Woj: Turner to Hawks for Bazemore

[bigdavid]

Don't hold back, Say what you really believe

[Khazim]

Crikey Wiz, relax a bit. Losing a guy like Evan is tough because of the person that he is, regardless of of how much he may have "sucked" on the court. Not everything is numbers, and there is this thing called "the human element", and believe it or not some of us have it.

[zzaj]

Just heard a segment with Clownzano where he was interviewing a Hawks beat writer about Baze...

Interestingly, the reporter said Bazemore was having a career year until he went down with an ankle sprain right before the new year. He returned two weeks later, but for whatever reasons wasn't the same player for the rest of the season.

After taking a closer look, that indeed seems to be true. Before he went down he averaged:

14.5/4/2.5 with 2 steals a game.

In the 10 games prior to the injury he averaged about 19/4/4 and shot 39.7% from 3pt. Let's all hope he can approach those kind of numbers on the Trailblazers...

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bazemke01/gamelog/2019#441-450-sum:pgl_basic

[Wizenheimer]

Crikey Wiz, relax a bit. Losing a guy like Evan is tough because of the person that he is, regardless of of how much he may have "sucked" on the court. Not everything is numbers, and there is this thing called "the human element", and believe it or not some of us have it.

LOL...c'mon man, stop with the "human element" jazz. You're not in a position to judge my humanity while casting yourself as superior...in fact, piss off with that noise

people have been trying to come up with trade scenarios for Turner....just to get him off the team...since halfway thru his 1st season in Portland, and even earlier. It wasn't just me...it was about 90% of the posters in this forum. Where the fk was the "human element" in that? People have been waiting for him to become an expiring contract for just as long; just, so the Blazers could hopefully have a chance to dump him. I've seen people spend a lot of time justifying why Turner had some trade value prior to becoming an expiring contract...again, it was because they wanted him gone. That includes just about everybody who has posted in this thread

I'm not the one being a hypocrite about this...waxing nostalgic about good guy Turner after spending 2 years or more wishing he was gone. I specifically mentioned his character and locker room presence, but was pushing back against the narrative it was just the size of his contract that made all the people in this forum spend all that time coming up with ideas about trading him and wishing it would happen. Those ideas would have come just as often if he was making 10M a year; that's because of the player he is, how poorly he fit in the Stotts system, and his bad mesh with Dame

[Blazinaway]

Crikey Wiz, relax a bit. Losing a guy like Evan is tough because of the person that he is, regardless of of how much he may have "sucked" on the court. Not everything is numbers, and there is this thing called "the human element", and believe it or not some of us have it.

LOL and Huh? Losing him is not tough at all, this is a biz and players get traded all the time - whether good or bad or in between. Yeah Turner seemed like a good guy but Bball wise I have wanted him gone badly the past 2 yrs and cringed at the over pay signing. This "human element" stuff is pure BUNK. We have great guys like Dame and CJ to keep this team in track, good luck to ET but also good riddance.

[PDXKnight]

Crikey Wiz, relax a bit. Losing a guy like Evan is tough because of the person that he is, regardless of of how much he may have "sucked" on the court. Not everything is numbers, and there is this thing called "the human element", and believe it or not some of us have it.

LOL...c'mon man, stop with the "human element" jazz. You're not in a position to judge my humanity while casting yourself as superior...in fact, piss off with that noise

people have been trying to come up with trade scenarios for Turner....just to get him off the team...since halfway thru his 1st season in Portland, and even earlier. It wasn't just me...it was about 90% of the posters in this forum. Where the fk was the "human element" in that? People have been waiting for him to become an expiring contract for just as long; just, so the Blazers could hopefully have a chance to dump him. I've seen people spend a lot of time justifying why Turner had some trade value prior to becoming an expiring contract...again, it was because they wanted him gone. That includes just about everybody who has posted in this thread

I'm not the one being a hypocrite about this...waxing nostalgic about good guy Turner after spending 2 years or more wishing he was gone. I specifically mentioned his character and locker room presence, but was pushing back against the narrative it was just the size of his contract that made all the people in this forum spend all that time coming up with ideas about trading him and wishing it would happen. Those ideas would have come just as often if he was making 10M a year; that's because of the player he is, how poorly he fit in the Stotts system, and his bad mesh with Dame

I have to agree here. While I think et had character I also think he was a terrible fit for 2 million or 18 mil & I’m glad he’s gone for that reason

B-ball is a business first and foremost & he wasn’t making the team better. Perhaps he can fit on another team but clearly in Portland it failed all 3 years he was here

[PDXKnight]

My day is ruined. I really liked ET. I could never understand why he was so hated in Portland. Yes I know he made too much money but is that a reason to hate him? He played hard did not complain and rarely missed a game. Who else on this team had back to back triple doubles?

I believe he would have been a good mentor for Little. Unless you watched every game it was hard to see how much he contributes.It is my belief with two of the best scoring PG's in the league he had no reason to take a ton of shots.

Good Bye Evan Turner. I hope you are able to resume your career like you did in Boston, where by the way fans loved you. Of course you made less money which is how many on this board rate you.

oh for chrissakes...

REGULAR SEASON:

PER:

Damian Lillard 23.7
Enes Kanter 23.5
Jusuf Nurkic 23.4
CJ McCollum 17.0
Meyers Leonard 15.8
Zach Collins 13.5
Jake Layman 13.5
Al-Farouq Aminu 13.2
Maurice Harkless 13.2
Evan Turner 11.6
Seth Curry 11.4
Anfernee Simons 11.1
Rodney Hood 10.9

TS%:

Meyers Leonard .675
Enes Kanter .614
Seth Curry .595
Jake Layman .594
Damian Lillard .588
Jusuf Nurkic .570
Al-Farouq Aminu .568
Zach Collins .562
CJ McCollum .553
Rodney Hood .549
Maurice Harkless .547
Nik Stauskas .545
Anfernee Simons .535
Evan Turner .504

winshares/48:

Damian Lillard .205
Enes Kanter .196
Jusuf Nurkic .189
Meyers Leonard .164
Al-Farouq Aminu .121
CJ McCollum .114
Maurice Harkless .114
Jake Layman .111
Zach Collins .104
Seth Curry .082
Rodney Hood .077
Evan Turner .060
Nik Stauskas .055

box plus/minus:

Damian Lillard 5.5
Jusuf Nurkic 5.1
Enes Kanter 2.3
Maurice Harkless 2.2
Meyers Leonard 1.4
Al-Farouq Aminu 0.9
CJ McCollum 0.3
Zach Collins 0.1
Jake Layman -0.3
Seth Curry -1.3
Rodney Hood -1.7
Evan Turner -1.8
Nik Stauskas -2.8

PLAYOFFS

PER:

Damian Lillard 20.6
CJ McCollum 17.9
Meyers Leonard 17.1
Enes Kanter 17.0
Maurice Harkless 14.4
Zach Collins 14.4
Rodney Hood 14.0
Al-Farouq Aminu 11.0
Evan Turner 9.0
Seth Curry 8.3

TS%

Meyers Leonard .616
Rodney Hood .606
Zach Collins .592
Damian Lillard .566
Enes Kanter .555
Maurice Harkless .537
CJ McCollum .527
Seth Curry .518
Al-Farouq Aminu .473
Evan Turner .409

winshares/48:

Damian Lillard 4.8
Maurice Harkless 3.1
Zach Collins 2.2
Meyers Leonard 1.8
CJ McCollum 1.2
Rodney Hood 0.4
Enes Kanter 0.3
Al-Farouq Aminu 0.0
Seth Curry -0.2
Evan Turner -1.9

box plus/minus:

Damian Lillard 4.8
Maurice Harkless 3.1
Zach Collins 2.2
Meyers Leonard 1.8
CJ McCollum 1.2
Rodney Hood 0.4
Enes Kanter 0.3
Al-Farouq Aminu 0.0
Seth Curry -0.2
Evan Turner -1.9

he also ranked 421st in the NBA in Real Plus/Minus

(you have to hand it to Olshey: he liked Turner so much he signed Stauskas so Turner wouldn't be the last in every category)

to say the reason so many Blazer fans "hated" Turner was because of his contract is about 90% bull$hit. Sure, there was a component of that. But the main reason he was viewed so negatively is because he generally sucked. His inability to shoot left his 4 on-the-floor teammates always dealing with 5 defenders. He couldn't space the floor to save his life. And I could post the same lists, with the same kind of results for the previous 2 seasons. Even his defense was overrated. He was ok against size, but he had no chance defending players with speed and quickness

now, you could probably argue that the Stotts offense was just about the worst system for him and that wasn't really his fault. And for sure he's a high character guy and a great locker room presence. But that didn't translate to on floor production or impact

Kent Bazemore is a below average player. He's below average in PER and RPM. He's well below average in TS%. He's a weak rebounder and below average in assist/turnover ratio. But just about every Blazer fan is really happy to be landing a below averge player for Turner. That's not becuae of salary, Bazemore makes more. It's because just about everybody is sick of seeing Turner in a Blazer uniform, and that's because of what he has done for 3 years, on the floor, while wearing that uniform

now bigdavid, I know you like Turner. And I imagine this post seems like an attack. Sorry about that; but I'm really sick of the narrative that the reason Turner is disliked is because of his contract. It doesn't help the situation, but Turner was signed to help the team and take pressure off of Lillard. He didn't help the team and if anything, him on the floor made things harder for Lillard. He failed because he was a square peg in a round hole world. Sorry, but good riddance

Wowza, I always felt like he was a net negative but those stats are telling!

[monopoman]

Just heard a segment with Clownzano where he was interviewing a Hawks beat writer about Baze...

Interestingly, the reporter said Bazemore was having a career year until he went down with an ankle sprain right before the new year. He returned two weeks later, but for whatever reasons wasn't the same player for the rest of the season.

After taking a closer look, that indeed seems to be true. Before he went down he averaged:

14.5/4/2.5 with 2 steals a game.

In the 10 games prior to the injury he averaged about 19/4/4 and shot 39.7% from 3pt. Let's all hope he can approach those kind of numbers on the Trailblazers...

https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bazemke01/gamelog/2019#441-450-sum:pgl_basic

Well we have made a lot of guys look better recently, Hood and Kanter are prime examples the chemistry of the team really pays dividends and a lot of guys like playing for a team that is competitive. Plenty of guys look better on teams that are pushing for 50+ wins every season.

As CJ said in Game of Zones:
"The Lord of lighthearted locker room chemistry smiles upon our brotherhood."

[plyrically]

I watched Baze most of last season. He a walking bucket, a pure shooter and a chasedown blocker. He averaged about 1.5 threes and 1.5 steals a game. For most of the season he was a top 80 fantasy player. That’s another brilliant move by Neo, I’m looking forward to July 1st

I’ll say it again. Baze is the best wing dame ever played with. Incl Batum, Barton.. whomever. The unique skillset he brings to the table (on ball defense, corner threes, easy transition/fast break scoring opportunities aka points off turnovers) is something Blazers dearly missed ever since Dame and CJ took over the reigns. Personally I’m geeked

[PDXKnight]

I watched Baze most of last season. He a walking bucket, a pure shooter and a chasedown blocker. He averaged about 1.5 threes and 1.5 steals a game. For most of the season he was a top 80 fantasy player. That’s another brilliant move by Neo, I’m looking forward to July 1st

I’ll say it again. Baze is the best wing dame ever played with. Incl Batum, Barton.. whomever. The unique skillset he brings to the table (on ball defense, corner threes, easy transition/fast break scoring opportunities aka points off turnovers) is something Blazers dearly missed ever since Dame and CJ took over the reigns. Personally I’m geeked

Batum was clearly better due to playmaking imo

[bigdavid]

OK OK cut the crap. All the stats...stats...stats too much to look at. Turner is gone most everyone is happy and elated. I always noticed on other boards when a player has spent several years with a team, whether he is a star or not many posters will at least wish him well and thanks for his service.

I for one wish him well.

[BlazersBroncos]

Wish him well, glad he is gone.

If he was a guy we signed for 1 year at the Vet Min, there is little chance we bring him back the next year. He was in the rotation because the FO didn't want a sunk cost investment, despite the fact that investment was clearly sunk and we all knew that by halfway through season 1.

Despite my hate for him on the court, he seems like the type that could be a great assistant coach someday and I would have no issues bringing him back in the organization once his playing days are over. I like the idea of him on the sidelines in a suit much more than I ever did on the actual hardwood.

[PDXKnight]

Wish him well, glad he is gone.

If he was a guy we signed for 1 year at the Vet Min, there is little chance we bring him back the next year. He was in the rotation because the FO didn't want a sunk cost investment, despite the fact that investment was clearly sunk and we all knew that by halfway through season 1.

Despite my hate for him on the court, he seems like the type that could be a great assistant coach someday and I would have no issues bringing him back in the organization once his playing days are over. I like the idea of him on the sidelines in a suit much more than I ever did on the actual hardwood.

I actually think he can play well, we were the worst team of all for his style of play

[HoopsFanAZ]

I'll take this in a slightly different direction:

1. Hawks fans (on a couple boards) pretty much conclude that Bazemore is the better player -- 3's, defense, athleticism, etc. -- and see Turner as able to play some small ball PF and backup PG. He can fill a couple roles their team needed to fill. They see the Blazers as winning the trade.

2. Turner is well liked by the Blazers players. Trading him now for better shooting and D -- a likely upgrade -- is understandable. They'll miss him, but Bazemore is reportedly a good dude, too. What the Blazers avoid is offering a lot less money next summer to ET ... or just letting him go. Next summer would've been uncomfortable in regards to ET. And if Bazemore doesn't work out, sure, some players might speak up about losing ET, but Bazemore gone on an expiring contract (or choosing to go elsewhere) isn't as bad as a "break-up" with ET.

And if it works out with Bazemore, it's a win for everyone. I wish ET well with Atlanta.

[Dogmont]

Crikey Wiz, relax a bit. Losing a guy like Evan is tough because of the person that he is, regardless of of how much he may have "sucked" on the court. Not everything is numbers, and there is this thing called "the human element", and believe it or not some of us have it.

LOL...c'mon man, stop with the "human element" jazz. You're not in a position to judge my humanity while casting yourself as superior...in fact, piss off with that noise

people have been trying to come up with trade scenarios for Turner....just to get him off the team...since halfway thru his 1st season in Portland, and even earlier. It wasn't just me...it was about 90% of the posters in this forum. Where the fk was the "human element" in that? People have been waiting for him to become an expiring contract for just as long; just, so the Blazers could hopefully have a chance to dump him. I've seen people spend a lot of time justifying why Turner had some trade value prior to becoming an expiring contract...again, it was because they wanted him gone. That includes just about everybody who has posted in this thread

I'm not the one being a hypocrite about this...waxing nostalgic about good guy Turner after spending 2 years or more wishing he was gone. I specifically mentioned his character and locker room presence, but was pushing back against the narrative it was just the size of his contract that made all the people in this forum spend all that time coming up with ideas about trading him and wishing it would happen. Those ideas would have come just as often if he was making 10M a year; that's because of the player he is, how poorly he fit in the Stotts system, and his bad mesh with Dame

Wiz, you obviously do have lots of basketball knowledge, and most of the time I enjoy reading what you have to say, but I absolutely agree with khazim on this.
Turner was a glue guy, and a great locker room guy, and will be missed.
I think you need a vacation. So, piss of with your attitude.
Amen.

[monopoman]

Wish him well, glad he is gone.

If he was a guy we signed for 1 year at the Vet Min, there is little chance we bring him back the next year. He was in the rotation because the FO didn't want a sunk cost investment, despite the fact that investment was clearly sunk and we all knew that by halfway through season 1.

Despite my hate for him on the court, he seems like the type that could be a great assistant coach someday and I would have no issues bringing him back in the organization once his playing days are over. I like the idea of him on the sidelines in a suit much more than I ever did on the actual hardwood.

I actually think he can play well, we were the worst team of all for his style of play

At least Olshey in recent years is trying to find guys that fit this teams style of play. It seems like Olshey+Stotts are now on the same page and are working together better.

[d-train]

Or, Olshey and Stotts after trial and error, have concluded a Lillard led team has to function without good playmaking.

[Wizenheimer]

Wiz, you obviously do have lots of basketball knowledge, and most of the time I enjoy reading what you have to say, but I absolutely agree with khazim on this.
Turner was a glue guy, and a great locker room guy, and will be missed.
I think you need a vacation. So, piss of with your attitude.
Amen.

please explain to me what exactly you think my attitude is so I'll know what to take with me when I piss off

my attitude, at least how I see it, is that Turner was a mistake free agent signing that has hampered Portland's flexibility for 3 years. He never came close to being the type of player Portland was hoping for when they signed him and a whole bunch of players would have been better with the playing time. My attitude is that he rarely had a positive impact on games for Portland over what just about any replacement player would have had, and all the numbers show that

my attitude is that a big majority of Blazer fans have had the same view of Turner as me and that's why there's been 3 years of trading Turner ideas floated in Blazer forums. And it's also why there is an almost overwhelming consensus that trading Turner for Bazemore is such a great deal for Portland. That's not because Bazemore is so good, but because Turner isn't

My attitude is that he seems to be a good guy well liked by his teammates and I wasn't really going to get into this kerfuffle until somebody tried to float the notion that Turner was "hated" because of his contract rather than his production.

I do not believe he was a "glue guy"...not for a minute. Ed Davis might have been a minor glue guy But Portland's structure didn't unravel when he left, and it won't with Bazemore playing Turner's minutes. Real glue guys are like Tayshaun Prince or Shane Battier or Draymond Green. Those are the kinds of players who are missed, not Turner

if that's the attitude you're referring to I'll be sure to stuff it in my carry-on when I board the flight on Piss-Off Airlines....I have frequent flyer miles with them by the way

[jayu70]

You guys will enjoy Baze. Keep him healthy and you'll be happy with his production.
Non stop enerygy, he'll get steals, blocks, lots of deflections in passing lanes. His 3 points shot has improved so much over his Atlanta tenure.
When he's asked to do too much on offense, he can be a disaster - with Dame and CJ he shouldn't have to.

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[Shem]

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