LaMelephant: The LaMelo Ball Thread (#2)

[LofJ]

Haliburton fell flat on his ass (literally) in FIBA this summer. He can't play defense to save his life, he's worse than LaMelo in that regard.

He also hasn't accomplished anything in his career. He got traded from a team that immediately took a massive leap and put up some nice stats on a team that was barely better than our injury depleted roster. But look at his stats!!!! Who cares if he got them while racking up losses because his team gave up 140 points.

[Hornet Mania]

Melo is getting dragged down by being associated with the Hornets, much like Brandon Miller. NBA media is perhaps the least-informed in all of the major North American pro sports, it's one step up from high school lunch table gossip.

The Hornets have to win some games to change the narrative, and even then it will take awhile because the usual suspects will only be paying attention to NY/LA/Miami/GSW/Boston most of the time.

I agree the Hali hype, relative to Melo getting mocked or downplayed, is extremely hypocritical. I am confident that if Melo stays healthy the hierarchy will be reestablished with him above Hali as a long-term prospect. Right now NBA media personalities are prisoners of the moment. We just have to be patient, eventually the 'expert' voices will remember, oh yeah, a 22yr-old kid averaging 25/7/7 is actually quite respectable.

[JDR720]

If Melo & him swapped teams, the narrative would be the opposite.

But to be fair, some of the Melo dislike is due to his flashy personality. Whereas Halliburton is more "professional"

[luciano-davidwesley]

Melo is getting dragged down by being associated with the Hornets, much like Brandon Miller. NBA media is perhaps the least-informed in all of the major North American pro sports, it's one step up from high school lunch table gossip.

The Hornets have to win some games to change the narrative, and even then it will take awhile because the usual suspects will only be paying attention to NY/LA/Miami/GSW/Boston most of the time.

I agree the Hali hype, relative to Melo getting mocked or downplayed, is extremely hypocritical. I am confident that if Melo stays healthy the hierarchy will be reestablished with him above Hali as a long-term prospect. Right now NBA media personalities are prisoners of the moment. We just have to be patient, eventually the 'expert' voices will remember, oh yeah, a 22yr-old kid averaging 25/7/7 is actually quite respectable.

You win the internet today.

Also LaMelo Ball is 18 months younger than Haliburton.

[Trey24]

What I am saying is that the Media Narritave and the fan narrative you are referring to are two different things.

The latter being the one you are elevating above the former.

How? The only thing the fans decide is ASG Staters.

The Media decides everything else, which is why I keep bringing it up.

I don't understand what you're trying to get at.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/nbas-top-50-players-in-2022-23-season-giannis-jokic-luka-battle-for-no-1-lebron-slips-out-of-top-10/

https://nbarankings.theringer.com/

Just a couple examples, but you can clearly see the public narrative (both media and "casuals") is Melo being held is lower regard. I'm not making any statement whatsoever about his production.

SWEDD all I am saying is that fans and media have different opinions. What are you even talking about? Don't let the casual fans BS opinion sway yours and the casual fans opinion does not equal media narrative.

Thats what I mean when I say Casual fan narrative is different than media. What happened to Lamelo being a bust? Everyone was saying it prior to him playing an NBA minute and he won rookie of the year.

By the logic you are displaying, Lamelo would have not had an opportunity to win ROY and be selected for ASG.

[SWedd523]

Yeah I think we're not reaching each other here. Why do you keep talking about casual fans?

[Trey24]

Because you are way too concerned about what they think when I know that you know how good Lamelo is. We are definitely on the same page there.

[SWedd523]

I don't know how many times I need(ed) to say it.

I do not give a flying **** what casual fans think.
I also do not give a flying **** what the media thinks.
I think he's much better than outside voices would argue.

My points, again:

1. The media is who votes on End of Year Accolades
2. End of Year Accolades have a significant impact upon players legacy, money earned, and HOF status
3. The media does not hold Melo in anywhere near as high a regard as his contemporaries (the ones I specifically mentioned were Fox, Young, and Haliburton)
4. Melo will need to win over the media (and, yes, casual fans), if he wants to be considered a superstar player outside of the Charlotte Hornets fan communities. It's just how it works.

[TheCollector]

The biggest issue for Melo was that he was hurt last year and the Hornets sucked. Out of sight out of mind in the NBA. If he stay healthy this year and just puts up the same stats he did last year with the Hornets in the top 8 in the east and he will get plenty of attention. Average even better stats or get into the top 6 of the east and he will REALLY get attention.

Only problem then is that as soon as he blows up, NBA media will be trying to get him to a "Big Market". NBA Media is BY FAR the worst of the professional sports. They are lazy and only care about 5-6 teams in LA, NY, Miami and Boston. It's what is holding the league back as a whole.

[HornetJail]

The biggest issue for Melo was that he was hurt last year and the Hornets sucked. Out of sight out of mind in the NBA. If he stay healthy this year and just puts up the same stats he did last year with the Hornets in the top 8 in the east and he will get plenty of attention. Average even better stats or get into the top 6 of the east and he will REALLY get attention.

Only problem then is that as soon as he blows up, NBA media will be trying to get him to a "Big Market". NBA Media is BY FAR the worst of the professional sports. They are lazy and only care about 5-6 teams in LA, NY, Miami and Boston. It's what is holding the league back as a whole.

they did it with Kemba once he became a star. Kemba only left Charlotte when the team lowballed him, otherwise he'd STILL be here.

I hope Melo even has a fraction of that loyalty. I do buy into the idea he'll eventually try to angle himself to play for a Cali team at some point, but hope we have him for a long time. This team has to turn it around eventually or we're only expediting his exit.

[fatlever]

https://youtu.be/LXeWkKsg-No?si=nP2z_Y3vZUXsTbel

lol. i turned it off after 1 minute

[wilson115]

Well, since it seems like internal development's the order of the day for the meantime... might be optimistic/delusional but chances LaMelo develops a back-to-the-basket game? Read claims he's at 6'8" now, got great touch from a few feet away and just feel getting him to play more of a draw-help-and-survey-the-court style helps his development better than just chucking it. Or is doing it like Magic did outdated/counter-productive now?

Watch on YouTube

[SWedd523]

Well, since it seems like internal development's the order of the day for the meantime... might be optimistic/delusional but chances LaMelo develops a back-to-the-basket game? Read claims he's at 6'8" now, got great touch from a few feet away and just feel getting him to play more of a draw-help-and-survey-the-court style helps his development better than just chucking it. Or is doing it like Magic did outdated/counter-productive now?

Watch on YouTube

For now, he's probably too light in the pants to have much of a post game. As he ages he'll probably do that natural slide down the lineup like LeBron, Giannis, and them did

[yosemiteben]

Read on Twitter

[yosemiteben]

Read on Twitter

[fatlever]

a colorful comic book style artwork of a very light-skin African American basketball player with light brown curly hair shaved on the sides and a thin mustache and goatee, tattoos on his arms, wearing a purple jersey with teal pinstripes. He is driving a yellow Lamborghini at night, running a red stoplight

[Walt Cronkite]

Actual lol, thanks for that.

[Bassman]

Read on Twitter

Excellent article by Lowe. He really did a fair break down of Ball’s strengths and weaknesses. LaMelo sounds a LOT more mature in some of his comments. Also interesting that he’s been working all during the off-season with Clifford and others on enhancing his game, managing it as a PG must to be successful against multiple styles. Well worth the read.

[Liver_Pooty]

I hate pay walls.

[Snidely FC]

here is the LaMelo portion of the article:

LaMelo Ball, Charlotte Hornets

Two years ago, the debate over the league's best young point guards (below Luka Doncic) focused on Ball, Trae Young and Ja Morant. After a lost season due to injuries, several youngish point guards have vaulted ahead of Ball in the discourse: Tyrese Haliburton, De'Aaron Fox, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, Darius Garland, Jalen Brunson.

"I don't care about that stuff," Ball tells ESPN. "I just want to lock in for the team. We are trying to make the playoffs."

That may sound ridiculous for a woebegone franchise that has cracked .500 once since 2016 and hasn't won a playoff series in 21 years, but the Hornets -- with a similar roster -- won 43 games two seasons ago. Ball was an All-Star.

Ball is a good bet to jump back up in that point guard conversation. Big ball handlers who can shoot are the NBA's apex player type. You just don't find many humans who are 6-foot-7 with genius vision and dangerous 3-point shots.

To get there -- and for the Hornets to sniff .500 again -- Ball has to tighten up a casual looseness in his game. It's most noticeable on defense, where Ball is an audacious gambler -- lunging wayward for steals. Steve Clifford, Charlotte's coach, has favored conservatism -- slow on offense, low-risk on defense.

Player and coach insist they are adaptable. "Your job is to understand your team and play in a way that gives you the best chance," Clifford tells ESPN. Charlotte played at the league's ninth-fastest pace last season. "This team was put together to run," Clifford says. Ball is a voracious grab-and-go rebounder.

Ball found a better balance on defense, Clifford says. "Stealing the ball is a good thing. But there are guys that want to steal the ball all the time, and it absolutely destroys your defense. [Ball] is not like that. He wants to defend."

Ball is 22; stouter defense comes with experience. The looseness on offense was more confounding. For a passing savant, Ball became a little shot happy; he was the only rotation player leaguewide to jack more than 20 shots per 36 minutes while earning fewer than four free throws.

His pull-up and step-back 3s are weapons, and Ball has unteachable guile in opening space for those shots -- faking toward picks and then rejecting them, tipping defenders off-balance with liquidy hesitation dribbles and snappy crossovers. But too many high-wire 3s early in the shot clock can be demoralizing for teammates.

The low free throws reflect Ball's reluctant, scattershot paint game. His attempts from the restricted area have decreased every season. He is one of the worst guard finishers in the league -- 54% at the rim, a stunning number given his size.

Ball approaches the basket in a rush, sometimes overeager to get rid of the ball before even touching the paint. That is the paradox of Ball: Dishing it early can be healthy, but there is such a thing -- even for point guards -- of dishing it too early, too often. Ball chases shots when it might be best to keep the ball moving, and moves the ball when it might be best to keep searching.

Against dropback schemes, Ball short-circuits pick-and-rolls -- picking his dribble up 20 feet from the rim with runway ahead, lofting ultra-long floaters or kicking to shooters who aren't open because Ball hasn't sucked in the defense. (Against traps, Ball's willingness to make the first available pass is essential; he catapults his screeners into 4-on-3s. Ball and Gordon Hayward worked an effective two-man game in this style. The Ball-Terry Rozier pick-and-roll is an occasional wrinkle.)


You seldom see Ball slow down, pin defenders on his hip and wait for the defense to make a mistake. The Steve Nash under-the-rim dribble is not in his regular arsenal.

"Everyone talks about hitting the paint, but for most players, it's getting deep into the paint that puts maximum heat on defenses," Clifford says. "It really limits those floaters and hook shots that are hard for any player."

Miles Bridges -- a favorite Ball screener -- will be back after serving a suspension linked to his no-contest plea to a felony domestic violence charge. Mark Williams is a hyper-athletic lob-catcher with savvy pitter-pat footwork.

Ball has spent the offseason developing his prodding game, watching film with Clifford and Marlon Garnett, a key Hornets assistant, and running reps with staffers dotting the floor as targets -- in the corners, under the rim, rolling for pocket passes.

"If Coach wants me to keep [the ball] longer, I'll do it," Ball says. He has shown glimpses of it -- especially two seasons ago, when the Hornets were healthier:


The coaches are also pushing Ball to be more judicious attacking bigs on switches -- to try to get by them more instead of settling for step-back bombs.

Ball prefers freedom bordering on chaos. The NBA game at its highest level -- a level Ball has not really felt yet -- is not so accommodating. It can get slow, ugly, brutish. To win big, you have to win every style. A more diverse pick-and-roll game would steel Ball and the Hornets for those moments.