Official Speculation & Free Agency Thread (Pt X, Mods close)

rcklsscognition · Post #1001 » by **rcklsscognition** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:18 pm

http://aol.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2 ... c-meltdown

Player from the Magic reports Stan losing his control over the team.

rcklsscognition · Post #1002 » by **rcklsscognition** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:19 pm

MagicFan41 wrote:
rcklsscognition wrote:This trade could be done today:

NOH/GSW/ORL:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachi ... Id=7syc3eb

Unfortunately, looks like NOH is ready to deal Kaman now, not sure if they'll wait till March when we can add other guys to the trade. If they wanted Ryan, he'd have to be bundled with Clark, Hughes, and Q-Rich to get salary high enough.

I don't think GSW would do that trade unfortunately. I would do that in a heartbeat if I were the Magic.

It may be a stretch, but they want Kaman and I've read reports that they don't think Ellis and Curry can play together. Also read something David Lee said about the same thing. They want to get rid of Biedrins too.

ADRajX · Post #1003 » by **ADRajX** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:21 pm

rcklsscognition wrote:http://aol.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2012-01-30/dwight-howard-stan-van-gundy-orlando-magic-meltdown

Player from the Magic reports Stan losing his control over the team.

God help us if we fire Stan before or directly after we move Dwight

I mean who are we going to replace him with? Phil Jackson? (in our dreams)... who else? Sloan? (yeah right)

So then who's after those two... Saunders? (God NO!), Westphal (Nope)... slim pickings folks, THINK!... stick with SVG... see how he does WITHOUT Howard and with new players in return.

Blue_and_Whte · Post #1004 » by **Blue_and_Whte** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:28 pm

DJRajX wrote:[-_- I was hoping we would flip Gasol for other players (get a 3rd team involved, like Utah). I've made that known in countless other posts. Ease up on the reaction.

At the end of the day, I want Howard to be moved... he isn't staying, and I want to start a new chapter with the Magic and rebuild... and that's not up for debate with me if you disagree with that.

Well my post wasn't an attack, so sorry if you took it that way. My reaction was to the Nets players being injured. I agree, I want them to rebuild not retool. The only difference is that I'm on the Lopez/Marshon/ridiculous amout of picks bus, either scenerio rebuilds I just feel as though the Nets option does it faster and it comes with less risk. It's not like Bynum/pau arent good players, Bynum could go down and there might not be a team willing to give up good young players or picks for a 30 year old Pau especially a rebuilding team.

Either way I want them to rebuild in some way shape or form....

MagicFan41 · Post #1005 » by **MagicFan41** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:30 pm

DJRajX wrote:
MagicFan41 wrote:
I don't like the Chicago trade for the pure reason that we don't get a good guard back. We are stuck in the EXACT same situation we are now - nobody who can create for others. I mean, between Jameer, Duhon, JRich and JJ, we have really nobody. Unless we can flip one of the Chicago guys for a good guard, I don't want it. That being said, I LOVE Deng and Noah and think they are very underrated players (there is a reason why Chicago had the best record in the league with those guys combined with Rose). I honestly think if you put a guy like Monta next to those guys you get a very similar team to the Bulls. They are perfect complementary players to an aggressive guard like Monta/Rose. Deng is an amazing wing defender, and Noah is one of the better big defenders (as well as athletic, a great rebounder, and a great passer). I only want the Chicago pieces if we can somehow pair them with a great guard, but I'm not sure we can do that.

Very well said. I would definitely do a Chicago trade if we can flip players for a good perimeter scorer or a guard. Maybe move Nelson and/or J-Rich at the deadline as well in a separate deal? As long as we get picks in return, we'll be good. Play Harper and Liggins and start a youth movement to finish out the season imo.

I wanna really keep Deng because he is a fantastic all around player, and the wing defender that we need, but I wonder if GSW would be interested in flipping him for Monta + Wright? Then we would have a solid C and a solid PG to build around. We could find another wing defender I think. Maybe do Hedo + Dwight+Duhon for Deng+Noah+Watson+Gibson+pick? Then try to flip Deng for Monta+Wright. Try to use Earl/Liggins as our wing defender in the meantime. Lineup of:

Monta/Watson
JRich/JJ
Wright/Earl
Ryan/Gibson
Noah/BBD

I am sure Jrich would greatly benefit from a PG who can break down a defense and kick it out to an open man when they converge. Wright is also a fantastic 3pt shooter. Noah can be our cleanup guy and hustle/energy/defense down low.

ADRajX · Post #1006 » by **ADRajX** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:36 pm

Blue_and_Whte wrote:
DJRajX wrote:*migraine* lol I was hoping we would flip Gasol for other players (get a 3rd team involved, like Utah, Memphis, Houston, etc. Teams that have shown interest in Gasol.). I've made that known in countless other posts. That's why I would take Bynum/Gasol over the Bulls' package. And I love all that is Bueno, which is why I would never do a Chicago deal haha.

At the end of the day, I want Howard to be moved... he isn't staying, and I want to start a new chapter with the Magic and rebuild... and that's not up for debate with me if you disagree with that opinion. I don't have the energy for it.

Well my post wasn't an attack, so sorry if you took it that way. My reaction was to the Nets players being injured. I agree, I want them to rebuild not retool. The only difference is that I'm on the Lopez/Marshon/ridiculous amout of picks bus, either scenerio rebuilds I just feel as though the Nets option does it faster and it comes with less risk. It's not like Bynum/pau arent good players, Bynum could go down and there might not be a team willing to give up good young players or picks for a 30 year old Pau especially a rebuilding team.

Either way I want them to rebuild in some way shape or form....

I didn't take it as an attack... I was just eating a sandwich and typed crap in a hurry... I edited my post before you made this reply. It sounds better... I came off as a tool (in one of my moods today). My bad lol.

Yeah I'm totally with you on the RIDICULOUS AMOUNT OF PICKS Bus... that's what we need in order to rebuild. Lopez and Brooks are talented as well... but the picks is what makes that deal better than Chicago (I mean, Deng is great, Noah is good... but there is no guards, no formula to rebuild with those guys imo), and it's on par with the Lakers deal imo (if Gasol is flipped for another player). The one thing of course with the Lakers deal is Bynum... and his health obviously :-/. As long as we get picks in return, I'll be happy. If Bynum does end up here, we just have to hope and pray he's healthy. I'm watching all the Lakers games just to see how he holds up... So far he's doing well.

But if there was a gun pointed at my head and I had to choose between NJ and Lakers... it would be Lopez/Brooks/picks ... because that pick is going to be a lottery pick.... Gasol/Bynum are great and all... but it's more difficult to move Gasol to another team... and the high-low game between an aging Gasol and Bynum is not better than the dynamic between Lopez and Brooks (on a team with a good defensive head coach in SVG).

Blue_and_Whte · Post #1007 » by **Blue_and_Whte** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:44 pm

MagicFan41 wrote:
DJRajX wrote:
MagicFan41 wrote:
I don't like the Chicago trade for the pure reason that we don't get a good guard back. We are stuck in the EXACT same situation we are now - nobody who can create for others. I mean, between Jameer, Duhon, JRich and JJ, we have really nobody. Unless we can flip one of the Chicago guys for a good guard, I don't want it. That being said, I LOVE Deng and Noah and think they are very underrated players (there is a reason why Chicago had the best record in the league with those guys combined with Rose). I honestly think if you put a guy like Monta next to those guys you get a very similar team to the Bulls. They are perfect complementary players to an aggressive guard like Monta/Rose. Deng is an amazing wing defender, and Noah is one of the better big defenders (as well as athletic, a great rebounder, and a great passer). I only want the Chicago pieces if we can somehow pair them with a great guard, but I'm not sure we can do that.

Very well said. I would definitely do a Chicago trade if we can flip players for a good perimeter scorer or a guard. Maybe move Nelson and/or J-Rich at the deadline as well in a separate deal? As long as we get picks in return, we'll be good. Play Harper and Liggins and start a youth movement to finish out the season imo.

I wanna really keep Deng because he is a fantastic all around player, and the wing defender that we need, but I wonder if GSW would be interested in flipping him for Monta + Wright? Then we would have a solid C and a solid PG to build around. We could find another wing defender I think. Maybe do Hedo + Dwight+Duhon for Deng+Noah+Watson+Gibson+pick? Then try to flip Deng for Monta+Wright. Try to use Earl/Liggins as our wing defender in the meantime. Lineup of:

Monta/Watson
JRich/JJ
Wright/Earl
Ryan/Gibson
Noah/BBD

I am sure Jrich would greatly benefit from a PG who can break down a defense and kick it out to an open man when they converge. Wright is also a fantastic 3pt shooter. Noah can be our cleanup guy and hustle/energy/defense down low.

So I know people keep saying this but as crappy as Jameer has been he has broken down the defense and kicked out to the perimeter on several occasions and Jason has missed wide open shots. Now before the Jameer nazis who specifically exist on this board to create 14 paragraph threads about every mistake jameer makes come out of their holes to flame me....

DISCLAIMER: Jameer is not playing well, Jameer isnt as good as Monta Ellis, Jameer is not a top 15 pg. We should probablly trade jameer nelson if he continues to stink it up.

My point is that Jrich has received alot of passes out of drives and kicks and has missed alot of open shots. Im pretty sure a pass is a pass as long as he can catch and shoot it despite who it's coming from. Now he'll probablly get more open looks because of the amount of times monta breaks down a defense..but he still has to hit those shots. I dont think getting a better pg will neccesarilly automatically make Jrich better.

MagicFan41 · Post #1008 » by **MagicFan41** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:02 pm

Blue_and_Whte wrote:
My point is that Jrich has received alot of passes out of drives and kicks and has missed alot of open shots. Im pretty sure a pass is a pass as long as he can catch and shoot it despite who it's coming from. Now he'll probablly get more open looks because of the amount of times monta breaks down a defense..but he still has to hit those shots. I dont think getting a better pg will neccesarilly automatically make Jrich better.

Which is absolutely correct, JRich has been a bit of an enigma to me this year. His shooting %s are way down, I don't know if it's due to lack of practice in the lockout, due to lack of confidence due to the Dwight uncertainty, or what. I do, however think he will get better looks with Monta (I don't think maybe people will debate that). A shooter as good as him doesn't just randomly dip 10% in 3pt % in a season when he has been a 40% shooter almost his entire career. Something is up, I don't think it's age or health. I think that will turn back around with shaking off some rust, and a better PG.

jezzer45 · Post #1009 » by **jezzer45** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:09 pm

I dunno but maybe minny is willing to trade d. Williams for gasol.

jameer
Jrich
williams
anderson
bynum

thats better than what philly indy nyk currently have. a nice mix of youth and vet. although the pg position needs to be adressed.

MagicFan41 · Post #1010 » by **MagicFan41** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:12 pm

jezzer45 wrote:I dunno but maybe minny is willing to trade d. Williams for gasol.

jameer
Jrich
williams
anderson
bynum

thats better than what philly indy nyk currently have. a nice mix of youth and vet. although the pg position needs to be adressed.

That def isn't better than what Philly and Indy have. Not even close imo. Those two teams have a good piece at basically every position (outside of Indy at SG, and they are gonna make a big play for Gordon in the summer since they have a lot of capspace). That's a better frontcourt, but certainly not a better backcourt, which is exactly our issue as it is today. Williams has yet to prove himself, not to mention, how exactly do you propose trading a rookie for a guy making $18mil? Doesn't match up.

Post #1011 » by **Def Swami** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:13 pm

jezzer45 wrote:I dunno but maybe minny is willing to trade d. Williams for gasol.

jameer
Jrich
williams
anderson
bynum

thats better than what philly indy nyk currently have. a nice mix of youth and vet. although the pg position needs to be adressed.

We'd have to get more than D. Williams to make that trade work. Perhaps Wes Johnson too.

Post #1012 » by **Def Swami** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:49 pm

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
Still not sold magic move Howard... I think they try several other things before trigger a Howard exit...

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
RT @Reggiegonzalez1: think Otis will make a run at Calderon? ---> not sold Orlando has the assets to add without subtracting in a big way
11:4

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
RT @SaintWalker191: would orlando accept a straight up trade with Bynum and Howard? ---> Not today.

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
RT @AndrewCumbow: Do you think the Lakers would have to give up both Bynum and Gasol to get Howard? ---> yes and they will not do that

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
RT @caseyw2002: do you see the orlando magic making any trade this week or next week? ---> takes two to tango, prices are awfully high now

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
RT @IAN0L0GY: Has Howard become a lockeroom "cancer" to ORL? ---> no, but the situation is not good.

Steve Kyler @stevekylerNBA
RT @OneTez: @stevekylerNBA should the magic go after g vasquez from nola? --- I like GV, but he is not better than Jameer or Duhon

Kyler hasn't seen Duhon play much

Post #1013 » by **Def Swami** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:56 pm

Jarrod N Rudolph @MisterRudolph
Word is Otis Smith has been trying to make moves, but he's struggled to find a trade partner. Not sure what can be done at this point.

Jarrod N Rudolph @MisterRudolph
But it's clear to everyone that upgrades are needed in Orlando. We're talking about non-Dwight trades. The Magic may be stuck.

I don't think we're going to trade Dwight until after March 1st. I have a feeling that we'll keep trying to make trades until then. And then once J-Rich and BBD can be included in trades, we may actually have some more trade partners arise. If those options are exhausted and come up empty, then I assume we'll make the best available trade for Dwight at the deadline.

rcklsscognition · Post #1014 » by **rcklsscognition** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:03 pm

We've got to jump in an help the Hornets in a 3-way to get rid of Kaman.

Nemesis21 · Post #1015 » by **Nemesis21** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:11 pm

rcklsscognition wrote:We've got to jump in an help the Hornets in a 3-way to get rid of Kaman.

Something around, Nelson, J Rich and Kaman to GSW, Ellis and Biedrins to ORL, what goes to NOH ?

Blue_and_Whte · Post #1016 » by **Blue_and_Whte** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:14 pm

What team would want to help Orlando keep Howard is the question. Why would they? They know that if Dwight leaves everyone on the Magic can be had wholesale.

EasternMagic · Post #1017 » by **EasternMagic** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:17 pm

Nemesis21 wrote:
rcklsscognition wrote:We've got to jump in an help the Hornets in a 3-way to get rid of Kaman.

Something around, Nelson, J Rich and Kaman to GSW, Ellis and Biedrins to ORL, what goes to NOH ?

J Rich still can't be traded till March 1. Don't you think that NOH will try to make a trade happen before that?

Nemesis21 · Post #1018 » by **Nemesis21** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:25 pm

EasternMagic wrote:
Nemesis21 wrote:
rcklsscognition wrote:We've got to jump in an help the Hornets in a 3-way to get rid of Kaman.

Something around, Nelson, J Rich and Kaman to GSW, Ellis and Biedrins to ORL, what goes to NOH ?

J Rich still can't be traded till March 1. Don't you think that NOH will try to make a trade happen before that?

Ah damn, yeah probably.

blue and white · Post #1019 » by **blue and white** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:40 pm

Dan_Savage Dan Savage
RT @SteeleMagic SVG doesn't expect Jameer back before next Monday (concussion)

Could Otis be trying to move jameer this week or is this just normal procedure for a concussion? Or could they be giving meer more time to get himself mentally back in game shape?

Post #1020 » by **Def Swami** » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:43 pm

blue and white wrote:Dan_Savage Dan Savage
RT @SteeleMagic SVG doesn't expect Jameer back before next Monday (concussion)

Could Otis be trying to move jameer this week or is this just normal procedure for a concussion? Or could they be giving meer more time to get himself mentally back in game shape?

It sounds like normal procedure. Concussions are no joke. He should take his time to get well.