2014 NBA Draft Prospects Thread #5 | Raps picking 20th

[Lukeem]

I go back and forth on this one.

For most of the year he did look like the best frosh in college basketball. If he does fall to 20 it would be hard to pass bit there are worries / limitations on his game that might make passing either the best move or a stupid one

Sent from my C6906 using RealGM Forums mobile app

[Dalek]

Finally, Jerami Grant is working out for us. The good mix between offensive-minded and defensive-minded players will give him a chance to show his game.

Like KJ McDaniels his calling card is defense. I think if Grant shows his lateral quicks and some shot alteration, he might move into number 1 at 20.

Grant may have D, but he has no offense to speak of. Most of the footage I found on YouTube are just him doing putback dunks. Kinda reminds me of Outlaw... nothing special.

I see where you think he is like Outlaw, but his edge is the edge he plays with. He is willing to do the little things and be a hustle guy like Kenneth Faried and similar to Faried he came into the league with a limited offensive game. Despite limited offense, Grant does get to the line quite a bit and he has the motor that Masai loves.

I think he is the type of guy that Masai was talking about, in that you can throw him into the rotation for a few minutes as a back-up and let him develop slowly. The draft is such a mess that he could even be there in the second round. A guy like KJ McDaniels is a better finished product, but Jerami Grant has bigger potential with his length and athleticism.

I don't see why people can take a patient route with European forwards and a guy like Elfrid Payton, while ignoring Jerami Grant who likely has more upside because of his NBA lineage.

[Rapsobsessed7]

If the DX mock is accurate who do you pick between Young (#22) & Capela (#21)

I think I'd lean towards Capela.

[Undefeated]

Jerami Grant is kind of raw, but he still finds way to score. He can attack in straight lines from the elbow and get to the rim with ridiculous ease because of his explosive first step. With a lot of ball reversals getting defenses to bend opening gaps on the perimeter he'll be able to drive against closeouts.

[Kevin Willis]

http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Clint-Capela-vs-Jusuf-Nurkic-Head-to-Head-Matchup-Analysis-4598/#ooid=F4MzE1bjrJT9STaBwfWfN9am8CwRZt_X

[Dalek]

Jerami Grant is kind of raw, but he still finds way to score. He can attack in straight lines from the elbow and get to the rim with ridiculous ease because of his explosive first step. With a lot of ball reversals getting defenses to bend opening gaps on the perimeter he'll be able to drive against closeouts.

He is a good driver, but he has a troubling habit of catching the ball and immediately turning to drive. I haven't watched his footwork enough to see if he drags his pivot foot when he starts his drives, but I don't think he will have any trouble blowing by PFs or SFs. His length and strides remind me of the way Doctor J can cover ground.

[Indeed]

Finally, Jerami Grant is working out for us. The good mix between offensive-minded and defensive-minded players will give him a chance to show his game.

Like KJ McDaniels his calling card is defense. I think if Grant shows his lateral quicks and some shot alteration, he might move into number 1 at 20.

Grant may have D, but he has no offense to speak of. Most of the footage I found on YouTube are just him doing putback dunks. Kinda reminds me of Outlaw... nothing special.

I see where you think he is like Outlaw, but his edge is the edge he plays with. He is willing to do the little things and be a hustle guy like Kenneth Faried and similar to Faried he came into the league with a limited offensive game. Despite limited offense, Grant does get to the line quite a bit and he has the motor that Masai loves.

I think he is the type of guy that Masai was talking about, in that you can throw him into the rotation for a few minutes as a back-up and let him develop slowly. The draft is such a mess that he could even be there in the second round. A guy like KJ McDaniels is a better finished product, but Jerami Grant has bigger potential with his length and athleticism.

I don't see why people can take a patient route with European forwards and a guy like Elfrid Payton, while ignoring Jerami Grant who likely has more upside because of his NBA lineage.

European forwards have lower expectation, they may stay with the Raptors for longer terms.
And some of them are really underrated due to marketing, so they can easily be a steal.

For example, Inglis has a similar handle and passing ability (pick and roll, drive and kick) in Kyle Anderson, but he is ranked lower even with better defense. Would you draft Inglis over Anderson?

[ForeverTFC]

http://walterfootball.com/nbadraft2014mock.php

This site apparently has a good track record with their mocks.

Noteables:
- Wiggins at 3
- Kyle Anderson to the Hawks at 15
- Raptors pick Payton at 20, but Tyler Ennis is at 24
- Raptors pick Damien Inglis at 37
- Jordan Bach @ 49 to the Bulls? The guy has finally made us way onto the draft boards.

Do you think people on this board would really care that much about Tyler Ennis if he wasn't
a Canadian.
Raptors should make their pick based on talent and potential not on nationality.

Yes. He had a great season and showed craftiness. He earned his points not based on pure athleticism and size, but rather IQ. I think Ennis has a great chance of making the rotation on most teams.

I also still don't think he will be there at 20.

[fame]

Just tell him it was a horrible comparison

How many bigs averaged 4.3 assists per game this year?

The difference is anderson actually brought the ball up and ran plays. Just cus mcroberts had 4 apg doesnt mean theyre similar players. Theyre totally different players

I agree, I wasn't the one comparing Anderson and McRoberts. I was just pointing out to the other poster (and thought to you) that McRoberts is in fact an above average passer for position. Which many people seemed shocked about.

[Double Helix]

It's interesting how often draft fans analyze and discuss measurements and physical attributes while completely ignoring the importance of a player having a gifted basketball mind.

We see guys every year come in who are blessed with similar physical proportions, speed, jumping ability, etc and each of them has a different career path. Why? Usually, it's because of what's controlling those bodies. The basketball mind which controls those limbs, depth perception, hand-eye-coordination, mental processing, maturity, motivation, decision-making while on the move, reaction time, ability to analyze and anticipate, and tons more. So many of these things aren't discussed because they're obviously much harder to measure and quantify (although, I'd argue that you could probably create some software that would test for some of these attributes). Kawhi Leonard would be less special if each arm was 2 inches shorter but he'd still be a special player. He wouldn't be in the league though if he had those exact same physical attributes he has right now but the mind of Joey Graham. It's the combination of both that determines player success.

Chuck Hayes has had a better NBA career than many Cs who were faster, longer, and stronger than him. John Stockton had a much better career than many PGs who were faster, longer and stronger than him. I could go on and on. When you combine an ideal basketball brain with an ideal physical body for a position you end up with Lebron James or Hakeem or MJ but between the ideal body and a poor basketball brain and a lesser body with an ideal basketball brain I think the latter is more likely to have the better career.

Even if Lebron James tore both ACLs and came back much slower than now I still think he'd find a way to impact the game more than many 6'8, 240lb NBA hopefuls simply because of how he sees the game. Look at the career Grant Hill was able to still have after he lost much of his speed and athleticism. It was Diaw's mind/skill that allowed him to impact the game in such a dramatic way yesterday. There are several players currently at his size and athleticism in the league right now who wouldn't have been able to do any of the things he did for the Spurs.

The basketball mind has to be the most underrated aspect of talent evaluation, especially online. If you could put Kyle Anderson's brain in Perry Jones' body you might have a player who could rival Lebron and Durant in his prime. It's not just body or just mind. It's both. And I would put Anderson's basketball mind and body combo above many other basketball mind and body combos rumored to be available past 20. Same for KJ McDaniels anticipation and reaction times. They're elite. This man is capable of seeing things develop and reacting in the moment on either end of the court in split-seconds. That's not as common a trait in a player blessed with pretty solid physical characteristics as many seem to think. For me, it's about the combination of basketball mind and body. It can't just be one or the other. You have to consider the combination of both. Perhaps you think one person has 8 out of 10 physical attributes but a 2 out of 10 basketball mind. Is that really better than a player with 6 out of 10 physical attributes and an 8 out of 10 mind? Some think so. I don't.

[Raptorfan2012]

http://walterfootball.com/nbadraft2014mock.php

This site apparently has a good track record with their mocks.

Noteables:
- Wiggins at 3
- Kyle Anderson to the Hawks at 15
- Raptors pick Payton at 20, but Tyler Ennis is at 24
- Raptors pick Damien Inglis at 37
- Jordan Bach @ 49 to the Bulls? The guy has finally made us way onto the draft boards.

Do you think people on this board would really care that much about Tyler Ennis if he wasn't
a Canadian.
Raptors should make their pick based on talent and potential not on nationality.

True, but if Ennis is on the same tier as other players and you believe he will be a good PG, then the Canadian aspect makes it all the more exciting. It is not like Ennis is a reach if he is there; in fact, you are picking up a bargain because Ennis was a highly touted prospect coming into the draft.

[YoungD23]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Raptors/status/476742444735004673[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Raptors/status/476758946016133120[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Raptors/status/476753596802142209[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Raptors/status/476749075237580800[/tweet]

[yt_boi]

Latest DX mock is interesting. Has us taking Payton now. It has James Young dropping huge down to 22.

I will take James Young and run. He is the type of player that you pick up at a buy low (dropped) situation.

NO NO NO NO NO

i always wondered why he was so high...he's one of a couple guys who i thought if they dropped i wouldn't want us taking him

NO DEFENSE....and really that's all that should matter at this point....and nothing elite offensively, just crazy athletic

[Dalek]

Lewenburg wrote that Grant flopped on three point drills while Cleanthony Early showed good competitive spirit. I am warming up to Early because I just see his good all around skills and competitive streak. He has a decent post-up game, and improved his three.

To me, his interviews make him sound like a positive guy who is a vocal team player. I see him fitting the culture here. I hate that he is 23, but he had some tough circumstances early on. He played junior college to be close to his family after his brother suddenly died. He only played two years at D-1 level and showed a good leap in efficiency. He is intriguing.

[Kevin Willis]

It's interesting how often draft fans analyze and discuss measurements and physical attributes while completely ignoring the importance of a player having a gifted basketball mind.

We see guys every year come in who are blessed with similar physical proportions, speed, jumping ability, etc and each of them has a different career path. Why? Usually, it's because of what's controlling those bodies. The basketball mind which controls those limbs, depth perception, hand-eye-coordination, mental processing, maturity, motivation, decision-making while on the move, reaction time, ability to analyze and anticipate, and tons more. So many of these things aren't discussed because they're obviously much harder to measure and quantify (although, I'd argue that you could probably create some software that would test for some of these attributes). Kawhi Leonard would be less special if each arm was 2 inches shorter but he'd still be a special player. He wouldn't be in the league though if he had those exact same physical attributes he has right now but the mind of Joey Graham. It's the combination of both that determines player success.

Chuck Hayes has had a better NBA career than many Cs who were faster, longer, and stronger than him. John Stockton had a much better career than many PGs who were faster, longer and stronger than him. I could go on and on. When you combine an ideal basketball brain with an ideal physical body for a position you end up with Lebron James or Hakeem or MJ but between the ideal body and a poor basketball brain and a lesser body with an ideal basketball brain I think the latter is more likely to have the better career.

Even if Lebron James tore both ACLs and came back much slower than now I still think he'd find a way to impact the game more than many 6'8, 240lb NBA hopefuls simply because of how he sees the game. Look at the career Grant Hill was able to still have after he lost much of his speed and athleticism. It was Diaw's mind/skill that allowed him to impact the game in such a dramatic way yesterday. There are several players currently at his size and athleticism in the league right now who wouldn't have been able to do any of the things he did for the Spurs.

The basketball mind has to be the most underrated aspect of talent evaluation, especially online. If you could put Kyle Anderson's brain in Perry Jones' body you might have a player who could rival Lebron and Durant in his prime. It's not just body or just mind. It's both. And I would put Anderson's basketball mind and body combo above many other basketball mind and body combos rumored to be available past 20. Same for KJ McDaniels anticipation and reaction times. They're elite. This man is capable of seeing things develop and reacting in the moment on either end of the court in split-seconds. That's not as common a trait in a player blessed with pretty solid physical characteristics as many seem to think. For me, it's about the combination of basketball mind and body. It can't just be one or the other. You have to consider the combination of both. Perhaps you think one person has 8 out of 10 physical attributes but a 2 out of 10 basketball mind. Is that really better than a player with 6 out of 10 physical attributes and an 8 out of 10 mind? Some think so. I don't.

Masai is looking at basketball players and not athletes and that's what matters. He drafted Faired who is a good athlete but he had a translatable skill in rebounding and he could defend. Fournier is also a strong IQ guy. He like Miller but then again he traded for JaVale McGee.

Even though I like Grant i don't think we'll draft him unless it's for the specific role of defending big wing players and nothing more.

[saham]

Lewenburg wrote that Grant flopped on three point drills while Cleanthony Early showed good competitive spirit. I am warming up to Early because I just see his good all around skills and competitive streak. He has a decent post-up game, and improved his three.

To me, his interviews make him sound like a positive guy who is a vocal team player. I see him fitting the culture here. I hate that he is 23, but he had some tough circumstances early on. He played junior college to be close to his family after his brother suddenly died. He only played two years at D-1 level and showed a good leap in efficiency. He is intriguing.

I am telling you the Raptors will take Early with the 37th if he is on the board.

In my opinion, he will be gone very early in the second round.

[_venom_]

Jerami Grant at 37 sure.

Jerami Grant at 20? Hell no.

[m83588333]

Jerami Grant on a Chandler Parsons second round deal would be ideal.

[Roland Brice]

KC (Naperville)

What is it about Elfrid Payton that sets him apart from the other PGs in this draft? I keep seeing his stock soar everywhere.

Chad Ford
(1:48 PM)

Size, quickness, ability to get to the basket, tough defender + he really is a true PG. He needs to get stronger and improve his jump shot, but I think he offers the most upside of any PG not named Exum or Smart. I think his range actually starts with the Lakers at 7, the Kings at 8, the Hornets at 9 and Magic at 12 are all real possibilities for him. Ennis is his closest competition, but the majority of teams now have Payton rated higher.

JJ (Liberty Twp, OH)

At this point, how many top ten picks do you think will be traded?

Chad Ford
(2:01 PM)

At least 2. Celtics, Lakers, Kings are the top 3 candidates.

[Roland Brice]

If the DX mock is accurate who do you pick between Young (#22) & Capela (#21)

I think I'd lean towards Capela.

Well if the DX mock is accurate I'm taking Payton, but since you asked about Capella and Young I'll just say that the choice is fairly simple for me. I see Capella as a boom or bust prospect, so at 20 I'll happily try for boom and if he busts no one will remember or care anyways. Young is still a teenager but his upside potential is overblown, he doesn't defend or do anything outside of shoot very well. His length is useless since he doesn't defend with it, he's just CJ Miles.