[Shams] Sources: Giannis Antetokounmpo to explore best fits outside of Milwaukee

[mademan]

Nobody is giving up the #1 pick for him.

Ya i'd be surprised. Dallas is the only one i think might, and Pel's, who shouldnt, but may be wary of yet another rebuild after their last 5+ year rebuild netted a single 1st round exit. But both still probably just take the consensus number 1 pick and get 5 years of cheap top tier talent

Zero chance Pels would trade it. That's ridiculous. Though they could consider trading Zion in that case. Besides, considering the Pels control Milwaukee's future picks, they wouldn't even have to give up that much.

Nothing ridiculous about it...Giannis is best player in the league territory and only thirty.

[___Rand___]

Turner is going to want a big raise, so how are the Pacers retaining Pascal and Haliburton then adding Giannis alongside all their guys getting pay increases?

I know there's some beef between Bucks and Pacers, but it's not enough to over come what makes sense. Bucks get good assets for Giannis, and some players to build with for the future and still be entertaining in the present.

Can you piece together a hypothetical package that makes sense? Turner is an unrestricted FA this summer so he is not an asset unless they S&T him I guess?

Pascal is worth about 4 mid FRPs, which loosely translates to like 1 decent lotto pick

Nembhard would be a really good young player but I doubt they’d want to part with him

A lot of their good bench pieces are due for salary increases. They can’t pay them all so why would a team give up value to take on their expiring assets?

You're undervaluing Pascal. He's a 2 way PF and an all-star who's been durable. We got shafted in the Pascal trade because Masai waited too long to make it and nobody was going to give assets for a 3 month rental. Take a look at a list of PFs in this league - he's a top 10 PF. Bridges got 5 1st round picks in comparison, and Bridges' value isn't as high. Pascal is under contract for 3 more years and a decent contract at that. Nembhard is coming up for a big pay day in 2 years' time. It's true Pacers may want to hang on to him for one more season, but they won't be able to pay him in 2 years so why not get the max value you can right now? Pascal, Nembhard, Sheppard and 2 picks. Or Pascal, Turner, Sheppard/Mathurin, no picks. That's a huge trade but one Pacers can make work. Nobody can come close to this package IMO.

[Chuck Everett]

I personally think Giannis is done winning chips. The fact that he pretty much refused to run pick and rolls with Dame (two-man game) doesn't exactly inspire confidence that he will do what's best to maximize everyone around him. Even Jokic runs pick and roll with Murray. Until Giannis is ready to be a screener for a high-impact perimeter player on top of his skillset as a downhill rim-wrecker, it's not going to matter if he changes teams.

this happened?

Yup. He probably feels like it devalues him as a player to not be an iso guy. Obviously, he's efficient as one, but Dame and him should have been an elite pick and roll combo. Giannis doesn't want to play that way.

[donato]

Ya i'd be surprised. Dallas is the only one i think might, and Pel's, who shouldnt, but may be wary of yet another rebuild after their last 5+ year rebuild netted a single 1st round exit. But both still probably just take the consensus number 1 pick and get 5 years of cheap top tier talent

Zero chance Pels would trade it. That's ridiculous. Though they could consider trading Zion in that case. Besides, considering the Pels control Milwaukee's future picks, they wouldn't even have to give up that much.

Nothing ridiculous about it...Giannis is best player in the league territory and only thirty.

It would be incredibly foolish for a team like the Pelicans to do that for a lot of reasons. I just don't think it's remotely realistic, but you are of course entitled to your opinion.

[bbms]

imagine being portland getting lucky on flagg and down the line getting lucky again with the milwaukee picks because the bucks refused to trade giannis

[GiannisAnte34]

I know there's some beef between Bucks and Pacers, but it's not enough to over come what makes sense. Bucks get good assets for Giannis, and some players to build with for the future and still be entertaining in the present.

Can you piece together a hypothetical package that makes sense? Turner is an unrestricted FA this summer so he is not an asset unless they S&T him I guess?

Pascal is worth about 4 mid FRPs, which loosely translates to like 1 decent lotto pick

Nembhard would be a really good young player but I doubt they’d want to part with him

A lot of their good bench pieces are due for salary increases. They can’t pay them all so why would a team give up value to take on their expiring assets?

You're undervaluing Pascal. He's a 2 way PF and an all-star who's been durable. We got shafted in the Pascal trade because Masai waited too long to make it and nobody was going to give assets for a 3 month rental. Take a look at a list of PFs in this league - he's a top 10 PF. Bridges got 5 1st round picks in comparison, and Bridges' value isn't as high. Pascal is under contract for 3 more years and a decent contract at that. Nembhard is coming up for a big pay day in 2 years' time. It's true Pacers may want to hang on to him for one more season, but they won't be able to pay him in 2 years so why not get the max value you can right now? Pascal, Nembhard, Sheppard and 2 picks. Or Pascal, Turner, Sheppard/Mathurin, no picks. That's a huge trade but one Pacers can make work. Nobody can come close to this package IMO.

The Bucks don’t control their own picks so why would they put together a team around Pascal? Like have you really thought about this from a basketball and a business standpoint? Nobody is buying tickets to go see Pascal Siakam lead the team. They’re probably fighting for play-in territory if their best players are Pascal and Nembhard.

I’ve noted earlier that the Pacers can’t maintain Turner, Sheppard, Mathurin, and Nembhard going forward. Why would the Bucks do them a favor by giving up an MVP level player for a collection of assets they can’t retain anyways? Let them make tough decisions without us bailing them out

There are better rebuild options out there than cobbling together a play in team

[knicksstuff]

Giannis is going to pick his destination. He's too much of a family man to just accept whatever location they send him. NY, LA or Miami will be where he ends up imo.

[chilluminati]

Teams with bigger tradable contracts (NY, LA etc) or teams with cap filler + young players that might cost too much in a year or two (HOU, OKC etc). It could go either way, but if I had to guess it's probably going to be a veteran team that flips a star and assets.

[GiannisAnte34]

Teams with bigger tradable contracts (NY, LA etc) or teams with cap filler + young players that might cost too much in a year or two (HOU, OKC etc). It could go either way, but if I had to guess it's probably going to be a veteran team that flips a star and assets.

Nah if Giannis isn’t openly demanding a trade to X, Y, and Z then it’s absolutely in Milwaukee’s hands to decline any deal that doesn’t stock the farm. There is no reason to make a short term move, again assuming that Giannis hasn’t openly demanded a trade to a short list.

This is all hearsay at this point, therefore the Bucks should decline all trades that don’t completely restock their farm. That’s the best deal the Bucks can make for a business and basketball standpoint.

[Helsbyte]

How is agreeing with what you said by breaking down the value piece ignoring what you said? I just don’t see how the Pacers could keep their depth and put together enough value, I explained my reasoning without lashing out. Shouldn’t that be fair enough back and forth? Feels like you’re just eager to pounce on whatever I said

You had not worded anything in a way which sounded like you were agreeing with me, but fair enough bro.

You: the Pacers probably can’t put together a good enough package, because theoretically their best offer is Siakam and some picks/throw in bench pieces

Me: yep and here’s why

You: why are you not agreeing with me?

Siakim, Mathurin, and Walker and draft picks. Siakim flipped to a 3rd team say for **** and giggles say NO for Zion. Now you have Zion, Mathurin, and Walker and picks for Giannis. That offer is pretty strong.

[CharityStripe34]

Shams' initial report was "Giannis open to exploring potential fit outside Milwaukee" lol. ESPN needed to juice up the draft lottery, didn't they?

[bbms]

There are better rebuild options out there than cobbling together a play in team

i'm curious, what rebuilding options the bucks have?

[GiannisAnte34]

You had not worded anything in a way which sounded like you were agreeing with me, but fair enough bro.

You: the Pacers probably can’t put together a good enough package, because theoretically their best offer is Siakam and some picks/throw in bench pieces

Me: yep and here’s why

You: why are you not agreeing with me?

Siakim, Mathurin, and Walker and draft picks. Siakim flipped to a 3rd team say for **** and giggles say NO for Zion. Now you have Zion, Mathurin, and Walker and picks for Giannis. That offer is pretty strong.

Personally not impressed with an offer centering around a 31 year old top 30 player All-Star. I think Zion doesn’t even like basketball either.

The Pacers are forced to give big contract extensions to Mathurin and Walker, I don’t consider those as real assets coming from them. They’ll probably end up losing them to FA or settling for less on a S&T.

If I’m the GM I’m asking for the moon and the stars in terms of pick compensation, knowing there are teams out there that can fulfill that wish. We can take back a bad contract to match salaries. Someone like Embiid or PG13 or Beal.

Again this is going off of the so far established fact that Giannis has not publicly said “trade me” or made a short list of teams to be traded to.

[GiannisAnte34]

There are better rebuild options out there than cobbling together a play in team

i'm curious, what rebuilding options the bucks have?

There’s only a few MVP level players in their prime, there are way more than a few teams who would want to acquire such a player. Do the math, there should be plenty of interested parties. It only takes one desperate owner to overpay.

[Backcountry]

Any chance the Lakers can get him? They don't have the draft picks I'd think.

Reaves/Knecht/Hachimura/1sts?

Nope. They are already offering basically that for Embiid. Read it in the other thread...

[Sixers in 4]

Giannis is going to pick his destination. He's too much of a family man to just accept whatever location they send him. NY, LA or Miami will be where he ends up imo.

He is going to pick his destination because he is close to free agency and can just refuse to sign with certain teams.

That puts MIL in the conundrum of either accepting a rental package or a package based on little leverage but that is what happens when you wait. If LAL, Miami, and NY are his teams is another team going to come in and blow MIL away knowing that they will only have GIannis for two years? Shrugs that is the question

[bbms]

There are better rebuild options out there than cobbling together a play in team

i'm curious, what rebuilding options the bucks have?

There’s only a few MVP level players in their prime, there are way more than a few teams who would want to acquire such a player. Do the math, there should be plenty of interested parties. It only takes one desperate owner to overpay.

what kind of overpay do you think would suit bucks better? bucks have limited options since they don't own themselves in the draft, they'd need players to make a team and picks back right?

[GiannisAnte34]

i'm curious, what rebuilding options the bucks have?

There’s only a few MVP level players in their prime, there are way more than a few teams who would want to acquire such a player. Do the math, there should be plenty of interested parties. It only takes one desperate owner to overpay.

what kind of overpay do you think would suit bucks better? bucks have limited options since they don't own themselves in the draft, they'd need players to make a team and picks back right?

Again I think the best option would be to completely rebuild with the farm restocked. Take back a bad contract like Embiid (if he’s dead cap) Beal, or PG13. You’ll get compensated for the bad contract dead weight plus have all the trade for Giannis centered around lottery picks and swaps.

[Castle Black]

Sources say he desperately wants to be a Spur.

[yannisk]

I personally think Giannis is done winning chips. The fact that he pretty much refused to run pick and rolls with Dame (two-man game) doesn't exactly inspire confidence that he will do what's best to maximize everyone around him. Even Jokic runs pick and roll with Murray. Until Giannis is ready to be a screener for a high-impact perimeter player on top of his skillset as a downhill rim-wrecker, it's not going to matter if he changes teams.

this happened?

Yup. He probably feels like it devalues him as a player to not be an iso guy. Obviously, he's efficient as one, but Dame and him should have been an elite pick and roll combo. Giannis doesn't want to play that way.

Giannis has been playing pnr with Middleton for ages and as late as this year. Somehow they did not manage to run it as successfully as expected with Dame. part of the reason was Dame being unable to make the pass when blitzed by both players defending the pnr