Official Speculation Thread ‘17-18’: XVIII: The Long Wait Continues

[woosah]

I want more doom and gloom!!

Vuc isn't injured?

dang

[SOUL]

The guy had 17 shots (8 more than anybody else not named Fournier) and went -14. Not sure if people actually watched the game or not. He was okay, that's not what people are really debating.

The point isn't if he isn't capable of doing that, he clearly is. It's that people are tired of it and we're saying that those shots going elsewhere doesn't make our offense suddenly worse because the stats I've posted in the gamethread show just how inefficient he is, and it's not like we have a noteworthy offense to begin with. People are not comprehending that Vucevic's offense is not of great value besides his passing ability.

And I'm not arguing that we have a great number of options here, nor is it Vucevic's fault that coaches draw up the gameplan like this and that the front office haven't moved him. It's a general frustration that we won't even allow players to become more prevalent options without Vucevic still taking 14-16 shots a game because we refuse to move him.

People were making the same arguments with Oladipo here. He was trending DOWN in field goal attempts and people sort of just assumed that he was what he was, which is why the majority of us were only annoyed/bothered when he was traded instead of downright rioting if we knew what he would turn into with more experience and freedom. You never know what you have in your players unless you give them more opportunity and let them try to prove themselves in a role. Vucevic has had his chances here as a number one option, and it clearly isn't conducive to winning. The blame isn't solely on him, obviously. It's just that he's not the answer, and we may not have ANY answers, but isn't it smarter to see if we do rather than saying "lol, Gordon/Isaac/Bamba/etc isn't the answer on offense" and do the same thing again and again? If this was only his first/second/third year, we wouldn't be having this discussion.. but it's his 7th in the same role.

[MagicFan4Lyfe]

Let’s pretend that vuc didn’t have 20/20 games a few years ago. But that doesn’t mean **** right??

In the 1991-92 season, Terry The Cat Man Catledge had a 30/22 game.

Just saying.

[MagicFan4Lyfe]

The guy had 17 shots (8 more than anybody else not named Fournier) and went -14. Not sure if people actually watched the game or not. He was okay, that's not what people are really debating.

The point isn't if he isn't capable of doing that, he clearly is. It's that people are tired of it and we're saying that those shots going elsewhere doesn't make our offense suddenly worse because the stats I've posted in the gamethread show just how inefficient he is, and it's not like we have a noteworthy offense to begin with. People are not comprehending that Vucevic's offense is not of great value besides his passing ability.

And I'm not arguing that we have a great number of options here, nor is it Vucevic's fault that coaches draw up the gameplan like this and that the front office haven't moved him. It's a general frustration that we won't even allow players to become more prevalent options without Vucevic still taking 14-16 shots a game because we refuse to move him.

People were making the same arguments with Oladipo here. He was trending DOWN in field goal attempts and people sort of just assumed that he was what he was, which is why the majority of us were only annoyed/bothered when he was traded instead of downright rioting if we knew what he would turn into with more experience and freedom. You never know what you have in your players unless you give them more opportunity and let them try to prove themselves in a role. Vucevic has had his chances here as a number one option, and it clearly isn't conducive to winning. The blame isn't solely on him, obviously. It's just that he's not the answer, and we may not have ANY answers, but isn't it smarter to see if we do rather than saying "lol, Gordon/Isaac/Bamba/etc isn't the answer on offense" and do the same thing again and again? If this was only his first/second/third year, we wouldn't be having this discussion.. but it's his 7th in the same role.

Well said. Vucevic has had MANY chances here to be an important core piece moving forward. However for whatever reason we can debate here, its not working. And last night even though Bamba got pushed around and in foul trouble, you know the 76ers had to think twice about where Bamba was. Even as a raw, unfinished player, Bamba is oozing with confidence and potential.

Vuc's lack of defensive hustle just drove me nuts. He just let Embiid walk all over him. While Embiid had his way with Bamba too, just felt Bamba wasn't going to back down. And that sort of "dog" mentality... i am going to come get mine now mentality is what this team lacks.

I don't think we should trade Vuc for the sake of trading him but if Bamba is showing fast growth and potential (and his intelligence and IQ say he is going to be a FAST learner), then Vuc needs to go to the bench. However I worry Vuc is going to pout and complain and become a distraction. Maybe the Magic can get some draft picks and other expiring contracts for Vuc. We'll see

[OrlChamps2030]

Vuc giving the usual effort on the box out.

Looks like the batteries for his controller died

[PennytoShaq]

The guy had 17 shots (8 more than anybody else not named Fournier) and went -14. Not sure if people actually watched the game or not. He was okay, that's not what people are really debating.

The point isn't if he isn't capable of doing that, he clearly is. It's that people are tired of it and we're saying that those shots going elsewhere doesn't make our offense suddenly worse because the stats I've posted in the gamethread show just how inefficient he is, and it's not like we have a noteworthy offense to begin with. People are not comprehending that Vucevic's offense is not of great value besides his passing ability.

And I'm not arguing that we have a great number of options here, nor is it Vucevic's fault that coaches draw up the gameplan like this and that the front office haven't moved him. It's a general frustration that we won't even allow players to become more prevalent options without Vucevic still taking 14-16 shots a game because we refuse to move him.

People were making the same arguments with Oladipo here. He was trending DOWN in field goal attempts and people sort of just assumed that he was what he was, which is why the majority of us were only annoyed/bothered when he was traded instead of downright rioting if we knew what he would turn into with more experience and freedom. You never know what you have in your players unless you give them more opportunity and let them try to prove themselves in a role. Vucevic has had his chances here as a number one option, and it clearly isn't conducive to winning. The blame isn't solely on him, obviously. It's just that he's not the answer, and we may not have ANY answers, but isn't it smarter to see if we do rather than saying "lol, Gordon/Isaac/Bamba/etc isn't the answer on offense" and do the same thing again and again? If this was only his first/second/third year, we wouldn't be having this discussion.. but it's his 7th in the same role.

I asked this already - where is the evidence that we refuse to move him? I simply don’t believe that is the case. Already explained why in an earlier post today.

[PennytoShaq]

Let’s pretend that vuc didn’t have 20/20 games a few years ago. But that doesn’t mean **** right??

In the 1991-92 season, Terry The Cat Man Catledge had a 30/22 game.

Just saying.

Don’t blaspheme the Cat Man like that. I freaking loved that guy.

[PennytoShaq]

It looks like he's dunking at the Open Practice so he's all good.

Read on Twitter

I had a feeling this was the case. People were being extremely over dramatic about this last night.

Really good to see he is ok.

[NickAnderson]

Let’s pretend that vuc didn’t have 20/20 games a few years ago. But that doesn’t mean **** right??

In the 1991-92 season, Terry The Cat Man Catledge had a 30/22 game.

Just saying.

Yeah ok keep discrediting him like that

[RookieStar]

It looks like he's dunking at the Open Practice so he's all good.

Read on Twitter

I had a feeling this was the case. People were being extremely over dramatic about this last night.

Really good to see he is ok.

Thing is.... basketball is supposed to be a physical contact sport, Im just confused.. so evey time a little hurt/injury comes JI's way... we immediately bench him for the night?

[PrimeThyme]

It looks like he's dunking at the Open Practice so he's all good.

Read on Twitter

I had a feeling this was the case. People were being extremely over dramatic about this last night.

Really good to see he is ok.

Some of the DSJ stuff was over the top (but expected), but I don't see how the rest of it can be seen as overly dramatic. He missed 3/4 of the season last year with ankle injuries and reinjured one of them in his first 10 minutes back. I don't see how that couldn't be taken as a serious concern. At this point, until he can show for a long extended period of time that he can be out on the court without injuring one of his ankles any type of injury to one of them should be taken seriously IMO. There was nothing dramatic about that part of it.

[fendilim]

The guy had 17 shots (8 more than anybody else not named Fournier) and went -14. Not sure if people actually watched the game or not. He was okay, that's not what people are really debating.

The point isn't if he isn't capable of doing that, he clearly is. It's that people are tired of it and we're saying that those shots going elsewhere doesn't make our offense suddenly worse because the stats I've posted in the gamethread show just how inefficient he is, and it's not like we have a noteworthy offense to begin with. People are not comprehending that Vucevic's offense is not of great value besides his passing ability.

And I'm not arguing that we have a great number of options here, nor is it Vucevic's fault that coaches draw up the gameplan like this and that the front office haven't moved him. It's a general frustration that we won't even allow players to become more prevalent options without Vucevic still taking 14-16 shots a game because we refuse to move him.

People were making the same arguments with Oladipo here. He was trending DOWN in field goal attempts and people sort of just assumed that he was what he was, which is why the majority of us were only annoyed/bothered when he was traded instead of downright rioting if we knew what he would turn into with more experience and freedom. You never know what you have in your players unless you give them more opportunity and let them try to prove themselves in a role. Vucevic has had his chances here as a number one option, and it clearly isn't conducive to winning. The blame isn't solely on him, obviously. It's just that he's not the answer, and we may not have ANY answers, but isn't it smarter to see if we do rather than saying "lol, Gordon/Isaac/Bamba/etc isn't the answer on offense" and do the same thing again and again? If this was only his first/second/third year, we wouldn't be having this discussion.. but it's his 7th in the same role.

You have a point with Oladipo. He has shown he can create his own shots despite sharing the scoring load with Tobias, Vuc, Evan.

But right now, do you REALLY believe we have better options than Evan and Vuc? Having pretty much the same roster from last year already tells you the answer for that.

[PennytoShaq]

It looks like he's dunking at the Open Practice so he's all good.

Read on Twitter

I had a feeling this was the case. People were being extremely over dramatic about this last night.

Really good to see he is ok.

Some of the DSJ stuff was over the top (but expected), but I don't see how the rest of it can be seen as overly dramatic. He missed 3/4 of the season last year with ankle injuries and reinjured one of them in his first 10 minutes back. I don't see how that couldn't be taken as a serious concern. At this point, until he can show for a long extended period of time that he can be out on the court without injuring one of his ankles any type of injury to one of them should be taken seriously IMO. There was nothing dramatic about that part of it.

It’s dramatic because it is preseason and they will yank guys real fast if there is a hint of a knee/ankle injury. I said that a few times last night because I suspected it was the case.

If this was regular season, it would be more serious concern to me because a starter wont get sat for little tweaks like that.

[PennytoShaq]

It looks like he's dunking at the Open Practice so he's all good.

Read on Twitter

I had a feeling this was the case. People were being extremely over dramatic about this last night.

Really good to see he is ok.

Thing is.... basketball is supposed to be a physical contact sport, Im just confused.. so evey time a little hurt/injury comes JI's way... we immediately bench him for the night?

In preseason - yes. That’s just common sense. Again, this was preseason game 1. It’s not regular season so it’s simply not close to the same thing.

[fendilim]

Let’s pretend that vuc didn’t have 20/20 games a few years ago. But that doesn’t mean **** right??

In the 1991-92 season, Terry The Cat Man Catledge had a 30/22 game.

Just saying.

[PrimeThyme]

I had a feeling this was the case. People were being extremely over dramatic about this last night.

Really good to see he is ok.

Some of the DSJ stuff was over the top (but expected), but I don't see how the rest of it can be seen as overly dramatic. He missed 3/4 of the season last year with ankle injuries and reinjured one of them in his first 10 minutes back. I don't see how that couldn't be taken as a serious concern. At this point, until he can show for a long extended period of time that he can be out on the court without injuring one of his ankles any type of injury to one of them should be taken seriously IMO. There was nothing dramatic about that part of it.

It’s dramatic because it is preseason and they will yank guys real fast if there is a hint of a knee/ankle injury. I said that a few times last night because I suspected it was the case.

If this was regular season, it would be more serious concern to me because a starter wont get sat for little tweaks like that.

Thats your opinion, but in my opinion, it's not dramatic whatsoever. Any sort of setback in his ankle recovery would be a huge deal and its worrisome to see him already get another mild sprain so soon. This wasn't them just playing him limited minutes to avoid an injury, he actually reinjured it. That is concerning.

[fendilim]

No one wants to have their players injured in preseason. Sheesh

[PennytoShaq]

Some of the DSJ stuff was over the top (but expected), but I don't see how the rest of it can be seen as overly dramatic. He missed 3/4 of the season last year with ankle injuries and reinjured one of them in his first 10 minutes back. I don't see how that couldn't be taken as a serious concern. At this point, until he can show for a long extended period of time that he can be out on the court without injuring one of his ankles any type of injury to one of them should be taken seriously IMO. There was nothing dramatic about that part of it.

It’s dramatic because it is preseason and they will yank guys real fast if there is a hint of a knee/ankle injury. I said that a few times last night because I suspected it was the case.

If this was regular season, it would be more serious concern to me because a starter wont get sat for little tweaks like that.

Thats your opinion, but in my opinion, it's not dramatic whatsoever. Any sort of setback in his ankle recovery would be a huge deal and its worrisome to see him already get another mild sprain so soon.

Last night seemed dramatic to me and others. At the end of the day, he stepped on a guys foot. Stuff like that happens and it sucks, but it doesnt look like he suffered any setbacks. If anything, i think it is a positive sign that he came back today like it was nothing. I did not expect to see that happen.

[PennytoShaq]

No one wants to have their players injured in preseason. Sheesh

Correct. I am pretty sure everyone agrees with that statement.

[J the Drafter]

The guy had 17 shots (8 more than anybody else not named Fournier) and went -14. Not sure if people actually watched the game or not. He was okay, that's not what people are really debating.

The point isn't if he isn't capable of doing that, he clearly is. It's that people are tired of it and we're saying that those shots going elsewhere doesn't make our offense suddenly worse because the stats I've posted in the gamethread show just how inefficient he is, and it's not like we have a noteworthy offense to begin with. People are not comprehending that Vucevic's offense is not of great value besides his passing ability.

And I'm not arguing that we have a great number of options here, nor is it Vucevic's fault that coaches draw up the gameplan like this and that the front office haven't moved him. It's a general frustration that we won't even allow players to become more prevalent options without Vucevic still taking 14-16 shots a game because we refuse to move him.

People were making the same arguments with Oladipo here. He was trending DOWN in field goal attempts and people sort of just assumed that he was what he was, which is why the majority of us were only annoyed/bothered when he was traded instead of downright rioting if we knew what he would turn into with more experience and freedom. You never know what you have in your players unless you give them more opportunity and let them try to prove themselves in a role. Vucevic has had his chances here as a number one option, and it clearly isn't conducive to winning. The blame isn't solely on him, obviously. It's just that he's not the answer, and we may not have ANY answers, but isn't it smarter to see if we do rather than saying "lol, Gordon/Isaac/Bamba/etc isn't the answer on offense" and do the same thing again and again? If this was only his first/second/third year, we wouldn't be having this discussion.. but it's his 7th in the same role.

The pecking order is determined in practice, by observing the players and seeing what they’re good and bad at. Oladipo wasn’t a star who never got a fair shot here; he made bad decisions on offense, holding the ball and disrupting the offensive flow. Gordon will probably become our primary scorer either this year or next year, because of the offensive improvements he’s made and continues to make. He’ll get those shots if he earns them. That’s how coaching staffs work (assuming they’re behaving professionally).