Deni Avdija

[closg00]

I won't buy Deni's shot creation until i see it against NBA comp. I do however think he can be our Otto Porter 2.0 if his 3pt improves to 35% or better. Basically just a winning player, that makes few mistakes and is always in the right place. Will likely never shoot 40% from 3 but his playmaking and individual defense is significantly better than Otto.

It's not a negative to not buy his shot creation lol. And he was never slated to be that. Secondary playmaker, great defense and outside shooting. Any shot creation he gives us would be extra. I mean with consistent shot creation he's basically Luka Doncic. No need to introduce extreme and unrealistic goals in an attempt to take away from what has been a massive improvement.

While I was thrilled to see Deni being aggressive and taking some big shots in the clips, I remember that Jan Vesely too was in his comfort zone playing in the Euro league, I would be ecstatic to see Deni playing like this in the NBA. As-far as Deni never slated being slated.... well, we drafted a wing player

[nate33]

I like seeing him aggressively look for his shot, but he doesn't yet create the kind of separation he is going to need to get off shots against NBA caliber defenders in isolation. I'm not hating; he is definitely improving and that's a good thing. But I'm really a lot more interested in his catch-and-shoot 3-ball than his on-ball shot creation. We already have 3 guys on the team who are better options as on-ball isolation scorers (Beal, Zinger and Kuzma) so there won't be much need for Deni to do that with the Wizards. His 3P accuracy will be the difference between whether he is a starter or a bench player.

[DCZards]

I won't buy Deni's shot creation until i see it against NBA comp. I do however think he can be our Otto Porter 2.0 if his 3pt improves to 35% or better. Basically just a winning player, that makes few mistakes and is always in the right place. Will likely never shoot 40% from 3 but his playmaking and individual defense is significantly better than Otto.

It's not a negative to not buy his shot creation lol. And he was never slated to be that. Secondary playmaker, great defense and outside shooting. Any shot creation he gives us would be extra. I mean with consistent shot creation he's basically Luka Doncic. No need to introduce extreme and unrealistic goals in an attempt to take away from what has been a massive improvement.

While I was thrilled to see Deni being aggressive and taking some big shots in the clips, I remember that Jan Vesely too was in his comfort zone playing in the Euro league, I would be ecstatic to see Deni playing like this in the NBA. As-far as Deni never slated being slated.... well, we drafted a wing player

Vesely never, ever—in the Euroleague or anywhere else—showed the kind of shotmaking or playmaking that Deni has shown.

[badinage]

I’m just enjoying the growth of one of our very young players. It’s nice. And exciting.

I’m not projecting, I’m not thinking of ceilings and floors. I’m just enjoying what looks to be really fine progress. A young player — a young person — realizing more of his potential. It’s nice.

That’s the good thing about having a team like ours. This feeling I have right now. I wouldn’t have that with the Nets.

[arusinov]

I like seeing him aggressively look for his shot, but he doesn't yet create the kind of separation he is going to need to get off shots against NBA caliber defenders in isolation. I'm not hating; he is definitely improving and that's a good thing. But I'm really a lot more interested in his catch-and-shoot 3-ball than his on-ball shot creation. We already have 3 guys on the team who are better options as on-ball isolation scorers (Beal, Zinger and Kuzma) so there won't be much need for Deni to do that with the Wizards. His 3P accuracy will be the difference between whether he is a starter or a bench player.

Well. The thing is : Deni is not C&S 3&D player. He's very good D player but there're a lot players which don't have 10% of his potential but much better at C&S.

He's secondary (maybe primary if he improves) playmaker and yep... shot-creator (and if he doesn't get chance to do it in NBA - we'll never know whether he's good enough)

It's basically problem with attempt to contend and develop players at the same time...

[nate33]

I like seeing him aggressively look for his shot, but he doesn't yet create the kind of separation he is going to need to get off shots against NBA caliber defenders in isolation. I'm not hating; he is definitely improving and that's a good thing. But I'm really a lot more interested in his catch-and-shoot 3-ball than his on-ball shot creation. We already have 3 guys on the team who are better options as on-ball isolation scorers (Beal, Zinger and Kuzma) so there won't be much need for Deni to do that with the Wizards. His 3P accuracy will be the difference between whether he is a starter or a bench player.

Well. The thing is : Deni is not C&S 3&D player. He's very good D player but there're a lot players which don't have 10% of his potential but much better at C&S.

He's secondary (maybe primary if he improves) playmaker and yep... shot-creator (and if he doesn't get chance to do it in NBA - we'll never know whether he's good enough)

It's basically problem with attempt to contend and develop players at the same time...

I'm not expecting him to ever shoot 43% from 3-point range, but I do think he needs to prioritize catch-and-shoot and become serviceable at it so that he can stay on the floor. If he can competently shoot 36% of so from 3-point range, he'll be a worthy starter and then he can continue to develop the rest of his game so that maybe he'll become more of a well-rounded playmaker in the future.

Again, I'm not criticizing. For all I know, Deni is busting his butt and trying to become a 36% 3P shooter in addition to working on his shot creation. All I'm saying is that a modest improvement in his catch-and-shoot 3 will have a more immediate, useful impact in NBA games than a modest improvement in shot-creation/playmaking.

[doclinkin]

I like seeing him aggressively look for his shot, but he doesn't yet create the kind of separation he is going to need to get off shots against NBA caliber defenders in isolation. I'm not hating; he is definitely improving and that's a good thing. But I'm really a lot more interested in his catch-and-shoot 3-ball than his on-ball shot creation. We already have 3 guys on the team who are better options as on-ball isolation scorers (Beal, Zinger and Kuzma) so there won't be much need for Deni to do that with the Wizards. His 3P accuracy will be the difference between whether he is a starter or a bench player.

I'm more heartened by his willingness to actually take a shot, and call his own number. If that confidence carries over to the pro game then teams will have to guard him instead of playing 5-on-4 defense. Deni makes the smart play on his passes. Sometimes the smart play will be him shooting instead. Especially if teams try to shade him with a non-defender or smaller guard that they are trying to hide at one end. When teams have to play him for the shot as well as the pass then KP will be open, or the shooter with the hot hand. Deni can swing it to the right guy, still. But up to now Deni has been scared to shoot. This Deni is not that guy. Watching the outside shot drop in with the shot clock winding down and carrying your team to last second victories builds the confidence that you can get it done when it matters most. If Deni scores over shorter players then teams will have to send a big to chase him, which opens up more opportunities for the rest of the team. Being able to make your own shot is harder than hitting a catch and shoot 3. Seems to me the one feeds the other.

[Runner300]

While attacking his guy, Deni might not get past him perfectly, but he's creating an advantage for his team, but not every team can take advantage of this advantage.
I don't see him doing those things with Wizards

[closg00]

It's not a negative to not buy his shot creation lol. And he was never slated to be that. Secondary playmaker, great defense and outside shooting. Any shot creation he gives us would be extra. I mean with consistent shot creation he's basically Luka Doncic. No need to introduce extreme and unrealistic goals in an attempt to take away from what has been a massive improvement.

While I was thrilled to see Deni being aggressive and taking some big shots in the clips, I remember that Jan Vesely too was in his comfort zone playing in the Euro league, I would be ecstatic to see Deni playing like this in the NBA. As-far as Deni never slated being slated.... well, we drafted a wing player

Vesely never, ever—in the Euroleague or anywhere else—showed the kind of shotmaking or playmaking that Deni has shown.

The comment was about Vesely's comfort level playing in the Europe, never mentioned his shooting.

[nate33]

Vesely was a really strange case. Vesely had the skills of a center (i.e. very unskilled) but the size and strength of a SF. That's a really bad combination in the NBA. However, at the time, Europe was full of highly skilled big men who had the shooting and passing ability of a typical forward. (They were available because, in the European system, you could get away with slow, plodding bigs because hand-checking was allowed. So the talent pool of huge humans was bigger because they didn't also have to be agile.) Basically, a guy like Vesely still had a role in Europe because you could put 4 skilled guys around him and let him run around and just be athletic. In the NBA, you could only put 3 skilled guys around him because very few centers are skilled, and Vesely wasn't skilled. And with only 3 skilled guys on the court, the offense just couldn't work.

Vesely got a little better later in his career once he filled out and was able to play center.

[doclinkin]

Vesely was and is very athletic. Barcelona picked him up and he will play next to countryman Satoransky this year. Those two are going to feast at that level. Good chemistry, length, etc.

In the NBA Vesely never developed. In fact he got worse. His greatest vulnerability was his mental weakness. All you need to look at is his FT%. He shot 53% his first year with the Wiz. Then 30% his next, then 27% before we traded him. All due to a lack of confidence. In Europe he is shooting 62% at the FT line for his career because his confidence is high. He still can't shoot from outside, still doesn't pass, but he is playable in europe because he can dunk on anybody in that league. In the NBA he gets stuffed, bumped, bodied, and intimidated. Quits. Here he is no longer an athletic mismatch and so has no idea what to do. Quits. Gets anxious. Misses FT shots. Gets booed.

Deni is not that. Deni somehow leads the team in +/- year after year despite that he can't hit shots from outside, has no left hand, can't finish inside. Deni is in the league not due to superior athleticism or length, but because of the thing we are seeing with the Israeli national team: his BBIQ is precocious and he has a sense of what the right play is at whatever time. Here the right play is to pass to the better finishers, at Eurobasket the right play is to take the shot.

Zero danger Deni is anything like Vesely. We already get useful minutes from Deni. Watching him develop and take the spotlight in a high pressure situation is exactly what I would like to see for his offseason. Even more so than playing pick-up against NBA talent who are playing halfass defense in Pro-Am games.

[Dolevi]

This is what I was hoping yet expecting from Avidja ,improvement and more confident play. With Pride of Country and so many stars from the NBA playing in this tournament this is not some 2nd rate basketball being played .There's alot at stake for these guys and they play to win and excel.
The way KP played gives you insight on what to expect from him this year and that goes for Avidja as well. His wanting the ball and wanting to do something with it is not going to be different when he gets to the Wiz for training camp. His game is maturing as he is.

Actually, i must dis-agree with you.
Deni was already a leader in the Israeli NT. Offcourse he looks a little bit better now after the days in the NBA, but his role before wasn't that much different. You will see similiar highlights also in previous tournaments he had. The different in my opinion at least is that in Israel he's the go to go guy and the people / dressing room trust him enough to let him take control on things. He's not there yet with the Wizards at all, he still needs to prove himself offensively and fact that you haven't seen him doing this stuff last season (you did see him nice as a secondary/third playmaker plus as a defender, but not more than that). His role was not big on the team, and it's a compliment when i'm saying it. In the NT he's like the Bradly Beal / Russ type of guy by USG% / touches and time with ball. The question you need to ask is why it didn't happen also in the Wiz last season. It's just roles and trust from your teammates / organization / coach. That's all. You can't compare because of that. Different environment plus pressure. The kid can do big things and be good, he just hasn't found the place to take things on himself on Washington until now. If something is gonna change this year about Deni for good - then it will be just because he will gain more trust from people around him, not something about talent / abilities. The kid can play, even if not perfect (still turnsovers the ball too many times).

[Dolevi]

I like seeing him aggressively look for his shot, but he doesn't yet create the kind of separation he is going to need to get off shots against NBA caliber defenders in isolation. I'm not hating; he is definitely improving and that's a good thing. But I'm really a lot more interested in his catch-and-shoot 3-ball than his on-ball shot creation. We already have 3 guys on the team who are better options as on-ball isolation scorers (Beal, Zinger and Kuzma) so there won't be much need for Deni to do that with the Wizards. His 3P accuracy will be the difference between whether he is a starter or a bench player.

Offcourse, because he hasn't have yet the confidence he has in the NT. I don't like all these NBA to non NBA comparisons. You have bad defenders also in the NBA. What you said is excatly the reason why he's not doing what he can do in the NBA as well. As you said - you have a lot of options before going to Deni. That's the difference. In israel he is the Bradly Beal. It's all about USG% and confidence from your environment. If you want him to be your C&S type of guy player on the corner like Scott Brooks wanted, then fine you'll get this, but you will lose Deni as a player and as an important player in the dressing room (at least a lot more important than what he is now), that's all.

[Dolevi]

Deni Avdija highlights from game against Netherlands (on Israeli sport5 site)

https://www.sport5.co.il/articles.aspx?FolderID=7867&docID=413916

As you can see - Deni looks very tired at the end of the game as he played whole 20 min of 2nd half.

Speaking about the team performance... While several players of Israel NT (starting SG Yovel Zoosman for example) had embarrassingly bad games the biggest by far problem is the coach.

Guy Goodes never was a great coach, and didn't really impress at any time but this campaign his decisions are crossing into realm of weird and illogical.

It seems that Goodes refuses to accept that new times arrived and the keys should be firmly placed in hands of young generation e.g. mostly Deni and Yam Madar. Disappointedly he decided to cut from the squad without giving real chance both 20 years old PG/SG (all-star five member of this summer Euro U20) Noam Dovrat and 22 years old PF/C Gabriel Chachashvili (played in this year summer league for Warriors).

As Chachashvili was released the only real "big" in the team is Roman Sorkin - quite athletic guy and good rim protector. In the preparation games (not much relevant because of low level of opposition but anyway) with Deni out with Corona / struggling after Corona Yam Madar was the best player of the team and Sorkin played most minutes at C. For whatever reasons in the first EuroBasket game Goodes decided to play most of time Nimrod Levi and Jake Cohen - both can't defend inside at all as Levi is 6'10" but thin guy with SF-like build, and Cohen was soft and bad defender whole career. Not only Sorkin played just 3 min, Madar got only 7 minutes

And as several people already said it looked as if Goodes tried to prove that he can win without Deni and limited his minutes and role as games started, and it pretty much looks as if Deni had just to decide to take over games by his own decision and then Goodes had no choice but to go with it.

And in the case of the game against Netherlands seemingly afraid of huge embarrassment which losing to one of weakest teams in the Euro would cause - Goodes finally fielded Deni, Yam and Roman Sorkin for almost whole 2nd half which Israel won by 15 pts... but then he overplayed Deni (which played all 20 min) and he was exhausted as the last minutes came...

All in all. Current Israel NT has not much chance against top level team like Serbia but there's no real reason (if Deni will continue play well) why they wouldn't win both against Poland and Czech Republic, finish 2nd in the group with favorable matchup in 1/8 and maybe got to QF as a warm-up for a future medal run in like 4 years from now when Deni and Yam will be in their prime and several younger players like mentioned above Dovrat, 7'1" Gilad Levy , and Noam Yakov (Euro U18 all-star five selection) and Ben Saraf (best scorer and Euro U16 all-star five selection) join in... but having Goodes as the coach may prove to be too big obstacle.

Jeez, watch the play he did 2:19 to the end of the game as he's exhausted like crazy. Who will exactly let him take the ball like that in a critical game's ending as long as it's not a fast break. It's all about roles. If he will do it on your NBA team it's like violating invisible codes between your teammates.

[prime1time]

Let's expand on this shot creation discussion. How many players truly get a chance to shot create? Ignore all the bad teams that aren't competing for anything. Teams that are genuinely competing for the playoffs.

Miami - Butler, Adebayo, Herro, Oladipo
Boston - Tatum, Smart, Brown
Bucks - Giannis, Holliday, Middleton
76ers - Harden, Maxey, Embiid
Raptors - Barnes, Vanvleet, Siakam, Anunoby
Nets - Irving, Durant
Bulls - Lavine, Derozan, Vucevic
Hawks - Young, Murray
Cavs - Mitchell, Garland, Mobley

Purely talking about offensive, one-on-one scoring ability. Who on this list is Avdija better than?

[prime1time]

I won't buy Deni's shot creation until i see it against NBA comp. I do however think he can be our Otto Porter 2.0 if his 3pt improves to 35% or better. Basically just a winning player, that makes few mistakes and is always in the right place. Will likely never shoot 40% from 3 but his playmaking and individual defense is significantly better than Otto.

It's not a negative to not buy his shot creation lol. And he was never slated to be that. Secondary playmaker, great defense and outside shooting. Any shot creation he gives us would be extra. I mean with consistent shot creation he's basically Luka Doncic. No need to introduce extreme and unrealistic goals in an attempt to take away from what has been a massive improvement.

While I was thrilled to see Deni being aggressive and taking some big shots in the clips, I remember that Jan Vesely too was in his comfort zone playing in the Euro league, I would be ecstatic to see Deni playing like this in the NBA. As-far as Deni never slated being slated.... well, we drafted a wing player

Is every wing player that's drafted expected to be a shot creator?

[prime1time]

Barring continued major improvement year-over-year, I highly doubt that Avdija will ever be a shot creator in the NBA. And a team that features Avdija as a shot creator in his current state, is going to be at the top of the lottery (hoping to draft a shot creator).

Watch on YouTube

;ab_channel=KentBlazemore

The best I think you can hope for is a Toni Kukoc esque player. Another comparison is Hedo Türkoğlu. The challenge for Avdija is that both of those guys could confidently knock down 3's. Kukoc 3-point %'s were lower but he played in a different era and his career 3-point average is 33.5% still clearly higher than Avdija. If Avdija can get to the high 30s from 3, you can start to see how his game can develop. People will run him off the 3-point line. He has the ball skills, size and ability to attack the hoop or find open guys. We will see what he does this year.

[AFM]

Wiz really should be marketing Deni more. He’s low key one of the cutest fellas in the NBA (no pause), between him and Kispert we could have ladies nights at the Verizon Center, catapulting our popularity skyward

[keynote]

Rough outing from Deni vs Poland. Only 3 points, plus a little tantrum that damaged the sideline display.

[Wizraeli]

Great game by Deni today against the very strong Serbia, 14 pts, 6 reb, 5 ast, 1 blk while the Serbian defense really targeted him(what's new?)

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube