2016-2017 College Basketball / '17 NBA Draft Thread IV

[freshie2]

Andrew Wiggins couldn't and still can't dribble a basketball. He can't beat anybody. He's had to live and die by the step back mid-range jumper.

Maybe what you were trying to say he's a better ball handler, but I don't think anyone should shoots in the 50 percent range at the line is a superior offensive talent to many.

If free-throw shooting is your measurement of offensive talent, then I don't know what to say you.

Josh Jackson is an infinitely better ballhandler than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson is an infinitely better passer than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson has infinitely better body control than Wiggins
Josh Jackson is a better finisher at the rim than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson shot better on catch and shoot than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson shot better from the 3 point line than Wiggins.
Wiggins has a better vertical and hits Free-throws, so he's better...

If he's the sixers pick, them I hope you're right. I have a lot of concerns regarding the hype he's receiving. He's an upgrade to the roster, but I don't think he's got as much star potential as some are stating, plus some potential baggage. If he comes into the workout with an improved jumper, that shows huge growth and true self awareness...Fox has clearly demonstrated this. Jackson has always been able to get by on athleticism, and even in his comments of late doesn't seem to truly recognize his limitations. If he's a sixer next year, then I'm onboard and hope he's a stud, but I just don't see the same star that many are admiring.

[76ciology]

Here's what I think happened:

Lakers were debating Fox and Ball, and then someone gave Jackson a promise at 3.

Lakers thought "if it's boston, then Jackson won't work out for us a second time most likely, so let's have him in again to find out if Boston promised him. And if it was philly, then we want to try to trade down 1 spot and get our pick back (even though thats a no), so let's make it look like we might take Jackson since clearly they love him. Also, let's get Ball and Fultz back in here in case Boston does take Jackson."


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They shot themselves in the foot if they think that way. Because Sixers will just draft Ball.

If you were to ask me. Maybe most people have Jackson, Fultz and Ball are at the same tier. They want Ball and they want to create some doubts at Ball so that he falls to them.

I think what we can more or less agree is that more people do have them three interchangeable.

It's like..

I want Fultz, but It ain't bad if it's Jackson.

I want Ball, but it ain't bad if it's Jackson.

Going to a step further..

I want Jackson, but it ain't bad if it's Isaac.

[SelfishPlayer]

Andre Wiggins 18-19 year old freshman
Josh Jackson 19-20 year old freshman
Jaylen Brown 19 year old freshman
Kobe 18 year old NBA rookie

[Kobblehead]

I'd like Hart in the second round...solid player who definitely could contribute.

When it's all said and done, I think Hart sneaks into the first round.

Hard to imagine a player with size, offensive skill, production, intangibles and a championship pedigree like Hart could be an afterthought.

[HankTheTank]

Maybe what you were trying to say he's a better ball handler, but I don't think anyone should shoots in the 50 percent range at the line is a superior offensive talent to many.

If free-throw shooting is your measurement of offensive talent, then I don't know what to say you.

Josh Jackson is an infinitely better ballhandler than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson is an infinitely better passer than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson has infinitely better body control than Wiggins
Josh Jackson is a better finisher at the rim than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson shot better on catch and shoot than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson shot better from the 3 point line than Wiggins.
Wiggins has a better vertical and hits Free-throws, so he's better...

If he's the sixers pick, them I hope you're right. I have a lot of concerns regarding the hype he's receiving. He's an upgrade to the roster, but I don't think he's got as much star potential as some are stating, plus some potential baggage. If he comes into the workout with an improved jumper, that shows huge growth and true self awareness...Fox has clearly demonstrated this. Jackson has always been able to get by on athleticism, and even in his comments of late doesn't seem to truly recognize his limitations. If he's a sixer next year, then I'm onboard and hope he's a stud, but I just don't see the same star that many are admiring.

The hype he's receiving? I don't see it that way-- he's been picked apart by every so called expert, and they're questioning whether the Sixers should even pick him at 3 under the premise that he can't shoot.

I'm confident Jackson will be a scorer, whether he shoots 32% or 37% from 3, has potential to be an excellent defender, and has elite athleticism.

He did show improvement shooting this year. He shot 50% from 3 and 64% FT in second half of the year.

[LloydFree]

Here's what I think happened:

Lakers were debating Fox and Ball, and then someone gave Jackson a promise at 3.

Lakers thought "if it's boston, then Jackson won't work out for us a second time most likely, so let's have him in again to find out if Boston promised him. And if it was philly, then we want to try to trade down 1 spot and get our pick back (even though thats a no), so let's make it look like we might take Jackson since clearly they love him. Also, let's get Ball and Fultz back in here in case Boston does take Jackson."


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Come on man, you're better than this. The Lakers aren't considering Fox. That's nothing but misdirection and subterfuge. Ask yourself this: Why is it that all of these leaks and rumors are coming from the Lakers camp? Why nothing from Boston, Philly or Phoenix?

The Lakers are purposely leaking nonsense to cast doubt on who they like. First they leak to a minor news website, that they like Fox more than Ball, and people run with that for a week. Then they leak that Ball is "out of shape", a few days after his workout, knowing he won't work out for Boston. Nothing negative about any other prospect. Then a Phoenix writer tweets that Josh Jackson must have a promise from the Lakers because he's canceled his workout with Phoenix. Where is all of this information about the Lakers coming from? Unnamed sources. Funny how no other team in the top 4, has unnamed sources. The Lakers want Lonzo Ball, period. They just don't want everyone to be certain, because they don't want to get taken advantage of.

[LloydFree]

If free-throw shooting is your measurement of offensive talent, then I don't know what to say you.

Josh Jackson is an infinitely better ballhandler than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson is an infinitely better passer than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson has infinitely better body control than Wiggins
Josh Jackson is a better finisher at the rim than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson shot better on catch and shoot than Wiggins.
Josh Jackson shot better from the 3 point line than Wiggins.
Wiggins has a better vertical and hits Free-throws, so he's better...

If he's the sixers pick, them I hope you're right. I have a lot of concerns regarding the hype he's receiving. He's an upgrade to the roster, but I don't think he's got as much star potential as some are stating, plus some potential baggage. If he comes into the workout with an improved jumper, that shows huge growth and true self awareness...Fox has clearly demonstrated this. Jackson has always been able to get by on athleticism, and even in his comments of late doesn't seem to truly recognize his limitations. If he's a sixer next year, then I'm onboard and hope he's a stud, but I just don't see the same star that many are admiring.

The hype he's receiving? I don't see it that way-- he's been picked apart by every so called expert, and they're questioning whether the Sixers should even pick him at 3 under the premise that he can't shoot.

I'm confident Jackson will be a scorer, whether he shoots 32% or 37% from 3, has potential to be an excellent defender, and has elite athleticism.

He did show improvement shooting this year. He shot 50% from 3 and 64% FT in second half of the year.

You do know that if you don't follow DX's rankings of these prospects, you're just believing in some imaginary hype from some unseen source. Every year from the same Barnes-Wiggins-Okafor contingent it's the same thing.

[Wilfried]

The Lakers are purposely leaking nonsense to cast doubt on who they like. First they leak to a minor news website, that they like Fox more than Ball, and people run with that for a week. Then they leak that Ball is "out of shape", a few days after his workout, knowing he won't work out for Boston. Nothing negative about any other prospect. Then a Phoenix writer tweets that Josh Jackson must have a promise from the Lakers because he's canceled his workout with Phoenix. Where is all of this information about the Lakers coming from? Unnamed sources. Funny how no other team in the top 4, has unnamed sources. The Lakers want Lonzo Ball, period. They just don't want everyone to be certain, because they don't want to get taken advantage of.

Maybe, but Josh Jackson with the Lakers makes a lot more sense to me than Ball. Ball would be a misfit with Russell and on D.
Jackson fits in nicely between Ingram and Russell and would improve their D.

[Kobblehead]

It wouldn't surprise me if people within the Lakers camp preferred Dennis Smith and De'Aaron Fox over Ball from a physical tools, assertive personality, and scheme fit perspective.

Ball is a superior prospect and superior box office attraction, though. Hard to believe they would pass on that for anyone other than Josh Jackson.

[shawn_hemp]

I'd rather draft Damyean Dotson than Josh Hart in the 2nd round considering I don't see either of them being anything more than an occasional shooter at best and I feel like Dotson is way better at that.

Maybe Hart could surprised me with tough defensive play, but correct me if I'm wrong (ironically, I don't really see a lot of Nova games), that wasn't really what he hung his hat on right?

[Sixerscan]

If the lakers take Ball, they should probably trade one of their other core guys for someone that's actually going to play defense. Randle and Russell are zeros on that end and Ingram is all potential at this point.

[Kobblehead]

Ball was a transcendent enough talent to get Steve Alford to throw his pick and roll/isolation scheme out the window and run a motion offense. You would hope Walton would be receptive enough to do the same. Especially with his Golden State roots.

[LloydFree]

If the lakers take Ball, they should probably trade one of their other core guys for someone that's actually going to play defense. Randle and Russell are zeros on that end and Ingram is all potential at this point.

They should get rid of that garbage Julius Randle regardless of whether they take Ball or Jackson. Russell will be a 20-25 PPG scorer next year if they take Lonzo Ball and move Russell to SG.

[Unbreakable99]

This Ian funny. Lol. It's good seeing Ball make fun of the whole dad situation.

Read on Twitter

[shawn_hemp]

Kind of random but the more I watch of Luca Doncic the more I see the next Mario Hezonja

Doncic looks like he can go wherever he wants and make all sorts of plays because he's playing against a league that is incredibly unathletic compared to the NBA.

A lot of the passes he makes would get picked off in a second from NBA players, and he doesn't have blow by speed or athleticism when you consider who he is playing against.

I would be pretty upset if we wound up with him

Granted, he's what like 17 years old? But still, no thanks

[kriss73]

Anyone but me is surprised that Fultz will have a workout with the Lakers?

He is yet the usual suspect for the #1, but he's far from a lock at this point.

By the way I think that Isaac is the best fit for the Celtics: great potential, he could play as stretch-4 with Horford (or Zizic in the future) and he could be grown as a Durant's stopper.

He would be a reach at #1, but imho he is the best fit for them.

[76ciology]

Kind of random but the more I watch of Luca Doncic the more I see the next Mario Hezonja

Doncic looks like he can go wherever he wants and make all sorts of plays because he's playing against a league that is incredibly unathletic compared to the NBA.

A lot of the passes he makes would get picked off in a second from NBA players, and he doesn't have blow by speed or athleticism when you consider who he is playing against.

I would be pretty upset if we wound up with him

Granted, he's what like 17 years old? But still, no thanks

Me too. But too early to tell.

[Unbreakable99]

This is interesting.

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[BigSleep333]

offtopic, but i reply anyway

rewatch toronto@philly. look at lowry's facial expression when the fans chanted trust the process. i knew since that point, lowry is more than willing to come home and sees that the potential with embiid and simmons is certainly higher here than with toronto.

lowry/butler/covington/simmons/embiid...make it happen BC. nobody will score on us

[KramerDSP]

offtopic, but i reply anyway

rewatch toronto@philly. look at lowry's facial expression when the fans chanted trust the process. i knew since that point, lowry is more than willing to come home and sees that the potential with embiid and simmons is certainly higher here than with toronto.

lowry/butler/covington/simmons/embiid...make it happen BC. nobody will score on us

Do you remember which quarter or when exactly in the game the "trust the process" Chants happened in?