Tom Moore 2.0

Court_visioN · Post #1661 » by **Court_visioN** » Thu Sep 3, 2009 5:16 pm

i will agree with dedicated that Lou Williams is probably a better fit for the princeton offense than andre miller is. What I'm more skeptical about is whether or not that will ultimately make the Sixers a better team. Andre Miller brought a lot to the table...

Don · Post #1662 » by **Don** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 1:04 am

Well at least the Lou defenders have Eddie Jordan on their side. Obviously he feels Lou is ready to play the starting point. If he's wrong, it just means Jrue may be starting sooner than later. At least there's a backup plan. Only problem is that both have little to no experience, and for the little experience (Lou), little success as a point guard in the league. I'm skeptical, but not unaware of the possibility (not probability) that the pg platoon could be a success. All I know is that I better not be seeing Royale running the point for any significant periods, because that'll signal that it's time to focus my energies elsewhere than the Sixers.

Post #1663 » by **Sixerscan** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 1:27 am

I mean, he doesn't necessarily have Jordan on his side. Comcast wouldn't give them money to sign anyone so he's kind of stuck with the guy.

ankle420breaker · Post #1664 » by **ankle420breaker** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 2:18 am

I do recall Jordan inferring in his opening press conference that it would make things a lot easier for him if Miller stayed.

Dedicated_76ers_fan · Post #1665 » by **Dedicated_76ers_fan** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 12:15 pm

Lou can do it, kid's a baller. And his skills are up there with Miller's. Just not the resume.

ankle420breaker · Post #1666 » by **ankle420breaker** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 12:21 pm

Dedicated_76ers_fan wrote:Lou can do it, kid's a baller. And his skills are up there with Miller's. Just not the resume.

Uhh, Lou's skill set is such a far cry from Miller's its not even funny.

Dedicated_76ers_fan · Post #1667 » by **Dedicated_76ers_fan** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 12:25 pm

You highly overvalue Andre Miller.

Miller CANNOT play off the ball. Lou can.

Lou can play in a Motion Offense

Miller cannot

Everything is dictated around Andre Miller. He's a heavy isolation player. He's not a good point guard, he isn't what I wanted on this team.

Jrue on the other hand,looks like a stud.

ankle420breaker · Post #1668 » by **ankle420breaker** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 1:27 pm

When did Lou show he can play in a motion offense? You act as if he's already proven himself.

Sixercise · Post #1669 » by **Sixercise** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 2:05 pm

there's a reason why tom hardly posts here these dayz, folkz.

tmoore · Post #1670 » by **tmoore** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 3:12 pm

Not sure what to say ... I need to see Lou Williams do these things to believe it. Enough about Andre Miller and his supposed shortcomings already. He served the Sixers well but is gone. Time to move on.

sixerswillrule · Post #1671 » by **sixerswillrule** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 4:58 pm

Exactly. The past is the past. Leave it there, and look to the future...

sweetlou23 · Post #1672 » by **sweetlou23** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 6:23 pm

"Then explain to me why you are confident in the kid when he's never really played the point guard position full time to any kind of success.

And just to be clear that original line about Williams ruining Miller's assist numbers was a joke. (A joke with some basis in reality... but still a joke)"

I have confidence in Lou because in the limited time i have seen him play the point for the sixers, I have seen improvement in his point guard skills. He is able to get the ball to people in a position where they can score. He is also good at driving and kicking the ball out to open shooters. His stats as a point are better than his stats as a two according to 82games. now that he will be surrounded by brand iggy thad etc. i expect to see a big improvement in his assist numbers.

BobbyJones · Post #1673 » by **BobbyJones** » Fri Sep 4, 2009 8:53 pm

Dedicated_76ers_fan wrote:How can we tell he's succeeded or failed? There are some times where he looks like an excellent PG. The drive and kick game, which Miller does not have AT ALL. That in of itself will lead to dimes....

Lou can do it, kid's a baller. And his skills are up there with Miller's. Just not the resume.

Dedicated, you remind me of Carch back when he wanted to persuade everyone that Sam was the second coming of Bill Russell. Didn't matter what was posted to prove to the contrary, he kept coming back to argue that Sam was going to be great. He got the **** kicked out of him so often that we nicknamed him the Energizer Bunny. You know, takes a lickin', but keeps on tickin'. I think you have finally taken over his mantle as the most obstinate fighter of a losing cause. Wear that mantle with pride my son. It has taken Carch this long to shed it.

bebopdeluxe · Post #1674 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 3:03 am

We can sit here and talk confidently that the Sixers are going to be alright with a PG combo that has probably played a grand total of 1200 minutes of PG at the college AND NBA levels.

Or you can be a realist.

I choose to be a realist...and I have come to the conclusion that - from a financial perspective - the Sixers are f*cked for at least the next two seasons, which is the primary driver behind our current PG situation. It is why we chose not to work our azz off trying to move Miller at the deadline - we had no desire to take any meaningful contract back and we wanted the home playoff gates (followed by Miller's contract off the books). They had to know - at the trading deadline - that anything short of a 3-year deal was not bringing Miller back...and if they were not going to offer that, then why not use the rest of last season (while Brand was out) to play Williams at the point - he was the only guy you had signed for this season (and while you're at it, play Speights instead of Evans). They still might have gotten some playoff revenue...and they would be in a heckuva lot better position today to deal with a post-Miller Sixers roster (with Brand back in the lineup) than they will be this season.

And I don't want to hear the "well, getting Holliday changed everything" crap. Take out Jrue and put, say, Ty Lawson in his place. Would things be that different? Huh?

Look, I hope that this works out...I really do. But I have a feelign that there are going to be a LOT of times this season that I am going to be throwing something at the set (or better yet, just turning the TV off...how's that for your ad rates, Comcast?) because Stefanski badly mismanaged things.

(and I thought that Wharton grads were supposed to be smart)

Dedicated_76ers_fan · Post #1675 » by **Dedicated_76ers_fan** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 3:32 am

I would be sharing your same sentiment: If I didn't see anything out of Lou Williams that indicated a PG. We all saw that for a time in Late March-Early April. A very small sample size indeed, but he seemed to get it. And elevated his level of play.

Further more, Jrue has shown an NBA Ready game from what we've seen. It'll take years before he reaches his true potential, but he can definately be a servicable point. He has handles, good instincts and great bball IQ.

If Lou doesn't get it done, Jrue will. I love Jrue as a PG.

bebopdeluxe · Post #1676 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 4:28 am

You love Jrue based on WHAT?

Are you some kind of California high school basketball geek? Because that is the ONLY place where the guy has gotten "love" at PG in his VERY young career.

I mean...I am as much as a Sixers Kool-Aid drinker as there has been on this forum for most of my 7 years here, but your confidence in Jrue Holiday (as noble as it is) has no current grounding in reality. In a year or two, he may dev elop into a fine PG, but for the 2009-10 season, I am expecting some MAJOR growing pains at the PG position for the Sixers.

Anything other than that is based solely on hopes and prayers, IMO.

ankle420breaker · Post #1677 » by **ankle420breaker** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 5:25 am

Amen, Bebop.

corwin · Post #1678 » by **corwin** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 12:32 pm

We've all been over this argument before about the Lou/Jrue show. It is almost incomprehensible to me that that this team will go very far into the season without a veteran back-up PG. The roster is still at 12 & Primoz & probably Ivey are vet's minimum players (easy to trade or cut). Ed is leaving himself room to sign the last PG standing after free agency or to make a 2/1, 3/1, or 3/2 trade. Since they're well under the LT this season, they can take back a little more salary in a deal.

Dedicated_76ers_fan · Post #1679 » by **Dedicated_76ers_fan** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 1:59 pm

I love Jrue based on the fundamentals he's shown us. He's shown us that defensively his long arms allows him to get deflections and that he's a fundamentally sound defender.

And offensively, although he's raw he has alot of potential with that long body of his and those long arms.

He's raw, and he may very well make mistakes. But he has all of the stuff that it's gonna wow us. Or did you forget Thad in '07?

bebopdeluxe · Post #1680 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Sat Sep 5, 2009 3:36 pm

What - EXACTLY - has he shown us?

Based on a dysfunctional summer league team (thanks, AGAIN, for that wonderful forum to help develop our not-ready-for-prime-time-but he's-gonna-play-cause-we'**** PG, Comcast), he showed us JACK. Relative to what, say, Speights showed last summer, we have ZERO clue as to whether the guy can actually run the point for an NBA team. The only thing that we KNOW is that he seems to have a good defensive foundation...which is GREAT...but it won't mean SQUAT when it is time to SCORE THE BALL.

Dedicated, you are killing me. Look, I appreicate your optimism...I really do. I am happy that we got Jrue...I think he has the POTENTIAL to be a good NBA player - he has the same kind of raw, projectable skills that Thad and Speights have. But we are not talking about a wing player or a big...

We are talking about being an NBA point guard.

There is a LOT more involved in being an NBA point guard than just physical tools. The guy got what - maybe 200-250 minutes of PG experience in college? How the f*ck do you think he's gonna be ready to play at the NBA level this season - huh? By comparison, a guy like Lawson (the starting PG for the defending NCAA basketball champions) has WAY more experience and is much better prepared to transition his game to the next level.

When you combine this with the ridiculous lack of PG minutes that Lou Williams got last season (when Stefanski HAD to know that there was a reasonable likelihood that Miller would not be signed), the pathetic preparation and handling of the roster for the PG position for the 2009-10 Sixers season by Stefanski was reckless, inept and utterly inexcusable. We are going to pi$$ away a key year of Elton Brand's contract because 1) Comcast is/was too freaking cheap to use Miller's $$$ to either do a deadline trade (while he still had value) or sign a quality vet PG this summer, and 2) Stefanski and DiLeo did not have the foresight or cojones to play Williams more at the PG last season (either by trading Miller or simply reducing Miller's 37 minutes/game), so that we would be better prepared - with Brand back in the lineup - to go with Lou and a rookie PG this season.

It SUCKED AZZ while was happening this past spring and summer...and it STILL sucks azz now.