2021-22 NBA Season Discussion

[Texas Chuck]

dont get me wrong i was just mentioning how impressed i am by your boys

they are a nice group, brunson is impressing me and the rest of the roster plays really damn hard defensively

Yeah as a fan its hard to find much to fault them for. Wish the coach had more than 5 guys he trusted, but they are certainly giving their all. Bullock and Finney-Smith might have to play all 48 at this point since Josh Green can't figure out how to make the Jazz pay for just not guarding him at all lol.

Still, this only works because the Jazz are just tragic at defending the perimeter. Dallas just had the most open 3's in a playoff game in over a decade. And that's not all great scheme by Dallas. That's Utah is playing guys who can't defend the perimeter(Bojan/Conley) and guys who don't even seem interested in trying(Mitchell/Clarkson) and O'Neale is kinda wasted chasing shooters since he can't man up either Brunson or Dinwiddie and House hurts their offense.

But Dallas can't win 3 of 5 from here without Luka I don't believe. Dallas turned the ball over 3 total times and shot 47% from 3. That's not nearly as sustainable as Gobert dominating the glass and Bojan intelligently taking smaller guys into the post and abusing them getting what he wants or forcing doubles that lead to open 3's. And Clarkson is doing a great job taking advantage of the attention Bojan and Spida require and attacking the weakside.

Feels like Dallas is working 3x as hard as Utah to stay in these games. But yeah as a fan I love the compete and the refusal to accept that arguably the 3 best players on the court are in Jazz jerseys.

[The High Cyde]

Where does DeMarcus Cousins go after this? He’s definitely not coming back to the Nuggets after the little spat with Barton on the sidelines, fair or not.

Given his comments, he seemed to really like Milwaukee, but they had other plans.

[Peregrine01]

Where does DeMarcus Cousins go after this? He’s definitely not coming back to the Nuggets after the little spat with Barton on the sidelines, fair or not.

Given his comments, he seemed to really like Milwaukee, but they had other plans.

Can't see him sticking anywhere else. The Nuggets were the only team that took him but it was cause they were literally running out of players.

[Colbinii]

Where does DeMarcus Cousins go after this? He’s definitely not coming back to the Nuggets after the little spat with Barton on the sidelines, fair or not.

Given his comments, he seemed to really like Milwaukee, but they had other plans.

China

[parsnips33]

Really excited for game 2 of Grizz vs Wolves

I expect Memphis to make a statement, but wouldn't be super surprised by any outcome

[feyki]

This is the only way we could beat Jazz, Brunson with 40 and Kleber on 8/11 3PT!

I thought we'll lose by sweep, but this changed the all things; Doncic probably will return in the game 4 and maybe even at the game 3.

Brunson took us to the Fİnals.

[Outside]

Some of you need to cool it on the Curry/Warriors superlatives and hyperbole. They are up 2-0 on a crumbling Denver team in the 1st round which is looking to be a terrible match-up for them. They don't have the defensive personnel to slow it down or a superstar who's just grinding out every possession (LeBron did this against the Warriors in 2015 & 2018).

Yeah, the Warriors look good as many expected and should be getting to WCF against the Suns but reading this thread it would seem like they are up 3-0 in the WCF or the Finals or something

Say it louder for those in the back. Ignoring that Curry and Green were healthy all last year and sat out the playoffs....

To be fair, there's no duo in history that has been able to do it by themselves. We all love superlative players and performances, but we also love basketball as a team game where a quality, cohesive team can overcome a superlative player or duo.

I mean, even this season we have LeBron and Anthony Davis not making the playoffs and KD and Kyrie having to get in through the play-in.

Now I have all the respect in the world for them as a duo. Their record speaks for itself. But it also shows they weren't ever doing it alone. And hell last year the Warriors fans spent all year telling us Wiggins was all-D and he had his most efficient offensive season ever and they still were sitting and watching the playoffs.

Now I get it. They are the darlings because people decided it was the way they played rather than their overwhelming talent advantage that led to all the winning, but last year should have forever put that notion to bed. It was always about the players, not that Steve Kerr solved basketball and all that silliness that went on around here.

I'd argue that it's a combination of players and system/coaching, but there's no doubt that the Warriors roster is hugely upgraded over last season. There's two parts to that:

-- Of 18 players who got minutes last season, half are no longer on the roster. The additions have been a significant positive (Otto Porter, Jr., Bjelica, Klay, Kuminga) and the subtractions were negatives last season, some significant (Oubre, Wiseman, Wannamaker, Bazemore, Mulder, Paschall)

-- The players they kept are better. Jordan Poole is obviously much better. Gary Payton II had only 40 minutes in 10 games last season and has been an impactful contributor this season.

There's obviously a lot of noise around the Warriors system under Kerr, but the roster they have now is maximized to perform in that system.

And this Denver team is like 1.5 guys right now. This would be like the Jazz declaring themselves champions for beating Dallas without Luka in game 1....

I completely agree that the Nuggets have turned out to be a weak opponent and aren't a true test to gauge how good the Warriors are going to be this PS. But it's still worth something that the Warriors have been this good and that they've been able to give the death.0 lineup a test drive. To me, the Warriors ability to keep Jokic in check is more about how lousy the Denver supporting cast has been than Jokic not playing well.

We'll see if the Warriors defense can hold up against a better opponent. We'll see if the offense-heavy death.0 lineup can defend and rebound well enough against a better opponent. Denver is not the test that Memphis or the Suns will be.

[70sFan]

Jokic came from GOAT level player to not made for playoffs via General Board. It's funny how quickly the narrative changes for most people.

[falcolombardi]

Jokic came from GOAT level player to not made for playoffs via General Board. It's funny how quickly the narrative changes for most people.

i agree, but there is an area where i am starting to think the criticis may have a point. jokic defense being exploitable against the pick and roll

i need to see him with better perimeter defenders first, but this and last season vs suns are starting feel like a worrisome trend

the combination of jokic high fg% allowed at the rim and his impressive amount of shots contested are starting to worry me a bit

compared to gobert and premier rim protectors who defend fewer shots by reducing the amount of shots taken at the rim while allowing really low percentages

[The High Cyde]

Philly Miami is going to be a great series, super interested to see how Harden fares against that Heat defense. Good thing they have the best release valve in the playoffs with Maxey. Maybe Poole but you get the idea.

Harden is going to see PJ Tucker, a walking talking semi truck, Bam, a DPOY candidate, Jimmy Butler, another dog, and Lowry who’s as smart as any defender in the league.

And Spo at the helm. Doc hasn’t been too bad these two games, but Toronto is toothless at the moment.

[Texas Chuck]

I'd argue that it's a combination of players and system/coaching,.

No doubt. And I probably came across more dismissive of Kerr's part in all of this. I think much like Phil Jackson, his intangible, non-X and O stuff is vital. He's clearly one of the smartest coaches in the league, he knows the issues that are important to his players and speaks up on issues he cares about. His schemes are clearly good on both sides of the ball. He's a very good coach and maybe the ideal coach for a team led by stars and strong personalities. He manages to ensure he receives the respect the head coach has to have to succeed while not being an ass about it(Rick Carlisle a brilliant basketball mind one of a handful of guys who could really use this ability).

But 4 years ago this board had a number of posters who acted like he was the Messiah of basketball, and that was overblown. He had the best talent. And yeah he used it well, but we see that the schemes even with arguably the best offensive and (2nd? Gobert) best defensive players of a generation can only do so much.

[Outside]

Jokic came from GOAT level player to not made for playoffs via General Board. It's funny how quickly the narrative changes for most people.

i agree, but there is an area where i am starting to think the criticis may be right. jokic defense being exploitable against the pick and roll

i need to see him with better perimeter defenders first, but this and last season vs suns are starting feel like a worrisome trend

Gobert, Embiid, and pretty much any seven-footer are also exploitable against the PnR. That's what small lineups with perimeter shooting and ballhandling do to big guys.

[Texas Chuck]

Jokic came from GOAT level player to not made for playoffs via General Board. It's funny how quickly the narrative changes for most people.

i agree, but there is an area where i am starting to think the criticis may be right. jokic defense being exploitable against the pick and roll

i need to see him with better perimeter defenders first, but this and last season vs suns are starting feel like a worrisome trend

Gobert, Embiid, and pretty much any seven-footer are also exploitable against the PnR. That's what small lineups with perimeter shooting and ballhandling do to big guys.

There is a reason this is a PNR league. Because teams hunt mismatches. And yes centers are the most common target, but definitely not the only ones. Look at how teams hunt small guards too. I keep waiting for a defensive counter to this that isn't just lazy auto-switching, but with the quality of the shooting in the league today I do get why they do it.

but it's silly to dismiss the value of any of these players be it Jokic or Trae Young, Gobert or Curry because teams look to attack them. Even Draymond can be had. Or Smart. Or Mikal. Or Giannis. These are the best offensive players in the world surrounded by guys who you can't leave open behind the arc. There are no easy answers here. This isn't the 90's with two bigs with ranges of 8 feet, a PG who is a pass first, shoot rarely guy, and at least one if not both wings, were more slashers than shooters. We have to re-calibrate what good defense even looks like today.

[falcolombardi]

Jokic came from GOAT level player to not made for playoffs via General Board. It's funny how quickly the narrative changes for most people.

i agree, but there is an area where i am starting to think the criticis may be right. jokic defense being exploitable against the pick and roll

i need to see him with better perimeter defenders first, but this and last season vs suns are starting feel like a worrisome trend

Gobert, Embiid, and pretty much any seven-footer are also exploitable against the PnR. That's what small lineups with perimeter shooting and ballhandling do to big guys.

every big is exploitable outside the paint to a degree

but jokic poor (as in high) fg% allowed at the rim combined with the stats praising him for the amount og points defended paint a picture of a guy is -easy- to get to the rim against

that he is defending so many shots is not necesarrily a positive stat if the reason is that teams feel good about attacking the rim against him

gobert and co greater value is not the amount of shots they contest but rather the amount they dont by deterring players from going to the rim

[itsxtray]

The warriors at their best were always the most fun team to watch especially when Steph or Klay got hot and now you add Poole to that.

I love their new death lineup, it has more firepower than the 16 version but hasn't been tested on defense yet and frankly the Nuggets don't have what it takes to test them. Teams are gonna attack Poole & Curry to try to take their legs out of the game im eager to see if it can hold up.

[itsxtray]

Jokic came from GOAT level player to not made for playoffs via General Board. It's funny how quickly the narrative changes for most people.

i agree, but there is an area where i am starting to think the criticis may be right. jokic defense being exploitable against the pick and roll

i need to see him with better perimeter defenders first, but this and last season vs suns are starting feel like a worrisome trend

Gobert, Embiid, and pretty much any seven-footer are also exploitable against the PnR. That's what small lineups with perimeter shooting and ballhandling do to big guys.

Yep, this was my problem with 76ers fans against the hawks last year. Ben Simmons sucked but did they not see how Trae Young destroyed Embiid in the PnR? He was caught in between so many times and Young either lobbed it over his head to Capela or Collins or threw up a floater. Most bigs are food in this league, even the ones with decent mobility, be grateful for Draymond he's one of a kind.

[SeniorWalker]

Have the Warriors won the title - obviously no. Strictly speaking playoffs they've probably looked the most impressive so far though. We'll see how they continue to look as the playoffs go on.

Let me say this: though I'm not totally convinced the bucks will.make the finals, I think if the warriors do make it and run into giannis and company, they will get slaughtered. A lot of the NBA is about matchups and giannis over the past few years has shown me time and again in this particular match-up that he is basically a freight train against them. Plus with holiday to bully curry and Middleton for klay to cover.....warriors aren't a good match for them. The suns actually provide a much tougher matchup.

Again tho, I could see Milwaukee potentially losing to Boston or to philly/Miami. Any of those 4 can make it imo, though id say Boston and Milwaukee have the highest chances.

[falcolombardi]

Have the Warriors won the title - obviously no. Strictly speaking playoffs they've probably looked the most impressive so far though. We'll see how they continue to look as the playoffs go on.

Let me say this: though I'm not totally convinced the bucks will.make the finals, I think if the warriors do make it and run into giannis and company, they will get slaughtered. A lot of the NBA is about matchups and giannis over the past few years has shown me time and again in this particular match-up that he is basically a freight train against them. Plus with holiday to bully curry and Middleton for klay to cover.....warriors aren't a good match for them. The suns actually provide a much tougher matchup.

Again tho, I could see Milwaukee potentially losing to Boston or to philly/Miami. Any of those 4 can make it imo, though id say Boston and Milwaukee have the highest chances.

sometines matchups dont play out how we expect in theory tho

which is why i dont feel confident assuming how a matchup will play out, last finals i thought ayton and crowder would limit giannis by walling him out and see how that worked out lol

for all we know maybe warriors will find a way to destroy the bucks or suns (who i think dont matchup thst well with warriors) find a way to run warriors off the court

[Ron Swanson]

The "Jokic isn't made for the playoffs" stuff is comical, but I also don't think it should be completely dismissed how badly he's been stymied in his last two playoff series by teams that understand you should just target him on high pick & rolls over and over again, while devoting single coverage and playing the passing lanes on defense.

We're in an era where these guys are always gonna get their numbers (25/10/5 doesn't look "bad" on paper), but 51.6% TS, only 10 assists vs. 6 turnovers, and a mind-boggling 45 points-per-100 worse with him on the court vs. off is.......yikes. GS is just going small and quite literally running him off the court. I'm just stunned that he's been this ineffective through 2 games.

[parsnips33]

Marcus Smart DPOY got me thinking - should there be separate DPOY award for perimeter vs interior? It feels wrong that Smart won when there are bigs with much greater defensive impact, but it also feels wrong for guards to basically be excluded from the award except for rare occasions