Pelicans Called Bulls

[nomorezorro]

i think one of the most curious details to me — and a reason that i'm still skeptical that the hawks offer was on the table to us or teams that picked before us — is the specific conditions on the pick being "the more favorable of the new orleans or milwaukee 2026 pick"

it is hard for me to believe the *starting point* for the pelicans was "hey, not only are we willing to trade an unprotected future first to you, but we'll let you have whichever one of our two first round picks is higher." this is pure speculation, but it feels way more normal that the pelicans would offer up the less favorable of those two picks, especially if protections were on the table.

or even if the pelicans wanted to offer up their most attractive draft asset to ensure the deal got done — is the unprotected pelicans pick not good enough on its own? did they really need to also create a contingency where the other team would get the bucks pick, just in case that one ended up higher?

again, i don't know what the truth is, but imo the conditions around the pick feel very strongly like the end point of a negotiation, not a starting offer.

[drosestruts]

The Dunc'd on pod talked about this in their recent Eastern Conference offseason grades pod and this part stood out to me:

The trade was offered to other teams, who did not take it. Some teams did other trades, or unclear with the Bulls if they understood what the pick was or if the Pels understood what pick(s) they were offering the Bulls or what it was, but the deal didn't get done, but Atlanta did get it done.

Which kind of left me curious what it is they possibly heard about this - cause it seems like there may have been some confusion reported between the Bulls and Pelicans when discussing the trade, and there is a shot clock on getting a deal done on draft night.

I know AK/ME are a usual punching bag - but is it possible Dumars was proposing a trade that perhaps wasn't clear or didn't make sense and the time simply ran out on getting it organized?

Following up with another snippet from this pod discussing this specific trade

however i really like Carter Bryant who was still on the baord and theoretically the Pelicans trade. The trade was presumably still on the board as Derick Queen was still there, which would have been a huge win for the Bulls.

So now it just seems like another pod assuming this trade was offered to the Bulls, without any confirmation that it was.

[dougthonus]

i think one of the most curious details to me — and a reason that i'm still skeptical that the hawks offer was on the table to us or teams that picked before us — is the specific conditions on the pick being "the more favorable of the new orleans or milwaukee 2026 pick"

it is hard for me to believe the *starting point* for the pelicans was "hey, not only are we willing to trade an unprotected future first to you, but we'll let you have whichever one of our two first round picks is higher." this is pure speculation, but it feels way more normal that the pelicans would offer up the less favorable of those two picks, especially if protections were on the table.

or even if the pelicans wanted to offer up their most attractive draft asset to ensure the deal got done — is the unprotected pelicans pick not good enough on its own? did they really need to also create a contingency where the other team would get the bucks pick, just in case that one ended up higher?

again, i don't know what the truth is, but imo the conditions around the pick feel very strongly like the end point of a negotiation, not a starting offer.

Not sure if you read the description of the Hawks negotiation from one of the reporters (I think the athletic but don't remember), but this was absolutely directly offered to them. They didn't negotiate at all. In fact, they were so blown away by the offer, they verified they understood the offer correctly and asked explicitly "are you sure this is what you are saying?!".

Maybe there was some huge seismic shift between the Bulls pick and the Hawks pick, but there's not really a lot of reason to think that IMO given Atlanta was immediately following us. That rationale would hole more value for the picks earlier where maybe NOP thought they were offering enough and they got progressively more desperate, but if they were desperate enough to offer this to Atlanta in the opening seconds, it feels really unlikely that we couldn't have gotten there if we tried.

[eierluke]

Imo, Krause>>>Garpax>>>>>>>AKME. Krause may have had the people skills of a feral cat, but he GM'd how I play fantasy. Aggressive, dopamine chasing, and fun as hell.

When was Krause any of those things? He was never that creative during the dynasty years and most everything he did from the 90s on failed.

?????

Krause picked up Tex Winter to run the triangle, exceptionally creative and forward thinking.
Krause drafted Pippen as a long-term guy.
Krause traded Oakley for Cartwright, which was a pretty aggressive and creative move at the time (fit with the triangle).
Krause picked Phil Jackson out of the CBA.
Krause traded for Rodman, a known head case figuring the Bulls could keep him in line between PJ/MJ.
Krause identified the right kind of PG to play with an MJ/Pip team in BJ/Pax/Kerr.

Then, while it flopped, Krause tanked and acquired cap space. He was hit by the loss of Jay Williams, but he was tanking before tanking was a thing.

As much as folks want to slam Krause for the ending of the dynasty and period afterwards, he was a pretty creative and forward thinking GM in building the dynasty.

[HomoSapien]

i think one of the most curious details to me — and a reason that i'm still skeptical that the hawks offer was on the table to us or teams that picked before us — is the specific conditions on the pick being "the more favorable of the new orleans or milwaukee 2026 pick"

it is hard for me to believe the *starting point* for the pelicans was "hey, not only are we willing to trade an unprotected future first to you, but we'll let you have whichever one of our two first round picks is higher." this is pure speculation, but it feels way more normal that the pelicans would offer up the less favorable of those two picks, especially if protections were on the table.

or even if the pelicans wanted to offer up their most attractive draft asset to ensure the deal got done — is the unprotected pelicans pick not good enough on its own? did they really need to also create a contingency where the other team would get the bucks pick, just in case that one ended up higher?

again, i don't know what the truth is, but imo the conditions around the pick feel very strongly like the end point of a negotiation, not a starting offer.

Not sure if you read the description of the Hawks negotiation from one of the reporters (I think the athletic but don't remember), but this was absolutely directly offered to them. They didn't negotiate at all. In fact, they were so blown away by the offer, they verified they understood the offer correctly and asked explicitly "are you sure this is what you are saying?!".

Maybe there was some huge seismic shift between the Bulls pick and the Hawks pick, but there's not really a lot of reason to think that IMO given Atlanta was immediately following us. That rationale would hole more value for the picks earlier where maybe NOP thought they were offering enough and they got progressively more desperate, but if they were desperate enough to offer this to Atlanta in the opening seconds, it feels really unlikely that we couldn't have gotten there if we tried.

This account refutes the notion that the Hawks were savvy enough to ask for an unprotected pick:

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