Coronavirus

[League Circles]

Rationalize away. You were wishing they'd go out for a walk in the park and some ice cream.
How could I have been mistaken.
Carry on.

It was an observation on human nature. Normally when people act like that for long enough, others around them can't help themselves eventually and resort to their base instincts, which is to start punching. I believe very strongly in the rule of law, above any other political values, and I do not think anyone should attempt extrajudicial violence against a political leader. That said, people often don't do what they should. In stressful circumstances people often lose their better judgements and start doing things like punching a reckless bafoon who is saying wild things to distract from unbelievably crucial topics.

thank you for the clarification.

So, do you go around punching folks who routinely say stupid things? In this day and age I'd think you'd have very sore knuckles by now.

Myself, I try to understand the other person. Engage in dialog. Try to see where they're coming from. I'm pretty sure I"ve said (and done) a lot of stupid things in my time. I've yet to be pummeled by those around me. I gotta get out more.

I've been fortunate to never be around anyone, especially in a crucial position of authority, who said reckless things all the time, at least not as an adult. Not sure how I'd respond if I was in a position where I had to choose between appearing to provide tacit support to that person or physically attacking them, because the person has demonstrated that they are unwilling to revise their behavior despite receiving consistently negative feedback on their behavior from countless others for it. I'd like to think I'd keep my cool for the sake of the republic, but everyone has an emotional limit. We're apes after all. Hopefully Trump can find a way to change before finding out what those limits are among those who surround him.

[Fl_Flash]

It was an observation on human nature. Normally when people act like that for long enough, others around them can't help themselves eventually and resort to their base instincts, which is to start punching. I believe very strongly in the rule of law, above any other political values, and I do not think anyone should attempt extrajudicial violence against a political leader. That said, people often don't do what they should. In stressful circumstances people often lose their better judgements and start doing things like punching a reckless bafoon who is saying wild things to distract from unbelievably crucial topics.

thank you for the clarification.

So, do you go around punching folks who routinely say stupid things? In this day and age I'd think you'd have very sore knuckles by now.

Myself, I try to understand the other person. Engage in dialog. Try to see where they're coming from. I'm pretty sure I"ve said (and done) a lot of stupid things in my time. I've yet to be pummeled by those around me. I gotta get out more.

I've been fortunate to never be around anyone, especially in a crucial position of authority, who said reckless things all the time, at least not as an adult. Not sure how I'd respond if I was in a position where I had to choose between appearing to provide tacit support to that person or physically attacking them, because the person has demonstrated that they are unwilling to revise their behavior despite receiving consistently negative feedback on their behavior from countless others for it. I'd like to think I'd keep my cool for the sake of the republic, but everyone has an emotional limit. We're apes after all. Hopefully Trump can find a way to change before finding out what those limits are among those who surround him.

This is actually a really good response (no sarcasm). Honest and well thought out. I appreciate your candor.
I'll leave it at that. don't want to hijack this thread anymore than I have.

[dougthonus]

I've been fortunate to never be around anyone, especially in a crucial position of authority, who said reckless things all the time, at least not as an adult. Not sure how I'd respond if I was in a position where I had to choose between appearing to provide tacit support to that person or physically attacking them, because the person has demonstrated that they are unwilling to revise their behavior despite receiving consistently negative feedback on their behavior from countless others for it. I'd like to think I'd keep my cool for the sake of the republic, but everyone has an emotional limit. We're apes after all. Hopefully Trump can find a way to change before finding out what those limits are among those who surround him.

Pretty weird to go to physical assault in this day in age. I mean that basically doesn't happen. There are lots of examples of people doing things to show displeasure, but physical assault isn't a real common one for people in authority. Nowadays, you'd see people walk out and quit, maybe some yelling and verbal whatever, but physical assault?

[League Circles]

I've been fortunate to never be around anyone, especially in a crucial position of authority, who said reckless things all the time, at least not as an adult. Not sure how I'd respond if I was in a position where I had to choose between appearing to provide tacit support to that person or physically attacking them, because the person has demonstrated that they are unwilling to revise their behavior despite receiving consistently negative feedback on their behavior from countless others for it. I'd like to think I'd keep my cool for the sake of the republic, but everyone has an emotional limit. We're apes after all. Hopefully Trump can find a way to change before finding out what those limits are among those who surround him.

Pretty weird to go to physical assault in this day in age. I mean that basically doesn't happen. There are lots of examples of people doing things to show displeasure, but physical assault isn't a real common one for people in authority. Nowadays, you'd see people walk out and quit, maybe some yelling and verbal whatever, but physical assault?

Agreed on all counts, but we're in weird times. It's also very weird and virtually unprecedented in American society to say a lot of the things Trump has and continues to say for a high level authority figure. Also, sometimes the most extreme responses come from those who were able to stay cool the longest. They bottle up their objection and disgust for so long, feigning support and positivity, until they can no longer handle it and lash out. Maybe it won't happen now, but maybe by his 5th term in the oval office it would.

[Bandit King]

Obama can hold an intelligent discussion unlike Trump who has a mind of a toddler.

[transplant]

https://medium.com/six-four-six-nine/evidence-over-hysteria-covid-19-1b767def5894

Very interesting read about how COVID-19 is not nearly as dangerous as many believe. Doesn't answer every question but still eye opening.

Fascinating article. Thanks for sharing.

As a kid, I remember adults lamenting that, "we can send a man to the moon, but we still can't cure the common cold." Now I'm a senior citizen looking at all the technological marvels produced in the past 50 years and I'm more amazed than my parents that there's still no cure for a cold...or other viruses. I can't help but wonder if the reason is that there's simply not much profit in curing a cold.

The article makes important points about this virus not being super-contagious and not being as deadly as originally thought. Encouraging. If it turns out that the "abundance of caution" being taken by governments right now turns out to be an overreaction in retrospect, let's hope that we will have learned lessons that will help us deal with the next crisis of this sort in a more measured manner.

[Bandit King]

https://medium.com/six-four-six-nine/evidence-over-hysteria-covid-19-1b767def5894

Very interesting read about how COVID-19 is not nearly as dangerous as many believe. Doesn't answer every question but still eye opening.

Fascinating article. Thanks for sharing.

As a kid, I remember adults lamenting that, "we can send a man to the moon, but we still can't cure the common cold." Now I'm a senior citizen looking at all the technological marvels produced in the past 50 years and I'm more amazed than my parents that there's still no cure for a cold...or other viruses. I can't help but wonder if the reason is that there's simply not much profit in curing a cold.

The article makes important points about this virus not being super-contagious and not being as deadly as originally thought. Encouraging. If it turns out that the "abundance of caution" being taken by governments right now turns out to be an overreaction in retrospect, let's hope that we will have learned lessons that will help us deal with the next crisis of this sort in a more measured manner.

That article is a lie! Italy is losing more and more people each day they just lost 800 people recently!

[dougthonus]

As a kid, I remember adults lamenting that, "we can send a man to the moon, but we still can't cure the common cold." Now I'm a senior citizen looking at all the technological marvels produced in the past 50 years and I'm more amazed than my parents that there's still no cure for a cold...or other viruses. I can't help but wonder if the reason is that there's simply not much profit in curing a cold.

I think there would be massive profit if you had cure for the cold, there are tons and tons of cold medications that are on the market to treat symptoms. Even BS drugs like Zicam to shorten colds/flu have a pretty big market. Anything that really worked would be a huge benefit.

The article makes important points about this virus not being super-contagious and not being as deadly as originally thought. Encouraging. If it turns out that the "abundance of caution" being taken by governments right now turns out to be an overreaction in retrospect, let's hope that we will have learned lessons that will help us deal with the next crisis of this sort in a more measured manner.

While I'm not saying I disagree with the core of the article, the fact that people are extremely widely suspicious of the data because there is no testing, it's really hard to gauge. The one thing I've said since the beginning is one of two things seems true:

1: The mortality rate isn't nearly so bad as we think (because there are tons of infections that are just unreported).
2: The virus isn't nearly as contagious as we think (we actually are diagnosing all the cases).

[coldfish]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

[PaKii94]

https://medium.com/six-four-six-nine/evidence-over-hysteria-covid-19-1b767def5894

Very interesting read about how COVID-19 is not nearly as dangerous as many believe. Doesn't answer every question but still eye opening.

Fascinating article. Thanks for sharing.

As a kid, I remember adults lamenting that, "we can send a man to the moon, but we still can't cure the common cold." Now I'm a senior citizen looking at all the technological marvels produced in the past 50 years and I'm more amazed than my parents that there's still no cure for a cold...or other viruses. I can't help but wonder if the reason is that there's simply not much profit in curing a cold.

The article makes important points about this virus not being super-contagious and not being as deadly as originally thought. Encouraging. If it turns out that the "abundance of caution" being taken by governments right now turns out to be an overreaction in retrospect, let's hope that we will have learned lessons that will help us deal with the next crisis of this sort in a more measured manner.

If the data is legit, it's pretty well thought out. The dangerous aspect is the response not the virus itself. This wouldn't be a big deal if the infrastructure was prepped for a high level of infections

[TheStig]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

I don't think we have any idea how many people actually have this. A lot of young people have had really light cases, a lot of illegals are scared to get a test, a lot of uninsured are not getting tested, there are very few tests actually out there and it takes days for symptoms to come. There could literally be millions who have it now.

[Bandit King]

Numbers are crap no doubt

[coldfish]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

I don't think we have any idea how many people actually have this. A lot of young people have had really light cases, a lot of illegals are scared to get a test, a lot of uninsured are not getting tested, there are very few tests actually out there and it takes days for symptoms to come. There could literally be millions who have it now.

That's both a good and bad thing. If there is that many people infected, then the severe case percentage isn't that high.

I can argue it many ways. It really seems that this virus spreads easily. NBA players getting it after just being on the same court together, near 100% cruise ship penetration, some Italy data indicates that this thing spreads REALLY fast. That said, the overall percentages in the affected countries are really low. It simply doesn't add up. Either it doesn't spread that fast or it doesn't kill that easily.

Regardless, the absolute worst case of millions of americans dead isn't possible and something is really, really wrong with the picture that is being painted.

[drosereturn]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

Thats bad. Do you think its corona? If so why not try to take aids medication?

[dice]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

Thats bad. Do you think its corona? If so why not try to take aids medication?

AIDS patients are getting tested because their immune systems are compromised. the medication they are on has nothing to do with treating coronavirus. there is no drug known to help w/ coronavirus right now and there won't be for some time

[dice]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

what kind of shape are the hospitals in right now where you're at?

hope your health clears up quickly

[coldfish]

what kind of shape are the hospitals in right now where you're at?

hope your health clears up quickly

I believe the hospitals are holding up well right now. They basically stopped all non critical care activities days ago and have cleared themselves out.

The big issue is the testing. They basically can't do it right now. This is completely mind boggling how bad the CDC **** this up. And yes, Trump deserves a lot of grief on this but he isn't the only one who should be getting crapped on. He didn't order the CDC to ship lots of defective tests.

[coldfish]

I noted before that I have had mild symptoms for a week or so. After I started getting some chest tightness, I called the doctor. Here in northeast ohio, the doctor told me that they could only perform 600 tests per day. They were saving those tests for active AIDS patients, chemo patients, people over 70, people with pre-existing lung problems, etc. The doctor said that if I was in any other country, I would get tested. I asked him what the trigger point for me doing something is. He said that if I was at rest and was having difficulty breathing, I should go to an ER. Basically, near death. Other than that, rest and fluids and avoid people until 3 days after symptoms gone.

The numbers out there are complete and utter BS. They are only testing severe cases and some massive number are either completely hidden or mild to moderate.

I have been saying this for a while but I had it thrown in my face this morning. The numbers are complete crap.

Thats bad. Do you think its corona? If so why not try to take aids medication?

I think its unlikely that I have it but some of the symptoms match. If I do, its mild.

There are so many barriers between where I am and taking aids meds its not funny. I couldn't get tested to even start the process until I was barely able to breath. This whole situation is unfathomable and the press really isn't being accurate when they inform the public. People just see these numbers and they are effectively meaningless.

[transplant]

As a kid, I remember adults lamenting that, "we can send a man to the moon, but we still can't cure the common cold." Now I'm a senior citizen looking at all the technological marvels produced in the past 50 years and I'm more amazed than my parents that there's still no cure for a cold...or other viruses. I can't help but wonder if the reason is that there's simply not much profit in curing a cold.

I think there would be massive profit if you had cure for the cold, there are tons and tons of cold medications that are on the market to treat symptoms. Even BS drugs like Zicam to shorten colds/flu have a pretty big market. Anything that really worked would be a huge benefit.

The article makes important points about this virus not being super-contagious and not being as deadly as originally thought. Encouraging. If it turns out that the "abundance of caution" being taken by governments right now turns out to be an overreaction in retrospect, let's hope that we will have learned lessons that will help us deal with the next crisis of this sort in a more measured manner.

While I'm not saying I disagree with the core of the article, the fact that people are extremely widely suspicious of the data because there is no testing, it's really hard to gauge. The one thing I've said since the beginning is one of two things seems true:

1: The mortality rate isn't nearly so bad as we think (because there are tons of infections that are just unreported).
2: The virus isn't nearly as contagious as we think (we actually are diagnosing all the cases).

Yeah, there are tons and tons of products that treat symptoms. None of them would exist if there was a product that cured the cold.

1: I agree that tons of infections are unreported. I disagree that a significant number of deaths are going unreported which would mean that the numerator is fairly accurate and the denominator is being underestimated so the mortality rate being reported is overstated.

2: Fair point. The contagion numbers are likely understated due to the limitations of under-testing.

Truth is that we didn't know anything about this virus when it burst on the scene and we are only slowly learning about it. The uncertainty is a big part of the problem. Make no mistake, I am personally treating this virus with "an abundance of caution."

[bulls_troy]

Some states and territories in Australia are preparing to close borders. South Australia (where I am) maybe as of 8PM today,Sunday (currently 8.50am Sunday at time of writing)