 » by Grumpy Heat Fan » Fri Nov 5, 2021 6:48 pm

Last night vs the Thunder. The final possession. There's the classic Westbrook I know.

Instead of giving the ball to the hot handed Carmelo, who put on a superman cape and was draining 3's to bring them back...

Westbrook decides to hold onto the final ball, iso's, and chucks a 3 to clank off the rim and lose the game.

This is classic WB, and what he used to do to Durant in OKC.

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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#119 » by Danny1616 » Fri Nov 5, 2021 6:55 pm

Westbrook is one of those guys who is both overrated and underrated at the same time.

His haters make him out to be a scrub and forgot how good he actually was in his prime.

He's a very talented player with incredible athleticism who has serious flaws in his game and is getting old.
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Re: Russel Westbrook is showing you what Kevin Durant had to put up with for 8 years. 

Post#120 » by Grumpy Heat Fan » Fri Nov 5, 2021 7:02 pm

Danny1616 wrote:Westbrook is one of those guys who is both overrated and underrated at the same time.

His haters make him out to be a scrub and forgot how good he actually was in his prime.

He's a very talented player with incredible athleticism who has serious flaws in his game and is getting old.


Stat padding does not make you great. He was always a very athletic, but low bball IQ, and inefficient..... and ballhog.
"As for me personally, I don't truly care how much I make these days, my main focus is on playing for a winner." - Dirk Nowitzki, July 2016

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