Official Trade Thread Part XLVII

[joshuacf]

Has there been a player who has been traded away twice, in consecutive seasons, by one team? I *think* the answer is "no", and for only that reason I would entertain trading Bagley. He has outplayed his contract, and is value to any team needing a C that he goes to. Of course, I would without hesitation, re-sign him in free agency...again.

As for Middleton... wouldnt it be better if we dont trade him and let his $33M contract expire? The free agency market could be good this year. Hartenstein, John Collins, Kuminga, Nurkic, Mitchell Robinson, Robert Williams, Ayton, many more.

Actually it would be better if we just buy out Middleton, which is what i expect to happen.

Agreed. Wouldn’t mind buying Khris out and seeing what Kadary Richmond or someone else from the G-League could do on the NBA roster

[nate33]

Has there been a player who has been traded away twice, in consecutive seasons, by one team? I *think* the answer is "no", and for only that reason I would entertain trading Bagley. He has outplayed his contract, and is value to any team needing a C that he goes to. Of course, I would without hesitation, re-sign him in free agency...again.

As for Middleton... wouldnt it be better if we dont trade him and let his $33M contract expire? The free agency market could be good this year. Hartenstein, John Collins, Kuminga, Nurkic, Mitchell Robinson, Robert Williams, Ayton, many more.

Actually it would be better if we just buy out Middleton, which is what i expect to happen.

Agreed. Wouldn’t mind buying Khris out and seeing what Kadary Richmond or someone else from the G-League could do on the NBA roster

We will probably buy out Middleton just before making a BOYD trade deadline move where we absorb someone's contract for a pick. We will need to free up a roster spot first, and Middleton is the guy to go.

[Frichuela]

Actually it would be better if we just buy out Middleton, which is what i expect to happen.

Agreed. Wouldn’t mind buying Khris out and seeing what Kadary Richmond or someone else from the G-League could do on the NBA roster

We will probably buy out Middleton just before making a BOYD trade deadline move where we absorb someone's contract for a pick. We will need to free up a roster spot first, and Middleton is the guy to go.

Makes sense. The Lonzo Ball absorption trade for SAS 2026 1st owned by Cleveland is an example (currently #27).

[nate33]

We need to trade Bagley ASAP so we can find out what we have in Vuk… no reason that Bagley should be playing 27 mpg and Vuk 8.

Absolutely. I said it a few days ago, but it's literally GM malpractice to keep Bagley on this roster. Somebody will trade a SRP and an expiring contract for this kind of production. We must capitalize on that while boosting our tanking chances.

No offense to Bagley. I really like the guy and I'd be very happy to resign him again this summer. But he is playing too well at the moment to not capitalize on him as an asset.

The trade a Boston fan and I agreed to on the trade board was Bagley and our Phoenix SRP (#51) to Boston for Tillman and their New Orleans SRP (#33).

[nate33]

Agreed. Wouldn’t mind buying Khris out and seeing what Kadary Richmond or someone else from the G-League could do on the NBA roster

We will probably buy out Middleton just before making a BOYD trade deadline move where we absorb someone's contract for a pick. We will need to free up a roster spot first, and Middleton is the guy to go.

Makes sense. The Lonzo Ball absorption trade for SAS 2026 1st owned by Cleveland is an example (currently #27).

Ball is the target I'd like to absorb because Cleveland is highly incentivized to unload him, but working out the compensation is difficult. Cleveland can't trade away that 2026 pick because their 2027 pick is encumbered. They can only swap. And as long as San Antonio is playing so well, there's very little value for us to swap up from our OKC pick (#30) to the San Antonio pick (#27).

[payitforward]

We need to trade Bagley ASAP so we can find out what we have in Vuk… no reason that Bagley should be playing 27 mpg and Vuk 8.

Absolutely. I said it a few days ago, but it's literally GM malpractice to keep Bagley on this roster. Somebody will trade a SRP and an expiring contract for this kind of production. We must capitalize on that while boosting our tanking chances.

No offense to Bagley. I really like the guy and I'd be very happy to resign him again this summer. But he is playing too well at the moment to not capitalize on him as an asset.

The trade a Boston fan and I agreed to on the trade board was Bagley and our Phoenix SRP (#51) to Boston for Tillman and their New Orleans SRP (#33).

Oh absolutely!

OTOH -- tho it's nice that you & the Boston fan came to terms on the trade board -- I'm not sure why Boston would do this unless they planned to sign Bagley to a longer term contract on the cheap. Which, to tell the truth, would be an even better move for our future than trading him.

As to the need to "find out what we have in Vuk," I think we've already done that. He's played just over 1000 minutes, & he has just plain NOT been good. There's a cost to anything you do, & I don't want to bear any more costs related to Vuk. Time to cut the cable.

[Frichuela]

We will probably buy out Middleton just before making a BOYD trade deadline move where we absorb someone's contract for a pick. We will need to free up a roster spot first, and Middleton is the guy to go.

Makes sense. The Lonzo Ball absorption trade for SAS 2026 1st owned by Cleveland is an example (currently #27).

Ball is the target I'd like to absorb because Cleveland is highly incentivized to unload him, but working out the compensation is difficult. Cleveland can't trade away that 2026 pick because their 2027 pick is encumbered. They can only swap. And as long as San Antonio is playing so well, there's very little value for us to swap up from our OKC pick (#30) to the San Antonio pick (#27).

I see. Maybe try to get Porter Jr too (and send them fodder instead, e.g, Branham). Porter Jr has a team option for next year, and he could give us guard depth behind Trae. He is having a low key great year, very solid defensively.

[nate33]

OTOH -- tho it's nice that you & the Boston fan came to terms on the trade board -- I'm not sure why Boston would do this unless they planned to sign Bagley to a longer term contract on the cheap. Which, to tell the truth, would be an even better move for our future than trading him.

The logic for Boston is that they currently lead the East in net rating and they plan on bringing back Tatum. Believe it or not, they are serious contenders this year. At the very least, they have a clear path the Finals.

Sacrificing a few spots in the 2nd round to significantly upgrade their backup center play could materially affect their shot at a title.

[nate33]

Makes sense. The Lonzo Ball absorption trade for SAS 2026 1st owned by Cleveland is an example (currently #27).

Ball is the target I'd like to absorb because Cleveland is highly incentivized to unload him, but working out the compensation is difficult. Cleveland can't trade away that 2026 pick because their 2027 pick is encumbered. They can only swap. And as long as San Antonio is playing so well, there's very little value for us to swap up from our OKC pick (#30) to the San Antonio pick (#27).

I see. Maybe try to get Porter Jr too (and send them fodder instead, e.g, Branham). Porter Jr has a team option for next year, and he could give us guard depth behind Trae. He is having a low key great year, very solid defensively.

Or maybe work out swap rights in future drafts in additions to the marginally useful 2026 swap. Like the right to swap our 2030 pick.

[payitforward]

Oh I agree! But, given their history of excellent talent evaluation, I could easily see them keeping him.

Given that we'd have no reason or inclination to keep Tillman, the only benefit is in the higher R2 pick. Which might suffice, to be sure, especially if we really like enough of the bigs in this draft to roll the dice on getting one of them w/ that higher R2 pick -- e.g. Nkongba, Diop, Condon, Faye, Ejiofor, Jefferson, Toppin, Morez Johnson, Bidunga, Ivisic 1 & 2, Chinyelu, Ruzic...

Danm! there's a lot of them! What a draft!

[nate33]

Oh I agree! But, given their history of excellent talent evaluation, I could easily see them keeping him.

Given that we'd have no reason or inclination to keep Tillman, the only benefit is in the higher R2 pick. Which might suffice, to be sure, especially if we really like enough of the bigs in this draft to roll the dice on getting one of them w/ that higher R2 pick -- e.g. Nkongba, Diop, Condon, Faye, Ejiofor, Jefferson, Toppin, Morez Johnson, Bidunga, Ivisic 1 & 2, Chinyelu, Ruzic...

Danm! there's a lot of them! What a draft!

We could also package that #33 with our second FRP to move up a bit more.

First we swap our #30 with a team like LA in a BOYD trade and move up to #22 or so. Then we package that #22 with our #33 to move up to #18 or so. That might be in the range to grab a guy like Acuff or Yaxel.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

We need to trade Bagley ASAP so we can find out what we have in Vuk… no reason that Bagley should be playing 27 mpg and Vuk 8.

Absolutely. I said it a few days ago, but it's literally GM malpractice to keep Bagley on this roster. Somebody will trade a SRP and an expiring contract for this kind of production. We must capitalize on that while boosting our tanking chances.

No offense to Bagley. I really like the guy and I'd be very happy to resign him again this summer. But he is playing too well at the moment to not capitalize on him as an asset.

The trade a Boston fan and I agreed to on the trade board was Bagley and our Phoenix SRP (#51) to Boston for Tillman and their New Orleans SRP (#33).

I would like to see that for Marvin Bagley.

The trade that sent Kristaps Porzingis to Boston turned into a win-win during their championship season. Marvin is playing well and can help Boston and their legit playoff chances.

For the Wizards, moving up in round two would be a strong move.

[joshuacf]

We need to trade Bagley ASAP so we can find out what we have in Vuk… no reason that Bagley should be playing 27 mpg and Vuk 8.

Absolutely. I said it a few days ago, but it's literally GM malpractice to keep Bagley on this roster. Somebody will trade a SRP and an expiring contract for this kind of production. We must capitalize on that while boosting our tanking chances.

No offense to Bagley. I really like the guy and I'd be very happy to resign him again this summer. But he is playing too well at the moment to not capitalize on him as an asset.

The trade a Boston fan and I agreed to on the trade board was Bagley and our Phoenix SRP (#51) to Boston for Tillman and their New Orleans SRP (#33).

Oh absolutely!

OTOH -- tho it's nice that you & the Boston fan came to terms on the trade board -- I'm not sure why Boston would do this unless they planned to sign Bagley to a longer term contract on the cheap. Which, to tell the truth, would be an even better move for our future than trading him.

As to the need to "find out what we have in Vuk," I think we've already done that. He's played just over 1000 minutes, & he has just plain NOT been good. There's a cost to anything you do, & I don't want to bear any more costs related to Vuk. Time to cut the cable.

He’s been fine. You’re just biased against him for some reason. Maybe you’re just hoping your original evaluation turns out to be true? Not sure.

[tontoz]

Vuk's scoring efficiency has been weak, he doesn't rebound much, turns it over a lot and doesn't defend well. Other than that, how was the play Mrs Lincoln?

[TGW]

Vuk is better than Carrington, yet people still defend Carrington for some strange reason.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Vuk is better than Carrington, yet people still defend Carrington for some strange reason.

The Wizards should send Bub to New Orleans to pair up with DQ.

[payitforward]

OTOH -- tho it's nice that you & the Boston fan came to terms on the trade board -- I'm not sure why Boston would do this unless they planned to sign Bagley to a longer term contract on the cheap. Which, to tell the truth, would be an even better move for our future than trading him.

The logic for Boston is that they currently lead the East in net rating and they plan on bringing back Tatum. Believe it or not, they are serious contenders this year. At the very least, they have a clear path the Finals.

Sacrificing a few spots in the 2nd round to significantly upgrade their backup center play could materially affect their shot at a title.

I don't disagree one bit!

In fact, if you can "significantly upgrade... backup center play" in a way that will "materially affect" you "shot at a title," with a 26-year-old guy you can sign long-term for not much more than the vet minimum, then you'd be nuts not to do it!

Which is to say that we should do this, to tell the truth. He & Champagnie could wind up being 2 of the biggest bargains in the league.

Now... it'd be nice to have a far better R2 pick this year: that's also true. But the value we are delivering is, all things considered, pretty high....

[payitforward]

Absolutely. I said it a few days ago, but it's literally GM malpractice to keep Bagley on this roster. Somebody will trade a SRP and an expiring contract for this kind of production. We must capitalize on that while boosting our tanking chances.

No offense to Bagley. I really like the guy and I'd be very happy to resign him again this summer. But he is playing too well at the moment to not capitalize on him as an asset.

The trade a Boston fan and I agreed to on the trade board was Bagley and our Phoenix SRP (#51) to Boston for Tillman and their New Orleans SRP (#33).

Oh absolutely!

OTOH -- tho it's nice that you & the Boston fan came to terms on the trade board -- I'm not sure why Boston would do this unless they planned to sign Bagley to a longer term contract on the cheap. Which, to tell the truth, would be an even better move for our future than trading him.

As to the need to "find out what we have in Vuk," I think we've already done that. He's played just over 1000 minutes, & he has just plain NOT been good. There's a cost to anything you do, & I don't want to bear any more costs related to Vuk. Time to cut the cable.

He’s been fine. You’re just biased against him for some reason. Maybe you’re just hoping your original evaluation turns out to be true? Not sure.

I didn't have an "original evaluation" of Tristan, & I have no reason whatever to be biased against him. & no he certainly has not "been fine." He's shooting a low percentage, turning the ball over a lot, & generally contributing nothing. This is his 3d year &, if anything, his worst.

Compare the two guys on this page -- per 36 minutes this season -- & tell me what you see & what it tells you:
https://www.sports-reference.com/stathead/basketball/versus-finder.cgi?player_id2=baglema01&year_min=2026&player_id1=vukcetr01&seasons_type=forall&request=1&utm_id=vukcetr01&utm_source=bbr&utm_medium=sr_xsite&utm_campaign=2023_01_wdgt_player_comparison

[nate33]

The one thing I'll say about Tristan is that these big Eastern European centers often peak later than the guys coming out of the American system. Guys like Marc Gasol, Jonas Valanciunas, Jokic, Porzingis, etc. all peaked in the 5th, 6th or 7th season, not their 3rd or 4th as is typical among the wiry rim-runner types in the Gafford/Davis/Tyson Chandler mold.

For that reason, I'd be open to keeping Tristan around a bit longer, but PIF is correct that he has not been a good player so far. He has shown flashes of impressive talent, but has been lacking in consistency and willingness to do the boring grunt work. I'd only offer him a vet minimum deal - preferably with the same terms we gave Champagnie (3-years but none of them guaranteed).

[payitforward]

Oh I agree! But, given their history of excellent talent evaluation, I could easily see them keeping him.

Given that we'd have no reason or inclination to keep Tillman, the only benefit is in the higher R2 pick. Which might suffice, to be sure, especially if we really like enough of the bigs in this draft to roll the dice on getting one of them w/ that higher R2 pick -- e.g. Nkongba, Diop, Condon, Faye, Ejiofor, Jefferson, Toppin, Morez Johnson, Bidunga, Ivisic 1 & 2, Chinyelu, Ruzic...

Danm! there's a lot of them! What a draft!

We could also package that #33 with our second FRP to move up a bit more.

First we swap our #30 with a team like LA in a BOYD trade and move up to #22 or so. Then we package that #22 with our #33 to move up to #18 or so. That might be in the range to grab a guy like Acuff or Yaxel.

Sounds good to me!