Fred VanVleet Mega Thread III

[DelAbbot]

Come on guys, FVV should stay a raptors for life.

Guys like pingpong and los_29 work so hard defending him for the last 2 years that it’s actually an art.

They may single handedly prevent a FVV trade with their efforts

Shots fired!

[DelAbbot]

Management likely sees FVV as the “heart and soul” of this team. Sure, ownership also wants to save a few bucks if possible during this whole process but they want to keep him around.

FVV will test free agency and maybe some team like the Magic may throw good money at him but the Raptors will likely at least match it.

I think this is a viable option. We need someone senior to keep Scottie in check on the court. Fred can bark at Scottie on the court to make him insecure enough to not demand the rookie max. If Fred can neg Scottie enough and take away enough shots from Scottie, then come extension time Scottie may take a Norm Powell deal instead of a rookie max. The money saved will be well worth whatever extra we pay Fred now, especially since the 2025 new tv deal makes that cheap anyways.

[mihaic]

You replied to me. If you believe my statement applies to you, that's on you. I'm just explaining my statement in case it required explanation.

I was the only one talking about strawman on the thread and your next post is "To call it a straw man is incredibly disingenuous." What else could you have been referring too?

I stand corrected, it was you who brought it up. I'll give you a scenario: Fred is 36 yrs old, producing similar numbers on last year of deal, we're out of playoffs. Does this justify hyping up mediocre stats regardless of all the other variables? No. That's disingenuous. A team like that should dump him for whatever they can get.

But we signed Lowry in a scenario similar to that to 30mil

Edit: Don't come back at me talking about Fred. Don't really want to keep fred unless we think we can sign him way under market price and trade him later. Or S&T later like we did with Lowry.

[nikster]

You replied to me. If you believe my statement applies to you, that's on you. I'm just explaining my statement in case it required explanation.

I was the only one talking about strawman on the thread and your next post is "To call it a straw man is incredibly disingenuous." What else could you have been referring too?

I stand corrected, it was you who brought it up. I'll give you a scenario: Fred is 36 yrs old, producing similar numbers on last year of deal, we're out of playoffs. Does this justify hyping up mediocre stats regardless of all the other variables? No. That's disingenuous. A team like that should dump him for whatever they can get.

It's a very different scenario considering Fred is 28, so I'm not sure of the relevance. Obviously at 36 years Fred is nearly out of the league

[ItsDanger]

I was the only one talking about strawman on the thread and your next post is "To call it a straw man is incredibly disingenuous." What else could you have been referring too?

I stand corrected, it was you who brought it up. I'll give you a scenario: Fred is 36 yrs old, producing similar numbers on last year of deal, we're out of playoffs. Does this justify hyping up mediocre stats regardless of all the other variables? No. That's disingenuous. A team like that should dump him for whatever they can get.

It's a very different scenario considering Fred is 28, so I'm not sure of the relevance. Obviously at 36 years Fred is nearly out of the league

But thats the point, everything is viewed in context of age, injuries, contract status, the moving parts of the remaining roster, qualitative, rest of the league, etc. Just viewing recent performance on an island to justify a stance is incorrect in light of all the other issues. FYI, I thought this guy was overpaid at $20M, let alone $30+ or whatever he wants.

That being said, the TS% open question remains. I answered it. I'm ready to put that argument to bed permanently.

[nikster]

I stand corrected, it was you who brought it up. I'll give you a scenario: Fred is 36 yrs old, producing similar numbers on last year of deal, we're out of playoffs. Does this justify hyping up mediocre stats regardless of all the other variables? No. That's disingenuous. A team like that should dump him for whatever they can get.

It's a very different scenario considering Fred is 28, so I'm not sure of the relevance. Obviously at 36 years Fred is nearly out of the league

But thats the point, everything is viewed in context of age, injuries, contract status, the moving parts of the remaining roster, qualitative, rest of the league, etc. Just viewing recent performance on an island to justify a stance is incorrect in light of all the other issues. FYI, I thought this guy was overpaid at $20M, let alone $30+ or whatever he wants.

That being said, the TS% open question remains. I answered it. I'm ready to put that argument to bed permanently.

What's the point? Justify what stance? The only stance we're taking is that Fred is not as garbage as some of the posters make him out to be. Are you incapable of understanding that I can both think he's playing well and can still have concerns about his contract status?

You guys are fine with all over the top bashing of his on court performance but as soon as someone pushes back you want to turn into a conversation about his contract. Btw since his rough start his TS% has been fine. Above average for a guard

[ItsDanger]

It's a very different scenario considering Fred is 28, so I'm not sure of the relevance. Obviously at 36 years Fred is nearly out of the league

But thats the point, everything is viewed in context of age, injuries, contract status, the moving parts of the remaining roster, qualitative, rest of the league, etc. Just viewing recent performance on an island to justify a stance is incorrect in light of all the other issues. FYI, I thought this guy was overpaid at $20M, let alone $30+ or whatever he wants.

That being said, the TS% open question remains. I answered it. I'm ready to put that argument to bed permanently.

What's the point? Justify what stance? The only stance we're taking is that Fred is not as garbage as some of the posters make him out to be. Are you incapable of understanding that I can both think he's playing well and can still have concerns about his contract status?

You guys are fine with all over the top bashing of his on court performance but as soon as someone pushes back you want to turn into a conversation about his contract. Btw since his rough start his TS% has been fine. Above average for a guard

I'm very capable of understanding he's well below other starting point guards and isn't worth extending at his age, amongst many other factors. Looking at past 6 weeks as justification for ignoring the NBA realities here is 100% disingenuous. Go look at TS% for starting PGs across the league.

Now project that sub par TS% as a team vs rest of league. That translates into losses.

[t54zhao]

Management likely sees FVV as the “heart and soul” of this team. Sure, ownership also wants to save a few bucks if possible during this whole process but they want to keep him around.

FVV will test free agency and maybe some team like the Magic may throw good money at him but the Raptors will likely at least match it.

I think this is a viable option. We need someone senior to keep Scottie in check on the court. Fred can bark at Scottie on the court to make him insecure enough to not demand the rookie max. If Fred can neg Scottie enough and take away enough shots from Scottie, then come extension time Scottie may take a Norm Powell deal instead of a rookie max. The money saved will be well worth whatever extra we pay Fred now, especially since the 2025 new tv deal makes that cheap anyways.

This is how you get Scottie to ask out or take the qualifying offer.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

Come on guys, FVV should stay a raptors for life.

Guys like pingpong and los_29 work so hard defending him for the last 2 years that it’s actually an art.

They may single handedly prevent a FVV trade with their efforts

Shots fired!

facts only.

[LBJKB24MJ23]

Come on guys, FVV should stay a raptors for life.

Guys like pingpong and los_29 work so hard defending him for the last 2 years that it’s actually an art.

They may single handedly prevent a FVV trade with their efforts

What are your reasons for stating this?

because we let Mike James go and the franchise has regretted it ever since. hence why we won't let go of FVV, aka Mike James reincarnated.

[nikster]

But thats the point, everything is viewed in context of age, injuries, contract status, the moving parts of the remaining roster, qualitative, rest of the league, etc. Just viewing recent performance on an island to justify a stance is incorrect in light of all the other issues. FYI, I thought this guy was overpaid at $20M, let alone $30+ or whatever he wants.

That being said, the TS% open question remains. I answered it. I'm ready to put that argument to bed permanently.

What's the point? Justify what stance? The only stance we're taking is that Fred is not as garbage as some of the posters make him out to be. Are you incapable of understanding that I can both think he's playing well and can still have concerns about his contract status?

You guys are fine with all over the top bashing of his on court performance but as soon as someone pushes back you want to turn into a conversation about his contract. Btw since his rough start his TS% has been fine. Above average for a guard

I'm very capable of understanding he's well below other starting point guards and isn't worth extending at his age, amongst many other factors. Looking at past 6 weeks as justification for ignoring the NBA realities here is 100% disingenuous. Go look at TS% for starting PGs across the league.

Now project that sub par TS% as a team vs rest of league. That translates into losses.

So you can talk about his on court play when you're trashing him, but when we say he's playing well we have to be berated with talks of his contract status as if the entire board isn't already aware of this

[DelAbbot]

Read on Twitter

I'm rooting for GSW to trade for Fred just so I can see Draymond get in his face and put him in his place

[metafisical]

FVV is the heart and soul of our team? No wonder we have a losing record. We haven't had a heart and soul in our team since Lowry left. FVV is an ultra-poor replacement who really only cares about getting his.

[ItsDanger]

When Fred scores 34+ pts, Raps record is 0-4.

Discuss.

[DelAbbot]

FVV is the heart and soul of our team? No wonder we have a losing record. We haven't had a heart and soul in our team since Lowry left. FVV is an ultra-poor replacement who really only cares about getting his.

Coming from nothing and working and grinding your way up is our culture. We need the embodiment of this to instill such a mindset in all our prospects.

[Clay Davis]

Watch on YouTube

Mike James had the #BetOnYourself mentality before Fred did.

[StopitLeo]

FVV is the heart and soul of our team? No wonder we have a losing record. We haven't had a heart and soul in our team since Lowry left. FVV is an ultra-poor replacement who really only cares about getting his.

Coming from nothing and working and grinding your way up is our culture. We need the embodiment of this to instill such a mindset in all our prospects.

Pascal embodies that just as much, if not more.

[bboyskinnylegs]

When Fred scores 34+ pts, Raps record is 0-4.

Discuss.

we need to trade Scottie/OG/GTJ for KD to get FVV help.

[Brinbe]

Watch on YouTube

Mike James had the #BetOnYourself mentality before Fred did.

bahamas ain't just a place. it's a state of mind.

[ItsDanger]

When Fred scores 34+ pts, Raps record is 0-4.

Discuss.

we need to trade Scottie/OG/GTJ for KD to get FVV help.

Waiting for analytics bros to bring their A game for this one.