Welcome Okafor

broseph13 · Post #1961 » by **broseph13** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 2:30 pm

I don't understand why people think keeping Noel over Okafor is a great idea. Basically, you guys would prefer keeping a guy with virtually no upside over a guy with tons of upside, and I'm not sure why.

Hate to break it to you folks, but Noel probably won't getting any better than he is now...he just doesn't have the tools. Noel is simply an athlete, not a basketball player, and guys like that tend not to improve much throughout their career.

ET Da Gawd · Post #1962 » by **ET Da Gawd** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 3:20 pm

ExplosionsInDaSky wrote:The game switches and slows down in the playoffs. Keeping Noel and Okafor allows us to be so versatile it's scary.

Yup, its all about halfcourt execution, Jahlil and Joel allow us to do that with their skill on the block. Jah is so much better than demarcus his rookie year but I didn't see all this negativity about Cousins his 1st year, a lot of people on this forum have an agenda against Jahlil, for what reason? No idea, can people imagine how he's gonna look in 5 years? He's pretty unstoppable on the block as it is currently

Unbreakable99 · Post #1963 » by **Unbreakable99** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 5:29 pm

broseph13 wrote:I don't understand why people think keeping Noel over Okafor is a great idea. Basically, you guys would prefer keeping a guy with virtually no upside over a guy with tons of upside, and I'm not sure why.

Hate to break it to you folks, but Noel probably won't getting any better than he is now...he just doesn't have the tools. Noel is simply an athlete, not a basketball player, and guys like that tend not to improve much throughout their career.

I don't know how you can say Noel won't get better. He already looks a lot better than when he was at Kentucky. His jumper is still a work in progress but he has gotten better shooting FTs.

Mik317 · Post #1964 » by **Mik317** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 6:06 pm

ET Da Gawd wrote:
ExplosionsInDaSky wrote:The game switches and slows down in the playoffs. Keeping Noel and Okafor allows us to be so versatile it's scary.

Yup, its all about halfcourt execution, Jahlil and Joel allow us to do that with their skill on the block. Jah is so much better than demarcus his rookie year but I didn't see all this negativity about Cousins his 1st year, a lot of people on this forum have an agenda against Jahlil, for what reason? No idea, can people imagine how he's gonna look in 5 years? He's pretty unstoppable on the block as it is currently

People actually did **** on Cousins for not being efficient his rookie year...mainly due to us taking Turner and still hoping for the best.

broseph13 wrote:I don't understand why people think keeping Noel over Okafor is a great idea. Basically, you guys would prefer keeping a guy with virtually no upside over a guy with tons of upside, and I'm not sure why.

Hate to break it to you folks, but Noel probably won't getting any better than he is now...he just doesn't have the tools. Noel is simply an athlete, not a basketball player, and guys like that tend not to improve much throughout their career.

Come on man...you know this is stupid right? Noel can get better....just by getting playing time and picking up on things. He will never be KG but come on. His jumper is still bad but it still has come a long way from Kentucky.

You dudes don't have **** on the other guy to prompt up your guy...like holy ****.

roma258 · Post #1965 » by **roma258** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 7:11 pm

broseph13 wrote:I don't understand why people think keeping Noel over Okafor is a great idea. Basically, you guys would prefer keeping a guy with virtually no upside over a guy with tons of upside, and I'm not sure why.

Hate to break it to you folks, but Noel probably won't getting any better than he is now...he just doesn't have the tools. Noel is simply an athlete, not a basketball player, and guys like that tend not to improve much throughout their career.

The notion that Noel has topped out and has no upside is one of the most insane things I've read on this board.

ET Da Gawd · Post #1966 » by **ET Da Gawd** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 7:49 pm

Noel won't even weight 250 at his peak, unless his jumper gets wet, he's nothing more than an energy utility big man. He can come off the bench, he's no long term starter or someone who stays in late game during a playoff game. You need people who can score in the halfcourt, not a guy who literally needs ish for an alley to be competent in the halfcourt. Jahlil has a muchhhh higher ceiling than nerlens, nothing wrong with that, it should be obvious.

Post #1967 » by **HartfordWhalers** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 8:15 pm

ET Da Gawd wrote:Noel won't even weight 250 at his peak, unless his jumper gets wet, he's nothing more than an energy utility big man. He can come off the bench, he's no long term starter or someone who stays in late game during a playoff game. You need people who can score in the halfcourt, not a guy who literally needs ish for an alley to be competent in the halfcourt. Jahlil has a muchhhh higher ceiling than nerlens, nothing wrong with that, it should be obvious.

This take on Nerlens is balderdash. I'm really not sure how someone watches him and comes to this take.

If you like Okafor, that is swell. But talking absurd **** on Noel doesn't help Okafor's case in the slightest.

Unbreakable99 · Post #1968 » by **Unbreakable99** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 8:32 pm

HartfordWhalers wrote:
ET Da Gawd wrote:Noel won't even weight 250 at his peak, unless his jumper gets wet, he's nothing more than an energy utility big man. He can come off the bench, he's no long term starter or someone who stays in late game during a playoff game. You need people who can score in the halfcourt, not a guy who literally needs ish for an alley to be competent in the halfcourt. Jahlil has a muchhhh higher ceiling than nerlens, nothing wrong with that, it should be obvious.

This take on Nerlens is balderdash. I'm really not sure how someone watches him and comes to this take.

If you like Okafor, that is swell. But talking absurd **** on Noel doesn't help Okafor's case in the slightest.

Agreed. Noel isn't new anymore. Out with the new and in with the newer lol. Wait until next year when Embiid plays. New toy. He would be the newest to hit the floor. So out with the new and the newer and in with the newest.

Mik317 · Post #1969 » by **Mik317** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 9:27 pm

bunch of fortune tellers up in this

Dave321 · Post #1970 » by **Dave321** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 9:29 pm

The best argument for Noel is that the league is now about guards, wings and stretch 4s. Teams like that only need a center to protect the rim and get rebounds ala DeAndre Jordan. Of course Noel will never be as big as Jordan.

If Embiid doesn't come back I think they can both co-exist, not because Noel gets a jumper, but if Okafor gets incredibly fit over the summer and continues to improve his already good mid range jumper and his much improved free throw shooting.

Agnostifarian · Post #1971 » by **Agnostifarian** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 9:36 pm

Winning games has a lot to do with preventing the other team from scoring. Half. Don't forget that part of Noel. I like Okafor too. It's ok. OK?

ExplosionsInDaSky · Post #1972 » by **ExplosionsInDaSky** » Wed Feb 3, 2016 11:41 pm

^Absolutely, no reason why they can't eventually co exist together.

Sixersftw · Post #1973 » by **Sixersftw** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 12:00 am

ExplosionsInDaSky wrote:^Absolutely, no reason why they can't eventually co exist together.

You can have a preference. Hell, I prefer Noel as a piece moving forward if I have to choose one but pretending either player is some mediocre bumbling backup at best 1) isn't helping any discussion on the boards 2) is flat out wrong. We're are talking about a top defensive prospect in the league and a top offensive prospect in the league here. Discussing which one you wanna keep is fine but the exaggeration of their faults is getting out of hand.

ET Da Gawd · Post #1974 » by **ET Da Gawd** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 12:12 am

I don't want people to misunderstand, I personally want to keep the big 4 front court rotation. I feel like that would be the type of depth we need to really compete. Having a real bench and starter combination would do wonders for us over the longterm. I don't mind us overpaying for the luxury of having a super defense offense frontcourt

joyeuxnoel · Post #1975 » by **joyeuxnoel** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 1:37 pm

I think what ET is saying is you take Okafor over Noel without blinking because if you want to win in the playoffs, you need to execute your offense in the halfcourt

Unless you have an all defensive lineup like the early 2000 pistons good luck winning with nerlens noel. Hes going to be a huge black hole on offense while imo okafor worst case scenario is a good defender at PF

A lot of you want noel because the small ball fad. The warriors small ball only works because they have 3 all star caliber players and one being mvp caliber

joyeuxnoel · Post #1976 » by **joyeuxnoel** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 1:40 pm

ET Da Gawd wrote:I don't want people to misunderstand, I personally want to keep the big 4 front court rotation. I feel like that would be the type of depth we need to really compete. Having a real bench and starter combination would do wonders for us over the longterm. I don't mind us overpaying for the luxury of having a super defense offense frontcourt

I would love it too but only of we get good wings. Stauskas can be one of those guys if his confidence/mental game wasnt so weak

If we dont get good wings we'll continue to get penetrated harder on the perimeter than your average sorority chick

Sixersftw · Post #1977 » by **Sixersftw** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 2:08 pm

joyeuxnoel wrote:Unless you have an all defensive lineup like the early 2000 pistons good luck winning with nerlens noel. Hes going to be a huge black hole on offense while imo okafor worst case scenario is a good defender at PF

A lot of you want noel because the small ball fad. The warriors small ball only works because they have 3 all star caliber players and one being mvp caliber

I assume by blackhole you mean useless rather than a high usage ball hog like the term typically means. i have no idea why okafor is destined to be a good defender, let alone at pf, but noel couldn't become a passable offensive player. I would just like a little clarification on how that works.

The small ball argument is a lame strawman imo. Are prime Tyson chandler and noah purely small ball bigs too?

joyeuxnoel · Post #1978 » by **joyeuxnoel** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 2:16 pm

Sixersftw wrote:
joyeuxnoel wrote:Unless you have an all defensive lineup like the early 2000 pistons good luck winning with nerlens noel. Hes going to be a huge black hole on offense while imo okafor worst case scenario is a good defender at PF

A lot of you want noel because the small ball fad. The warriors small ball only works because they have 3 all star caliber players and one being mvp caliber

I assume by blackhole you mean useless rather than a high usage ball hog like the term typically means. i have no idea why okafor is destined to be a good defender, let alone at pf, but noel couldn't become a passable offensive player. I would just like a little clarification on how that works.

The small ball argument is a lame strawman imo. Are prime Tyson chandler and noah purely small ball bigs too?

Yes thats what i meant by black hole. And before ish smith got here okafor was an above average 1v1 defender. Since ish smith and playing both pf and c, hes been top 2

Putting him at pf means all he has to worry about is his man and the occasional defensive rotation. He needs to drop 10 pounds to increase his mobility and stamina so he doesnt get gassed.

Il take those odds of him being conditioned enough to defend 4s over the odds of noel becoming a plus on offense

Okafor has the potential to be great on offense, good on defense

Noel has the potentisl to be ok on offense, great on defense

joyeuxnoel · Post #1979 » by **joyeuxnoel** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 2:19 pm

Also lets be honest here, noel is not a good 1v1 defender but is an outstanding rim protector and can create turnovers. Hes suited for the 5

Okafor is more suited for the 4. And theyve been playing well together, so if embiid doesnt get healthy, noel isnt a bad plan b for sure

76ciology · Post #1980 » by **76ciology** » Thu Feb 4, 2016 2:25 pm

I know a lot of people don't like the argument, but I think it's a good exercise where we can look back to this discussion once one of them gets traded. You actually can learn a lot of things with how the game is evolving with the bigs nowadays. Yeah, seems like the league is heavy on guards, wings and 2 way stretch 4s. But you still need a rim protector to start each half and play big. In terms of present value, I think Noel is more likeable because he has shown the ability to provide great impact already on one side of the floor. While Jah is still a promising rookie who's adjusting to the pace and space style of the NBA.

Anyway, I thought Jah did well with his individual defense against the Hawks playing PF. I think there was even one instance where I think it was Teague who called an Iso against Jah, while Jah was able to keep up with him. Milsap shot 3/11. I don't know why Hawks didn't attack Jah's defense with some PnR with Milsap. Jah has the length to close out stretch 4s. I think exerting that much energy on defense did affect his offense where he was not as aggressive and doesn't look to have that lift to finish around the basket.