Official Scottie Barnes Thread 2

[dalton749]

Yeah well so is Barnes.

true. He's elite too

Would you trade Barnes for Mobley? I would. i think it would fit both teams well tbh

I just don't see why you make that trade.

Scottie seems to be able to do everything Mobley can, but with even more versatility and the ability to actually headman the offense too.

Scottie’s got some dog in him too and looks to be the guy to be the leader of a team, Mobley is too passive and reserved, I don’t see a good number 1 guy in him.

It’s like AD who clearly can’t be the main guy, scottie at least has the potential to be.

[WuTang_CMB]

https://theathletic.com/3168555/2022/03/11/evan-mobley-cade-cunningham-lead-rookie-of-the-year-race-nikola-jokic-tops-mvp-list-for-now-nba-awards-rankings/

Rookie of the Year is a funny award.

We put a ton of stock into it because it’s supposed to be predictive of things to come. We’ll ignore the occasional Mike Miller or Michael Carter-Williams win. We’ll remember getting caught up in the Tyreke Evans hype with Steph Curry serving as a late bloomer in his rookie campaign. For the most part, this award does bring about the hype you’d want to build upon.

The four most recent recipients of the award have already been All-Stars. One has been in Defensive Player of the Year discussions. Two have already been in MVP discussions. Eight of the last 10 ROY winners have been named All-Stars at least once. Three of the last 20 Rookie of the Year winners have gone on to win an MVP at some point. There are 10 championship rings sprinkled throughout the past 20 ROY award winners. While this award can often be overlooked and just given to the rookie scoring the most points, it does give you a high likelihood that these players will become somewhat historic.

In this year’s race, we’ve already seen a ton of top talent. Two players have been at the forefront, while the No. 1 overall pick is in the process of surging up the rookie rankings to try to snatch this trophy. This week, we focus on the tight three-man race for the Rookie of the Year award.

Here’s how the Awards Rankings shake out:

Over the last three seasons, I was fortunate enough to be one of the media members selected to vote on the awards. It is an honor I take very seriously, as I tried to make sure I selected the players I felt most deserving of the respective awards. With it being public, I also didn’t want to end up getting meme’d to eternity for casting a ridiculous vote. I like to do this column down the stretch run of the season, and I think it’s a pretty good gauge of my thoughts/research and those opinions submitted by other writers and the readers of The Athletic to help filter the players who are less deserving than the eventual vote-getters.

In this space over the next few weeks, we’ll focus on different awards but also come up with my own rankings for where all of the races stand. As is the case with all types of rankings and opinions on the internet, I’m sure this will be met with agreements and handshakes rather than yelling and name-calling. If you have a differing opinion, I’m interested in reading those in the comments. Let’s just get this out of the way before you submit:

Yes, I watch the games.
Yes, I have looked at the numbers.
No, I don’t hate that player.
No, I don’t hate that team. There is one team I hate in all of professional sports, and it doesn’t exist in the NBA. None of that carries over to the NBA.
If you have a differing opinion and want to roast me, by all means, have at it. Just try to have a point that makes sense. I’m less interested in your bias toward your favorite player or team, but I am very interested in a possible perspective that I have missed or haven’t considered enough. I’m all about acquiring as much information and as many opinions as possible for these awards.
With each award section, I’m going to give my personal criteria for how it should be considered while taking my own thoughts and what I feel the award has historically emphasized in voting.
Let’s get into each award, with this week’s emphasis on Rookie of the Year. We’ll have quick-hitter thoughts and criteria for the rest of the awards.

Rookie of the Year
Criteria: My criteria for how you earn the ROY award are based both on how I view the award and what a lot of voting in the NBA’s past has said about the winners of the award.

Are you a big story in the NBA? Three years ago, this was “Are you Luka Doncic?” and it was pretty self-explanatory. If you can capture being a storyline as a rookie, you have a huge upper hand.
Cool stats for a rookie — Most of the time, ROY goes to the leading rookie scorer.
Team success — It usually doesn’t matter for ROY, but team success can be a tiebreaker for some.
Two honorable mentions: Franz Wagner, Orlando Magic | Josh Giddey, Oklahoma City Thunder

Quick thought on honorable mentions: It’s difficult not to include Wagner or Giddey in the top three in the Rookie of the Year voting, but look at what they’re competing against. There just isn’t enough room with the guys ahead of them to justify throwing them into the mix. They’ve still had great rookie campaigns, and both fan bases have to be excited about the future with them in tow, but these guys get stuck on the outside looking in — barring an injury to the star competition.

3. Scottie Barnes, Toronto Raptors
Reason: The surge from Cade Cunningham has knocked Scottie Barnes out of the top two for now. It’s hard to ignore Barnes and what he’s done for the Toronto Raptors all season. If all things become equal, Barnes and his contribution to a successful team could win out in the voting positioning between these two rookies. That’s, of course, assuming there isn’t a major shift in production by any of these guys. For the most part, they’ve been pretty consistent for a long stretch of this season. Barnes has managed to be good across the board no matter what the Raptors ask of him on the floor. He’s filled bigger roles and then slid into lesser but still important roles for Nick Nurse depending on player availability.

Barnes hit the rookie wall in January, where we saw his shooting percentage drop to 42.0 percent and his overall true shooting drop below 50 percent, and he was fouling kind of a lot. It happens to most rookies most seasons, and Barnes wasn’t impervious to that. But we saw him adapt to the struggle and learn how to get out of it pretty quickly. He bounced back fiercely in February hitting 54.0 percent of his shots, launching that true shooting over 60 and fouling way less. Nurse trusts him to be on the floor at the end of games, and we’ve seen him make clutch plays on both ends. Masai Ujiri hit a home run with grabbing him at No. 4 when a lot of people believed Jalen Suggs should be the choice. Barnes fits the Raptors’ preference for type of player and the type of person/competitor they want embedded in their culture.

[Madhouse]

Cavs are a below average defensive team with Mobley and without Jarrett Allen.

Yah I haven't gotten around to seeing how Mobley plays without Allen.

you guys are bias.

We lost w/o fred. Listen to argue Scottie is a better prospect is fine but Mobley is a top 10 trade asset in this league. don't be silly here

Scottie smoking that Mobley pack...

Since the allstar break:

Scottie Barnes: +4.2 BPM, 19/8/3/2/1, 57% FG, 62% TS
Evan Mobley: +0.4 BPM, 15/10/3/1/2, 49% FG, 54% TS
Cade Cunningham: -0.5 BPM, 22/8/6/1/1, 44% FG, 52% TS
Jalen Green: +2.1 BPM, 20/3/4/1, 49% FG, 58% TS
Franz Wagner: -0.3 BPM, 13/5/3/1, 46% FG, 54% TS
Jonathan Kuminga: -0.6 BPM, 15/5/1/1/1, 52% FG, 64% TS
Ayo Dosunmu: +0.1 BPM, 11/3/5/2/1, 57% FG, 63% TS

[positivetension]

Big loser energy from the people who don't think Scottie is poised to be a superstar. I like Mobley and he was #1 on my list at the draft but I wouldn't trade Barnes for him at this point. If Barnes was on any other team in the league, the analysts would be raving about him and he'd have all the hype. Who cares about hype.. I'd rather have the better player.

[mdenny]

Big loser energy from the people who don't think Scottie is poised to be a superstar. I like Mobley and he was #1 on my list at the draft but I wouldn't trade Barnes for him at this point. If Barnes was on any other team in the league, the analysts would be raving about him and he'd have all the hype. Who cares about hype.. I'd rather have the better player.

Yah I think Barnes' ceiling is higher but Mobley has a higher floor.

It would be really hard to pick between the 2 at this point. Maybe still go to Mobley just because it may be a better positional fit? I don't know.....I think the promise for Barnes is higher. I'm just pleased we didn't end up with Green or Suggs.

[vini_vidi_vici]

Big loser energy from the people who don't think Scottie is poised to be a superstar. I like Mobley and he was #1 on my list at the draft but I wouldn't trade Barnes for him at this point. If Barnes was on any other team in the league, the analysts would be raving about him and he'd have all the hype. Who cares about hype.. I'd rather have the better player.

Yah I think Barnes' ceiling is higher but Mobley has a higher floor.

It would be really hard to pick between the 2 at this point. Maybe still go to Mobley just because it may be a better positional fit? I don't know.....I think the promise for Barnes is higher. I'm just pleased we didn't end up with Green or Suggs.

I think I agree with this, but I dont know about positional fit, this is the positionless era of basketball. I dont think he fits OUR philosophies.

Hes been meh defensively, while guarding bad players, other than as a rim protector, I dont see the fit and would likely struggle with all the switching on our defense. Even our bigs pick up fullcourt when OREB, he wont do that.

Offensively, hes not a creator. Hes a finisher. We need guys who are triple threats on the perimeter for swings, to open up gravity for our DHO/PnR initial action/s. Hes not even good in transition.

Id easily argue Barnes is the better fit, and I think better player (with less certainty, because they are so young).

[OakleyDokely]

If Mobley was on this team, people would still be talking about the need for a " true center". Mobley has height/length, but he doesn't have the bulk/strength Barnes has. Mobley is/was still playing most of his minutes next to a legit big C in Allen.

In the end, whomever from this draft becomes the best offensive player will likely be the most valuable player. The hardest thing to find are elite, efficient, 3 level scorers who can create for themselves and others. Barnes fits the prototype of that elite, versatile big wing that dominates the playoffs (Kawhi, KD, Giannis, Lebron etc) best.

[vini_vidi_vici]

If Mobley was on this team, people would still be talking about the need for a " true center". Mobley has height/length, but he doesn't have the bulk/strength Barnes has. Mobley is/was still playing most of his minutes next to a legit big C in Allen.

In the end, whomever from this draft becomes the best offensive player will likely be the most valuable player. The hardest thing to find are elite, efficient, 3 level scorers who can create for themselves and others.

Who are versatile on defense, and can handle various positions/roles/USG rates. Scottie being #1 in defensive versatility is such a huge utility for this franchise, in the same way it is for OG/Spicy. Even guys like Precious/Boucher, or our "midgets" FVV/GTJ are versatile defenders, just with varying levels of success. I like how unlike alot of teams, we dont have one defender and rely on them because with switching/PnR/transition D the way it is, you can be exploited.

[OakleyDokely]

If Mobley was on this team, people would still be talking about the need for a " true center". Mobley has height/length, but he doesn't have the bulk/strength Barnes has. Mobley is/was still playing most of his minutes next to a legit big C in Allen.

In the end, whomever from this draft becomes the best offensive player will likely be the most valuable player. The hardest thing to find are elite, efficient, 3 level scorers who can create for themselves and others.

Who are versatile on defense, and can handle various positions/roles/USG rates. Scottie being #1 in defensive versatility is such a huge utility for this franchise, in the same way it is for OG/Spicy. Even guys like Precious/Boucher, or our "midgets" FVV/GTJ are versatile defenders, just with varying levels of success. I like how unlike alot of teams, we dont have one defender and rely on them because with switching/PnR/transition D the way it is, you can be exploited.

That was a big reason why the 2019 Raps were so good. Gasol/Ibaka/Siakam/Kawhi/Green/Powell/Lowry/VV - who/where do you exactly exploit defensively?

[HiJiNX]

If Mobley was on this team, people would still be talking about the need for a " true center". Mobley has height/length, but he doesn't have the bulk/strength Barnes has. Mobley is/was still playing most of his minutes next to a legit big C in Allen.

In the end, whomever from this draft becomes the best offensive player will likely be the most valuable player. The hardest thing to find are elite, efficient, 3 level scorers who can create for themselves and others.

Who are versatile on defense, and can handle various positions/roles/USG rates. Scottie being #1 in defensive versatility is such a huge utility for this franchise, in the same way it is for OG/Spicy. Even guys like Precious/Boucher, or our "midgets" FVV/GTJ are versatile defenders, just with varying levels of success. I like how unlike alot of teams, we dont have one defender and rely on them because with switching/PnR/transition D the way it is, you can be exploited.

That was a big reason why the 2019 Raps were so good. Gasol/Ibaka/Siakam/Kawhi/Green/Powell/Lowry/VV - who/where do you exactly exploit defensively?

This is why I thought the Raps were gonna win the championship going into the 2019 season. Too many good defenders who could score and make threes. Add Kawhi to that mix and well we know the rest.

[WuTang_CMB]

Who are versatile on defense, and can handle various positions/roles/USG rates. Scottie being #1 in defensive versatility is such a huge utility for this franchise, in the same way it is for OG/Spicy. Even guys like Precious/Boucher, or our "midgets" FVV/GTJ are versatile defenders, just with varying levels of success. I like how unlike alot of teams, we dont have one defender and rely on them because with switching/PnR/transition D the way it is, you can be exploited.

That was a big reason why the 2019 Raps were so good. Gasol/Ibaka/Siakam/Kawhi/Green/Powell/Lowry/VV - who/where do you exactly exploit defensively?

This is why I thought the Raps were gonna win the championship going into the 2019 season. Too many good defenders who could score and make threes. Add Kawhi to that mix and well we know the rest.

\
picking up Gasol was major too. He was the commander for the wall vs Giannis

[Madhouse]

Scottie Barnes raising Raptors' ceiling with change in mentality

https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/nba-scottie-barnes-raising-raptors-ceiling-with-change-in-mentality-215021581.html

[Raps1103]

Is Scottie unguardable in the post? Have we seen anyone actually stop him in the post ? Jesus Christ !

[everdiso]

Scottie is a freaking monster.

[dTox]

Read on Twitter

?t=0aGA6AcaerOPNhZbe-964g&s=09

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

[XTC]

Loved Scottie tonight. He became more passive as the game went on, but he became a monster at the other facets of the game.

Dude is literally turning into a nightly 20 point threat, while being a 6-9 point guard with a 7-4 wingspan, while also being our best defender... just read that over and process it and realize this guy is a Raptor.... Jeeeez

[Madhouse]

He didn't hit his shots in the 2nd half but he had steals, blocks, defense, assists.

21/9/5/1/2 on 53% FG

[Basketball_Jones]

I like how simple he keeps it. I mean, nobody is really stopping that turn around hook so that’s all he’s been doing

[hype_2004]

Loved Scottie tonight. He became more passive as the game went on, but he became a monster at the other facets of the game.

Dude is literally turning into a nightly 20 point threat, while being a 6-9 point guard with a 7-4 wingspan, while also being our best defender... just read that over and process it and realize this guy is a Raptor.... Jeeeez

He was facilitating and playing sound team defense. I mean this kids IQ is off the charts, he damn frustrated LeBron early. Scottie Barnes vs rookie LeBron one one who you got? Bron has him in speed but Barnes is just a straight beast and will punish him in the post.

[HumbleRen]

Loved Scottie tonight. He became more passive as the game went on, but he became a monster at the other facets of the game.

Dude is literally turning into a nightly 20 point threat, while being a 6-9 point guard with a 7-4 wingspan, while also being our best defender... just read that over and process it and realize this guy is a Raptor.... Jeeeez

He was facilitating and playing sound team defense. I mean this kids IQ is off the charts, he damn frustrated LeBron early. Scottie Barnes vs rookie LeBron one one who you got? Bron has him in speed but Barnes is just a straight beast and will punish him in the post.

Rookie Bron with no hesitation lol.

Give him the spacing and officiating ways of the current era ? Nobody would be able to stop him.