James Wiseman 2021/2022

[hamncheese]

Watch on YouTube

[a8bil]

Not to mention wiseman only scored two less points in 12 less minutes per game than Mobley...

Yeah, my sense is that aside from those dumb plays where JW thinks he's a PG driving the length of the Court, he's fine offensively. It's his defense where he's a real liability on the Court right now.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Thanks for the Video Hamncheese.
I always feel better about Wiseman after hearing him talk.
He talks a good game.
I feel confident that Wiseman is coachable, interested in the game and wants to get better.

Watching film and studying the game makes a good coach but does it translate into on the floor Basketball IQ?
In games intellectual understanding is to slow. The body brain operates at faster soeeds than the verbal/intellectual brain.

Wiseman's body needs to react correctly before his mind has even had a chance to understand what is happening.

[FNQ]

Not to mention wiseman only scored two less points in 12 less minutes per game than Mobley...

Yeah, my sense is that aside from those dumb plays where JW thinks he's a PG driving the length of the Court, he's fine offensively. It's his defense where he's a real liability on the Court right now.

He's nowhere near fine offensively.. he didnt know where to go when he was off-ball, he decided what he was going to do with the ball before he got it and never adjusted to the defense. 4 players on the team had a worse ORtg: Nico, Wanamaker, Smiley, and Jordan Bell. And what's really damning is that the C position in our offense is usually gifted a great ORtg - Looney was at 130 last year, 131 so far this year. Nemo at 112..Wiseman clocked in at 100

Let's not misremember who this guy is *currently*. He's very, very bad at team basketball right now until proven otherwise. The optimism lies in the fact that he has skills, size, and is young/inexperienced. But currently he's a guy who was incapable of making any quality decisions on the court, and he should have to prove otherwise before getting any legitimate minutes away from Looney or Nemo

[FNQ]

And even a cursory comp of Mobley to Wiseman is brutal

[Mac1958]

And even a cursory comp of Mobley to Wiseman is brutal

That's a fair point, but Mobley has also played a LOT (capitalized, bolded, underlined, italicized) more competitive basketball than Wiseman has.

So really, it's not unreasonable to flip the two and use Mobley as the goal for Wiseman. I'd just hate to give up until he's had a full shot at this.

[michaelm]

And even a cursory comp of Mobley to Wiseman is brutal

That's a fair point, but Mobley has also played a LOT (capitalized, bolded, underlined, italicized) more competitive basketball than Wiseman has.

So really, it's not unreasonable to flip the two and use Mobley as the goal for Wiseman. I'd just hate to give up until he's had a full shot at this.

Exactly my view, he hadn’t really had anything like a real shot at it yet imo as well, and the fanbase getting down on him at this point in time is not likely to help his advancement. If the FO really have just picked him on athleticism and he has no basketball ability then that is a mistake they have made, I don’t see that he has misrepresented himself or shown any lack of character, he is a big gangly kid with close to no experience who came into a system which is probably the most complex and demanding in the NBA both offensively and defensively, with no preparation, no Chriss who got injured, Draymond coming of a Covid infection (he seems better physically this year) and few other vets, with one of them in Oubre also starting and not playing according to the system either. If he really does have bad hands/doesn’t have the strength to hold onto the ball this year now he is hopefully stronger that really would be a problem even for me though.

Mobley wasn’t in the 2020 draft as has been said and I doubt he was at all procurable by GSW this year. even if they decided to discard Wiseman in his favour, so there is no point imo wishing for him. I think what Lacob really wants is another Kevin Durant, whom Mobley probably won’t be either, and the actual Kevin Durant wasn’t happy playing the GSW system anyway as he has made quite clear subsequently.

[FNQ]

And even a cursory comp of Mobley to Wiseman is brutal

That's a fair point, but Mobley has also played a LOT (capitalized, bolded, underlined, italicized) more competitive basketball than Wiseman has.

So really, it's not unreasonable to flip the two and use Mobley as the goal for Wiseman. I'd just hate to give up until he's had a full shot at this.

100%

Mobley has had environmental factors that greatly have helped him, although one could blame Wiseman for his college situation. But either way, Mobley would still be better because of his BBIQ, but we'd at least have a better idea of what Wiseman could be by now, if things had gone differently

But when someone comps Wiseman/Mobley and only uses points as the factor.. yeesh. Mobley's advanced metrics have him almost at net netural, which is insane because some metrics (RPM/BPM for example) use past data as part of their formula, so rookies are given a static, negative value to start (bc rookies typically arent immediately good). And in 8 games, Mobley's BPM is +0.8.. the kid is a blue chipper every way, and I agree with the idea of Wiseman using Mobley as the goal, not a comparison. Because right now Mobley is on a way different level

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Sometimes I think big men are afraid of being percieved as big bullies and they don't fully unleash their aggressiveness and strength.

But you wouldn't worry so much about your little brother thinking you are a bully. I think LA had more good big men to play against than Memphis had. And Mobley's little brother is a good big man. Mobley getting infinite practice time vs his little brother probably helped his development. There's a video out there of the Mobley brothers playing against Wiseman on a high school All-Star team and both Mobley brothers looked more NBA ready then Wiseman did. The High school versions of the Mobley brothers looked like they had well polished street games and NBA ready reactions, where as Wiseman looked more tentative and more confused . Wiseman needs to catch up to the Mobley brothers on playing time before he can have the quick aggressive basketball reactions that the Mobley brothers is have.

On the other hand Wiseman is bigger than the Mobley brothers and you can't teach size. I think Wiseman is almost as quick as the Mobley brothers but unlike the Mobley brothers Wiseman does not know how to use his quickness.

[TB]

As it stands, the trajectory and type of player Wiseman is vs Mobley is just not even worth comparing.

When it comes to absolute ceilings, right now based on what we have seen for years with them:

Mobley is aiming for a Duncan, KG, Brow type of all around MVP level game.

Wiseman is a more direct player, with a ceiling of Turner on defense and Wood on offense.

Maybe that changes as we see their games progress, but to me those are the ceilings for them right now.

[GSWFan1994]

So in the video he says he added 17 lbs... and it indeed looks like it, his arms and shoulders are much bigger than last season.

I compare Wiseman's playing style to David Robinson. Tall and strong for his position, runs the floor very well, can handle and pass a bit.

Please note Robinson was a 24-year old rookie, and how Wiseman is going to be 4 years from now.

I'm excited to follow his development with the new & improved coaching staff. The sky's the limit.

I still stand by my prediction that we will have an All-Star caliber player (= borderline top 25 in the league) in his 4th/5th season, barring injuries.

As for the comparison to Mobley, please bear in mind the team's context as well... Mobley's been playing 33 mpg in a team that's been perpetually in the treadmill of mediocrity. I bet if you give this playing time to Wiseman in this kind of team he would surely put up beautiful numbers as well.

PS: Old_Fart, when you quote this post to put something in you signature, don't take it out of context (= a part of a single sentence that pushes the narrative you want to deliver).

Come to think of it, having being quoted in your signature is like having an outdoor in the sheettiest place in town.

[FNQ]

Wiseman is a more direct player, with a ceiling of Turner on defense and Wood on offense.

I think thats about as reasonable of a ceiling as we can expect for Wiseman, at least at this stage. I had initially hoped for a bigger Bosh (trading some of Bosh's offense for defense) but Bosh had a feel for the game that Wiseman hasnt shown yet

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

As it stands, the trajectory and type of player Wiseman is vs Mobley is just not even worth comparing.

When it comes to absolute ceilings, right now based on what we have seen for years with them:

Mobley is aiming for a Duncan, KG, Brow type of all around MVP level game.

Wiseman is a more direct player, with a ceiling of Turner on defense and Wood on offense.

Maybe that changes as we see their games progress, but to me those are the ceilings for them right now.

I was thinking Young Amar'e Stoudemire for Mobley.
For Wiseman I am thinking a cross between 2 parts Robert Parish and 2 parts Channing Frye and 1 part David Robinson, but we have to wait two years for him to get there.
I know we used the high draft pick on Wiseman but I am not sure that every draft has a player as good as a cross between Robert Parish and Channing Frye although most drafts have a player better than that. I just hope that Wiseman becomes as good as I expect. I want that cross between Robert Parish and Channing Frye, especially if he can play in the NBA until age 40 something like Parish did.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

I was confused. Evan Mobley was older than I was Isaih Mobley but Evan is the younger brother.

[HiRez]

I don't understand all the comparisons to Mobley, we never had a chance to draft Mobley and they weren't even in the same draft. For sure I'd take Mobley over Wiseman right now but it's kind of meaningless.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Mobley's dad Eric Mobley the USC assistant basketball coach apparently played pro ball overseas.
Many websites say that Mobley's dad died this June and is the Eric Mobely who played in the NBA and played at the Univeristy of Pittsburg with Willy Caully Stein's dad but I am 95% sure that NBA Eric Mobley was a different Eric Mobley who is not Evan Mobley's dad.

I believe that Evan's older brother Isiah Mobley will eventually play in the NBA. Isiah and Evan played a lot of 1 on 1 at thecourt at their home. Isiah was taller than Evan until Evan grew 4 inches in 8th grade. In high school the brothers stopped playing 1 on 1 because they were so competitive that games were almost becoming fights. In order to make sure that they did not start throwing punches at each other they stopped playing 1 on . Evan Mobley really wanted to beat his older brother at basketball and his older brother really did not want to be beaten by his younger brother. So instead of playing each other they became teammates at USC.

Evan's mom was also a high school basketball star.

Not only did Wiseman never have good competition like Evan had, but very few NBA draft picks had the luxury of sharpening their skills against an older brother who was also destined to play in the NBA. Maybe Albert King who woukd never be as good as Bernard, or Major Jones who would not be as good as Caldwell, Edgar and Charles, or Gerald Wilkins who would not be as good as Dominque.

Thank the younger brother gets more benefit than the older brother but the trend seems to be that the older brothers are usually better.

[clyde21]

comping Wise to Mobley is a losing battle, two different types of players, one is a perfect fit for today's NBA, the other is not...no matter how many shots he has or hasn't gotten yet.

[a8bil]

Mobley's dad Eric Mobley the USC assistant basketball coach apparently played pro ball overseas.
Many websites say that Mobley's dad died this June and is the Eric Mobely who played in the NBA and played at the Univeristy of Pittsburg with Willy Caully Stein's dad but I am 95% sure that NBA Eric Mobley was a different Eric Mobley who is not Evan Mobley's dad.

I believe that Evan's older brother Isiah Mobley will eventually play in the NBA. Isiah and Evan played a lot of 1 on 1 at thecourt at their home. Isiah was taller than Evan until Evan grew 4 inches in 8th grade. In high school the brothers stopped playing 1 on 1 because they were so competitive that games were almost becoming fights. In order to make sure that they did not start throwing punches at each other they stopped playing 1 on . Evan Mobley really wanted to beat his older brother at basketball and his older brother really did not want to be beaten by his younger brother. So instead of playing each other they became teammates at USC.

Evan's mom was also a high school basketball star.

Not only did Wiseman never have good competition like Evan had, but very few NBA draft picks had the luxury of sharpening their skills against an older brother who was also destined to play in the NBA. Maybe Albert King who woukd never be as good as Bernard, or Major Jones who would not be as good as Caldwell, Edgar and Charles, or Gerald Wilkins who would not be as good as Dominque.

Thank the younger brother gets more benefit than the older brother but the trend seems to be that the older brothers are usually better.

Drew Gordon and Aaron Gordon are contrary evidence.

[NeoWarriors]

Mobley's dad Eric Mobley the USC assistant basketball coach apparently played pro ball overseas.
Many websites say that Mobley's dad died this June and is the Eric Mobely who played in the NBA and played at the Univeristy of Pittsburg with Willy Caully Stein's dad but I am 95% sure that NBA Eric Mobley was a different Eric Mobley who is not Evan Mobley's dad.

I believe that Evan's older brother Isiah Mobley will eventually play in the NBA. Isiah and Evan played a lot of 1 on 1 at thecourt at their home. Isiah was taller than Evan until Evan grew 4 inches in 8th grade. In high school the brothers stopped playing 1 on 1 because they were so competitive that games were almost becoming fights. In order to make sure that they did not start throwing punches at each other they stopped playing 1 on . Evan Mobley really wanted to beat his older brother at basketball and his older brother really did not want to be beaten by his younger brother. So instead of playing each other they became teammates at USC.

Evan's mom was also a high school basketball star.

Not only did Wiseman never have good competition like Evan had, but very few NBA draft picks had the luxury of sharpening their skills against an older brother who was also destined to play in the NBA. Maybe Albert King who woukd never be as good as Bernard, or Major Jones who would not be as good as Caldwell, Edgar and Charles, or Gerald Wilkins who would not be as good as Dominque.

Thank the younger brother gets more benefit than the older brother but the trend seems to be that the older brothers are usually better.

Drew Gordon and Aaron Gordon are contrary evidence.

Or Mychel and Klay. Or Taylor and Blake Griffin. Or Thanasis and Giannis...

Sent from my Golden State Warriors Protoast Elite toaster using RealGM mobile app

[The-Power]

A lot of people still don't seem to understand that the Warriors system is one of the most difficult to learn (and young bigs generally tend to develop more slowly). Lee, JTA, Looney, Payton, old Iguodala – a third or more of our current rotation consists of players nobody else in the league wanted but who are impactful for us because they know the system and do what's asked of them.

There is nothing that inherently stops Wiseman from doing in two years what Ayton is doing right now. There certainly isn't anything inherently stopping Wiseman from doing what Looney does on the court except with greater effectiveness due to Wiseman's superior size and athletic ability. It's a matter of time and effort.

He can absolutely be a positive impact player for us some time soon if he puts his mind to it. Just give him time to prove himself before going after him. It's as if people have learned nothing from Poole's development. Or Looney's before him. Players who are really useful now despite fans being willing to move on from them very quickly.