Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 4

[Book1Nation]

I'm on board with a Booker-Bradley back court.

I wouldn't give Bradley the max, but if we can get him for $15-16 million sign me up.

[lilfishi22]

Spoiler:

And I'm not necessarily at odds with you, but as I alluded, once Chriss/Bender become more consistent, we have PFs that shoot the 3 at a clip of 38% or higher; we have Booker that does as well; once we bring in a 3rd, be it Reed with Booker as the Combo, or some PG with Booker as the SG...whatever. That's 3 of 5 'shooters'. Using the 'traditional' model, most teams only have 2-3 3PT threats...some have 4...but it's certainly not a requirement.

Regarding his assists, he had 5 just 2 games ago...he had 4 back on 12/20...and is averaging 1.8 per game his past 10 games. Overall, his AP48 is 2.1. Porter's is 2.8. Wiggins is 2.3. Ariza is 2.2. Tobias Harris is 2.6. And Bojan Bogdanovich is 2.2. Not to mention Covington (2.8), Stan the Man (2.5), and MKG (2.2). So, rather than just looking at it in a vacuum against another stat of his, look at other starting SFs and their numbers, and you see the while Warren's number are less, we're talking, in many cases, just fractions less.

But the big piece here, is again, understanding that Warren is a different animal than any other SF out there; he's special in that regard. Rather than look at that as a problem that needs to be hidden, why not find a way to take advantage of the skillset so that we have a weapon that no one else has...an unconventional offense that will require extra attention to defend against.

But whatever, I'm not a coach, not a player...just a fan. What do I know? Maybe there's no way to make it work in it's current form...

My whole point is that TJ right now is a fine player but for us to take our game to the next level collectively, he needs to do more than just be an efficient 2PT scorer. We're going to struggle getting up to the upper echelon of the playoff brackets if our 2nd/3rd best scorer is a wing that can't shoot 3's or pass very well. It's just the way the NBA is today. You need to spread the floor for your star players to flourish and be most effective. If we want a great complementary scorer next to Booker, we need someone that can hit the 3 because Harden didn't become Harden and averaging double digit assists by playing next to guys who can't hit 3's. I want that complementary scorer to be Warren but he needs to have a reliable 3 ball if we are to be a contender.

Regarding the assists, the only 2 players who comes close to TJ in USG% is Wiggins and Harris. Neither guys are great passers but neither players a liability from the 3 either, in other words, they provide an outlet for passers. TJ doesn't pass much and he doesn't shoot the 3 ball. As I mentioned already, if we want TJ to be a 2nd option on a upper echelon playoff team, he needs to be able to pass and/or spread the floor for your #1 option.

And to say TJ is a 'different animal' means very little. He's different in that he's only very good at one thing. He's different in that he can't hit 3's like many of the top SF's. He's different in that he has a low assist rates compared to his high usage. I'm not saying he can't be on a good team but his weakness is very apparent already. When teams scout out team better and see what TJ can and can't do, it's going to be an issue for us.

Well, if his usage rate is so high, and we win more games this season as he gets better and is used more, then that seems to work out ok. My point is, there are a ton of players in the NBA with high USG%, with non-existent 3PT%. Yes, they might be PFs or Cs, but the point of the matter is, teams can win with 3, 3PT threats on the floor. PG-Booker-Bender or Chriss...why cannot they plus Warren and our Center be successful?

And Warren IS different in that he's a threat from anywhere within the arc; there are very few players who can present the type of threat that he can, and while it would be fantastic if he could shoot the 3, for some reason, he's got a mental block this year, or his shot mechanics have taken a nose-dive from his 2nd season in the league...IDK. Hopefully, the 'coaches' are addressing it somehow with him.

But the fact of the matter is, we have a 19.6/5.6 producer on the floor, who's #1 in ORB (3rd ORR) at his position (why? IDK, but contrary to popular belief, that is very helpful to get 2nd chance shots), he's tied for 6th in 2PT%...so without Bledsoe, yet WITH Warren's improvements, we are better than last year. Of course, Bender is better, and we have JJ, as well, who seems to be getting better each game, as well.

So, if we can be successful with this core, with just an added PG or Combo Guard or whatever the heck McD's plan is, with a Center NOT named Chandler as our starter, we'd probably be pretty darned good.

If it requires that we start JJ, because he's the better 3PT shooter, well, then I suggest McD trade Warren now, because put yourself in Warren's shoes for a minute. You are top 5 in the NBA in Scoring and PER, and THE top in ORB, and in the top 5-10 in other areas as well (2PT%, FGA, etc.). You've done everything you can toestablish yourself as the starting SF on the team, up to and including, taking a team-friendly contract extension. And in return, the Team drafts a guy at your position, then the next year, puts you on the bench in favor of a guy who can't shoot better than you in ANY regard, EXCEPT, 3PT, and not even that well.

Well, if I'm Warren and a Pro-Basketball player, I probably have a bit of an ego...and an attitude. And hey, I've just seen it happen over and over on this club; if i act like a whiny pain in the butt, I'll get traded to a team I want...cool. See ya!

Maybe it doesn't play out that way, but I see no reason to 'test those waters'. Keep him as the starter, and make him fit into our offense, because he's NOT the biggest roadblock to have to overcome. My god, the guy shoots 19.6 pts/gm, and provides 5.6 TRB. He's a positive contributor, and many teams would love to have him on their team over what they are trotting out there now as their starting SF.

And in the meantime, coaches, do what you can to fix his weaknesses, be it his assists, or his 3PT shot, and figure out away to make JJ happy by getting him bench minutes at the 2 and 3, so he gets his 30 MPG as well.

Yes but you're looking at the team now and it's not even a winning team now (for the record, we're still 16-26). I'm looking at us as an upper echelon team and as I've shown before, in the last 5 years, players with his level of USG% and and low AST%, the only ones who were on good teams were bigs. My whole argument is that you can't have a guy who has a #2 scorer level USG% that doesn't pass or hit 3's and still be a top team. How many top teams have their 2nd best player be a non-big that can't hit 3's or pass?

[bwgood77]

I am really on board with the Avery Bradley signing this summer. If we can pull that off, and get a guy like bamba in the draft (I’d be fine with moving another pick in order to go get him) then we are in a great position in my opinion. Point booker seems to be the way to go, and Avery is the type of defender we need next to him (plus he’s shooting 39% from 3.) if bender continues to grow I like that starting line up next year, plus we would have some expiring contracts to move in order to go get a big name next year.

Given the way we're shaping up, I think Bamba is starting to look like the best "fit." Obviously we'd have to trade up. I've said it before - I could see Memphis being down to trade one pick for a pile.

I don't agree with this, nor do any or many voting in the draft polls. Where exactly do you expect Memphis to finish in the standings in relation to us?

I don't think they'd trade out of like a top 5 pick. Maybe if they were at 6 and Bamba was there (and Bagley, Porter, Young, Doncic and Ayton were gone). I'll be pretty surprised if anyone trades out of the top 7 or so though.

[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

My whole point is that TJ right now is a fine player but for us to take our game to the next level collectively, he needs to do more than just be an efficient 2PT scorer. We're going to struggle getting up to the upper echelon of the playoff brackets if our 2nd/3rd best scorer is a wing that can't shoot 3's or pass very well. It's just the way the NBA is today. You need to spread the floor for your star players to flourish and be most effective. If we want a great complementary scorer next to Booker, we need someone that can hit the 3 because Harden didn't become Harden and averaging double digit assists by playing next to guys who can't hit 3's. I want that complementary scorer to be Warren but he needs to have a reliable 3 ball if we are to be a contender.

Regarding the assists, the only 2 players who comes close to TJ in USG% is Wiggins and Harris. Neither guys are great passers but neither players a liability from the 3 either, in other words, they provide an outlet for passers. TJ doesn't pass much and he doesn't shoot the 3 ball. As I mentioned already, if we want TJ to be a 2nd option on a upper echelon playoff team, he needs to be able to pass and/or spread the floor for your #1 option.

And to say TJ is a 'different animal' means very little. He's different in that he's only very good at one thing. He's different in that he can't hit 3's like many of the top SF's. He's different in that he has a low assist rates compared to his high usage. I'm not saying he can't be on a good team but his weakness is very apparent already. When teams scout out team better and see what TJ can and can't do, it's going to be an issue for us.

Well, if his usage rate is so high, and we win more games this season as he gets better and is used more, then that seems to work out ok. My point is, there are a ton of players in the NBA with high USG%, with non-existent 3PT%. Yes, they might be PFs or Cs, but the point of the matter is, teams can win with 3, 3PT threats on the floor. PG-Booker-Bender or Chriss...why cannot they plus Warren and our Center be successful?

And Warren IS different in that he's a threat from anywhere within the arc; there are very few players who can present the type of threat that he can, and while it would be fantastic if he could shoot the 3, for some reason, he's got a mental block this year, or his shot mechanics have taken a nose-dive from his 2nd season in the league...IDK. Hopefully, the 'coaches' are addressing it somehow with him.

But the fact of the matter is, we have a 19.6/5.6 producer on the floor, who's #1 in ORB (3rd ORR) at his position (why? IDK, but contrary to popular belief, that is very helpful to get 2nd chance shots), he's tied for 6th in 2PT%...so without Bledsoe, yet WITH Warren's improvements, we are better than last year. Of course, Bender is better, and we have JJ, as well, who seems to be getting better each game, as well.

So, if we can be successful with this core, with just an added PG or Combo Guard or whatever the heck McD's plan is, with a Center NOT named Chandler as our starter, we'd probably be pretty darned good.

If it requires that we start JJ, because he's the better 3PT shooter, well, then I suggest McD trade Warren now, because put yourself in Warren's shoes for a minute. You are top 5 in the NBA in Scoring and PER, and THE top in ORB, and in the top 5-10 in other areas as well (2PT%, FGA, etc.). You've done everything you can toestablish yourself as the starting SF on the team, up to and including, taking a team-friendly contract extension. And in return, the Team drafts a guy at your position, then the next year, puts you on the bench in favor of a guy who can't shoot better than you in ANY regard, EXCEPT, 3PT, and not even that well.

Well, if I'm Warren and a Pro-Basketball player, I probably have a bit of an ego...and an attitude. And hey, I've just seen it happen over and over on this club; if i act like a whiny pain in the butt, I'll get traded to a team I want...cool. See ya!

Maybe it doesn't play out that way, but I see no reason to 'test those waters'. Keep him as the starter, and make him fit into our offense, because he's NOT the biggest roadblock to have to overcome. My god, the guy shoots 19.6 pts/gm, and provides 5.6 TRB. He's a positive contributor, and many teams would love to have him on their team over what they are trotting out there now as their starting SF.

And in the meantime, coaches, do what you can to fix his weaknesses, be it his assists, or his 3PT shot, and figure out away to make JJ happy by getting him bench minutes at the 2 and 3, so he gets his 30 MPG as well.

Yes but you're looking at the team now and it's not even a winning team now (for the record, we're still 16-26). I'm looking at us as an upper echelon team and as I've shown before, in the last 5 years, players with his level of USG% and and low AST%, the only ones who were on good teams were bigs. My whole argument is that you can't have a guy who has a #2 scorer level USG% that doesn't pass or hit 3's and still be a top team. How many top teams have their 2nd best player be a non-big that can't hit 3's or pass?

Like I said earlier, no reason to consider trading Warren barring some great deal that comes along. If eventually he is our 4th or 5th best player, things will be looking up in Phoenix, because we have that talented of a scorer as our 4th or 5th best guy. I don't think it's necessary to always have some type of pecking order. I don't remember people saying "Nash is our #1, Amare #2, Joe Johnson #3, Marion # 4..." etc...

I just want a good group of players that play well together that lead to success.

[lilfishi22]

And I'm not necessarily at odds with you, but as I alluded, once Chriss/Bender become more consistent, we have PFs that shoot the 3 at a clip of 38% or higher; we have Booker that does as well; once we bring in a 3rd, be it Reed with Booker as the Combo, or some PG with Booker as the SG...whatever. That's 3 of 5 'shooters'. Using the 'traditional' model, most teams only have 2-3 3PT threats...some have 4...but it's certainly not a requirement.

Regarding his assists, he had 5 just 2 games ago...he had 4 back on 12/20...and is averaging 1.8 per game his past 10 games. Overall, his AP48 is 2.1. Porter's is 2.8. Wiggins is 2.3. Ariza is 2.2. Tobias Harris is 2.6. And Bojan Bogdanovich is 2.2. Not to mention Covington (2.8), Stan the Man (2.5), and MKG (2.2). So, rather than just looking at it in a vacuum against another stat of his, look at other starting SFs and their numbers, and you see the while Warren's number are less, we're talking, in many cases, just fractions less.

But the big piece here, is again, understanding that Warren is a different animal than any other SF out there; he's special in that regard. Rather than look at that as a problem that needs to be hidden, why not find a way to take advantage of the skillset so that we have a weapon that no one else has...an unconventional offense that will require extra attention to defend against.

But whatever, I'm not a coach, not a player...just a fan. What do I know? Maybe there's no way to make it work in it's current form...

My whole point is that TJ right now is a fine player but for us to take our game to the next level collectively, he needs to do more than just be an efficient 2PT scorer. We're going to struggle getting up to the upper echelon of the playoff brackets if our 2nd/3rd best scorer is a wing that can't shoot 3's or pass very well. It's just the way the NBA is today. You need to spread the floor for your star players to flourish and be most effective. If we want a great complementary scorer next to Booker, we need someone that can hit the 3 because Harden didn't become Harden and averaging double digit assists by playing next to guys who can't hit 3's. I want that complementary scorer to be Warren but he needs to have a reliable 3 ball if we are to be a contender.

Regarding the assists, the only 2 players who comes close to TJ in USG% is Wiggins and Harris. Neither guys are great passers but neither players a liability from the 3 either, in other words, they provide an outlet for passers. TJ doesn't pass much and he doesn't shoot the 3 ball. As I mentioned already, if we want TJ to be a 2nd option on a upper echelon playoff team, he needs to be able to pass and/or spread the floor for your #1 option.

And to say TJ is a 'different animal' means very little. He's different in that he's only very good at one thing. He's different in that he can't hit 3's like many of the top SF's. He's different in that he has a low assist rates compared to his high usage. I'm not saying he can't be on a good team but his weakness is very apparent already. When teams scout out team better and see what TJ can and can't do, it's going to be an issue for us.

Well, since I gave you 'my argument' opinion, I'm curious--no snarkiness, or attitude in this question at all--just pure curiosity. What do you think we should do during the off-season, presuming Warren does not start shooting the 3 better; I don't honestly think it's getting much better this season. Also presuming his assists hover around his current season average, as does his usage rate. Do think Warren would be amenable to a reduction in status, so long as maintains his minutes...say 28-30 per game or so? Or should McD shop him while he's 'hot' to a contender as a 6th-Manwho doesn't shoot 3s, or whatever he can market Warren as, in order to improve our pick status, obtain a pick, or package him with Monroe, maybe, and Dudley, for a young 'star in the making' and a bad contract?

I ask because if you do not see Warren as a 3rd piece on a contributor, and we want to contribute, that would mean we would 2 more contributors, and I don't think we can keep Warren, Chriss, JJ, and Bender and get two more contributors (assuming the other 3, since they are currently 'worse' than Warren, are not your idea of a contributor either? Maybe JJ improves, and one of Chriss and Bender to become the #2 and #3 guys..

I personally think we need a stud at PG, and then #s 2 & 3 can come from other positions. But maybe not? I guess I am just wondering what your ideas or ideal scenarios are to pair with Booker to become our 'Big 3', and, can Warren exist on this type of team in Phoenix if he isn't part of it (basically, he not being a starter...if we have a Big 3, and he's not one of the 3, yet he's a starter, then we have a Big 4 that no one recognizes as such, I guess, because he'll still be, at worst, an 18/5 guy).

We keep going as is but if a good deal comes along for us to get better, we should look into it even if it includes TJ. I don't think we're an upper echelon playoff team for a couple of seasons unless our young guys really start contributing consistently ala the Boston young'ins and another star comes along and we have an opportunity to nab this player. I'm trying to mentally put Warren on one of the top playoff teams and I can't see him better than a 3rd option at best with his weaknesses.

I'm not suggesting we trade him because we're not "there" yet and he could still develop consistency from the 3 and he could become a bit more of a playmaker (we've seen some flashes). But if an opportunity does present itself, I'd look into it. Before we get to the upper echelon, we need to be a playoff team and TJ should be fine until then.

[lilfishi22]

Spoiler:

Well, if his usage rate is so high, and we win more games this season as he gets better and is used more, then that seems to work out ok. My point is, there are a ton of players in the NBA with high USG%, with non-existent 3PT%. Yes, they might be PFs or Cs, but the point of the matter is, teams can win with 3, 3PT threats on the floor. PG-Booker-Bender or Chriss...why cannot they plus Warren and our Center be successful?

And Warren IS different in that he's a threat from anywhere within the arc; there are very few players who can present the type of threat that he can, and while it would be fantastic if he could shoot the 3, for some reason, he's got a mental block this year, or his shot mechanics have taken a nose-dive from his 2nd season in the league...IDK. Hopefully, the 'coaches' are addressing it somehow with him.

But the fact of the matter is, we have a 19.6/5.6 producer on the floor, who's #1 in ORB (3rd ORR) at his position (why? IDK, but contrary to popular belief, that is very helpful to get 2nd chance shots), he's tied for 6th in 2PT%...so without Bledsoe, yet WITH Warren's improvements, we are better than last year. Of course, Bender is better, and we have JJ, as well, who seems to be getting better each game, as well.

So, if we can be successful with this core, with just an added PG or Combo Guard or whatever the heck McD's plan is, with a Center NOT named Chandler as our starter, we'd probably be pretty darned good.

If it requires that we start JJ, because he's the better 3PT shooter, well, then I suggest McD trade Warren now, because put yourself in Warren's shoes for a minute. You are top 5 in the NBA in Scoring and PER, and THE top in ORB, and in the top 5-10 in other areas as well (2PT%, FGA, etc.). You've done everything you can toestablish yourself as the starting SF on the team, up to and including, taking a team-friendly contract extension. And in return, the Team drafts a guy at your position, then the next year, puts you on the bench in favor of a guy who can't shoot better than you in ANY regard, EXCEPT, 3PT, and not even that well.

Well, if I'm Warren and a Pro-Basketball player, I probably have a bit of an ego...and an attitude. And hey, I've just seen it happen over and over on this club; if i act like a whiny pain in the butt, I'll get traded to a team I want...cool. See ya!

Maybe it doesn't play out that way, but I see no reason to 'test those waters'. Keep him as the starter, and make him fit into our offense, because he's NOT the biggest roadblock to have to overcome. My god, the guy shoots 19.6 pts/gm, and provides 5.6 TRB. He's a positive contributor, and many teams would love to have him on their team over what they are trotting out there now as their starting SF.

And in the meantime, coaches, do what you can to fix his weaknesses, be it his assists, or his 3PT shot, and figure out away to make JJ happy by getting him bench minutes at the 2 and 3, so he gets his 30 MPG as well.

Yes but you're looking at the team now and it's not even a winning team now (for the record, we're still 16-26). I'm looking at us as an upper echelon team and as I've shown before, in the last 5 years, players with his level of USG% and and low AST%, the only ones who were on good teams were bigs. My whole argument is that you can't have a guy who has a #2 scorer level USG% that doesn't pass or hit 3's and still be a top team. How many top teams have their 2nd best player be a non-big that can't hit 3's or pass?

Like I said earlier, no reason to consider trading Warren barring some great deal that comes along. If eventually he is our 4th or 5th best player, things will be looking up in Phoenix, because we have that talented of a scorer as our 4th or 5th best guy. I don't think it's necessary to always have some type of pecking order. I don't remember people saying "Nash is our #1, Amare #2, Joe Johnson #3, Marion # 4..." etc...

I just want a good group of players that play well together that lead to success.

And I haven't suggested we need to trade Warren.

[NavLDO]

Read on Twitter

I would take a long look at Dragic if it became known he was available. Yes, I know when he requested a trade there were hurt feelings and pissed off people on all sides. However, time heals all wounds, and I am someone who is over the butt-hurt caused by his departure.

Would you guys return one of the Miami picks (plus filler) in a trade for Goran? Like they always say "the third time's the charm".
I honestly think he would be perfect next to Booker.

Please, no. This year is another Heat season where they are good despite Dragic, not 'thanks' to him.

'14-'15 -- 12-14 -- 16.6 / 5.3 / .502 / .329
'15-'16 -- 48-34 -- 14.1 / 5.8 / .477 / .312
'16-'17 -- 41-41 -- 20.3 / 5.8 / .475 / .405
'17-'18 -- 22-17 -- 16.7 / 4.8 / .432 / .362

So, when Dragic is good, the Heat are 'meh', when Dragic is 'meh' the Heat are good.

I know, very simplistic analysis, and impossible to correlate causality, but I don't care. The main reason why I don't want him...or Hill...or some others mentioned, is because we don't need 'old', mediocre PGs. That does nothing for us. Especially overpriced ones. If we are going to bring in an 'old' PG, I just as soon they go get a recently retired PG, pay him for a year, and be done with it. Or get a guy in his last year of his deal, like Devin Harris, Marcus Smart, Shabazz Napier, or Elfrid Payton. Then, at the end of the season, we'll see if they want to re-sign with us, or a different team. Anyway, just one of several options that are better than signing 30+ YO PGs to multi-year contracts.

Please, everyone, think. This gets brought up, seemingly, every 2-3 weeks for some reason. If we do this, we are then, stuck with paying Chandler + BK almost $28M next season PLUS this 'new' contract. Do we really want to tie up $40-45M, potentially $30M in just 'Combo Guards' that are not part of our Rebuild? To me, that's just a terrible idea.

[bwgood77]

And I haven't suggested we need to trade Warren.

I was just elaborating on your response.

[lilfishi22]

And I haven't suggested we need to trade Warren.

I was just elaborating on your response.

I'm just trying to put it out there to people who think I hate TJ or that I don't think he has value on this team. I don't. I don't want to trade him but I do see it as potentially something we need to do if we get to that #4 or #5 seed and we want to take it to that next level.

[lilfishi22]

I still like Dragic but for sure no backsies on those MIA picks

[TOO]

Read on Twitter

I would take a long look at Dragic if it became known he was available. Yes, I know when he requested a trade there were hurt feelings and pissed off people on all sides. However, time heals all wounds, and I am someone who is over the butt-hurt caused by his departure.

Would you guys return one of the Miami picks (plus filler) in a trade for Goran? Like they always say "the third time's the charm".
I honestly think he would be perfect next to Booker.

Please, no. This year is another Heat season where they are good despite Dragic, not 'thanks' to him.

'14-'15 -- 12-14 -- 16.6 / 5.3 / .502 / .329
'15-'16 -- 48-34 -- 14.1 / 5.8 / .477 / .312
'16-'17 -- 41-41 -- 20.3 / 5.8 / .475 / .405
'17-'18 -- 22-17 -- 16.7 / 4.8 / .432 / .362

So, when Dragic is good, the Heat are 'meh', when Dragic is 'meh' the Heat are good.

I know, very simplistic analysis, and impossible to correlate causality, but I don't care. The main reason why I don't want him...or Hill...or some others mentioned, is because we don't need 'old', mediocre PGs. That does nothing for us. Especially overpriced ones. If we are going to bring in an 'old' PG, I just as soon they go get a recently retired PG, pay him for a year, and be done with it. Or get a guy in his last year of his deal, like Devin Harris, Marcus Smart, Shabazz Napier, or Elfrid Payton. Then, at the end of the season, we'll see if they want to re-sign with us, or a different team. Anyway, just one of several options that are better than signing 30+ YO PGs to multi-year contracts.

Please, everyone, think. This gets brought up, seemingly, every 2-3 weeks for some reason. If we do this, we are then, stuck with paying Chandler + BK almost $28M next season PLUS this 'new' contract. Do we really want to tie up $40-45M, potentially $30M in just 'Combo Guards' that are not part of our Rebuild? To me, that's just a terrible idea.

Solid post.

I have zero interest in Dragic. Way over hyped by Suns fans. Like waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay over hyper.

[NavLDO]

looks like MCD whiffed on Jackson, he needs to not whiff on this years pick

I'm going to assume you've missed out on how terrible, or non-existent, 5 of the top 6 rookie selections are this year? Lonzo Ball is a PG that can't shoot...like, at all...like sub-.500 at the FT line-bad. The #1 Overall pick isn't playing at all. Isaac only got about 15 games of work before he went down. Fox is the best shooting PG of the top 6 picks, and his eFG is .433, and his FT% is ALSO stellar @ .684, Yet Ball has him beat from beyond the arc, shooting a compelling .305, and our boy, you ask, the one we whiffed on, as you say, has a higher Usage rate then all of them? He also is only .7 pts behind in scoring, per36, behind Tatum.

The point is, none of these guys are in line for ROY honors, but more importantly, is to keep in mind the word 'Rookie', and while some players come into the NBA a guns a-blazin', in most cases, they do not.

[LukasBMW]

You sure do like Myles Turner. You'd trade Bender, Jackson and 4 picks for Myles Turner?

He's a shot blocking big with post moves and a 3 point shot. Plus he plays with intensity. He'd be a serious problem at the 5 alongside of Chriss or Bender.

I'd trade one of Chriss/Bender + Jackson + picks for him in a heartbeat.

Miami, Miami, Bucks, and a top 5 protected Suns pick would be OK with me.

But I bet Indiana still says "NO" to that.

He shoots 33% from 3, isn't a particularly good rebounder and shoots less than 50% from the field. He is a pretty good shot blocker and I like him as a player but Bender is shooting far better from 3 this year and I think he could eventually be close to as good of a shot blocker and is probably a better perimeter defender.

But most of all, we may be able to get a C in the draft who has the potential to be better. I've always liked Myles Turner but that is a drastic overpay.

My dreams of finding our next great center in this draft have gone out the window with our recent winning streak.

Moving up on draft day would be too expensive.


I'd purpose something like this:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yauuo63x

LAC (Gets something for Jordan)
-Monroe
-Bucks 1st (via suns
-2 second rounders from the Suns

Indiana (Dumps contracts, get two picks, a young player with potential, and a legit center)
-Jordan
-Jackson
-Suns 2018 1st
-Miami 2018 1st

Phoenix (Gets their 5 of the future, takes on some salary)
-Myles Turner
-Al Jefferson
-Thad Young

So we lose Jackson, 3 1st rounders (Miami 18, Bucks 1st, Suns 18), and 2 seconds.

PG Knightmare/Ulis
SG Booker/Daniels/Reed
SF TJ/Thad
PF Chriss/Bender
C Myles/Len/Sauce

Chandler, Dudley, Jefferson all rot on the bench collecting golden parachute money. Then we make a run at a PG via trade or 2019 free agency when Dudley, Chandler, Jefferson all come off the books.

[MathiasPW]

And I haven't suggested we need to trade Warren.

I was just elaborating on your response.

I'm just trying to put it out there to people who think I hate TJ or that I don't think he has value on this team. I don't. I don't want to trade him but I do see it as potentially something we need to do if we get to that #4 or #5 seed and we want to take it to that next level.

Double negative! Hater!

[lilfishi22]

I was just elaborating on your response.

I'm just trying to put it out there to people who think I hate TJ or that I don't think he has value on this team. I don't. I don't want to trade him but I do see it as potentially something we need to do if we get to that #4 or #5 seed and we want to take it to that next level.

Double negative! Hater!

Just hatin' on them hater's

[bwgood77]

He's a shot blocking big with post moves and a 3 point shot. Plus he plays with intensity. He'd be a serious problem at the 5 alongside of Chriss or Bender.

I'd trade one of Chriss/Bender + Jackson + picks for him in a heartbeat.

Miami, Miami, Bucks, and a top 5 protected Suns pick would be OK with me.

But I bet Indiana still says "NO" to that.

He shoots 33% from 3, isn't a particularly good rebounder and shoots less than 50% from the field. He is a pretty good shot blocker and I like him as a player but Bender is shooting far better from 3 this year and I think he could eventually be close to as good of a shot blocker and is probably a better perimeter defender.

But most of all, we may be able to get a C in the draft who has the potential to be better. I've always liked Myles Turner but that is a drastic overpay.

My dreams of finding our next great center in this draft have gone out the window with our recent winning streak.

Moving up on draft day would be too expensive.


I'd purpose something like this:

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yauuo63x

LAC (Gets something for Jordan)
-Monroe
-Bucks 1st (via suns
-2 second rounders from the Suns

Indiana (Dumps contracts, get two picks, a young player with potential, and a legit center)
-Jordan
-Jackson
-Suns 2018 1st
-Miami 2018 1st

Phoenix (Gets their 5 of the future, takes on some salary)
-Myles Turner
-Al Jefferson
-Thad Young

So we lose Jackson, 3 1st rounders (Miami 18, Bucks 1st, Suns 18), and 2 seconds.

PG Knightmare/Ulis
SG Booker/Daniels/Reed
SF TJ/Thad
PF Chriss/Bender
C Myles/Len/Sauce

Chandler, Dudley, Jefferson all rot on the bench collecting golden parachute money. Then we make a run at a PG via trade or 2019 free agency when Dudley, Chandler, Jefferson all come off the books.

Now Myles Turner is worth DeAndre Jordan, Josh Jackson, a top 10 pick and another mid/early 20s first? That's way too much. I think Jaren Jackson can very potentially be as good or better than Turner and I think there is a decent chance we can get him.

[Son of Ra]

I'd either do:
A) Bucks 1st and Knight for Tyreke
This would be a good ROI *if* we could sign a max contract free agent a la Cousins and then after we're done with our off-season dealings (also add Lin?) sign Tyreke to a 4 year deal regardless our cap situation.
The year after we'll have cap space available again with Chandler/Dudley off the books while having Booker, Cousins, Evans, Lin, Warren, Bender etc all locked in.

A lineup of Lin-Booker-Evans-Bender-Cousins would be insane. 3 point shooting and passing from all 5 positions. All but Bender can create their own shot.
If we need more D play Booker-Evans-Jackson-Bender-Cousins.

B) Just offer Tyreke a monster 1 year deal in the off-season.

[RaisingArizona]

Gambo is right.

No he isn't. He is overreacting to a cupcake December schedule and career nights from two of our youngest players.

Might as well call this place RealDraft because that's all you guys talk about.

[darealjuice]

Gambo is right.

No he isn't. He is overreacting to a cupcake December schedule and career nights from two of our youngest players.

Might as well call this place RealDraft because that's all you guys talk about.

Or we can call it RealLyImpatient, because that's what acting like we should go all in on this team right now is

[RaisingArizona]

No he isn't. He is overreacting to a cupcake December schedule and career nights from two of our youngest players.

Might as well call this place RealDraft because that's all you guys talk about.

Or we can call it RealLyImpatient, because that's what acting like we should go all in on this team right now is

Or ReallyOverratingDraftPicks.