Trade Ideas thread

[KGdaBom]

I'm pretty sure we're not trading away Gorgui.

I think some people were wondering in some other thread which other player Thibodeau wanted Bulls to draft but then they didn't other than Draymond... The answer is Gorgui Dieng. Thibs loves him and wanted him over Tony Snell back in Chicago.

Granted, he loved Dunn and LaVine as well, but he was offered Jimmy Butler. Unless we get an offer that seems too good to be true, we're not trading Dieng. At least not just to clear cap space.

Fine then we trade him next year or the year after when he has less value, but he is getting traded if our guys re-up and we extend Towns. If we do it now we have some control over what we get in return. So if we don't trade him we are pretty stupid.

How about the novel idea of just keeping him because he is a good player.

[KGdaBom]

I heard Doogie mention 3 years $36 million on the radio on the way home from golfing....I'm pretty sure I heard him correctly....maybe I misheard him.

I have heard our remaining Cap space to be anywhere from 1 million to 4 million. If we are able to clear Aldrich that would make our absolute best offer possible to be 11 million per year. If I understand this right. I'm pretty sure we have less though. We have renounced every option we can renounce I think so we have no way to offer him 12 Million and more likely only 9 million unless we are going to trade Gorgui into somebodies cap space.

Read on Twitter

Please explain what Cole Zwicker is talking about. I already know far more about the cap than I ever wanted to know, but I'm not a capologist. Does this have something to do with stretching which is something I don't understand either.

Edit: Is this the thing where in a trade between certain $ amounts you can have a $5 million difference in what you are taking back from what you are sending?

[Ethomasp31]

I heard Doogie mention 3 years $36 million on the radio on the way home from golfing....I'm pretty sure I heard him correctly....maybe I misheard him.

I have heard our remaining Cap space to be anywhere from 1 million to 4 million. If we are able to clear Aldrich that would make our absolute best offer possible to be 11 million per year. If I understand this right. I'm pretty sure we have less though. We have renounced every option we can renounce I think so we have no way to offer him 12 Million and more likely only 9 million unless we are going to trade Gorgui into somebodies cap space.

Read on Twitter

There is a whole thread on Doogies Twitter page. Someone asked if we could sign Miles for $7-8 million a year and Doogie responded that Miles will get more than that. I'm not saying they should give Miles that much money....just saying what it would probably take to get him. I'm in agreement that Dieng to me seems like the odd man out. To have $35 million ride up in Gibson, Aldrich and Dieng next year is crazy....especially when you consider we don't have a back on wing on the roster and about $3 million in cap space. If we had the $21 million we have committed to Dieng and Aldrich available I'd feel a lot better about building our bench.

[SO_MONEY]

I'm pretty sure we're not trading away Gorgui.

I think some people were wondering in some other thread which other player Thibodeau wanted Bulls to draft but then they didn't other than Draymond... The answer is Gorgui Dieng. Thibs loves him and wanted him over Tony Snell back in Chicago.

Granted, he loved Dunn and LaVine as well, but he was offered Jimmy Butler. Unless we get an offer that seems too good to be true, we're not trading Dieng. At least not just to clear cap space.

Fine then we trade him next year or the year after when he has less value, but he is getting traded if our guys re-up and we extend Towns. If we do it now we have some control over what we get in return. So if we don't trade him we are pretty stupid.

How about the novel idea of just keeping him because he is a good player.

It is not going to happen. He is getting trade, now or later. Glen is going to try and avoid the LUX, not saying he is never going to go into it but, we will be right up against it nest year with Wiggins, I could see him traded then, if not then when we clearly go over it the following year with Towns assuming we keep the band together. Glen is not going to want to go into the LUx next year we will be close enough to avoid it and our clock for the repeater won't start. So if we don't trade Dieng who will it be? Who gets us under the LUX, the answer, we likely won't have a contract like that. Cole will save about $5mil if we still have him, but that might not be enough. Gorgui is the logical odd man out.

[KGdaBom]

I have heard our remaining Cap space to be anywhere from 1 million to 4 million. If we are able to clear Aldrich that would make our absolute best offer possible to be 11 million per year. If I understand this right. I'm pretty sure we have less though. We have renounced every option we can renounce I think so we have no way to offer him 12 Million and more likely only 9 million unless we are going to trade Gorgui into somebodies cap space.

Read on Twitter

There is a whole thread on Doogies Twitter page. Someone asked if we could sign Miles for $7-8 million a year and Doogie responded that Miles will get more than that. I'm not saying they should give Miles that much money....just saying what it would probably take to get him. I'm in agreement that Dieng to me seems like the odd man out. To have $35 million ride up in Gibson, Aldrich and Dieng next year is crazy....especially when you consider we don't have a back on wing on the roster and about $3 million in cap space. If we had the $21 million we have committed to Dieng and Aldrich available I'd feel a lot better about building our bench.

Something I once read came back in my brain. I think between certain $ amounts the incoming player can be getting $5 million more than the outgoing player.

[KGdaBom]

Fine then we trade him next year or the year after when he has less value, but he is getting traded if our guys re-up and we extend Towns. If we do it now we have some control over what we get in return. So if we don't trade him we are pretty stupid.

How about the novel idea of just keeping him because he is a good player.

It is not going to happen. He is getting trade, now or later. Glen is going to try and avoid the LUX, not saying he is never going to go into it but, we will be right up against it nest year with Wiggins, I could see him traded then, if not then when we clearly go over it the following year with Towns assuming we keep the band together. Glen is not going to want to go into the LUx next year we will be close enough to avoid it and our clock for the repeater won't start. So if we don't trade Dieng who will it be? Who gets us under the LUX, the answer, we likely won't have a contract like that. Cole will save about $5mil if we still have him, but that might not be enough. Gorgui is the logical odd man out.

I say pay the luxury tax like all successful teams do. Problem resolved.

[Ethomasp31]

I'm pretty sure we're not trading away Gorgui.

I think some people were wondering in some other thread which other player Thibodeau wanted Bulls to draft but then they didn't other than Draymond... The answer is Gorgui Dieng. Thibs loves him and wanted him over Tony Snell back in Chicago.

Granted, he loved Dunn and LaVine as well, but he was offered Jimmy Butler. Unless we get an offer that seems too good to be true, we're not trading Dieng. At least not just to clear cap space.

Fine then we trade him next year or the year after when he has less value, but he is getting traded if our guys re-up and we extend Towns. If we do it now we have some control over what we get in return. So if we don't trade him we are pretty stupid.

What could the Wolves get for Dieng?

[Ethomasp31]

I have heard our remaining Cap space to be anywhere from 1 million to 4 million. If we are able to clear Aldrich that would make our absolute best offer possible to be 11 million per year. If I understand this right. I'm pretty sure we have less though. We have renounced every option we can renounce I think so we have no way to offer him 12 Million and more likely only 9 million unless we are going to trade Gorgui into somebodies cap space.

Read on Twitter

Please explain what Cole Zwicker is talking about. I already know far more about the cap than I ever wanted to know, but I'm not a capologist. Does this have something to do with stretching which is something I don't understand either.

Edit: Is this the thing where in a trade between certain $ amounts you can have a $5 million difference in what you are taking back from what you are sending?

I don't know and understand it either....but it seems like we can take back more than we are trading out. Maybe we are trying to sign a guy before we make a trade like this so we don't use up all of our cap. I'm willing to see what the team looks like after we make all our moves. I'm just a little concerned with what is happening with the bench.

[SO_MONEY]

How about the novel idea of just keeping him because he is a good player.

It is not going to happen. He is getting trade, now or later. Glen is going to try and avoid the LUX, not saying he is never going to go into it but, we will be right up against it nest year with Wiggins, I could see him traded then, if not then when we clearly go over it the following year with Towns assuming we keep the band together. Glen is not going to want to go into the LUx next year we will be close enough to avoid it and our clock for the repeater won't start. So if we don't trade Dieng who will it be? Who gets us under the LUX, the answer, we likely won't have a contract like that. Cole will save about $5mil if we still have him, but that might not be enough. Gorgui is the logical odd man out.

I say pay the luxury tax like all successful teams do. Problem resolved.

Sure you do, but it will be avoided when it is logical to do it and it is logical to do it by the time we extend Wiggins. The repeater tax is bad news, delaying the running clock on that is just the smart thing to do, Post Towns extension, there just isn't going to be much to do to get under even if we traded Gorgui. So it is keep under the Lux and not start the repeter tax or lower our tax bill in year one or two respectively. But it is going to happen and Dieng is worth more now than he will ever be.

[Oriole8159]

How about the novel idea of just keeping him because he is a good player.

It is not going to happen. He is getting trade, now or later. Glen is going to try and avoid the LUX, not saying he is never going to go into it but, we will be right up against it nest year with Wiggins, I could see him traded then, if not then when we clearly go over it the following year with Towns assuming we keep the band together. Glen is not going to want to go into the LUx next year we will be close enough to avoid it and our clock for the repeater won't start. So if we don't trade Dieng who will it be? Who gets us under the LUX, the answer, we likely won't have a contract like that. Cole will save about $5mil if we still have him, but that might not be enough. Gorgui is the logical odd man out.

I say pay the luxury tax like all successful teams do. Problem resolved.

I have a very hard time believing that Thibs would have taken this job if Taylor didn't promise him that he would open up the checkbook.

Thibs was the hottest commodity on the market last summer and he could have any job he wanted, so it's incredibly naive to think he didn't interview Taylor just as much as Taylor interviewed him. I'm 100% sure that Thibs flat out told Taylor that he wouldn't go anywhere that had an owner holding him back, and Taylor isn't the type of guy to lie to someone's face about his intentions. Taylor needed Thibs probably more than Thibs needed our job, so I agree that going into the luxury tax is an expectation going forward.

We'll see how many years Taylor is comfortable doing it, but the previous poster is naive to think that Taylor won't go in at all.

[KGdaBom]

It is not going to happen. He is getting trade, now or later. Glen is going to try and avoid the LUX, not saying he is never going to go into it but, we will be right up against it nest year with Wiggins, I could see him traded then, if not then when we clearly go over it the following year with Towns assuming we keep the band together. Glen is not going to want to go into the LUx next year we will be close enough to avoid it and our clock for the repeater won't start. So if we don't trade Dieng who will it be? Who gets us under the LUX, the answer, we likely won't have a contract like that. Cole will save about $5mil if we still have him, but that might not be enough. Gorgui is the logical odd man out.

I say pay the luxury tax like all successful teams do. Problem resolved.

Sure you do, but it will be avoided when it is logical to do it and it is logical to do it by the time we extend Wiggins. The repeater tax is bad news, delaying the running clock on that is just the smart thing to do, Post Towns extension, there just isn't going to be much to do to get under even if we traded Gorgui. So it is keep under the Lux and not stop the repeter tax or lower our tax bill in year one or two respectively. But it is going to happen and Dieng is worth more now than he will ever be.

It's not my money. I'm fine with Glen spending it. Don't know if Glen is fine with spending it. but I hear that each playoff game a team makes about $5 million. Maybe that's just for home games. A successful team will make a lot more money by selling out during the regular season and the rights paid to broadcast that team.

[nba_addict]

[quote="SO_MONEY"][quote="KGdaBom"][quote="SO_MONEY"]

Blah.

First, it comes down to the fact you should not have paid Taj $14 million per, but that is done, this roster is not maximized by having Dieng, first he is the odd man out if there is an issue with the LUX, second if Taj is starting Dieng can be replaced by players like Dedmon and/or Udoh. There is a drop off, but it is not violent, and it would leave space for other players who will complement this team better. If Thibs is not looking to trade him he is a fool at this point. I like Deing, but the reality is the team would be better without him if we can move him, we can get players who better fit NOW and not put off the inevitable where he is traded for the ability to avoid the LUX at which point his value will be lower. Trading Dieng now no matter how you cut it is likely the best and most prudent move.[/quote]
Dieng IMO is without a doubt a better player than Gibson. Gibson can back up the more talented KAT and Dieng and get between 24-30 MPG. Nice front court rotation.[/quote]

So what? I think Dieng might be better than Taj too... That doesn't stop the fact that we made our decision with Taj, and that determined the fact Dieng is now movable. I spelled everything out for you, it is up to you to see that those are good points and to maximize value he needs to go. That or we have no real bench rolling into the season, nothing that will help us in the end anyways, or we overpay based on panic and give up a first for dumping a guy who might get a first if we just wait. This is chess not checkers.[/quote]

Thibs is building a continous contender team and not optimizing money for each starting and back up position. Before Noah, Asik and Gibson realized their potential how to anchor team defense they had Kurt Thomas on the side as veteran mentor to help them understand how Thibs system works (team communication, positioning and proper rotation). None of these are individual prowress.

If Dieng is not a long term piece based on thibs view he should have been long gone during the draft or Opening FA. i still think having Gibson on the team is more than just getting a starting caliber player or making Dieng expendable but accelerating the other pieces that Towns and Dieng needs to understand to elevate their team game.

Towns can put up MVP like stats but that will be empty stats until he realizes how to anchor and play team defense. Wolves is 27th in the leauge in defense last year despite having ideal pieces in Dieng and Towns. Until they learn how to anchor team oriented D they will not be able to realize their physical advantages.

[C-Dub47]

Celtics shopping Bradley and Crowder. Man I'd love to be able to get one of those two.

[jpatrick]

I take Bradley or Crowder over Miles in a heartbeat.

[big3_8_19_21]

With the Celtics shopping Bradley, Crowder and Smart I wonder if we could stretch Aldrich and absorb Crowder into cap space

[shrink]

Read on Twitter

Please explain what Cole Zwicker is talking about. I already know far more about the cap than I ever wanted to know, but I'm not a capologist. Does this have something to do with stretching which is something I don't understand either.

Edit: Is this the thing where in a trade between certain $ amounts you can have a $5 million difference in what you are taking back from what you are sending?

People who use the ESPN Trade Checker are led to believe that for teams over the cap to salary match, they need to be within 125%. That's not true, there are three different rules, for three different levels of outgoing salary.

$0 to $6,533,333 ----- 175% of the outgoing salary, plus $100,0005
$6,533,334 to $19.6 million -------The outgoing salary plus $5 million5
$19.6 million and up ------ 125% of the outgoing salary, plus $100,000

Cole makes $7.3, that would be our outgoing salary, so we can take back $12.3 mil.

[shrink]

Which reminds me, where are we on moss' list?

So find me a shooter, on a two year deal, who makes less than $12.3 mil next year?

Terrence Ross - $10,500,000 - $10,500,000 - 37% career from 3 on 4.5 attempts
Wilson Chandler - $12,016,854 $12,800,562 - would be hard to get, not a great shooter either.
Danny Green - $10,000,000 - $10,000,000 - 3 and D
Austin Rivers - $11,825,000 $12,650,000 - puke 37% from 3 on 4 attempts last year.
Al Farouq Aminu - $7,319,035 $6,957,105 - would be a dream, only 33% from 3 though.
Iman Shumpert - $10,337,079 $11,011,236 - only 34% for his career, good defender at least.
Garrett Temple - $8,000,000 $8,000,000 - 37% from 3
Jared Dudley - $10,000,000 $9,530,000 - almost 40% for his career
Lance Thomas - $6,655,325 $7,119,650 $7,583,975(unguaranteed, not sure how much) - shot 40 and 44% the last 2 years, solid role player.

not a real big list of guys that I found. Could probably get some of those in an Aldrich + OKC 1st deal if you needed to.

HartfordWhalers suggested Cole for Dudley straight up, which I like. This gives PHX $2.7 mil savings this year, gives them leverage over Len's next contract, and gets them $7.5 mil next year. We keep the OKC pick.

[TheProdigy]

With the Celtics shopping Bradley, Crowder and Smart I wonder if we could stretch Aldrich and absorb Crowder into cap space

Crowder would be the perfect pickup. It will take more than the 2018 OKC 1st to pry him away from Boston though. They will probably also ask for some combination of 2020 1st rd pick (with protection), 2nd rd picks, or Justin Patton.

[D1SGRUNTL3D]

Utah and Boston may do a sign and trade...which would suck

[C.lupus]

Which reminds me, where are we on moss' list?

So find me a shooter, on a two year deal, who makes less than $12.3 mil next year?

Terrence Ross - $10,500,000 - $10,500,000 - 37% career from 3 on 4.5 attempts
Wilson Chandler - $12,016,854 $12,800,562 - would be hard to get, not a great shooter either.
Danny Green - $10,000,000 - $10,000,000 - 3 and D
Austin Rivers - $11,825,000 $12,650,000 - puke 37% from 3 on 4 attempts last year.
Al Farouq Aminu - $7,319,035 $6,957,105 - would be a dream, only 33% from 3 though.
Iman Shumpert - $10,337,079 $11,011,236 - only 34% for his career, good defender at least.
Garrett Temple - $8,000,000 $8,000,000 - 37% from 3
Jared Dudley - $10,000,000 $9,530,000 - almost 40% for his career
Lance Thomas - $6,655,325 $7,119,650 $7,583,975(unguaranteed, not sure how much) - shot 40 and 44% the last 2 years, solid role player.

not a real big list of guys that I found. Could probably get some of those in an Aldrich + OKC 1st deal if you needed to.

HartfordWhalers suggested Cole for Dudley straight up, which I like. This gives PHX $2.7 mil savings this year, gives them leverage over Len's next contract, and gets them $7.5 mil next year. We keep the OKC pick.

I'd do that deal.