Don't Be Hurtin' Lin - The Jeremy Lin Thread 2

Kswiss · Post #1341 » by **Kswiss** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:51 am

Liver_Pooty wrote:I like Lin. Really good, solid backup PG and role player.

I agree he does his role really well. Play lock-down D and take over games with his offensive playmaking/scoring

Vae Victus · Post #1342 » by **Vae Victus** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:52 am

Lin right now is playing like a top notch 6th man, 1st combo guard off the bench type player. If he can get his outside shot all the way back, keeps up the aggression leading to more assists (~8+) or excellent looks for others, maintains his D intensity, and not be too sloppy with the ball (<2) there's no reason he cant be a starter. Whether its starting over Kemba if he reverts to his old lazy D low % chucking self, or more likely, starting at SG as part of a massively potent offensive lineup with 3 attacking ball handlers/shooters, Lin needs to step the hell up and be more consistent in putting a complete excellent games if he wants to shut up the haters/doubters.

If he doesnt/cant, yea he's just a top notch backup and it's a damn waste of his talent since he obviously can be so much more as evidenced by the last few games 1st halves. Handles and mentality are holding him back right now.

tonman · Post #1343 » by **tonman** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:14 am

Vae Victus wrote:Lin right now is playing like a top notch 6th man, 1st combo guard off the bench type player. If he can get his outside shot all the way back, keeps up the aggression leading to more assists (~8+) or excellent looks for others, maintains his D intensity, and not be too sloppy with the ball (<2) there's no reason he cant be a starter. Whether its starting over Kemba if he reverts to his old lazy D low % chucking self, or more likely, starting at SG as part of a massively potent offensive lineup with 3 attacking ball handlers/shooters, Lin needs to step the hell up and be more consistent in putting a complete excellent games if he wants to shut up the haters/doubters.

If he doesnt/cant, yea he's just a top notch backup and it's a damn waste of his talent since he obviously can be so much more as evidenced by the last few games 1st halves. Handles and mentality are holding him back right now.

Wall had 8 turnovers and averages 4.4 per game. Guess the handles only applies to some players.

13th Man · Post #1344 » by **13th Man** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:26 am

Don't want to see Lin start this year even if he outplays Kemba (which he hasn't). This is Kemba's team, he's locked up long-term. No coach will demote a cornerstone player over a guy that might leave at the end of the season. Plus nobody else has had a chance to play this role so Lin is needed there, wouldn't make sense to start him and have somebody else try to play combo guard.

Clifford wanted Lin to fill in the combo-guard role off the bench and he's finally making strides to do that. If he wants to run a team at pg, then he'll have to entertain other options in the off-season, hence why his contract has an option year but I'm sure that's not his concern right now. His only focus is to play well and help the team win.

13th Man · Post #1345 » by **13th Man** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:28 am

*edit* double post.

Vae Victus · Post #1346 » by **Vae Victus** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:32 am

In order for Lin to shake the bad TO rep he needs to go above and beyond to shut people up. Just like how people harp that he's a bad defender. He needs to bust ass and be recognized that he actually is a good defender at BOTH PG/SG to shut people up. It's a sad double standard, but he's gotta do what he's gotta do. If he goes 7-8 assist to 2-3 TO, it's gonna be hard to call him a TO machine without looking like a complete damn fool.

*shrugs* He's asian-american, he ought to be used to it by now. Gotta go above and beyond in order to be recognized for doing something decently well.

kinein · Post #1347 » by **kinein** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 6:26 am

Vae Victus wrote:In order for Lin to shake the bad TO rep he needs to go above and beyond to shut people up. Just like how people harp that he's a bad defender. He needs to bust ass and be recognized that he actually is a good defender at BOTH PG/SG to shut people up. It's a sad double standard, but he's gotta do what he's gotta do. If he goes 7-8 assist to 2-3 TO, it's gonna be hard to call him a TO machine without looking like a complete damn fool.

*shrugs* He's asian-american, he ought to be used to it by now. Gotta go above and beyond in order to be recognized for doing something decently well.

Anyone still talking about TOs and Lin like its a problem have their heads so far up their asses they can see the sun rise.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/point-guards

Lin has a 1.7 avg this season.

Batum had 8 a few games ago.

The last game Kemba and Batum had 4 a piece and they are starters.

John Wall had 8, does anyone talk about Wall's 8 TOs?

I'll say it one more time. Anyone talking about Lin and TO's being an issue have their heads shoved up their asses.

Let's look at Westbrook:
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/3468/russell-westbrook

Or how about John Wall:
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/4237/john-wall

This TO thing is just a false argument people who dislike Lin have, to keep him down. Anyone looking at purely numbers would call BS the minute they actually reviewed the stats and averages for any 10 random point guards Good to Elite categories.

Rajon Rondo hasn't had a TO average below 2.6 in over 7 years.

So what does that tell you when people willfully ignore the numbers.

You can't shake a bad rep when people don't care about the stats and want to knock him down. All he can do is win and win and keep on winning. His only choice in my opinion is to become a more consistent scorer. Nothing else will shut the haters down.

bigbob · Post #1348 » by **bigbob** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 6:44 am

kinein wrote:
Vae Victus wrote:In order for Lin to shake the bad TO rep he needs to go above and beyond to shut people up. Just like how people harp that he's a bad defender. He needs to bust ass and be recognized that he actually is a good defender at BOTH PG/SG to shut people up. It's a sad double standard, but he's gotta do what he's gotta do. If he goes 7-8 assist to 2-3 TO, it's gonna be hard to call him a TO machine without looking like a complete damn fool.

*shrugs* He's asian-american, he ought to be used to it by now. Gotta go above and beyond in order to be recognized for doing something decently well.

Anyone still talking about TOs and Lin like its a problem have their heads so far up their asses they can see the sun rise.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/assists/sort/avgAssists/position/point-guards

Lin has a 1.7 avg this season.

Batum had 8 a few games ago.

The last game Kemba and Batum had 4 a piece and they are starters.

John Wall had 8, does anyone talk about Wall's 8 TOs?

I'll say it one more time. Anyone talking about Lin and TO's being an issue have their heads shoved up their asses.

Let's look at Westbrook:
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/3468/russell-westbrook

Or how about John Wall:
http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/4237/john-wall

This TO thing is just a false argument people who dislike Lin have, to keep him down. Anyone looking at purely numbers would call BS the minute they actually reviewed the stats and averages for any 10 random point guards Good to Elite categories.

Rajon Rondo hasn't had a TO average below 2.6 in over 7 years.

So what does that tell you when people willfully ignore the numbers.

You can't shake a bad rep when people don't care about the stats and want to knock him down. All he can do is win and win and keep on winning. His only choice in my opinion is to become a more consistent scorer. Nothing else will shut the haters down.

true..im not going to say its good that he has alot of turnovers some games, but it seems to be pretty common for pg's to turnover the ball..comes with the trade really.

bws94 · Post #1349 » by **bws94** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 6:58 am

Westbrook's TOs go up each season, so does his assists. Really, some of the top NBA players have pretty high TO rates. Still, if you don't turn the ball over much it's good. I'm liking Lin seems less bothered by pressure on his dribble and his handles seem more stable now. That's important for a PG. He still has to watch getting stripped on drives but he's improving his TOs well this season. HIs assists could go up but guys have to make shots you dish it to. That should happen as guys get more familiar with him. 7 the last game is good.

Whatever people say they say. It takes a long time before people change notions about a player. Then they see him and go, oh, he's different. Really, whatever. Lin's looking good. I think Lin scores when he needs to or gets the notion. I think he'll figure out when his scoring is needed and turn it on then as the season progresses.

bigbob · Post #1350 » by **bigbob** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 7:07 am

also, id like to point out something i noticed. The last game thread for the wizards was locked apparently because of all the kembrick bashing. Supposedly thats all lin fans and only lin fans fault lol. But, the interesting thing to me is that most kemba bashing posts I seen so far are from posters who joined this site BEFORE lin even joined the hornets. This just means that most of the kemba hate is coming from pure hornets fans.

There is a point where fans just snap when their star player keeps fudging up hard and doom the teams chances of making the playoffs. Obviously im not happy with kemba either for bricking so many shots and losing a few games for the team, but then its also true that he has won many games for the team this season, more than he's lost at least. Maybe he is in a slump right now, and will get back in his groove soon, either way the bashing of kemba is a little bit too far fetched even in my eyes as a lin fan.

Mostly, Im pretty happy that the lin fans have mostly kept their lin worship to this thread and not spilled over too much into the game threads. There are one or two lin fans who post ridiculous comments in game threads, but mostly nobody takes it seriously either way. The ones who have REALLY gone of the deep end are the HORNETS fans, you guys need to support your team through thick and thin.

Look at it this way...it was expected for the hornets to be a losing team this year with no hope, probably 6 wins the entire season and tank mode to get a pick. Currently, the teams situation is MUCH better than anybody could have ever even dreamed possible, especially after MKG got injured in the preseason. With that in mind, hornets fans should count ever win as a blessing and not get caught up on the losses lol

Vae Victus · Post #1351 » by **Vae Victus** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 9:16 am

Regarding Lin and TO, i dont look at raw TO per game, im more interested in Assist/TO ratio. I mean if Lin is turning it over 4 times a game (BAD!) but dishing out 12 dimes a game (HOLY MAGIC BATMAN!) for a sweet 3:1 ratio, then yea no one is gonna bitch about it (well his hardcore haters would but they'll get laughed out of the room wherever they try). Now of course it's hard for him to rack up assists since he's not the primary facilitator, although that seems to be changing a bit, but he really needs to reduce the really egregious bad ones, like the terrible lead pass on the break and the rushed travel. Him driving getting pummeled for no calls or swarmed i dont mind as much cuz its strong aggressive play and he needs to consistently attack the rack to hopefully draw fouls and open up the floor for himself and the rest of the team.

Kemba is not Kembrick this year. I've long thought Lin was better but Kemba has REALLY stepped up his game (prolly cuz he's scared that Lin will steal his spot) and has definitely outplayed Lin so far. He's really hustling on defense racking up steals/blocks and chucking less stupid ass hero bricks (although he still hasnt totally shaken the habit). Now of course having more offensive talent has helped alot for efficiency in opening up the floor for him to operate, but man his decision making at times is just hair pulling. Personally i say just let Kemba go dark side and slide him to SG when Lin plays, so he doesnt need to care about making plays but shooting up open looks off ball movement/Lin penetration and attacking seams off of disruption similar to what Lin is doing right now. Kemba by far a is more natural scorer/shooter and is better suited to spacing a floor since i trust him making his open shots a helluva lot more than Lin.

Simply put, Cliff needs to have the facilitators be facilitators (Lin, Batum) and scorers be scorers (Kemba). I personally think Batum is looking for his own shot too much cuz he aint shooting from the field all that great shooting so many tough shots, he's so hung up on being THE MAN that his decision making is being affected, but i cant blame him cuz he's trying to get paid. There's a reason he was like the 4th option in POR, its cuz he's not some natural scoring savant, heck when he plays for team France it's not like he's taking the scoring load on his back alone, no he's more of the glue guy who elevates a team's play by making smart decisions and picking up the slack where needed.

Heck Lin should be trying to get paid too, why wont he more selfish, its like a rerun of last with the Lakers, but at least the Hornets are a playoff team so its more understandable/acceptable for him to try to fit in and go with the flow.

Lorenzomax7 · Post #1352 » by **Lorenzomax7** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:01 pm

Vae Victus wrote:Lin right now is playing like a top notch 6th man, 1st combo guard off the bench type player. If he can get his outside shot all the way back, keeps up the aggression leading to more assists (~8+) or excellent looks for others, maintains his D intensity, and not be too sloppy with the ball (<2) there's no reason he cant be a starter. Whether its starting over Kemba if he reverts to his old lazy D low % chucking self, or more likely, starting at SG as part of a massively potent offensive lineup with 3 attacking ball handlers/shooters, Lin needs to step the hell up and be more consistent in putting a complete excellent games if he wants to shut up the haters/doubters.

If he doesnt/cant, yea he's just a top notch backup and it's a damn waste of his talent since he obviously can be so much more as evidenced by the last few games 1st halves. Handles and mentality are holding him back right now.

Mentally he is earning 20 mil right?

13th Man · Post #1353 » by **13th Man** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:29 pm

Big game tonight (especially for Lin fans lol) against the Rockets! No game thread?

lin is ok · Post #1354 » by **lin is ok** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:49 pm

13th Man wrote:Big game tonight (especially for Lin fans lol) against the Rockets! No game thread?

big game for clutchfans too. haha

dorkestra · Post #1355 » by **dorkestra** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 2:56 pm

I'm no fanboy or anything, but always thought he was a better player than most would believe. He just needed to find the right system. Very happy to see him succeeding in Charlotte. And his hair is fantastic.

tmonk · Post #1356 » by **tmonk** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 4:41 pm

Hope some of lin's fans won't do the same things after HOU game........

bws94 · Post #1357 » by **bws94** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:04 pm

This is the craziest thread on this board, by far. That chart is accurate, tmonk. Good post.

bigbob · Post #1358 » by **bigbob** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:42 pm

bws94 wrote:This is the craziest thread on this board, by far. That chart is accurate, tmonk. Good post.

not really...maybe it applied to houston where harden actually played reasonably well. But on this hornets team, the player most similar to harden, ie kemba, gets more hate from hornets fans than all the lin fans put together ahaha

lin is ok · Post #1359 » by **lin is ok** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:45 pm

bws94 wrote:This is the craziest thread on this board, by far. That chart is accurate, tmonk. Good post.

OK this is baiting here. haha

13th Man · Post #1360 » by **13th Man** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 6:05 pm

Haven't been following the Rockets closely this year, how's Lawson and Beverley doing? I know that Lawson hasn't been good at all, what about Bev, has he been injured for half the season as usual? Just curious because didn't they sign him for $12M or something? wonder if they're regretting that.