Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continues

[Blackification]

Imagine if Phoenix drafts the Harrison twins and trade Plumlee and both Lopezs.

Dragic/Harrison
Dragic/Harrison
Morris/Plumlee
Morris/Plumlee
Lopez/Lopez

Bring a new dimension to the court. Confusing opponents with similar looking players.

Forget the Lopez twins give me the Gasol Bros

[BurningHeart]

Now that things have worked out just fine, LeBron took to Instagram to congratulate both Bledsoe and Paul, while taking a shot at the critics at the same time.

“Congrats to my brother @ebled2!! Family stand for each other through the good and bad! I guess we still don’t know what we doing yet huh Rich!?! #StriveForGreatness #Klutch #RWTW”

[LukasBMW]

Lebon is a giant d-bag with an unbelievable ego.

Part of me is so glad we didn't get him.

I'd rather lose without him then win with him.

[BurningHeart]

Well, it looks like we got mini-LeBron in stature and performance as well as idiocy and attitude.

What a dumb **** thing. "Family stand for each other through the good and bad!" WHAT bad are you talking about? You mean the bad that was only bad because "ya boy" didn't bother coming to the **** negotiating table to get things done until his bitch ass was scared he'd get stuck with the qualifying offer?

Whatever bro, whatever motivates you and gives you that inferiority complex bro. Everyone's conspiring against you bro and you gotta prove them wrong bro.

What a horrible, DUMB mentality these Paul/LeBron/Bledsoe douchebags have.

[jredsaz]

Well, it looks like we got mini-LeBron in stature and performance as well as idiocy and attitude.

What a dumb **** thing. "Family stand for each other through the good and bad!" WHAT bad are you talking about? You mean the bad that was only bad because "ya boy" didn't bother coming to the **** negotiating table to get things done until his bitch ass was scared he'd get stuck with the qualifying offer?

Whatever bro, whatever motivates you and gives you that inferiority complex bro. Everyone's conspiring against you bro and you gotta prove them wrong bro.

What a horrible, DUMB mentality these Paul/LeBron/Bledsoe douchebags have.

You are one of the posters on Real GM that took this process personally. Let it go. The end result is good for both sides, no matter how the Bled/Paul camp portrays the contract.

[BurningHeart]

I don't care about the process so much as the attitude and inaccuracy involved, how it reflects his personality and mindset, how they try to paint the Phoenix Suns (much like when people try to demonize "evil" corporations or some ****) and how similar it is to many other people that I can't stand, that I feel are helping to ruin sports and other aspects of our society. These types of things get dismissed and dismissed and dismissed until one day one realizes that a wholly inaccurate narrative has taken hold and one that is completely unbreakable no matter what the facts truly are. Another example involving the Suns? "SSOL teams under D'Antoni never ever ever played defense." Reasonable, intelligent Suns fans are STILL trying to break down that one.

Sorry if he makes those traits clear as day, and sorry if I don't particularly enjoy having these types on my team. I will not "let it go." If you don't like it, you can put me on ignore. I can and will take examples that reflect why I feel the way I feel to show what I mean.

My opinions or feelings are not baseless and I am sick and tired of the notion that sports fans don't or shouldn't *actually* feel things or that any negative feelings toward a player or team are automatically to be dismissed as without merit. That's where that whole "hating on" garbage came from and it's really dumb.

Let his ass actually prove something before getting his Cleveland butt buddy to chime in on his behalf acting like he and their precious little clique had been wronged somehow.

[phrazbit]

The reason it seems baseless is because you're furious at Bledsoe for something LeBron said. You're just looking for reasons to hate him. This is like someone taking Dragic to task for his Slovenian coach saying Goran is going to leave next summer.

Get over it, he is back, he never said one thing during this entire process worth getting mad at him for.

[DirtyDez]

Screw Lebron for congratulating his friend. What a punk!

[BurningHeart]

The reason it seems baseless is because you're furious at Bledsoe for something LeBron said. You're just looking for reasons to hate him. This is like someone taking Dragic to task for his Slovenian coach saying Goran is going to leave next summer.

Get over it, he is back, he never said one thing during this entire process worth getting mad at him for.

Okay, that's your opinion. There are many people who share your opinion. You are not the arbiter of anything and it is not up to you to decide what's worth getting mad over and what's not worth getting mad over or what people are allowed to get mad at him for and what people aren't allowed to get mad at him for.

It simply isn't up to you. As much as you'd like it to be, it simply isn't up to you.

I have my opinion and many people share my opinion as well. And that's okay. And I'll continue showing examples that show what I mean so that people like you can ignore them (like me commenting about what Bledsoe posted on HIS Instagram, reflecting the same tone and attitude that LeBron did in his own Instagram, connecting them and presenting them as two examples of what I mean when I lob criticisms towards Bledsoe and his camp) and just go on saying that I'm "looking for reasons to hate him" and that my criticisms are "baseless." Again, if they were baseless, I'd be the only one holding those opinions. I'm not. I'm just the only one passionate enough to type like this. Surprise surprise, I'm BurningHeart, and this is the manner in which I express myself. You'd think people would be used to it by now. I guess not.

No no no....on the contrary, right now, I'm looking for reasons to love him. When my opinion of him and his camp keeps getting confirmed, I'm going to be even more boisterous about it. Don't like it? Go ahead and put me on ignore too.

[Zelaznyrules]

Imagine if Phoenix drafts the Harrison twins and trade Plumlee and both Lopezs.

Dragic/Harrison
Dragic/Harrison
Morris/Plumlee
Morris/Plumlee
Lopez/Lopez

Bring a new dimension to the court. Confusing opponents with similar looking players.

Forget the Lopez twins give me the Gasol Bros

Give me the Gasol brothers AND a time machine. Otherwise I'd probably take the Plumlee brothers but do without either of those sets.

[thamadkant]

Well, it looks like we got mini-LeBron in stature and performance as well as idiocy and attitude.

What a dumb **** thing. "Family stand for each other through the good and bad!" WHAT bad are you talking about? You mean the bad that was only bad because "ya boy" didn't bother coming to the **** negotiating table to get things done until his bitch ass was scared he'd get stuck with the qualifying offer?

Whatever bro, whatever motivates you and gives you that inferiority complex bro. Everyone's conspiring against you bro and you gotta prove them wrong bro.

What a horrible, DUMB mentality these Paul/LeBron/Bledsoe douchebags have.

Yet they live their lives without giving a single f&* what hateful fans think.

Seriously, Bledsoe and his agent played the "free agency" game as anyone in their shoes would.

Rich Paul is still to prove he isnt a talentless hack, but apart from that... they did what they did to play the free agency game.


Not once did Bledsoe diss the Suns...
Not once did Rich Paul and Lebron diss the Suns...
Not once did Bledsoe said he doesnt want to play in Phoenix...

Lebron calls Bledsoe his "brother", and wanted best for him. Put yourself in his shoes and I bet you, you would do what ever it takes to get the best contract.

Dragic will do the same thing... there's absolutely no way Dragic would play under his market value to be loyal to Phoenix. Same with any of those players...
Hence why Suns are getting Zoran.. to have a personal link with Dragic because 3-4 teams will offer him his market value.

Do you think Team FOs will be loyal to players when theirs an opportunity to get an advantage?



I absolutely hate the "new age" prima dona stars who conspire to team up in big cities... But I'd be lying if I said I wont be celebrating if those same stars would team up in Phoenix.

At the end of the day... I want the Suns to have the very best shot for their first championship... douche bag players or not. No one plays for good will.

[thamadkant]

Just messing around with some trades...

Suns / Thunder

Green + Morris + Morris + Ennis

For

Ibaka + Jones


Why for Thunder?
Adams is ready to grab that starting center spot and be the rim protector and interior defender.
They add depth and insurance for Reggie Jackson next season who would want 8-9 million by the sound of things, call it the "Bledsoe" effect.
They get Green to give them that instant offense and Morris brothers to stretch the defense and add more scoring punch from all around.

C: Adams / Perkins
PF: Morris / Morris / Collison
SF: Durant / Green / Morris
SG: Morrow / Lamb / Green
PG: Westbrook / Jackson / Ennis / Telfair

Deep team.



Why for Suns?
Fits like a glove.
C: Plumlee/Len
PF: Ibaka/Jones/Tolliver
SF: Tucker/Warren
SG: Dragic/Goodwin/Dragic
PG: Bledsoe/Thomas



Its an NBA2K type scenario, but Thunder may get desperate for depth to go all in for the playoffs and Adams has shown he could be a Noah-lite player with minutes.

[BurningHeart]

I absolutely hate the "new age" prima dona stars who conspire to team up in big cities... But I'd be lying if I said I wont be celebrating if those same stars would team up in Phoenix.

Then you would be a hypocrite. Plain and simple. You don't "absolutely hate" anything about that. The only thing you "absolutely hate" is that they haven't done it in Phoenix just yet.

And Dragic has already taken less than market value to play for us. Not only that, he took less than market value to come BACK to play for us. And the fact that he's said outright that he'll opt out and quickly resign here indicates that he'll get paid very fairly and is sure that they'll come to something reasonable for all parties. Usually that means a fair deal. And even if he gets FULL market value from us, he clearly won't be running through the process the way The Hype Machine went through theirs.

And there are plenty of players who play with good will----across all sports. I have no idea what you're talking about. Dirk turned down multiple max offers to re-sign in Dallas this offseason. Why? Because he's loyal. Because he's a good person. Because he's not a petulant, primadonna brat like so many of the other superstars in this league. He's grateful for what he has and it shows. Duncan has repeatedly taken less to stay where he is. Andrew McCutchen got locked up by the Pirates for an unbelievably cheap price and has won an MVP since. The best baseball player on the planet and the next face of the sport, Mike Trout, just extended for probably HALF of what he could have and would have gotten on the open market had he hit free agency. JJ Watt extended with the Texans like 3 years before he would have otherwise had to. Why? Obviously he feels like he belongs in Houston, doesn't want it all to be a distraction, and wants to go out there and do what he does best. He went in to work out at 4am the night he signed the extension, and in the first week of the season he went out there and proved it by having arguably his best game as a Houston Texan thus far. He didn't go on Instagram with hashtags and slogans and sayings conveying some false grievance or manufactured inferiority complex.

There are PLENTY of people in sports who act in good will, who act with respect and intelligence. Not everyone is like Kobe Bryant, who's sucking up all the money, refuses to restructure, and then bitches and whines about the team around him. Not everyone is that oblivious.

There is no joy in watching a team full of players you loathe win a championship. None. We watch these guys night-in, night-out for months at a time. It is entirely understandable that some would like to LIKE who they're rooting for. I am proud to root for guys like JJ Watt, Goran Dragic, and Freddie Freeman. They make sports way more likable. Way more. And I am very clearly not shy in calling out players on my favorite teams when they act in an unlikable fashion. Like Andre Johnson for example. I love Andre more than life itself, he's made countless sacrifices to remain a Houston Texan. In this last offseason he acted like a whiny brat. He wanted to collect a bonus even though the bonus was contingent on him attending organized team activities. He didn't attend because he was on his period and consequently, he didn't get his bonus. Well, he bitched and moaned about it and it became this whole ordeal. As soon as training camp rolled around, he shut up and came to work and is now the same old Andre. I was livid about it, especially because this is completely unlike the Andre Johnson I love. I was very glad that he came to his senses and that he got over the nonsense.

I am a Phoenix Suns, Atlanta Braves, Houston Texans, and Buffalo Sabres fan. I root for respectable, solid, stable organizations built on class, structure, and integrity. It's why I love them so much. I find a lot of myself in them, and I want the players on those teams to reflect those values because my teams are representative of myself and vice versa. It sickened me when the Suns had turmoil the last couple years before Hornacek and McDonough came in. The Braves current instability horrifies me because the entire success of the franchise is predicated on what happened with Bobby Cox and John Schuerholz so many years ago. The Sabres have been an embarrassment these last few years despite relatively new, respected ownership and it's been painful. The Houston Texans were fighting on the sidelines, had off-the-field problems, and had front office calamities last year and it was absolutely horrendous to live through. The complete antithesis to what I want out of my teams and players.

Maybe I'm too demanding. Maybe I expect too much. Frankly, I've been taught to expect a lot, because of what the franchises I've rooted for for years and years now have gotten me accustomed to. When they or the players on the team act contrary to that, it bothers me. Sports are entertainment to me but since I take them as a reflection of my choices and myself, I'd rather never see any of my teams win a championship than see them act like the detestable franchises and players that I see everywhere I turn.

[SunsFanSSOL]

Bledsoe only came back to Phoenix this week because Drake's concert last night and after party at the Pink Rhino . No lie, he apparently was there though along with Ennis, Larry Fitz and Johnny Football. Drake is team #Klutch of course.

[phrazbit]

First off, Dragic has never SIGNED with the Suns for below market value. When he signed with us 2 years ago there was no one offering more money. Yes, he is currently playing below market value (just like Bledsoe did last year) but that will change the moment he gets the opportunity to sign for more. The Suns will likely pay Dragic as much or more money than any other team could, and if they do not they will almost certainly lose him in free agency.

As for the examples of JJ Watt, McCutchen and Trout; those guys didn't just say "oh tack this onto the end of my current contract", that is not how it works in those sports. They took MASSIVE raises in the immediate rather that play for rookie contracts for several years. Yes, Trout could have gotten well over 200 million as a free agent, but he would not have become a free agent for another 4 years! Trout's deal was the largest EVER, by a huge margin, for a guy in his situation. McCutchen's deal came 3 years before he could have become a free agent. That was not a loyalty play by either of those guys, they cashed in, and they had every right to do so. JJ Watt's new contract made him the highest paid d-lineman in football... and you somehow interpret that as him doing the Texans a favor?! He went from making to make 6 million in 2015 to 21 million... with a 30 million signing bonus right off the bat. Basketball does not even allow for these types of situations!

This is what I mean by baseless non-sense. Comparing any NBA player to those situations is a false narrative.

As for comparing him to Dirk and Duncan, you're comparing a guy coming off his rookie deal to two guys have have already played on enormous max deals for over a decade. The Duncan comparison is especially funny because at the end of his rookie deal he reeeeally made the Spurs sweat as he was deep in negotiations to jump ship and play for the Magic, even Tim has admitted he was really close to signing with Orlando.

[SunsFanSSOL]

Read a tweet about Bledsoe that made me do some digging. Apparently his Junior year of high school his family was so poor they lived out of their car. Sort of explains why Bledsoe held out for more money during negotiations.

[King4Day]

Just messing around with some trades...

Suns / Thunder

Green + Morris + Morris + Ennis

For

Ibaka + Jones

I actually don't like it. Adding Ibaka gives us no offensive post game between the PF and C position.
I could see the Thunder being interested for sure though. That's a lot of depth they'd be adding.

[carey]

Just messing around with some trades...

Suns / Thunder

Green + Morris + Morris + Ennis

For

Ibaka + Jones

I actually don't like it. Adding Ibaka gives us no offensive post game between the PF and C position.
I could see the Thunder being interested for sure though. That's a lot of depth they'd be adding.

We'd instantly become one of the best defensive teams in the league. Bledsoe & Tucker on the perimeter with iBlocka and Plumlee inside? I'd throw in a pick to make it happen.

[dgwdum]

Just messing around with some trades...

Suns / Thunder

Green + Morris + Morris + Ennis

For

Ibaka + Jones


Why for Thunder?
Adams is ready to grab that starting center spot and be the rim protector and interior defender.
They add depth and insurance for Reggie Jackson next season who would want 8-9 million by the sound of things, call it the "Bledsoe" effect.
They get Green to give them that instant offense and Morris brothers to stretch the defense and add more scoring punch from all around.

C: Adams / Perkins
PF: Morris / Morris / Collison
SF: Durant / Green / Morris
SG: Morrow / Lamb / Green
PG: Westbrook / Jackson / Ennis / Telfair

Deep team.



Why for Suns?
Fits like a glove.
C: Plumlee/Len
PF: Ibaka/Jones/Tolliver
SF: Tucker/Warren
SG: Dragic/Goodwin/Dragic
PG: Bledsoe/Thomas



Its an NBA2K type scenario, but Thunder may get desperate for depth to go all in for the playoffs and Adams has shown he could be a Noah-lite player with minutes.

That's a bad trade for OKC. Ibaka is probably the most unique and irreplaceable pf in the game. Im not saying he is a great player but No one has his combination of defensive skills and ability to spread the floor from the pf position.

The only good player in this trade is kieff and he is probably only about an above average player, green has always been an inconsistent player, mcmorris isn't any good and ennis is unproven.

I think if okc put Ibaka on the block they could probably get a much better offers.

[bwgood77]

Dallas was the only team that pushed San Antonio to 7 games in the playoffs last season. They shuffled their team around this offseason and added Tyson Chandler and Chandler Parsons. I see them as a top 3 or 4 team in the West if they are healthy. I think the two biggest candidates for taking a step back are the Trailblazers and Rockets. I would rank the teams in the West the following way:

Spurs
Thunder
Clippers
Mavericks
Grizzlies
Warriors
Suns
Rockets

The Trailblazers may have made the second round of the playoffs, but they struggled mightily the second half of last year beating playoff teams. Then the Rockets lost Parsons which I think is a big blow to their team. They basically have Harden (who is amazing), Howard, and a bunch of role players. It is very difficult to win games relying on only two players. I do think it is very possible that there could be a Western team with 50 wins next season that misses the playoffs. If that happens, the league really has to think about adjusting the conferences. It is difficult to have a team like the Suns finishing 9th in West last year with the same record as the 3rd seed in the East.

I agree almost exactly with this. I think OKC would be #1 if they are healthy, and especially if they can finally add that third player to play in crunch minutes whether it takes them getting rid of Perkins or not.

I think because the Spurs came back and continued to defy odds in staying great, they are starting to get a bit of a free pass. And while they finished off great, I think they had such a drive after that devastating finals appearance that they could take a bit of a step back. Duncan is 38, and Nash, Kobe, Ray, Pierce, KG and most of the other players hitting those ages suddenly took steep drop offs. His is coming at some point.

I do think Kawhi can become a star, but once Duncan takes that step back, Splitter and Diaw won't cut it. Diaw isn't young either. Ginobili is about done too. I wouldn't be too surprised if they fell back to 4th or so, possibly 5th. I think a large percentage of people are discounting the Grizz too much too partially because they were the 7th seed last year, even though Gasol was injured, for a large chunk, and with him they had the best record in the league.

Dallas too, who barely got in and had big upgrades. I think Tyson Chandler will be rejuvenated under Carlisle and playing with Dirk as opposed to Melo. Nelson and possibly Felton too after being in kind of bad situations. Carlisle has a bit of that Hornacek in him (or maybe it's the other way around) in that they REALLY know how to maximize strengths of players and minimize weaknesses.

I wouldn't be too surprised if it was something like:

OKC
Memphis
Dallas
LAC
SA

slight separation

GS
Phx
Por
Hou

these four neck and neck throughout the season to get 50-54 wins

Pelicans seem to have great players, but have ANY of them ever won more than 45-50 games, other than maybe Ryan Anderson, and Asik as a backup? Is their coaching good enough? Can they stay healthy enough?

The positive thing about the above is that SA, Dallas and Memphis have key parts getting quite old, so they could fall off quite a bit in 2-3 years, and Howard seems to be breaking down a bit. Chris Paul was brittle most of his career before his LA years so it wouldn't shock me if he had a career like KJ and it ended prematurely, and GS's frontcourt blows.