2019-2020 College/Draft thread (Part 3)

[RHODEY]

Knicks prob wont take Wiseman if given a chance which I think is dumb but I firmly believe that he will be 10x better than Mitch. No question about it. He's like Bosh but with an AD build. Yall gon learn. Lol

Bosh?

dude shot 48% from 3 in his only season in college

https://i.imgur.com/0OvsEzR.gifv

that is his career shot chart. You really believe wiseman will have that versatility with his shot?

Its unlikely but it could happen. Who would have thought Ewing would become one of the best jump shooting centers to ever play the game?

[RHODEY]

A PG finding saga. The looking for a Point Guard Saga (without a great investment - Big FA sign or great draft prospects).

2010/11: Felton is good but he is not a contender PG. Lets trade him to get Melo. Besides, we dont need a young PG. 34 years Billups can work. He still has some years ahead...

2011/2012: Billup is over. 32 years. Mike Bibby is the solution. Hmmm. Mike is no good anymore. The solution is 32 years old Baron Davis. He is still injured... Sucks; I Know the solution is the undrafted Jeremy Lee. Linsanity!! Lin is out. Baron Davis is back!. Crap! Another injury...

2012/13: Baron is over. Lin is too expensive. The solution are 39 years Jason Kid and Felton for the long run!! Felton is better than Lee. Yeah! 54 wins campaign. Hmm... Playoffs are boring...

2013/14: Jason Kid is over. Who would imagine that? But we have the incredible Felton. Oh No! He got fat. We always knew that he is not a contenders PG.

2014/2015: Felton is over. 33 years old Jose Calderon is the solution, a great pass first PG. Injuries!? We really have bad luck with 32+ years old PGs with huge injury historic who no team wants.

2015/2016: Calderon is not great to a contender team. He is not a scorer. Lets develop a PG trough the draft. This guy Jerian Grant is the solution (a still with the 19th pick). Some months later: Jerian is looking like a bust. Calderon was healthy. But is getting more old and he is not a scorer (who would figure that).

2016/2017: Calderon and Jerian are over. Derick Rose is the solution!! He is a scorer and still 28. He is perfect to play triangule for some obscure motive!!! He is getting better from his huge injury... I hope... Some months later: He is not the same guy he once were and he doesnt pass.

2017/2018: Rose is over. Frank is the solution. He has great defensive instincts and a great frame. Its easy to develop a ofensive game. To mentor him Ramon Session. Oh No, he is really bad. To mentor him 34 years Jarret Jack. We always got luck with vet PGs!! Somes months later: Frank looks very green. He may need much time to mature. We need insurance. Lets redraft some wronged busts. Mudlay and Burke can still be good players.

2018/2019: Jack is over. Lets try Mud, Burke and Frank. One of them is destined to be great. We dont need another PG in the draft. No Shai. Some months later: The trio is very bad... Lets trade for Dennis Jr.

2019/2020: Dennis Jr is the solution. We are stuck with Frank. Payton can be a mentor and a insurance because he is still 25 years old. Some months later: Dennis is a bust... Payton is not a contender PG. We dont know what Frank is.

2020/2021: Who will be out next solution?

this level of incompetence is hard to even put into words. you could take some kind of random decision generator or a magic 8 ball to make decisions for the team and still luck into a better outcome than the people running this team have done. It's almost impossible to be consistently wrong about everything and somehow they've done it

For real let’s draft Haliburton the best all around PG in the draft or Hayes who is a PG but needs some work. Reading this Cole Anthony isn’t going to make it in NY

Logic does not apply when it comes to the Knicks. Its like they make decisions based on Perceived value over true value. Branding over Brains.
It will be Cole, CP3 just you wait and see...

[mpharris36]

Knicks prob wont take Wiseman if given a chance which I think is dumb but I firmly believe that he will be 10x better than Mitch. No question about it. He's like Bosh but with an AD build. Yall gon learn. Lol

Bosh?

dude shot 48% from 3 in his only season in college

https://i.imgur.com/0OvsEzR.gifv

that is his career shot chart. You really believe wiseman will have that versatility with his shot?

Its unlikely but it could happen. Who would have thought Ewing would become one of the best jump shooting centers to ever play the game?

we comparing him to ewing now?

[WargamesX]

this level of incompetence is hard to even put into words. you could take some kind of random decision generator or a magic 8 ball to make decisions for the team and still luck into a better outcome than the people running this team have done. It's almost impossible to be consistently wrong about everything and somehow they've done it

For real let’s draft Haliburton the best all around PG in the draft or Hayes who is a PG but needs some work. Reading this Cole Anthony isn’t going to make it in NY

Logic does not apply when it comes to the Knicks. Its like they make decisions based on Perceived value over true value. Branding over Brains.
It will be Cole, CP3 just you wait and see...

I don’t know. Leon might not be like the prior people in charge. I don’t think he wants to make a splash to make a splash. He’s been media shy, Cole is such a risk. It’s early but he doesn’t seem to like unnecessary risks. Also the timing of the CP3 rumor still makes me thing Bagley was talking about Perry alone.

[Richard4444]

A PG finding saga. The looking for a Point Guard Saga (without a great investment - Big FA sign or great draft prospects).

2010/11: Felton is good but he is not a contender PG. Lets trade him to get Melo. Besides, we dont need a young PG. 34 years Billups can work. He still has some years ahead...

2011/2012: Billup is over. 32 years. Mike Bibby is the solution. Hmmm. Mike is no good anymore. The solution is 32 years old Baron Davis. He is still injured... Sucks; I Know the solution is the undrafted Jeremy Lee. Linsanity!! Lin is out. Baron Davis is back!. Crap! Another injury...

2012/13: Baron is over. Lin is too expensive. The solution are 39 years Jason Kid and Felton for the long run!! Felton is better than Lee. Yeah! 54 wins campaign. Hmm... Playoffs are boring...

2013/14: Jason Kid is over. Who would imagine that? But we have the incredible Felton. Oh No! He got fat. We always knew that he is not a contenders PG.

2014/2015: Felton is over. 33 years old Jose Calderon is the solution, a great pass first PG. Injuries!? We really have bad luck with 32+ years old PGs with huge injury historic who no team wants.

2015/2016: Calderon is not great to a contender team. He is not a scorer. Lets develop a PG trough the draft. This guy Jerian Grant is the solution (a still with the 19th pick). Some months later: Jerian is looking like a bust. Calderon was healthy. But is getting more old and he is not a scorer (who would figure that).

2016/2017: Calderon and Jerian are over. Derick Rose is the solution!! He is a scorer and still 28. He is perfect to play triangule for some obscure motive!!! He is getting better from his huge injury... I hope... Some months later: He is not the same guy he once were and he doesnt pass.

2017/2018: Rose is over. Frank is the solution. He has great defensive instincts and a great frame. Its easy to develop a ofensive game. To mentor him Ramon Session. Oh No, he is really bad. To mentor him 34 years Jarret Jack. We always got luck with vet PGs!! Somes months later: Frank looks very green. He may need much time to mature. We need insurance. Lets redraft some wronged busts. Mudlay and Burke can still be good players.

2018/2019: Jack is over. Lets try Mud, Burke and Frank. One of them is destined to be great. We dont need another PG in the draft. No Shai. Some months later: The trio is very bad... Lets trade for Dennis Jr.

2019/2020: Dennis Jr is the solution. We are stuck with Frank. Payton can be a mentor and a insurance because he is still 25 years old. Some months later: Dennis is a bust... Payton is not a contender PG. We dont know what Frank is.

2020/2021: Who will be out next solution?

In the last decade, we tried for most of time to get a point guard for bargain.

List of bargain former players:
a) Inexpensive former great Veterans: Billups, Bibby, Baron Davis, Jason Kid, Ramon Sessions, Jarret Barret, Derick Rose*
b) Average PGs on the market for a discounted price: Felton, Payton,
c) Unknown or bad reputation young point guards (redrafting or betting on second rouders/undrafted players): Lin, Baker, Mud, Burke, Dennis Smith.

*Rose was a bargain. He was struggling to recover from a serious injury and was traded for several limited players (Robin, Calderon and Jerian). We all know he had great potential.

Only 3 times we invested great assets in a Point guard.
I) Calderon: He had a expensive contract considering age and skill set. Bad signing.
II) Frank: 8th pick
III) Grant: 19th pick.

The 3 players were anacronic players, little aggressive, pass first PGs in a scoring point guard age.

[Gravy]

Too bad they moved the draft lottery back. It already feels like a super long wait each year because our season is usually over around January.

[robillionaire]

Too bad they moved the draft lottery back. It already feels like a super long wait each year because our season is usually over around January.

Our season has been over for years

[RHODEY]

Bosh?

dude shot 48% from 3 in his only season in college

https://i.imgur.com/0OvsEzR.gifv

that is his career shot chart. You really believe wiseman will have that versatility with his shot?

Its unlikely but it could happen. Who would have thought Ewing would become one of the best jump shooting centers to ever play the game?

we comparing him to ewing now?

Yeah I'm comparing him to Georgetown Ewing. Who later became top ten center Ewing. Im a big Mitch fan but I have to admit he realistically hasn't tried to expand his game.

I look at Wiseman and I see that tool set. Like Mitch he's got a great defensive baseline -although not quite Mitch level on the perimeter. But again that tool set...and then you c an see Wiseman WANTS to be more than a rim runner. As much as I love Mitch he seems to be content running the rim and taking only point blank shots.

Do I think he will become Ewing on offense? Unlikely, but he does have the rare tools required. Does he have the killer mindset and discipline necessary? The Motor? If so then maybe he's worth the swing for the fences. Because outside of Lamelo are there really any other "swing for the fences" options out there?

[RHODEY]

For real let’s draft Haliburton the best all around PG in the draft or Hayes who is a PG but needs some work. Reading this Cole Anthony isn’t going to make it in NY

Logic does not apply when it comes to the Knicks. Its like they make decisions based on Perceived value over true value. Branding over Brains.
It will be Cole, CP3 just you wait and see...

I don’t know. Leon might not be like the prior people in charge. I don’t think he wants to make a splash to make a splash. He’s been media shy, Cole is such a risk. It’s early but he doesn’t seem to like unnecessary risks. Also the timing of the CP3 rumor still makes me thing Bagley was talking about Perry alone.

Knicks don't see him that way. . They see Big School, NBA DAD, Fan approval, and he likes to put shots up. On top of that he's the type of "PG" Perry likes. Never mind the fact that he doesn't have good court vision.

I have not seen one article siting praise or Killian Hayes or Haliburton. All I see is Lamelo talk (which is fine) and the Cole Anthony "mercy" articles talking about how much he would love to play here.

[Gravy]

Too bad they moved the draft lottery back. It already feels like a super long wait each year because our season is usually over around January.

Our season has been over for years

Facts.

I still get that October-November hope tho!

[BLACKFEET 2010]

Its unlikely but it could happen. Who would have thought Ewing would become one of the best jump shooting centers to ever play the game?

we comparing him to ewing now?

Yeah Im comparing him to Georgetown Ewing. Who later because top ten center Ewing. Im a big Mitch fan but I have ot admit he realistically tried to expand his game.

I look at Wiseman and I see that tool set. Like Mitch he;s got a great defensive baseline -although not quite Mitch level on the perimeter. But again that tool set...and then you c an see Wiseman WANTS to be more than a rim runner. As much as I love Mtch he seems to be content running the rim and taking only point blank shots.

Do I think he will become Ewing on offense? Unlikely, but he does have the rare tools required. Does he have the killer mindset and discipline necessary? The Motor? If so then maybe he's worth the swing for the fences. Because outside of Lamelo are there really any other "swing for the fences" options out there?

There’s absolutely nothing off base in your (Ewing) comparison.

[WargamesX]

Logic does not apply when it comes to the Knicks. Its like they make decisions based on Perceived value over true value. Branding over Brains.
It will be Cole, CP3 just you wait and see...

I don’t know. Leon might not be like the prior people in charge. I don’t think he wants to make a splash to make a splash. He’s been media shy, Cole is such a risk. It’s early but he doesn’t seem to like unnecessary risks. Also the timing of the CP3 rumor still makes me thing Bagley was talking about Perry alone.

Knicks don't see him that way. . They see Big School, NBA DAD, Fan approval, and he likes to put shots up. On top of that he's the type of "PG" Perry likes. Never mind the fact that he doesn't have good court vision.

I have not seen one article siting praise or Killian Hayes or Haliburton. All I see is Lamelo talk (which is fine) and the Cole Anthony "mercy" articles talking about how much he would love to play here.

https://nypost.com/2020/03/19/the-point-guard-who-could-be-knicks-safest-nba-draft-option/

https://nypost.com/2020/03/22/hidden-point-guard-gem-killian-hayes-may-be-answer-for-knicks/

Both are Berman articles, but to be honest I haven't seen an article yet that says who the knicks like post Mills. Also the entire "we need a scoring guard" narrative started under Mills/Perry, same with the CP3 rumors. Mills was the one who tried to trade for D Lo, Rozier, Malik Monk, and was holding up the clippers trade because he wanted Landry Shamet. He thought that a scoring PG would fix things. Also side note a CP3 trade makes a lot more sense if the knicks were planning to Keep Morris longterm, it also comes off as desperate to keep your job too.

There weren't any early articles for any of our picks either besides RJ and that was because we went 3rd in the three man draft. KP was about a week out, Knox, Frank, and Shump were a few days before, Mitch. Rose just hired Aller, and kept Perry. we don't know if that new brain trust is as fixated on scoring from the PG position as Mills.

Especially scorers who'll need work, and they can't be brought in to do workouts or a combine.

Cole got that "This is the guys name we chant when we pick someone else" vibe.

[Richard4444]

The Mitch contract situation concerns me. We need to give him an extension in beginning of his third year. If we dont, he will be an UFA in 2022 and lose the control about his future. But he will demand get paid to sigh a extension. I think we will be forced to overpay him. If we do, I hope we dont need cap space beyond 2022.

But Wiseman is not an easy solution.

Getting 2 centers is a bad move. Center is the position with less value in todays NBA. Few players get Max like Jokic and Embiid. Good centers like Capela, Nurkic and Myles have medium salaries.

We can trade Mitch for a another lottery pick and use ours to draft Wiseman. Its a really risky move trading a player who is playing great (although with some issues) to get a player who barely played in College.

[RHODEY]

we comparing him to ewing now?

Yeah Im comparing him to Georgetown Ewing. Who later because top ten center Ewing. Im a big Mitch fan but I have ot admit he realistically tried to expand his game.

I look at Wiseman and I see that tool set. Like Mitch he;s got a great defensive baseline -although not quite Mitch level on the perimeter. But again that tool set...and then you c an see Wiseman WANTS to be more than a rim runner. As much as I love Mtch he seems to be content running the rim and taking only point blank shots.

Do I think he will become Ewing on offense? Unlikely, but he does have the rare tools required. Does he have the killer mindset and discipline necessary? The Motor? If so then maybe he's worth the swing for the fences. Because outside of Lamelo are there really any other "swing for the fences" options out there?

There’s absolutely nothing off base in your (Ewing) comparison.

The Comparison (to George town Ewing) is a strong defensive center with offensive aptitude. Whether he can manifest his offensive aptitude is the question, but yeah I think he has it.

[WargamesX]

The Mitch contract situation concerns me. We need to give him an extension in beginning of his third year. If we dont, he will be an UFA in 2022. But he will demand get paid. I think we will be forced to overpay him. If we do, I hope we dont need cap space beyond 2022.

But Wiseman is not a easy solution.

Getting 2 centers is a bad move. Center is the position with less value in todays NBA. Few players get Max like Jokic and Embiid. Good players like Capela, Nurkic and Myles have medium salaries.

We can trade Mitch for a another lottery pick and use ours to draft Wiseman. Its a really risky move trading a player who is playing great (although with some issues) to get a player who barely played in College.

Funny story.... if the Warrior got number one. I could see them trading it for Mitch with the quickness. His defense perimeter defense means they could play him heavy minutes.

[RHODEY]

I don’t know. Leon might not be like the prior people in charge. I don’t think he wants to make a splash to make a splash. He’s been media shy, Cole is such a risk. It’s early but he doesn’t seem to like unnecessary risks. Also the timing of the CP3 rumor still makes me thing Bagley was talking about Perry alone.

Knicks don't see him that way. . They see Big School, NBA DAD, Fan approval, and he likes to put shots up. On top of that he's the type of "PG" Perry likes. Never mind the fact that he doesn't have good court vision.

I have not seen one article siting praise or Killian Hayes or Haliburton. All I see is Lamelo talk (which is fine) and the Cole Anthony "mercy" articles talking about how much he would love to play here.

https://nypost.com/2020/03/19/the-point-guard-who-could-be-knicks-safest-nba-draft-option/

https://nypost.com/2020/03/22/hidden-point-guard-gem-killian-hayes-may-be-answer-for-knicks/

Both are Berman articles, but to be honest I haven't seen an article yet that says who the knicks like post Mills. Also the entire "we need a scoring guard" narrative started under Mills/Perry, same with the CP3 rumors. Mills was the one who tried to trade for D Lo, Rozier, Malik Monk, and was holding up the clippers trade because he wanted Landry Shamet. He thought that a scoring PG would fix things. Also side note a CP3 makes a lot more sense if the knicks were planning to Keep Morris longterm, it also comes off as desperate to keep your job too.

There weren't any early articles for any of our picks either besides RJ and that was because we went 3rd in the three man draft. KP was about a week out, Knox, Frank, and Shump were a few days before, Mitch. Rose just hired Aller, and kept Perry. we don't know if that new brain trust is as fixated on scoring from the PG position as Mills.

Especially scorers who'll need work, and they can't be brought in to do workouts or a combine.

Cole got that "This is the guys name we chant when we pick someone else" vibe.

Yeah meant articles stating the Knick brass like Hayes or Hali.

The "we need a scoring" narrative lives as long a Perry is here IMO. Perry likes those types of players. "scoring" guards. Doesn't matter if they are of the empty stats variety. But yeah no word on who the Knicks like. But IMO the knicks will like who Perry likes.

[WargamesX]

Knicks don't see him that way. . They see Big School, NBA DAD, Fan approval, and he likes to put shots up. On top of that he's the type of "PG" Perry likes. Never mind the fact that he doesn't have good court vision.

I have not seen one article siting praise or Killian Hayes or Haliburton. All I see is Lamelo talk (which is fine) and the Cole Anthony "mercy" articles talking about how much he would love to play here.

https://nypost.com/2020/03/19/the-point-guard-who-could-be-knicks-safest-nba-draft-option/

https://nypost.com/2020/03/22/hidden-point-guard-gem-killian-hayes-may-be-answer-for-knicks/

Both are Berman articles, but to be honest I haven't seen an article yet that says who the knicks like post Mills. Also the entire "we need a scoring guard" narrative started under Mills/Perry, same with the CP3 rumors. Mills was the one who tried to trade for D Lo, Rozier, Malik Monk, and was holding up the clippers trade because he wanted Landry Shamet. He thought that a scoring PG would fix things. Also side note a CP3 makes a lot more sense if the knicks were planning to Keep Morris longterm, it also comes off as desperate to keep your job too.

There weren't any early articles for any of our picks either besides RJ and that was because we went 3rd in the three man draft. KP was about a week out, Knox, Frank, and Shump were a few days before, Mitch. Rose just hired Aller, and kept Perry. we don't know if that new brain trust is as fixated on scoring from the PG position as Mills.

Especially scorers who'll need work, and they can't be brought in to do workouts or a combine.

Cole got that "This is the guys name we chant when we pick someone else" vibe.

The "we need a scoring" narrative lives as long a Perry is here IMO. Perry likes those types of players. "scoring" guards. Doeskin matter if they are of the empty stats variety. But yeah no word on who the Knicks like. But IMO the knicks will like who Perry likes.

Yeah but he isn’t the only one making those decisions. Leon makes the decision, and Aller is going to have a big say, and I have a feeling Thibs might have a say too....

You might be right we continue to follow Perry, but I would say if they had confidence like that in Perry’s decision they wouldn’t have extended him 1 year. They would have re-signed him to a few more years.

[RHODEY]

https://nypost.com/2020/03/19/the-point-guard-who-could-be-knicks-safest-nba-draft-option/

https://nypost.com/2020/03/22/hidden-point-guard-gem-killian-hayes-may-be-answer-for-knicks/

Both are Berman articles, but to be honest I haven't seen an article yet that says who the knicks like post Mills. Also the entire "we need a scoring guard" narrative started under Mills/Perry, same with the CP3 rumors. Mills was the one who tried to trade for D Lo, Rozier, Malik Monk, and was holding up the clippers trade because he wanted Landry Shamet. He thought that a scoring PG would fix things. Also side note a CP3 makes a lot more sense if the knicks were planning to Keep Morris longterm, it also comes off as desperate to keep your job too.

There weren't any early articles for any of our picks either besides RJ and that was because we went 3rd in the three man draft. KP was about a week out, Knox, Frank, and Shump were a few days before, Mitch. Rose just hired Aller, and kept Perry. we don't know if that new brain trust is as fixated on scoring from the PG position as Mills.

Especially scorers who'll need work, and they can't be brought in to do workouts or a combine.

Cole got that "This is the guys name we chant when we pick someone else" vibe.

The "we need a scoring" narrative lives as long a Perry is here IMO. Perry likes those types of players. "scoring" guards. Doeskin matter if they are of the empty stats variety. But yeah no word on who the Knicks like. But IMO the knicks will like who Perry likes.

Yeah but he isn’t the only one making those decisions. Leon makes the decision, and Aller is going to have a big say, and I have a feeling Thibs might have a say too....

You might be right we continue to follow Perry, but I would say if they had confidence like that in Perry’s decision they wouldn’t have extended him 1 year. They would have re-signed him to a few more years.

We'll see. I agree others will have input. But again, what type of PG would Thibs like? And LEO I have no clue about his BBAll iQ.
There always a chance that either Hayes or Hali would wow them during a live workout.... But the last time that happened we picked Knox!

[rajajackal]

all we need in a point guard right now is ball handling and shooting efficiency. any additional scoring or defensive talent is a bonus. we need a shooter at all costs IMO. frank and RJ are both solid playmakers to have on the floor with a primary handler

[3toheadmelo]

Its unlikely but it could happen. Who would have thought Ewing would become one of the best jump shooting centers to ever play the game?

we comparing him to ewing now?

Yeah I'm comparing him to Georgetown Ewing. Who later became top ten center Ewing. Im a big Mitch fan but I have to admit he realistically hasn't tried to expand his game.

I look at Wiseman and I see that tool set. Like Mitch he's got a great defensive baseline -although not quite Mitch level on the perimeter. But again that tool set...and then you c an see Wiseman WANTS to be more than a rim runner. As much as I love Mitch he seems to be content running the rim and taking only point blank shots.

Do I think he will become Ewing on offense? Unlikely, but he does have the rare tools required. Does he have the killer mindset and discipline necessary? The Motor? If so then maybe he's worth the swing for the fences. Because outside of Lamelo are there really any other "swing for the fences" options out there?

Preach