LeBron James 2021-22 Regular Season Thread - Part ?

[nzahir]

Russ better be moved at the deadline or this season is a waste

Pelinka has 4 days...

[falcolombardi]

it would be for the best, but i think russ is too iked in the locker room and supproted by lakers stars for that

[homecourtloss]

AD + James without Russ hasn’t worked all that great this year (unlike the cheat code of AD+James the past few years).

But last night with AD and LBJ ON and Westbrook OFF

9 minutes, 140 ORtg, 65 DRtg

James 85.7% TS on 7 shots

[falcolombardi]

AD + James without Russ hasn’t worked all that great this year (unlike the cheat code of AD+James the past few years).

But last night with AD and LBJ ON and Westbrook OFF

9 minutes, 140 ORtg, 65 DRtg

James 85.7% TS on 7 shots

off topic but do you have your write up about Kevin love post up percentages in cleveland? i wanted to bring that up in another thread the other day but couldnt find it

[Fadeaway_J]

Russ better be moved at the deadline or this season is a waste

Pelinka has 4 days...

It's been a waste for some time now

[homecourtloss]

AD + James without Russ hasn’t worked all that great this year (unlike the cheat code of AD+James the past few years).

But last night with AD and LBJ ON and Westbrook OFF

9 minutes, 140 ORtg, 65 DRtg

James 85.7% TS on 7 shots

off topic but do you have your write up about Kevin love post up percentages in cleveland? i wanted to bring that up in another thread the other day but couldnt find it

It’s always funny to me when people say “He was turned into a spot up shooter” when his spot up shooting is infinitely better than what ANY player could provide from the post AND he was getting plenty of post up opportunities regardless but wasn’t scoring. The Cavs created two top 5 playoffs offenses ever using him to space the floor and shoot. Also, Love is having a resurgent season as a spot up shooter:

2015-2018: 44% of FGA were three-pointers (45% in playoffs).
2022: 61% of FGA have been three-pointers

2018 post up points per possession: .98 (top 21%), 4.2 possessions per game
2018 playoffs post up points per possession: .80 (bottom 31%), 4.2 possessions per game [6th most in the playoffs]
2018 spot up points per possession: 1.27 (top 4%), 3.7 possessions per game. Cavs should have had him spot up more, not less.
2018 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.00 (bottom 38%), 4.0 possessions per game [missed wide open shots all playoffs]

2017 post up points per possession: .87 (bottom 45%), 4.3 possessions per game
2017 playoffs post up points per possession: .98 (top 33%), 3.1 possessions per game [7th most in the playoffs]
2017 spot up points per possession: 1.19 (top 10%), 4.3 possessions per game
2017 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.15 (top 33%), 4.5possessions per game

Notice that in 2017, a top 33% post up PPP would be a BOTTOM 40% spot up PPP.

2016 post up points per possession: .98 (top 17%), 4 possessions per game
2016 playoffs post up points per possession: .81 (bottom 44%), 4.3 possessions per game [7th most in the NBA]
2016 spot up points per possession: 1.06 (top 23%), 4.3 possessions per game
2016 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.18 (top 23%), 4.7 possessions per game

[falcolombardi]

AD + James without Russ hasn’t worked all that great this year (unlike the cheat code of AD+James the past few years).

But last night with AD and LBJ ON and Westbrook OFF

9 minutes, 140 ORtg, 65 DRtg

James 85.7% TS on 7 shots

off topic but do you have your write up about Kevin love post up percentages in cleveland? i wanted to bring that up in another thread the other day but couldnt find it

It’s always funny to me when people say “He was turned into a spot up shooter” when his spot up shooting is infinitely better than what ANY player could provide from the post AND he was getting plenty of post up opportunities regardless but wasn’t scoring. The Cavs created two top 5 playoffs offenses ever using him to space the floor and shoot. Also, Love is having a resurgent season as a spot up shooter:

2015-2018: 44% of FGA were three-pointers (45% in playoffs).
2022: 61% of FGA have been three-pointers

2018 post up points per possession: .98 (top 21%), 4.2 possessions per game
2018 playoffs post up points per possession: .80 (bottom 31%), 4.2 possessions per game [6th most in the playoffs]
2018 spot up points per possession: 1.27 (top 4%), 3.7 possessions per game. Cavs should have had him spot up more, not less.
2018 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.00 (bottom 38%), 4.0 possessions per game [missed wide open shots all playoffs]

2017 post up points per possession: .87 (bottom 45%), 4.3 possessions per game
2017 playoffs post up points per possession: .98 (top 33%), 3.1 possessions per game [7th most in the playoffs]
2017 spot up points per possession: 1.19 (top 10%), 4.3 possessions per game
2017 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.15 (top 33%), 4.5possessions per game

Notice that in 2017, a top 33% post up PPP would be a BOTTOM 40% spot up PPP.

2016 post up points per possession: .98 (top 17%), 4 possessions per game
2016 playoffs post up points per possession: .81 (bottom 44%), 4.3 possessions per game [7th most in the NBA]
2016 spot up points per possession: 1.06 (top 23%), 4.3 possessions per game
2016 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.18 (top 23%), 4.7 possessions per game

so basically the same thingh happens that with bosh

lebron gets the Blame for love and bosh not being good enough to justify running offense through them in the post as "traditional post players" when the "Blame" for it is in the gane realizing post up game is not efficient enough with 99% of players

even ben Taylor does this criticism when comparing lebron to players like kobe (with shaq who was way better thsn bosh and love in the post) or bird (who played with Mchale who alse was way better in the post) or nagic (do i even need to say kareeem was good there) ot even curry/jordan (who didnt even play with a post up big in the first place)

and it really makes not much sense, past his prime lebron does just fine with davis, does anyone think he couldnt thrive with shaq, kareem or Mchale?

seems like an aesthetics/stylistic criticisms worked backwards into a game weakness criticism that lebron cannot play with traditional bigs

[homecourtloss]

off topic but do you have your write up about Kevin love post up percentages in cleveland? i wanted to bring that up in another thread the other day but couldnt find it

It’s always funny to me when people say “He was turned into a spot up shooter” when his spot up shooting is infinitely better than what ANY player could provide from the post AND he was getting plenty of post up opportunities regardless but wasn’t scoring. The Cavs created two top 5 playoffs offenses ever using him to space the floor and shoot. Also, Love is having a resurgent season as a spot up shooter:

2015-2018: 44% of FGA were three-pointers (45% in playoffs).
2022: 61% of FGA have been three-pointers

2018 post up points per possession: .98 (top 21%), 4.2 possessions per game
2018 playoffs post up points per possession: .80 (bottom 31%), 4.2 possessions per game [6th most in the playoffs]
2018 spot up points per possession: 1.27 (top 4%), 3.7 possessions per game. Cavs should have had him spot up more, not less.
2018 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.00 (bottom 38%), 4.0 possessions per game [missed wide open shots all playoffs]

2017 post up points per possession: .87 (bottom 45%), 4.3 possessions per game
2017 playoffs post up points per possession: .98 (top 33%), 3.1 possessions per game [7th most in the playoffs]
2017 spot up points per possession: 1.19 (top 10%), 4.3 possessions per game
2017 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.15 (top 33%), 4.5possessions per game

Notice that in 2017, a top 33% post up PPP would be a BOTTOM 40% spot up PPP.

2016 post up points per possession: .98 (top 17%), 4 possessions per game
2016 playoffs post up points per possession: .81 (bottom 44%), 4.3 possessions per game [7th most in the NBA]
2016 spot up points per possession: 1.06 (top 23%), 4.3 possessions per game
2016 playoffs spot up points per possession: 1.18 (top 23%), 4.7 possessions per game

so basically the same thingh happens that with bosh

lebron gets the Blame for love and bosh not being good enough to justify running offense through them in the post as "traditional post players" when the "Blame" for it is in the gane realizing post up game is not efficient enough with 99% of players

even ben Taylor does this criticism when comparing lebron to players like kobe (with shaq who was way better thsn bosh and love in the post) or bird (who played with Mchale who alse was way better in the post) or nagic (do i even need to say kareeem was good there) ot even curry/jordan (who didnt even play with a post up big in the first place)

and it really makes not much sense, past his prime lebron does just fine with davis, does anyone think he couldnt thrive with shaq, kareem or Mchale?

seems like an aesthetics/stylistic criticisms worked backwards into a game weakness criticism that lebron cannot play with traditional bigs

For the great majority of people, some narrative has more power than actual numbers and data. Look at the post up possessions for Love—he got more post up opportunities than most but wasn’t effective in the playoffs. On top of that, his spot up possessions, of course, yielded better offense.

I’m surprised that Ben Taylor continues on this arc because both the Cavs and the Heat figured out what was going to generate the best offense, and it was not going to be a post up for Kevin Love or Chris Bosh (or a face up for Chris Bosh). And as you say, LeBron did just fine with AD. Lakers actually also created good offense in 2020 even with non-shooting, space-clogging McGee because LeBron used him as vertical rim threat. In fact, that team won a title being a bottom 5-7 3point attempt rate team, something unheard of in this era.

[Im Your Father]

It’s obvious that this mistreatment is being legislated from the top. It’s far too consistent no to be.

I do not understand why a league would treat the absolute biggest draw in their sport this way. It’s getting outrageous.

LeBron and especially Jokic's lack of free throws is absolutely **** bonkers, but it's been like this his entire career.

Dwayne Wade in 3 straight seasons from 05-07 had free throw rates of 56.1%, 57.7% and 58.3%, and had his career high FTA in 06 where he had 10.8FTA per game on 19 shots.

LeBron James has only had a FTR of over 50% once in 2010 where it was 50.6% and he got 10.2 FTA a game on 20FGA. How on earth does a player with a playstyle identical to Lebron's have 3 seasons that destroy Lebron's career high FTR? Even if we just go off FTA, Lebron peaked in 06 at 10.3FTA per game on 23 shots and then 10.3FTA per game again in 08 on 22 shots. It took Wade 4 less shots to get more free throws, in both the aforementioned 06 and 07 where het got 10.5FTA, another season above Lebron's career high. Paul Pierce also has two seasons above Lebron's career high FTR because of course he does.

More examples of this nonsense. As mentioned in 2010, LeBron peaked in FTR at 10.2FTA on 20.0FGA. Kobe's FTR and FTA peaked in 05 as he got 10.1FTA per game on 20.1FGA with a FTR of 50.2%. KD's FTA peaked in 10 as he got 10.2FTA per game on 20.3FGA with a FTR of 50.4%, and his FTR peaked in 2013 with 9.3FTA on 17.7FGA for a FTR of 52.3%.

Why in the mother of god do two jump shooters in KD and Kobe Bryant have peak free throw rates near identical or higher than the slashing contact absorber that is Lebron. That's ridiculous.

Hell, in 2020 I asked people why Jimmy Butler was getting such a ridiculous amount of free throws, as it was flying under the radar. They said "he makes a lot of contact" as if Lebron didn't. Jimmy Butler took only 13FGA a game but was getting 9 **** free throws a game for a FTR of 69.3%. That's 4.6FGA per game below Lebron's career low in attempts whilst tying for his 5th best season in FTA. Absolutely ridiculous. He has 5 seasons above Lebron's career high FTR as well of course

In the 09 Post Season Lebron took a GOAT, peak Shaq level 13FGA a game in the paint and the restricted area combined. That was one of the few stretches in his entire career where he got the calls he should have, and go figure, he ended up having the best scoring post season in NBA history. A lot of people don't know that but yes, Lebron's 09 Post Season isn't just "ATG" or "one of the best", it's literally per 100 the highest scoring post season in NBA history, or at least it was pre-2019-2021, haven't actually checked since then.

Imagine if Lebron got the leeway that his peers did his entire career.
Harden obviously, Allen Iverson, Wade, KD, Dantley, REGGIE MILLER, Paul Pierce, DeRozan, Gilbert Arenas, Kirilenko, Richard Jefferson, Lou Williams, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, Bosh and Butler all have higher FTR for their careers than Lebron, with Ginobilli's being 0.2% lower, and so basically identical.

And for the people that think maybe he's just getting reffed that way because of his size;

David Robinson's career average FTR is 57.7%, meaning it's much higher than Lebron's peak FTR of 50.6%.

In fact David Robinson had a free throw rate above 50% every single year of his 14 year career except for one year in 2000 where it was 49.6%, still higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% lmao.

Shaq is basically the same, and also has a career average massively higher than Lebron's career high, as do Wilt, Barkley, Kemp, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, Embiid, Alonzo Mourning and Dwight Howard who has a career average FTR of 79% which is some super GOAT **** that poops on everyone's. Magic Johnson, Giannis and Amare have career averages of 48.9% and 49.5% respectively. That's higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% and basically damn near 10% higher than Lebron's career average of 40%.

Bill Russell, Pau Gasol, Duncan, Blake Griffin, AD and Boogie also have higher FTR's for their careers.

So there's literally no consistent criteria by which Lebron should be getting less free throws than everyone. Has a lower free throw rate than the likes of skinny ass jump shooters in KD and Reggie god damn Miller and a SIGNIFICANTLY lower free throw rate than the likes of his strong peers like Barkley, Karl Malone, or Kemp etc, with KD and Kobe have higher peaks than him.

Much more in depth post than I anticipated making when I first clicked reply lol, but basically, for Lebron's entire career he's been reffed like a jump shooter that's good at drawing contact not a GOAT slasher that's good at drawing contact.

For reference, pre Wizards MJ had a FTR of 37% and Kobe's is 39%. LeBron is at 40% right now and will be sub 40 by next year. The fact that Lebron James will retire with a free throw rate comparable to MJ, KD and Kobe's and WITH A LOWER FREE THROW RATE THAN REGGIE MILLER OR 0x ALL STAR RICHARD JEFFERSON is a **** joke. Especially while Magic is sitting damn near 50. LeBron might be the only muscular athletic inside player in NBA history to retire with a FTR that's not near the 50's, let alone in the **** 30's. It's an outlier of insane proportions. I'm not a fan on conspiratorial thinking or jumping to conclusions but it is ridiculously odd.

i wonder if the refs are biased and want to handicap him cause he would be scoring too much otherwise or somethingh, maybe subconscoously their minds go "lebron is the best player, we got to limit him a bit"

or if they just go by narrative: X player gets a los of free throws, mm, i should give him fouls then, he surely must be earning them right?

Y players doesnt get many fre throws, mm, i probably shouldnt give him free throws

relying in reputation rather than watching the plays which is a self fulfilling cycle

I tend to agree that Lebron doesn't get the most favorable whistle on offense, but it also seems like players that are able to create more separation when getting to the cup tend to get rewarded with the whistle vs those that create contact and force their way to the basket.

Lebron's draw rate peaked back when he still had an elite first step.

I'm not sure Lebron was ever as good at getting to the basket as young Wade and back when young Lebron was more of that kind of slasher he definitely got more whistles.

It also looks to me like Lebron (much like CP3) gets a pretty favorable whistle on defense.

[falcolombardi]

LeBron and especially Jokic's lack of free throws is absolutely **** bonkers, but it's been like this his entire career.

Dwayne Wade in 3 straight seasons from 05-07 had free throw rates of 56.1%, 57.7% and 58.3%, and had his career high FTA in 06 where he had 10.8FTA per game on 19 shots.

LeBron James has only had a FTR of over 50% once in 2010 where it was 50.6% and he got 10.2 FTA a game on 20FGA. How on earth does a player with a playstyle identical to Lebron's have 3 seasons that destroy Lebron's career high FTR? Even if we just go off FTA, Lebron peaked in 06 at 10.3FTA per game on 23 shots and then 10.3FTA per game again in 08 on 22 shots. It took Wade 4 less shots to get more free throws, in both the aforementioned 06 and 07 where het got 10.5FTA, another season above Lebron's career high. Paul Pierce also has two seasons above Lebron's career high FTR because of course he does.

More examples of this nonsense. As mentioned in 2010, LeBron peaked in FTR at 10.2FTA on 20.0FGA. Kobe's FTR and FTA peaked in 05 as he got 10.1FTA per game on 20.1FGA with a FTR of 50.2%. KD's FTA peaked in 10 as he got 10.2FTA per game on 20.3FGA with a FTR of 50.4%, and his FTR peaked in 2013 with 9.3FTA on 17.7FGA for a FTR of 52.3%.

Why in the mother of god do two jump shooters in KD and Kobe Bryant have peak free throw rates near identical or higher than the slashing contact absorber that is Lebron. That's ridiculous.

Hell, in 2020 I asked people why Jimmy Butler was getting such a ridiculous amount of free throws, as it was flying under the radar. They said "he makes a lot of contact" as if Lebron didn't. Jimmy Butler took only 13FGA a game but was getting 9 **** free throws a game for a FTR of 69.3%. That's 4.6FGA per game below Lebron's career low in attempts whilst tying for his 5th best season in FTA. Absolutely ridiculous. He has 5 seasons above Lebron's career high FTR as well of course

In the 09 Post Season Lebron took a GOAT, peak Shaq level 13FGA a game in the paint and the restricted area combined. That was one of the few stretches in his entire career where he got the calls he should have, and go figure, he ended up having the best scoring post season in NBA history. A lot of people don't know that but yes, Lebron's 09 Post Season isn't just "ATG" or "one of the best", it's literally per 100 the highest scoring post season in NBA history, or at least it was pre-2019-2021, haven't actually checked since then.

Imagine if Lebron got the leeway that his peers did his entire career.
Harden obviously, Allen Iverson, Wade, KD, Dantley, REGGIE MILLER, Paul Pierce, DeRozan, Gilbert Arenas, Kirilenko, Richard Jefferson, Lou Williams, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, Bosh and Butler all have higher FTR for their careers than Lebron, with Ginobilli's being 0.2% lower, and so basically identical.

And for the people that think maybe he's just getting reffed that way because of his size;

David Robinson's career average FTR is 57.7%, meaning it's much higher than Lebron's peak FTR of 50.6%.

In fact David Robinson had a free throw rate above 50% every single year of his 14 year career except for one year in 2000 where it was 49.6%, still higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% lmao.

Shaq is basically the same, and also has a career average massively higher than Lebron's career high, as do Wilt, Barkley, Kemp, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, Embiid, Alonzo Mourning and Dwight Howard who has a career average FTR of 79% which is some super GOAT **** that poops on everyone's. Magic Johnson, Giannis and Amare have career averages of 48.9% and 49.5% respectively. That's higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% and basically damn near 10% higher than Lebron's career average of 40%.

Bill Russell, Pau Gasol, Duncan, Blake Griffin, AD and Boogie also have higher FTR's for their careers.

So there's literally no consistent criteria by which Lebron should be getting less free throws than everyone. Has a lower free throw rate than the likes of skinny ass jump shooters in KD and Reggie god damn Miller and a SIGNIFICANTLY lower free throw rate than the likes of his strong peers like Barkley, Karl Malone, or Kemp etc, with KD and Kobe have higher peaks than him.

Much more in depth post than I anticipated making when I first clicked reply lol, but basically, for Lebron's entire career he's been reffed like a jump shooter that's good at drawing contact not a GOAT slasher that's good at drawing contact.

For reference, pre Wizards MJ had a FTR of 37% and Kobe's is 39%. LeBron is at 40% right now and will be sub 40 by next year. The fact that Lebron James will retire with a free throw rate comparable to MJ, KD and Kobe's and WITH A LOWER FREE THROW RATE THAN REGGIE MILLER OR 0x ALL STAR RICHARD JEFFERSON is a **** joke. Especially while Magic is sitting damn near 50. LeBron might be the only muscular athletic inside player in NBA history to retire with a FTR that's not near the 50's, let alone in the **** 30's. It's an outlier of insane proportions. I'm not a fan on conspiratorial thinking or jumping to conclusions but it is ridiculously odd.

i wonder if the refs are biased and want to handicap him cause he would be scoring too much otherwise or somethingh, maybe subconscoously their minds go "lebron is the best player, we got to limit him a bit"

or if they just go by narrative: X player gets a los of free throws, mm, i should give him fouls then, he surely must be earning them right?

Y players doesnt get many fre throws, mm, i probably shouldnt give him free throws

relying in reputation rather than watching the plays which is a self fulfilling cycle

I tend to agree that Lebron doesn't get the most favorable whistle on offense, but it also seems like players that are able to create more separation when getting to the cup tend to get rewarded with the whistle vs those that create contact and force their way to the basket.

Lebron's draw rate peaked back when he still had an elite first step.

I'm not sure Lebron was ever as good at getting to the basket as young Wade and back when young Lebron was more of that kind of slasher he definitely got more whistles.

It also looks to me like Lebron (much like CP3) gets a pretty favorable whistle on defense.

the low foul rate in defense is a very fair point

[McBubbles]

LeBron and especially Jokic's lack of free throws is absolutely **** bonkers, but it's been like this his entire career.

Dwayne Wade in 3 straight seasons from 05-07 had free throw rates of 56.1%, 57.7% and 58.3%, and had his career high FTA in 06 where he had 10.8FTA per game on 19 shots.

LeBron James has only had a FTR of over 50% once in 2010 where it was 50.6% and he got 10.2 FTA a game on 20FGA. How on earth does a player with a playstyle identical to Lebron's have 3 seasons that destroy Lebron's career high FTR? Even if we just go off FTA, Lebron peaked in 06 at 10.3FTA per game on 23 shots and then 10.3FTA per game again in 08 on 22 shots. It took Wade 4 less shots to get more free throws, in both the aforementioned 06 and 07 where het got 10.5FTA, another season above Lebron's career high. Paul Pierce also has two seasons above Lebron's career high FTR because of course he does.

More examples of this nonsense. As mentioned in 2010, LeBron peaked in FTR at 10.2FTA on 20.0FGA. Kobe's FTR and FTA peaked in 05 as he got 10.1FTA per game on 20.1FGA with a FTR of 50.2%. KD's FTA peaked in 10 as he got 10.2FTA per game on 20.3FGA with a FTR of 50.4%, and his FTR peaked in 2013 with 9.3FTA on 17.7FGA for a FTR of 52.3%.

Why in the mother of god do two jump shooters in KD and Kobe Bryant have peak free throw rates near identical or higher than the slashing contact absorber that is Lebron. That's ridiculous.

Hell, in 2020 I asked people why Jimmy Butler was getting such a ridiculous amount of free throws, as it was flying under the radar. They said "he makes a lot of contact" as if Lebron didn't. Jimmy Butler took only 13FGA a game but was getting 9 **** free throws a game for a FTR of 69.3%. That's 4.6FGA per game below Lebron's career low in attempts whilst tying for his 5th best season in FTA. Absolutely ridiculous. He has 5 seasons above Lebron's career high FTR as well of course

In the 09 Post Season Lebron took a GOAT, peak Shaq level 13FGA a game in the paint and the restricted area combined. That was one of the few stretches in his entire career where he got the calls he should have, and go figure, he ended up having the best scoring post season in NBA history. A lot of people don't know that but yes, Lebron's 09 Post Season isn't just "ATG" or "one of the best", it's literally per 100 the highest scoring post season in NBA history, or at least it was pre-2019-2021, haven't actually checked since then.

Imagine if Lebron got the leeway that his peers did his entire career.
Harden obviously, Allen Iverson, Wade, KD, Dantley, REGGIE MILLER, Paul Pierce, DeRozan, Gilbert Arenas, Kirilenko, Richard Jefferson, Lou Williams, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, Bosh and Butler all have higher FTR for their careers than Lebron, with Ginobilli's being 0.2% lower, and so basically identical.

And for the people that think maybe he's just getting reffed that way because of his size;

David Robinson's career average FTR is 57.7%, meaning it's much higher than Lebron's peak FTR of 50.6%.

In fact David Robinson had a free throw rate above 50% every single year of his 14 year career except for one year in 2000 where it was 49.6%, still higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% lmao.

Shaq is basically the same, and also has a career average massively higher than Lebron's career high, as do Wilt, Barkley, Kemp, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, Embiid, Alonzo Mourning and Dwight Howard who has a career average FTR of 79% which is some super GOAT **** that poops on everyone's. Magic Johnson, Giannis and Amare have career averages of 48.9% and 49.5% respectively. That's higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% and basically damn near 10% higher than Lebron's career average of 40%.

Bill Russell, Pau Gasol, Duncan, Blake Griffin, AD and Boogie also have higher FTR's for their careers.

So there's literally no consistent criteria by which Lebron should be getting less free throws than everyone. Has a lower free throw rate than the likes of skinny ass jump shooters in KD and Reggie god damn Miller and a SIGNIFICANTLY lower free throw rate than the likes of his strong peers like Barkley, Karl Malone, or Kemp etc, with KD and Kobe have higher peaks than him.

Much more in depth post than I anticipated making when I first clicked reply lol, but basically, for Lebron's entire career he's been reffed like a jump shooter that's good at drawing contact not a GOAT slasher that's good at drawing contact.

For reference, pre Wizards MJ had a FTR of 37% and Kobe's is 39%. LeBron is at 40% right now and will be sub 40 by next year. The fact that Lebron James will retire with a free throw rate comparable to MJ, KD and Kobe's and WITH A LOWER FREE THROW RATE THAN REGGIE MILLER OR 0x ALL STAR RICHARD JEFFERSON is a **** joke. Especially while Magic is sitting damn near 50. LeBron might be the only muscular athletic inside player in NBA history to retire with a FTR that's not near the 50's, let alone in the **** 30's. It's an outlier of insane proportions. I'm not a fan on conspiratorial thinking or jumping to conclusions but it is ridiculously odd.

i wonder if the refs are biased and want to handicap him cause he would be scoring too much otherwise or somethingh, maybe subconscoously their minds go "lebron is the best player, we got to limit him a bit"

or if they just go by narrative: X player gets a los of free throws, mm, i should give him fouls then, he surely must be earning them right?

Y players doesnt get many fre throws, mm, i probably shouldnt give him free throws

relying in reputation rather than watching the plays which is a self fulfilling cycle

I tend to agree that Lebron doesn't get the most favorable whistle on offense, but it also seems like players that are able to create more separation when getting to the cup tend to get rewarded with the whistle vs those that create contact and force their way to the basket.

Lebron's draw rate peaked back when he still had an elite first step.

I'm not sure Lebron was ever as good at [b]getting to the basket as young Wade and back when young Lebron was more of that kind of slasher he definitely got more whistles.
[/b]
It also looks to me like Lebron (much like CP3) gets a pretty favorable whistle on defense.

Both these things are categorically incorrect. From 04-10 LeBron averaged more FGA in the restricted area than Wade, peaked higher than Wade and literally never got as many whistles as he did let alone more. That was already mentioned in the data I showed.

And I addressed the second part too. Players that create contact and force their way to the basket have the highest free throw rates. LeBron James is the only player to do this that has low free throw rates. Dwight Howard's is 78% for his career ffs. Jimmy Butler peaked at damn near 70%, 20% higher than Lebron.

I don't mean to be rude but did you read my post lol, everything you said was already addressed and debunked.

[LukaTheGOAT]

It’s obvious that this mistreatment is being legislated from the top. It’s far too consistent no to be.

I do not understand why a league would treat the absolute biggest draw in their sport this way. It’s getting outrageous.

LeBron and especially Jokic's lack of free throws is absolutely **** bonkers, but it's been like this his entire career.

Dwayne Wade in 3 straight seasons from 05-07 had free throw rates of 56.1%, 57.7% and 58.3%, and had his career high FTA in 06 where he had 10.8FTA per game on 19 shots.

LeBron James has only had a FTR of over 50% once in 2010 where it was 50.6% and he got 10.2 FTA a game on 20FGA. How on earth does a player with a playstyle identical to Lebron's have 3 seasons that destroy Lebron's career high FTR? Even if we just go off FTA, Lebron peaked in 06 at 10.3FTA per game on 23 shots and then 10.3FTA per game again in 08 on 22 shots. It took Wade 4 less shots to get more free throws, in both the aforementioned 06 and 07 where het got 10.5FTA, another season above Lebron's career high. Paul Pierce also has two seasons above Lebron's career high FTR because of course he does.

More examples of this nonsense. As mentioned in 2010, LeBron peaked in FTR at 10.2FTA on 20.0FGA. Kobe's FTR and FTA peaked in 05 as he got 10.1FTA per game on 20.1FGA with a FTR of 50.2%. KD's FTA peaked in 10 as he got 10.2FTA per game on 20.3FGA with a FTR of 50.4%, and his FTR peaked in 2013 with 9.3FTA on 17.7FGA for a FTR of 52.3%.

Why in the mother of god do two jump shooters in KD and Kobe Bryant have peak free throw rates near identical or higher than the slashing contact absorber that is Lebron. That's ridiculous.

Hell, in 2020 I asked people why Jimmy Butler was getting such a ridiculous amount of free throws, as it was flying under the radar. They said "he makes a lot of contact" as if Lebron didn't. Jimmy Butler took only 13FGA a game but was getting 9 **** free throws a game for a FTR of 69.3%. That's 4.6FGA per game below Lebron's career low in attempts whilst tying for his 5th best season in FTA. Absolutely ridiculous. He has 5 seasons above Lebron's career high FTR as well of course

In the 09 Post Season Lebron took a GOAT, peak Shaq level 13FGA a game in the paint and the restricted area combined. That was one of the few stretches in his entire career where he got the calls he should have, and go figure, he ended up having the best scoring post season in NBA history. A lot of people don't know that but yes, Lebron's 09 Post Season isn't just "ATG" or "one of the best", it's literally per 100 the highest scoring post season in NBA history, or at least it was pre-2019-2021, haven't actually checked since then.

Imagine if Lebron got the leeway that his peers did his entire career.
Harden obviously, Allen Iverson, Wade, KD, Dantley, REGGIE MILLER, Paul Pierce, DeRozan, Gilbert Arenas, Kirilenko, Richard Jefferson, Lou Williams, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, Bosh and Butler all have higher FTR for their careers than Lebron, with Ginobilli's being 0.2% lower, and so basically identical.

And for the people that think maybe he's just getting reffed that way because of his size;

David Robinson's career average FTR is 57.7%, meaning it's much higher than Lebron's peak FTR of 50.6%.

In fact David Robinson had a free throw rate above 50% every single year of his 14 year career except for one year in 2000 where it was 49.6%, still higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% lmao.

Shaq is basically the same, and also has a career average massively higher than Lebron's career high, as do Wilt, Barkley, Kemp, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, Embiid, Alonzo Mourning and Dwight Howard who has a career average FTR of 79% which is some super GOAT **** that poops on everyone's. Magic Johnson, Giannis and Amare have career averages of 48.9% and 49.5% respectively. That's higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% and basically damn near 10% higher than Lebron's career average of 40%.

Bill Russell, Pau Gasol, Duncan, Blake Griffin, AD and Boogie also have higher FTR's for their careers.

So there's literally no consistent criteria by which Lebron should be getting less free throws than everyone. Has a lower free throw rate than the likes of skinny ass jump shooters in KD and Reggie god damn Miller and a SIGNIFICANTLY lower free throw rate than the likes of his strong peers like Barkley, Karl Malone, or Kemp etc, with KD and Kobe have higher peaks than him.

Much more in depth post than I anticipated making when I first clicked reply lol, but basically, for Lebron's entire career he's been reffed like a jump shooter that's good at drawing contact not a GOAT slasher that's good at drawing contact.

For reference, pre Wizards MJ had a FTR of 37% and Kobe's is 39%. LeBron is at 40% right now and will be sub 40 by next year. The fact that Lebron James will retire with a free throw rate comparable to MJ, KD and Kobe's and WITH A LOWER FREE THROW RATE THAN REGGIE MILLER OR 0x ALL STAR RICHARD JEFFERSON is a **** joke. Especially while Magic is sitting damn near 50. LeBron might be the only muscular athletic inside player in NBA history to retire with a FTR that's not near the 50's, let alone in the **** 30's. It's an outlier of insane proportions. I'm not a fan on conspiratorial thinking or jumping to conclusions but it is ridiculously odd.

All of this.

I will also just say.

LeBron had 24 shots and 2 free throws lmao. Read that again. Last two games: 45 FGA and 5 free throws.

For comparison purposes:

LeBron:
shot at the rim: 6.6 per game, FTA: 5.9
Embiid: rim:4.4, FTA: 11.1
Giannis: Rim: 7.1, FTA: 10.9
Kd: rim: 2.5, FTA: 7.1
Harden: rim: 3.8, FTA: 8

[falcolombardi]

LeBron and especially Jokic's lack of free throws is absolutely **** bonkers, but it's been like this his entire career.

Dwayne Wade in 3 straight seasons from 05-07 had free throw rates of 56.1%, 57.7% and 58.3%, and had his career high FTA in 06 where he had 10.8FTA per game on 19 shots.

LeBron James has only had a FTR of over 50% once in 2010 where it was 50.6% and he got 10.2 FTA a game on 20FGA. How on earth does a player with a playstyle identical to Lebron's have 3 seasons that destroy Lebron's career high FTR? Even if we just go off FTA, Lebron peaked in 06 at 10.3FTA per game on 23 shots and then 10.3FTA per game again in 08 on 22 shots. It took Wade 4 less shots to get more free throws, in both the aforementioned 06 and 07 where het got 10.5FTA, another season above Lebron's career high. Paul Pierce also has two seasons above Lebron's career high FTR because of course he does.

More examples of this nonsense. As mentioned in 2010, LeBron peaked in FTR at 10.2FTA on 20.0FGA. Kobe's FTR and FTA peaked in 05 as he got 10.1FTA per game on 20.1FGA with a FTR of 50.2%. KD's FTA peaked in 10 as he got 10.2FTA per game on 20.3FGA with a FTR of 50.4%, and his FTR peaked in 2013 with 9.3FTA on 17.7FGA for a FTR of 52.3%.

Why in the mother of god do two jump shooters in KD and Kobe Bryant have peak free throw rates near identical or higher than the slashing contact absorber that is Lebron. That's ridiculous.

Hell, in 2020 I asked people why Jimmy Butler was getting such a ridiculous amount of free throws, as it was flying under the radar. They said "he makes a lot of contact" as if Lebron didn't. Jimmy Butler took only 13FGA a game but was getting 9 **** free throws a game for a FTR of 69.3%. That's 4.6FGA per game below Lebron's career low in attempts whilst tying for his 5th best season in FTA. Absolutely ridiculous. He has 5 seasons above Lebron's career high FTR as well of course

In the 09 Post Season Lebron took a GOAT, peak Shaq level 13FGA a game in the paint and the restricted area combined. That was one of the few stretches in his entire career where he got the calls he should have, and go figure, he ended up having the best scoring post season in NBA history. A lot of people don't know that but yes, Lebron's 09 Post Season isn't just "ATG" or "one of the best", it's literally per 100 the highest scoring post season in NBA history, or at least it was pre-2019-2021, haven't actually checked since then.

Imagine if Lebron got the leeway that his peers did his entire career.
Harden obviously, Allen Iverson, Wade, KD, Dantley, REGGIE MILLER, Paul Pierce, DeRozan, Gilbert Arenas, Kirilenko, Richard Jefferson, Lou Williams, Chauncey Billups, Grant Hill, Bosh and Butler all have higher FTR for their careers than Lebron, with Ginobilli's being 0.2% lower, and so basically identical.

And for the people that think maybe he's just getting reffed that way because of his size;

David Robinson's career average FTR is 57.7%, meaning it's much higher than Lebron's peak FTR of 50.6%.

In fact David Robinson had a free throw rate above 50% every single year of his 14 year career except for one year in 2000 where it was 49.6%, still higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% lmao.

Shaq is basically the same, and also has a career average massively higher than Lebron's career high, as do Wilt, Barkley, Kemp, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, Embiid, Alonzo Mourning and Dwight Howard who has a career average FTR of 79% which is some super GOAT **** that poops on everyone's. Magic Johnson, Giannis and Amare have career averages of 48.9% and 49.5% respectively. That's higher than Lebron's 2nd career high of 47.2% and basically damn near 10% higher than Lebron's career average of 40%.

Bill Russell, Pau Gasol, Duncan, Blake Griffin, AD and Boogie also have higher FTR's for their careers.

So there's literally no consistent criteria by which Lebron should be getting less free throws than everyone. Has a lower free throw rate than the likes of skinny ass jump shooters in KD and Reggie god damn Miller and a SIGNIFICANTLY lower free throw rate than the likes of his strong peers like Barkley, Karl Malone, or Kemp etc, with KD and Kobe have higher peaks than him.

Much more in depth post than I anticipated making when I first clicked reply lol, but basically, for Lebron's entire career he's been reffed like a jump shooter that's good at drawing contact not a GOAT slasher that's good at drawing contact.

For reference, pre Wizards MJ had a FTR of 37% and Kobe's is 39%. LeBron is at 40% right now and will be sub 40 by next year. The fact that Lebron James will retire with a free throw rate comparable to MJ, KD and Kobe's and WITH A LOWER FREE THROW RATE THAN REGGIE MILLER OR 0x ALL STAR RICHARD JEFFERSON is a **** joke. Especially while Magic is sitting damn near 50. LeBron might be the only muscular athletic inside player in NBA history to retire with a FTR that's not near the 50's, let alone in the **** 30's. It's an outlier of insane proportions. I'm not a fan on conspiratorial thinking or jumping to conclusions but it is ridiculously odd.

All of this.

I will also just say.

LeBron had 24 shots and 2 free throws lmao. Read that again. Last two games: 45 FGA and 5 free throws.

For comparison purposes:

LeBron:
shot at the rim: 6.6 per game, FTA: 5.9
Embiid: rim:4.4, FTA: 11.1
Giannis: Rim: 7.1, FTA: 10.9
Kd: rim: 2.5, FTA: 7.1
Harden: rim: 3.8, FTA: 8

Jesús christ

[falcolombardi]

do you guys think the reason lebron game has been so resilient in the playoffs compared to most stars is that he gets less free throws in the first place?

the common belief that i have not fact checked is that calls dry out in the playoffs

[trickshot]

Worst part about AD missing the ASG is the stars aligned for him to step up his production with Lebron missing so many games. He also missed a huge opportunity to snag the DPOY last season. The last 2 years have been one of the most wasteful stretches we've seen from a player of his caliber. After the bubble voters were begging him to come take a regular season award. Potentially left A dpoy and an all star appearance on the table. Legacy boosting stretch down the drain. You should never waste peak seasons. Fortunately he's back to playing to the best of his abilities.

[LukaTheGOAT]

This team is so awkward

Read on Twitter

?s=19

[falcolombardi]

This team is so awkward

Read on Twitter

?s=19

he is not wrong per se, having davis and lebron is, like, pretty cool

but why did he declare this? only thingh he is doing is making it seem like he is just praying his stars make a miracle happen

doesnt make him sound like a competent coach amd can even come across as arrogant by saying he is confidente while the team is terrible

[LukaTheGOAT]

This team is so awkward

Read on Twitter

?s=19

he is not wrong per se, having davis and lebron is, like, pretty cool

but why did he declare this? only thingh he is doing is making it seem like he is just praying his stars make a miracle happen

doesnt make him sound like a competent coach amd can even come across as arrogant by saying he is confidente while the team is terrible

To me the controversial thing he said was, "when you have a starting point in Lebron,"....like as of now Russ has been the starting PG this year for every game and leads the league in total minutes. Just feels weird to say.

[LukaTheGOAT]

She could save the Lakers' season

Read on Twitter

This is getting serious too

Read on Twitter

[Fadeaway_J]

This team is so awkward

Read on Twitter

?s=19

he is not wrong per se, having davis and lebron is, like, pretty cool

but why did he declare this? only thingh he is doing is making it seem like he is just praying his stars make a miracle happen

doesnt make him sound like a competent coach amd can even come across as arrogant by saying he is confidente while the team is terrible

To me the controversial thing he said was, "when you have a starting point in Lebron,"....like as of now Russ has been the starting PG this year for every game and leads the league in total minutes. Just feels weird to say.

He said starting point not point guard. He's talking about LeBron and AD as a duo.