College/Draft thread. Knicks Currently have Picks 12 and 45

DaGawd · Post #41 » by **DaGawd** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:32 am

Oh **** he’s back In

Post #42 » by **Deeeez Knicks** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:37 am

Obi into the game from the spike Lee seats

DaGawd · Post #43 » by **DaGawd** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:37 am

Kentucky defense starting to go in..son with the last name starting with T dominating on defense

robillionaire · Post #44 » by **robillionaire** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:45 am

i'm sad now i might not start the gamethread

Post #45 » by **Duke4life831** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:27 am

3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:Kentucky is mid

Calipari losing his recruiting touch

only player I know is ty ty and he’s been ass

TyTy ran into Keels tonight. That big boy is going to haunt his dreams for awhile. He dominated that match up tonight.

dukeknicksirish · Post #46 » by **dukeknicksirish** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:54 pm

Atmosphere was electric here last night. Can Keels be there when we select in the late first?

FrozenEnvelope · Post #47 » by **FrozenEnvelope** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:57 pm

Bonchero, Holmgren and Bates did not disappoint. These kids are studs! Should be fun to see who establishes himself as the top pick.

Post #48 » by **mpharris36** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:04 pm

robillionaire wrote:i'm sad now i might not start the gamethread

we finally have a link to a college team and now that college team produces no NBA talent!!! :lol:

robillionaire · Post #49 » by **robillionaire** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:06 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
robillionaire wrote:i'm sad now i might not start the gamethread

we finally have a link to a college team and now that college team produces no NBA talent!!!

next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

of course the knicks aren't tanking now so none of this stuff really matters anyway

DaGawd · Post #50 » by **DaGawd** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:43 pm

robillionaire wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
robillionaire wrote:i'm sad now i might not start the gamethread

we finally have a link to a college team and now that college team produces no NBA talent!!!

next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

of course the knicks aren't tanking now so none of this stuff really matters anyway

Fk next year.. we need Banchero now!

3toheadmelo · Post #51 » by **3toheadmelo** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:51 pm

DaGawd wrote:
robillionaire wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
we finally have a link to a college team and now that college team produces no NBA talent!!!

next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

of course the knicks aren't tanking now so none of this stuff really matters anyway

Fk next year.. we need Banchero now!

Post #52 » by **mpharris36** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 4:59 pm

3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:
robillionaire wrote:
next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

of course the knicks aren't tanking now so none of this stuff really matters anyway

Fk next year.. we need Banchero now!

RJ 30 pt game incoming!

3toheadmelo · Post #53 » by **3toheadmelo** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:07 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:Fk next year.. we need Banchero now!

RJ 30 pt game incoming!

great person I am!!!!

DaGawd · Post #54 » by **DaGawd** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 5:40 pm

mpharris36 wrote:
3toheadmelo wrote:
DaGawd wrote:Fk next year.. we need Banchero now!

RJ 30 pt game incoming!

Build that trade Value RJ!!

Post #55 » by **moocow007** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:04 pm

Luv those Knicks wrote:
moocow007 wrote:
The Knicks can potentially have the following picks:

2022 (2 to 4 picks)
1. Own 1st
2. Own 2nd
3. Charlottes 1st (top 18 protected)
4. Charlottes 2nd (top 55 protected)

2023 (5 to 7 picks)
1. Own 1st
2. Own 2nd
3. Dallas 1st (top 10 protected)
4. Charlotte 1st (top 16 protected IF not already conveyed in 2022)
5. Detroit 2nd
6. Best 2nd from OKC, Washington, Dallas or Miami
7. Utah 2nd

2024 (4 to 6 picks)
1. Own 1st
2. Own 2nd
3. Charlotte 1st (top 14 protected IF not already conveyed in 2022 or 2023)
4. Best 2nd from Utah or Cleveland
5. Detroit 2nd
6. Miami 2nd (only if the pick is between 51 and 55)

2025 (2 to 3 picks)
1. Own 1st
2. Own 2nd
3. Charlotte 1st (top 14 protected IF not already conveyed in 2022, 2023 or 2024)

2026 (3 picks)
1. Own 1st
2. Own 2nd
3. Wolves 2nd

Now that's A LOT of picks on first glance but 2 things to consider about them:

1. The extra picks don't project to be great quality (due to protections on them)
2. The chances of the Knicks using them all is about as likely as me and Wingo dating the same supermodel at the same time.

Thanks for that, and seriously, props to you for the detail. I'd gone through it a while ago, but you have it down exactly.

So, do I understand this right, the Charlotte 2nd rounder vanishes after this year?

Yep. it's basically a super duper protected 2nd round pick. If it's not in the bottom 5 of the 2nd round the Knicks get diddly. Why I saw the details of the trade that got them this my reaction was might as well just not consider this. No way in hell regardless of how well LaMelo played would the Hornets be a top 5 team. Not even if Ball becomes Michael Jordan would this Hornets team be a top 5 team.

And what's the deal with the Miami pick between 51 and 55? Who agrees to something that silly?

The Miami pick actually already has a previously agreed upon condition on it. Combined both together it basically (as far as I'm reading it) would only be conveyed if it's between picks 51 and 55. If it's before 50 it's not conveyed, if it's after 55 it goes to another team is what I believe happens. It's not something I would even consider being useful and only included cause it technically is a possibility.

Both these 2 2nd rounders are really just smoke and mirrors picks from my POV.

The Dallas pick in 2023 could be interesting, or maybe Dallas wins 58 games and not so much.

At current look, chances are probably unlikely that the Mavs will be a top team. Could they be a top 10 lottery team next season? Hard to tell.

Yes a lot of the picks are fringe/not that interesting, but maybe they'll get lucky and draft the right player or two.

Well sure they could, but you don't really want to bank your future in any noticeable percentage on luck. Luck is something that if it happens great, but if it doesn't happen then it's no big deal cause it was never really a remotely significant part of any plan to get good.

I think the overall problem is that fans will look at the number of picks and think the Knicks have great assets to potentially either trade for a star or (more likely) pick one when the reality is that the numbers don't mean much of they don't have great value overall. And if we assume the Knicks will even hold current trend even their own picks won't likely be valuable much less any of the other picks they have. It's great if the biggest joy a fan has is dreaming/fantasizing about who they can draft with 5 draft picks and making the drafts (reading up on players, watching highlights, flights of fancy afterwards, etc.) and not really considering actually building a winner (expect based on luck and fantasy hoping and wishing that guys drafted in the bottom half of the 1st or in the 2nd round will turn into anything that is foundational to building a top tier championship caliber team). Sure it can happen and you can get some great role players that can contribute but you cannot simply base building a team mostly on draft picks and being lucky. For every 1 or 2 teams this plan (get lucky with bottom 1st or 2nd rounders) works for reality is that it fails to work for the other 28 or 29 teams.

FYI...since you mentioned those heavily protected 2nd round picks...that Charlotte 1st rounder. If Charlotte remains a lottery team through 2025 (which is actually quite possible) then they owe the Knicks absolutely nothing (not even a 2nd rounder). So all in all the chances that the Knicks will actually have a 1st rounder (forget about a top 14 or 15 pick) in any of the future drafts based on the trades (unless we're talking about their own 1sts being top 15...which given where they are at is probably also unlikely) is probably unlikely. At which point, yeah ok, they keep their own picks (which is not a great great thing except when compared to what they used to do...kinda like saying that I'm no longer 600lbs and at 350 I'm really looking good) but what they've realistically added for the future may be just a bunch of 2nd round picks from other teams while keeping their own bottom half of the 1st and 2nd round picks.

Bottom line? Chances of the "cavalry" to take this team to the next level coming from the draft is probably pretty low (they have no unconditional 1st round picks from any team, much less any team projected to be not so good for the forseeable future)...well unless they trade something significant to another team who actually will likely have a top draft pick.

thebuzzardman · Post #56 » by **thebuzzardman** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:21 pm

robillionaire wrote:
mpharris36 wrote:
robillionaire wrote:i'm sad now i might not start the gamethread

we finally have a link to a college team and now that college team produces no NBA talent!!!

next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

http://www.espn.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/playerrankings

of course the knicks aren't tanking now so none of this stuff really matters anyway

Which of those guys is the worst? That'll be who Calipari aggressively steers to the Knicks.

smw6230 · Post #57 » by **smw6230** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 10:50 pm

robillionaire wrote:next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

Not directed at you robillionaire, but it's funny if you go back a year to the day and read this forum BJ Boston was the messiah

In the end we could have had the messiah with our 3rd pick in the 2nd Rd.

Knick fans are Playas They fall in and outta love fast. A fun night and a Jeter fruit basket as a departing gift, is about the best you can hope for.

WajaBawl · Post #58 » by **WajaBawl** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:12 pm

smw6230 wrote:
robillionaire wrote:next year folks! #1 shaedon sharpe #9 cason wallace #12 chris livingston #16 skyy clark

Not directed at you robillionaire, but it's funny if you go back a year to the day and read this forum BJ Boston was the messiah

In the end we could have had the messiah with our 3rd pick in the 2nd Rd.

Knick fans are Playas They fall in and outta love fast. A fun night and a Jeter fruit basket as a departing gift, is about the best you can hope for.

Boston has more upside than that random Lithuanian dude we drafted.

smw6230 · Post #59 » by **smw6230** » Wed Nov 10, 2021 11:44 pm

[quote="WajaBawl]

Boston has more upside than that random Lithuanian dude we drafted.[/quote]

Yeah but, it ain't always about the talent. I would argue mental makeup is the key component of NBA success.

If a talented player doesn't have the mental makeup, I'd pass on him.

Knox has been mentioned in this thread. When he was coming out one of the knocks on him was his mental toughness. He wasn't a "dog". He seemed to drift in games at UK. He had talent but seemed indifferent and lacking in drive.

Basketball is important to RJ Barrett. Is it important to Kevin Knox? I have my doubts on the latter.

You can see important BB is to RJ by his FT percentage. He was a liability on his first year. RJ worked on his craft and the next year his ‰ jumped 20 points. That is no easy feat because RJ isn't a natural shooter with a light touch. RJ is kinda clunky and robotic and his form is more rote than natural feel.

Knox is still the same guy he was 3 years ago at UK. The warning signs were there but were ignored.

WajaBawl · Post #60 » by **WajaBawl** » Thu Nov 11, 2021 4:51 am

smw6230 wrote:[quote="WajaBawl]

Boston has more upside than that random Lithuanian dude we drafted.[/quote]

Yeah but, it ain't always about the talent. I would argue mental makeup is the key component of NBA success.

If a talented player doesn't have the mental makeup, I'd pass on him.

Knox has been mentioned in this thread. When he was coming out one of the knocks on him was his mental toughness. He wasn't a "dog". He seemed to drift in games at UK. He had talent but seemed indifferent and lacking in drive.

Basketball is important to RJ Barrett. Is it important to Kevin Knox? I have my doubts on the latter.

You can see important BB is to RJ by his FT percentage. He was a liability on his first year. RJ worked on his craft and the next year his ‰ jumped 20 points. That is no easy feat because RJ isn't a natural shooter with a light touch. RJ is kinda clunky and robotic and his form is more rote than natural feel.

Knox is still the same guy he was 3 years ago at UK. The warning signs were there but were ignored.[/quote]

I was talking about Boston in the context of being a second round pick with low risk/high reward. Not the mental makeup. I know Knox is a mental midget who'd rather play Fortnite than work on his drive. My point is that chances are are Rokas isn't even gonna play minutes for the Knicks, so it was a wasted pick.