The One And Only Offseason Thread 5: Dinnertime!

[SideSwipe]

People on this board are really over-valuing our players. Bledsoe holds some value, but not as much as people think. For all the same reasons why we want to trade him, other teams are reluctant on what they are willing to give. I mean seriously. SERIOUSLY! The Greek Freak? Really? Why the hell would the Bucks give up on that kind of young talent? Just to overpay a injury riddled PG that seems to have common sense issues. Thats crazy.

Also, Goodwin holds value pretty much with us and us alone. McD drafted him for a reason, but 28 other teams decided to pass on him. He has shown a few flashes of potential, but not enough for another team to give up a guy like Antetokounmpo.

While I don't discount there may be some overvaluing here...you are forgetting that you are also tremendously overvaluing "potential" When I look at Giannis, I think of other great potential guys with his skillset. Anthony Randolph, Jonathan Bender... For every Durant there are at least 10 others that don't live up to the hype. While the Greek Freak has shown some flashes, we've all been down this road before with many, many players. That is why proven guys are worth it. They remove risk from the equation. Giannis won't be good for 3 more seasons, probably. Even then, who knows what that ceiling is. He could just be Nicholas Batum, which is good, but nothing to say no to while he is developing into that. Batum may never be an All-star. People in MIL think that he is some sort of Savior. We'll all find out, but in my experience most of these guys turn out to be busts.

I always think back at the million trades that came in for Amare during his prime, how people weren't willing to give up Anthony Randolph or Jeff Green because they have so much potential. Where are those teams and players now? So many teams are focused on building a dynasty they never capitalize on the opportunity to take their franchise to places they have never been in the first place. They can't see the forest for the trees.

[Kerrsed]

Anyone have a stream for the Mercury game?

Check your PM's.

[SideSwipe]

Have y'all seen what Kieff and Marcus look like right now? They went hard this Summer.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/MookMorris2/status/505433568445595648[/tweet]

They look way more ripped than they did last year. They've never been out of shape, but they look like they have taken their workouts to the next level here.

[Safety Pickle]

People on this board are really over-valuing our players. Bledsoe holds some value, but not as much as people think. For all the same reasons why we want to trade him, other teams are reluctant on what they are willing to give. I mean seriously. SERIOUSLY! The Greek Freak? Really? Why the hell would the Bucks give up on that kind of young talent? Just to overpay a injury riddled PG that seems to have common sense issues. Thats crazy.

Also, Goodwin holds value pretty much with us and us alone. McD drafted him for a reason, but 28 other teams decided to pass on him. He has shown a few flashes of potential, but not enough for another team to give up a guy like Antetokounmpo.

Exactly. I doubt they would even do a Bledsoe/Giannis swap

[King4Day]

I've ignored the Bledsoe/Giannis ideas. Giannis could be a future all star. He and Parker are untouchable.
Our best hope is that Bledsoe gives in and re-signs with us.

[kingstyyyle]

Have y'all seen what Kieff and Marcus look like right now? They went hard this Summer.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/MookMorris2/status/505433568445595648[/tweet]

They look way more ripped than they did last year. They've never been out of shape, but they look like they have taken their workouts to the next level here.

Love it

[NoKneeBledsoe]

Then we are stuck paying $14M for him to ride the pine. Think Grant Hill in Orlando.

Look, i was/am a huge Bledsoe fan. I like his game and what he does on the court. Im a big fan of players that can play great on both sides of the court, but im not willing to jeopardize my franchise on hoping the kid will stay injury free and live up to his large contract. Thats what kills teams in the league.

So...$48/4 years is a good and fair contract and $56/4 years we will jeopardize our franchise???
Come on...that $2M more per year would be better to sign important players like Tolliver or Shavlik Randolph...
Seriously, Bledsoe is better than Lowry, Lawson, Holiday...etc...he deserves something around $65M/5 years or $56M/4 years and it would not be overpaying. We have to pay to have a good team, if not we will always have only prospects and cheap players that sometimes exceed expectations (like Tucker or Plumlee).
Every player can have an injury at any moment(think Paul George, healthy like very few players until last month) and he is only 24, so his health is not a big deal right now.

If we raise the offer and he says NO, then we will have made all the possible and this is it....but we need to try it at least.
Hopefully we will hear about an slightly better offer in the next few weeks.

I am going to grab my popcorn.


Please tell me why he deserves a Max? Please explain to me how a dude who has played half of two seasons injured with knee surgery and only started half a year?

Why is everyone throwing this money around and talks about giving into the max?


I hope he take QO and next year his best offer will be 10 mill if he can play a full season

If not he's looking at a 4 year 32mil

He will have thrown away 16 million!!!

[NoKneeBledsoe]

Also, how many people are over validating the Greek Freak on here????

Not just suns page but all real gm?

He played good in summer league wow!!!!

[drewsprocket]

WOw...The Morrii are bringing it. These guys really want to make it. I'm actually impressed. Marcus looks like he can play 4 too off the bench this year for real. Tolliver may not make it off the bench.

[blee732]

People on this board are really over-valuing our players. Bledsoe holds some value, but not as much as people think. For all the same reasons why we want to trade him, other teams are reluctant on what they are willing to give. I mean seriously. SERIOUSLY! The Greek Freak? Really? Why the hell would the Bucks give up on that kind of young talent? Just to overpay a injury riddled PG that seems to have common sense issues. Thats crazy.

While I don't discount there may be some overvaluing here...you are forgetting that you are also tremendously overvaluing "potential" When I look at Giannis, I think of other great potential guys with his skillset. Anthony Randolph, Jonathan Bender... For every Durant there are at least 10 others that don't live up to the hype. While the Greek Freak has shown some flashes, we've all been down this road before with many, many players. That is why proven guys are worth it. They remove risk from the equation. Giannis won't be good for 3 more seasons, probably. Even then, who knows what that ceiling is. He could just be Nicholas Batum, which is good, but nothing to say no to while he is developing into that. Batum may never be an All-star. People in MIL think that he is some sort of Savior. We'll all find out, but in my experience most of these guys turn out to be busts.

This is right, it's difficult for people to naturally factor in risk/uncertainty and the time it will take to develop. I think that's what's happening with the Greak Freak (and Archie too for that matter).

Also, very impressive digging into the memory banks and pulling out Bender Totally forgot about that guy. He actually bore some similarities to Giannis (not that I think Giannis is at risk of the same fate, just that Bender had great potential so it's sad he got derailed by injuries)

[NaturalBuns]

I think Giannis already has top 25 trade value.

I don't see him moving with his potential

[sunskerr]

Giannis's potential has ballooned his trade value enormously. In reality, he actually hasn't done much at all. Honestly with the way people talk about him, you'd think he is on par with Anthony Davis.

[AtheJ415]

Giannis's potential has ballooned his trade value enormously. In reality, he actually hasn't done much at all. Honestly with the way people talk about him, you'd think he is on par with Anthony Davis.

This. I'd honestly rather have Bledsoe. Giannis averaged 7 and 4 in 25 minutes a game. Yes, his frame is massive and he's a great athlete who is young and could become great one day, but Bledsoe's length is also freakish for his position and his athleticism is top 5 in the league regardless of position imo. Plenty of players with Giannis's potential have amounted to nothing in this league. The guy has real trade value, but Bledsoe is a potential all NBA player about to enter his prime. People think he's greedy so have soured on him a little bit, but you can't tell me Bledsoe doesn't have similar upside. As a pg with LAC I believe he lead all non-PF or C in blocks.

[Saberestar]

Then we are stuck paying $14M for him to ride the pine. Think Grant Hill in Orlando.

Look, i was/am a huge Bledsoe fan. I like his game and what he does on the court. Im a big fan of players that can play great on both sides of the court, but im not willing to jeopardize my franchise on hoping the kid will stay injury free and live up to his large contract. Thats what kills teams in the league.

So...$48/4 years is a good and fair contract and $56/4 years we will jeopardize our franchise???
Come on...that $2M more per year would be better to sign important players like Tolliver or Shavlik Randolph...
Seriously, Bledsoe is better than Lowry, Lawson, Holiday...etc...he deserves something around $65M/5 years or $56M/4 years and it would not be overpaying. We have to pay to have a good team, if not we will always have only prospects and cheap players that sometimes exceed expectations (like Tucker or Plumlee).
Every player can have an injury at any moment(think Paul George, healthy like very few players until last month) and he is only 24, so his health is not a big deal right now.

If we raise the offer and he says NO, then we will have made all the possible and this is it....but we need to try it at least.
Hopefully we will hear about an slightly better offer in the next few weeks.

I am going to grab my popcorn.


Please tell me why he deserves a Max? Please explain to me how a dude who has played half of two seasons injured with knee surgery and only started half a year?

Why is everyone throwing this money around and talks about giving into the max?


I hope he take QO and next year his best offer will be 10 mill if he can play a full season

If not he's looking at a 4 year 32mil

He will have thrown away 16 million!!!

I do not think he deserves a Max $84/5 years. I think he deserves $65M/5 years.

[Jdiddy701]

Imagine if Bledsoe and IT were Dragic's height. Bledsoe would be amazingly good.

Anyways good morning everyone.


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[batsmasher]

Slovenia are live in just under an hour and a half!!

Best of all, it's live on free-to-air telly over here in Aus.

[Flying Colors]

Have y'all seen what Kieff and Marcus look like right now? They went hard this Summer.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/MookMorris2/status/505433568445595648[/tweet]

thats the great thing about the Morris bros, those guys are total gym rats, every year they come into the season with more and more bulk

[Calvin Klein]

Anyone have a stream for the Mercury game?

Check your PM's.

what about world cup games? Dragic is playing now!

[jcsunsfan]

suns- OJ mayo, Antetokounmpo Giannia

Bucks- Eric Bledsoe s&t, Archie Goodwin.

Night, Bledsoe, Parker Is a young fun team to watch that the Bucks could roll with.

Suns get back the great freak and OJ mayo a combo guard. Still give us a great 2 deap. at the guard positions and the greak freak is a high potential player

You want Bledose and Goodwin? Okay. Give the Suns back Jabari Parker. Because other than him, there is not one player on the Bucks I would even trade Archie Goodwin alone for. Just because Bledsoe and the Suns are in a contract dispute does not mean they are going to throw him away for a borderline mediocre player like O.J. Mayo and a completely unproven shooting guard, let alone add in a 19 year old athletic freak shooting guard in Goodwin.

+1. Even taking out Archie that trade doesn't make much sense. Maybe Bledsoe for Giannis+Sanders feels better, might have to give up a lottery-protected pick too.

They aren't trading the Freak. I would take him for Bledsoe straight up.

[Zelaznyrules]

You want Bledose and Goodwin? Okay. Give the Suns back Jabari Parker. Because other than him, there is not one player on the Bucks I would even trade Archie Goodwin alone for. Just because Bledsoe and the Suns are in a contract dispute does not mean they are going to throw him away for a borderline mediocre player like O.J. Mayo and a completely unproven shooting guard, let alone add in a 19 year old athletic freak shooting guard in Goodwin.

+1. Even taking out Archie that trade doesn't make much sense. Maybe Bledsoe for Giannis+Sanders feels better, might have to give up a lottery-protected pick too.

They aren't trading the Freak. I would take him for Bledsoe straight up.

I might too but I wouldn't want to. Right now, Bledsoe is a much better player than the Freak and Eric still has untapped potential. Giannis is a marginal basketball player with incredible up-side. If neither player improves, Bledsoe will still be a star (assuming he plays) and Giannis will be a conversation piece with the occasional highlight. If they both hit their peak, Giannis, by virtue of his size, becomes the better player. Given where Milwaukee is right now, they can and should wait on that immense potential. I'm not sure that makes sense for us.