2021-22 NBA Rookie Thread (part 3)

DAcReator · Post #241 » by **DAcReator** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 3:10 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

ok cool, so why dont magic fans do the same? where are they?

OrlMagic05 · Post #242 » by **OrlMagic05** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:00 pm

DAcReator wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

ok cool, so why dont magic fans do the same? where are they?

Because its one game. No overreaction.

Its crazy how Barnes is praised so highly and many think he is the run away ROY, but head to head comparison between Franz and Barnes are VERY close with Franz playing almost 4 less minutes per game.

Blazing_royale · Post #243 » by **Blazing_royale** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:01 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

The Raptors got trashed on for taking Barnes over Suggs. Warrants 50 pages to remind the world y'all were the wrong ones.

OrlMagic05 · Post #244 » by **OrlMagic05** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:10 pm

Blazing_royale wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

The Raptors got trashed on for taking Barnes over Suggs. Warrants 50 pages to remind the world y'all were the wrong ones.

I do like Barnes and hope he continues to do well, but the head to head comparison is too close to warrant the overreaction.

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?player_id2=wagnefr01&player_id1=barnesc01&sum=0&request=1

Creativetran · Post #245 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:57 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:Suggs isnt a PG, he is a SG. This is how I know people only check the box score. Calling Cole Anthony a creator is laughable! Cole is a scoring guard which hurts Suggs more than anything. Cole tries to get Cole involved and everyone else is an after thought. Suggs has also put a few good games together, Raptors , Brooklyn and has put up really good halves. I think playing with a true PG like Fultz will help Suggs.

What are you talking about? Suggs is definitely a PG, he's an oversized one...just happens he isn't as ready as we all thought he would be. But I consider him more of a PG/SG than a SG/PG.

For him to justify picking so high as well he better be a PG in the future, otherwise he's kinda small for SG

zaymon · Post #246 » by **zaymon** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 4:58 pm

Blazing_royale wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

The Raptors got trashed on for taking Barnes over Suggs. Warrants 50 pages to remind the world y'all were the wrong ones.

Like you can settle it after 20 games. Suggs offense was bad but getting better and his defense is better than Barnes. One thing no one mentions is Barnes is left wide open most of the time, teams just dont guard him while Suggs is guarded by Smarts, Caruso's, Holiday's.
While Barnes looked better than Suggs so far for sure i would still took Wagner above both of them.

Creativetran · Post #247 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:03 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:

He will NEVER be the fulltime PG for the Magic, so YES you can change his position considering he will be their SG. Fultz will be the starting PG when he gets back which will most likely push Cole to the bench as a 6th man, which leaves Suggs as the starting SG.

Fultz is definitely a better PG than Suggs right now but lets put all our basket it a guy who can't shoot.... we drafted Suggs because he was the best player available at the time AND we thought he would be a better PG than Fultz

Creativetran · Post #248 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:05 pm

srhcan wrote:This is your thinking that Suggs will not be PG moving forward. But Orlando drafted Suggs as a PG long-term

Most Magic fans don't think what that guy does

Creativetran · Post #249 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:07 pm

yoyoboy wrote:Free Sengun. Why is he getting no minutes despite being so reproductive?

Kinda reminds me of Jokic at the start of his career, I kept thinking why ain't this guy getting more minutes too...

OrlMagic05 · Post #250 » by **OrlMagic05** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:08 pm

Creativetran wrote:
srhcan wrote:This is your thinking that Suggs will not be PG moving forward. But Orlando drafted Suggs as a PG long-term

Most Magic fans don't think what that guy does

Really so please explain to me why in the hell would they give Fultz a 60 million dollar deal if they didnt think he was going to be our starting PG of the future?

normgod6 · Post #251 » by **normgod6** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:08 pm

zaymon wrote:
Blazing_royale wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

The Raptors got trashed on for taking Barnes over Suggs. Warrants 50 pages to remind the world y'all were the wrong ones.

Like you can settle it after 20 games. Suggs offense was bad but getting better and his defense is better than Barnes. One thing no one mentions is Barnes is left wide open most of the time, teams just dont guard him while Suggs is guarded by Smarts, Caruso's, Holiday's.
While Barnes looked better than Suggs so far for sure i would still took Wagner above both of them.

Barnes is not left open most of the time. In fact, he has been double teamed on the block multiple times this season. His mid range attempts has decreased since his hot start as teams are playing him for the midrange shot now too. Stop this tired take

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Creativetran · Post #252 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:10 pm

BlazersBroncos wrote:Dont want to beat a dead horse, but OKC really messed up trading Sengun. They sorely lack a big to run the PNR w/ Josh (Its actually wild how well Giddey iss playing when his best trait, PNR initiating, is so limited by the OKC bigs).

Giddey and Sengun would be a terror in the PNR. Just such a miss for Presti.

I know right, and honestly this seems so much like a Presti guy too...seemed like the highest upset guy left

OrlMagic05 · Post #253 » by **OrlMagic05** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:11 pm

Creativetran wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:

He will NEVER be the fulltime PG for the Magic, so YES you can change his position considering he will be their SG. Fultz will be the starting PG when he gets back which will most likely push Cole to the bench as a 6th man, which leaves Suggs as the starting SG.
Fultz is definitely a better PG than Suggs right now but lets put all our basket it a guy who can't shoot.... we drafted Suggs because he was the best player available at the time AND we thought he would be a better PG than Fultz

Do you watch these games? So you dont want to trust fultz because he cant shoot, yet you want Suggs as your starting PG who shoots even worse and cant dribble? Suggs can't even dribble in the paint without getting ripped and you want him as our future PG?

Fultz will be the starting PG and Management agrees with this as they rewarded him with a contract extension.

Creativetran · Post #254 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:13 pm

LBJKB24MJ23 wrote:so is Jalen Suggs another Marcus Smart? started out as a defensive stud and letting his offensive game grow through the years.

Smart was #6 in his draft so I mean both are lottery level talent.

Dear god I hope he isn't...I had higher hopes for him that Smart level player. But so far it's looking like that.

Kurtz · Post #255 » by **Kurtz** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:14 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:
Blazing_royale wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

The Raptors got trashed on for taking Barnes over Suggs. Warrants 50 pages to remind the world y'all were the wrong ones.

I do like Barnes and hope he continues to do well, but the head to head comparison is too close to warrant the overreaction.

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?player_id2=wagnefr01&player_id1=barnesc01&sum=0&request=1

15/8/3 on 49% FG is not super close to 13/4/2 on 43% FG.

This is also reflected in ROY betting odds, where Scottie is +235 whereas Franz is +2800.

OrlMagic05 · Post #256 » by **OrlMagic05** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:16 pm

Creativetran wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:Suggs isnt a PG, he is a SG. This is how I know people only check the box score. Calling Cole Anthony a creator is laughable! Cole is a scoring guard which hurts Suggs more than anything. Cole tries to get Cole involved and everyone else is an after thought. Suggs has also put a few good games together, Raptors , Brooklyn and has put up really good halves. I think playing with a true PG like Fultz will help Suggs.

What are you talking about? Suggs is definitely a PG, he's an oversized one...just happens he isn't as ready as we all thought he would be. But I consider him more of a PG/SG than a SG/PG.

For him to justify picking so high as well he better be a PG in the future, otherwise he's kinda small for SG

You consider him that, but what does Coach Mosely and Management consider him? If he was a PG they would have started him at PG from the jump, but they didnt. Cole was given those duties while Suggs has been designated SG. Hell even when Franz is in the game Franz takes PG duties off of Suggs at times.

Also, Suggs is definitely not an undersized SG in todays NBA. considering the average height for a SG in today's nba is anywhere from 6'3-6'5.

https://basketballscan.com/average-nba-height-by-position/#:~:text=The%20Average%20Height%20of%20the%20Shooting%20Guard%3A,-Usually%2C%20shooting%20guards&text=A%20shooting%20guard's%20standard%20height,2000%20at%206'5%20%E2%80%9C.

Creativetran · Post #257 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:18 pm

LoveMyRaps wrote:ROTY Frontrunner Scottie Barnes with a 21p/7r/3a/2s/1b - Made 4 threes!!!

I remember those... "He can't shoot even if his life depended on it" comments pre-draft.

He definitely revamped his shoot, it looks ALOT better than in college... I'm shocked at this kids rapid improvement

OrlMagic05 · Post #258 » by **OrlMagic05** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:20 pm

Kurtz wrote:
OrlMagic05 wrote:
Blazing_royale wrote:
The Raptors got trashed on for taking Barnes over Suggs. Warrants 50 pages to remind the world y'all were the wrong ones.

I do like Barnes and hope he continues to do well, but the head to head comparison is too close to warrant the overreaction.

https://stathead.com/basketball/pcm_finder.cgi?player_id2=wagnefr01&player_id1=barnesc01&sum=0&request=1

15/8/3 on 49% FG is not super close to 13/4/2 on 43% FG.

This is also reflected in ROY betting odds, where Scottie is +235 whereas Franz is +2800.

Barnes also plays 4 more minutes and shoots 1 three a game compared to Franz 4 threes a game which reflects the difference in points and FG %. Franz rebound numbers are also skewed as he plays with WCJ and Bamba who live in the paint.

Barnes' hot start has a lot to do with those betting odds. Those will come down as he falls back to earth.

Creativetran · Post #259 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:20 pm

God Squad wrote:It's not just his shooting. It's his ball handling, lack of a jumper and finishing at the rim.

I'm not worried about any of that EXCEPT his handle, damn it's looking baaaadddd right now....

Creativetran · Post #260 » by **Creativetran** » Tue Nov 30, 2021 5:25 pm

OrlMagic05 wrote:Another Solid game from Franz 27pts 6reb 5ast. If Barnes had a game like that this thread would be at 50 pages with all the Raptor fans blowing this up.

Thats for sure! lol

Which three rookies impress you the most? (vote for up to 3)