Trade Value - Lillard & CJ individually

[Dame Lizard]

Three team trade with Miami and Boston in the offseason.

Portland trades CJ + Vonleh + Crabbe and the Cleveland pick For Bradley and Whiteside

Boston trades Bradley, filler and the Brooklyn Picks for CJ.

Miami Trades Whiteside for Crabbe, Vonleh, the Cleveland Pick, and the Brooklyn Picks. Miami could move Dragic for another first round pick to reload quick in a deep draft. They clear their expensive vets for a high upside borderline starter in Crabbe and a prospect in Vonleh, while also securing at least 2 of Brooklyn's picks, and a late first from Cleveland. With their own pick, that gives them 2 top 10 picks, plus a late first in this deep draft plus another future top pick. That seems like good value for Whiteside based on the trades I've seen floated around here.

Boston cashes in on their picks and grab another rising star in CJ, who can play SG next to Thomas to form the best scoring guard duo on the east coast, or they could move Thomas in a separate deal and let CJ run the team. Also gives them a big 3 of Horford, CJ and Thomas if they stick with that backcourt. The Defense of Crowder, Horford, and Johnson should help make up for the defensive woes of the backcourt. Ainge has been trying to deal those picks forever and they want to contend now ( I know they're playing really well right now too, but CJ is probably the best they're going to do with those assets unless they can grab PG13). They could also hope they can land Hayward in the offseason, but that's not a certainty by any means.

Portland puts a legit 3 and D SG next to Lillard to make up for his defense, while also getting their rim protector in Whiteside, clearing Crabbe and selling high on Vonleh. Trading CJ hurts but it also sells high on him and gives the team a more well rounded defense without trading too much offense.

Boston:

Thomas
CJ
Crowder
Horford
Amir

Portland:

Lillard
Bradley
Harkless
Aminu
Whiteside

Miami:

(One of the top PG's in the draft with either their pick or Brooklyn's picks.)
Crabbe
Winslow
(PF drafted with their own pick or Brooklyn's)
(Draft Jeane or another center with a late first from Cleveland)

I haven't proposed a trade in a long time so it's probably terrible value, just not sure for who... I Originally had Lillard in this trade but swapped him with CJ because I wasn't sure if the expiring contract of Bradley (could leave for nothing after next season) and Whiteside (attitude and motor questions? ) for a proven and loyal superstar in LIllard was fair value, especially since we're not getting any picks back and actually sending one out. CJ puts up 24, 4 and 4 a game on HIGH efficiency as the secondary scorer. He would definitely be an All star on the east coast I think. Miami get a starter, a prospect and multiple high picks to rebuild. Boston gets that third star Ainge has been obsessed with getting since his original big three.

That is really, really bad for Boston I'm afraid.

Also I'm not sure Boston is the right fit for CJ, as they have IT at point guard. It's a massive defensive downgrade from Bradley to CJ.

[NashtyNas]

Yea I'm not sure Boston trades Bradley straight up for CJ at this point... that's how good Bradley has been this season. No disrespect to CJ - I really like the Favors/Hood for CJ deal for both sides. Not sure how it works $ wise.

The Nurkic/Gallo deal is so bad for the Blazers. They go from bad to worse defensively and get more injury concerns (Gallo has a history despite being healthy recently). Just bad overall for Portland.

I'd like to see what Minnesota offers.

Maybe something with Indianna... needs a 3rd team though.

IND trades Turner, Miles, Ellis, Stuckey for McCollum, Plumlee, Scola
POR trades McCollum, Plumlee, Vonleh for Turner, Miles
BKN trades Scola for Ellis, Stuckey, Vonleh

Does BKN need a pick from IND here?

[Case2012]

Three team trade with Miami and Boston in the offseason.

Portland trades CJ + Vonleh + Crabbe and the Cleveland pick For Bradley and Whiteside

Boston trades Bradley, filler and the Brooklyn Picks for CJ.

Miami Trades Whiteside for Crabbe, Vonleh, the Cleveland Pick, and the Brooklyn Picks. Miami could move Dragic for another first round pick to reload quick in a deep draft. They clear their expensive vets for a high upside borderline starter in Crabbe and a prospect in Vonleh, while also securing at least 2 of Brooklyn's picks, and a late first from Cleveland. With their own pick, that gives them 2 top 10 picks, plus a late first in this deep draft plus another future top pick. That seems like good value for Whiteside based on the trades I've seen floated around here.

Boston cashes in on their picks and grab another rising star in CJ, who can play SG next to Thomas to form the best scoring guard duo on the east coast, or they could move Thomas in a separate deal and let CJ run the team. Also gives them a big 3 of Horford, CJ and Thomas if they stick with that backcourt. The Defense of Crowder, Horford, and Johnson should help make up for the defensive woes of the backcourt. Ainge has been trying to deal those picks forever and they want to contend now ( I know they're playing really well right now too, but CJ is probably the best they're going to do with those assets unless they can grab PG13). They could also hope they can land Hayward in the offseason, but that's not a certainty by any means.

Portland puts a legit 3 and D SG next to Lillard to make up for his defense, while also getting their rim protector in Whiteside, clearing Crabbe and selling high on Vonleh. Trading CJ hurts but it also sells high on him and gives the team a more well rounded defense without trading too much offense.

Boston:

Thomas
CJ
Crowder
Horford
Amir

Portland:

Lillard
Bradley
Harkless
Aminu
Whiteside

Miami:

(One of the top PG's in the draft with either their pick or Brooklyn's picks.)
Crabbe
Winslow
(PF drafted with their own pick or Brooklyn's)
(Draft Jeane or another center with a late first from Cleveland)

I haven't proposed a trade in a long time so it's probably terrible value, just not sure for who... I Originally had Lillard in this trade but swapped him with CJ because I wasn't sure if the expiring contract of Bradley (could leave for nothing after next season) and Whiteside (attitude and motor questions? ) for a proven and loyal superstar in LIllard was fair value, especially since we're not getting any picks back and actually sending one out. CJ puts up 24, 4 and 4 a game on HIGH efficiency as the secondary scorer. He would definitely be an All star on the east coast I think. Miami get a starter, a prospect and multiple high picks to rebuild. Boston gets that third star Ainge has been obsessed with getting since his original big three.

That is really, really bad for Boston I'm afraid.

Also I'm not sure Boston is the right fit for CJ, as they have IT at point guard. It's a massive defensive downgrade from Bradley to CJ.

Obviously CJ isn't a lockdown defender, but when Lillard was out, our defense went from 28th to 8th. Aminu had something to do with that, but Boston has way more plus defenders than Portland does. CJ can be an at least average defender in a better defensive system with better defensive players surrounding him. However, I don't know how much Boston values Bradley. I was making the trade with them under the assumption Ainge was willing to deal those pics for a star (he's been shopping those picks every year for a star but never lands one), and I think CJ has reached the point where he can be a 25-30 point scorer as a primary option, which is obviously a star. The guy is a highlight machine, and on the east coast I can see him making the allstar team pretty easy. Bradley is also a FA after next season and there's no guarantee he stays, while CJ on the other hand is locked up for the next 4 years.

[stitches]

High draft pick isn't going to happen. Top of the draft is loaded with cheap elite guard and wing prospects. I can't imagine those teams would want to sacrifice 4 years and a decade of team control for a guy making as much as CJ does when most of those teams are garbage. Then would the Trailblazers want to draft another PG or a wing when they have their cap space tied up almost entirely in those 2 positions?

What about a deal like Hood, Favors, and Exum or Lyles? Favors is undervalued like crazy right now and Hood is a much better fit next to Lillard. Pick up another young cheap asset as well. Favors and Hood could make a world of difference for yalls defense. The deal also keeps with the Trailblazers timeline and helps the cap situation a little bit short term until one of the wings can be moved. Could maybe even get Utah to throw in a pick since McCollum is the perfect fit over there. Seems like good value and fit from a non biased observer. I don't see Lillard and CJ ever being a contending backcourt since they are both best on the ball and give up way too much on the defensive end.

Jazz fans can correct me if I'm wrong, but Hood, Favors, Lyles/Exum seems like an awful lot to give up for McCollum.

Hahaha yep, Favors and Hood should do it.

Sure it should do it. Just like Hayward+Gobert+Favors+3 firsts should do it... that's not the question. The question is why in hell would you offer all that for CJ **** McCollum?

[stitches]

High draft pick isn't going to happen. Top of the draft is loaded with cheap elite guard and wing prospects. I can't imagine those teams would want to sacrifice 4 years and a decade of team control for a guy making as much as CJ does when most of those teams are garbage. Then would the Trailblazers want to draft another PG or a wing when they have their cap space tied up almost entirely in those 2 positions?

What about a deal like Hood, Favors, and Exum or Lyles? Favors is undervalued like crazy right now and Hood is a much better fit next to Lillard. Pick up another young cheap asset as well. Favors and Hood could make a world of difference for yalls defense. The deal also keeps with the Trailblazers timeline and helps the cap situation a little bit short term until one of the wings can be moved. Could maybe even get Utah to throw in a pick since McCollum is the perfect fit over there. Seems like good value and fit from a non biased observer. I don't see Lillard and CJ ever being a contending backcourt since they are both best on the ball and give up way too much on the defensive end.

How about thanks but no thanks.

[stitches]

Im pretty sure I have pushed a Favors and Hood for CJ through on the trade machine.

If you add a number of other not-insignificant players it could.

For example, an expanded trade of CJ, Davis, Ezeli, Vonleh, Connaughton for Favors, Hood, Burkes, Lyles, Withey works and brings you guys right to the cap... But I imagine that is less exciting for you guys.

Yep, I feel the Jazz are sending too much value and the Blazers will feel the same way.

In what world are they sending too much value? The Jazz are sending the 5 best players in this trade when you exclude CJ. This is insanity. People have indeed forgotten just how good Favors is when healthy. I probably won't trade Favors for McCollum straight up, let alone adding Hood and other pieces. WTF happened in the last 2 months for people to get a collective amnesia on Favors' play?

[AingesBurner]

If you add a number of other not-insignificant players it could.

For example, an expanded trade of CJ, Davis, Ezeli, Vonleh, Connaughton for Favors, Hood, Burkes, Lyles, Withey works and brings you guys right to the cap... But I imagine that is less exciting for you guys.

Yep, I feel the Jazz are sending too much value and the Blazers will feel the same way.

In what world are they sending too much value? The Jazz are sending the 5 best players in this trade when you exclude CJ. This is insanity. People have indeed forgotten just how good Favors is when healthy. I probably won't trade Favors for McCollum straight up, let alone adding Hood and other pieces. WTF happened in the last 2 months for people to get a collective amnesia on Favors' play?

The question is if Favors will ever return to the player he was? Back problems, knee problems, and hopefully we don't see foot problems, I doubt the Jazz trade him now but they need to cash out this summer unless we get the Suns training staff.

[stitches]

Yep, I feel the Jazz are sending too much value and the Blazers will feel the same way.

In what world are they sending too much value? The Jazz are sending the 5 best players in this trade when you exclude CJ. This is insanity. People have indeed forgotten just how good Favors is when healthy. I probably won't trade Favors for McCollum straight up, let alone adding Hood and other pieces. WTF happened in the last 2 months for people to get a collective amnesia on Favors' play?

The question is if Favors will ever return to the player he was? Back problems, knee problems, and hopefully we don't see foot problems, I doubt the Jazz trade him now but they need to cash out this summer unless we get the Suns training staff.

His back problems were there for 3 weeks and were gone after. I haven't heard anything of them for the last year. He's been recovering from IT band syndrome this season. He's 25 FFS. It's not like he's in his 30s and there some serious question about his long-term health. Yes, he's been injured and playing injured this season. I see no reason to assume he won't be back to his regular playing form, it's not like he's an old man or his injuries are long-term performance stoppers. He hasn't torn an Achilles or broken a foot bone or torn an ACL. He just has a **** IT band inflammation. There's nothing structurally wrong with any part of his body from what we know.

[AingesBurner]

In what world are they sending too much value? The Jazz are sending the 5 best players in this trade when you exclude CJ. This is insanity. People have indeed forgotten just how good Favors is when healthy. I probably won't trade Favors for McCollum straight up, let alone adding Hood and other pieces. WTF happened in the last 2 months for people to get a collective amnesia on Favors' play?

The question is if Favors will ever return to the player he was? Back problems, knee problems, and hopefully we don't see foot problems, I doubt the Jazz trade him now but they need to cash out this summer unless we get the Suns training staff.

His back problems were there for 3 weeks and were gone after. I haven't heard anything of them for the last year. He's been recovering from IT band syndrome this season. He's 25 FFS. It's not like he's in his 30s and there some serious question about his long-term health. Yes, he's been injured and playing injured this season. I see no reason to assume he won't be back to his regular playing form, it's not like he's an old man or his injuries are long-term performance stoppers. He hasn't torn an Achilles or broken a foot bone or torn an ACL. He just has a **** IT band inflammation. There's nothing structurally wrong with any part of his body from what we know.

His back problems I think are yearly nagging injury but like I said I think the Jazz wait to put him on the market, also I think our death ball lineup will render him useless unless he's subbing for Gobert.

[stitches]

The question is if Favors will ever return to the player he was? Back problems, knee problems, and hopefully we don't see foot problems, I doubt the Jazz trade him now but they need to cash out this summer unless we get the Suns training staff.

His back problems were there for 3 weeks and were gone after. I haven't heard anything of them for the last year. He's been recovering from IT band syndrome this season. He's 25 FFS. It's not like he's in his 30s and there some serious question about his long-term health. Yes, he's been injured and playing injured this season. I see no reason to assume he won't be back to his regular playing form, it's not like he's an old man or his injuries are long-term performance stoppers. He hasn't torn an Achilles or broken a foot bone or torn an ACL. He just has a **** IT band inflammation. There's nothing structurally wrong with any part of his body from what we know.

His back problems I think are yearly nagging injury but like I said I think the Jazz wait to put him on the market, also I think our death ball lineup will render him useless unless he's subbing for Gobert.

Do you have a source for that? From what I know the time he missed last January is the only time he's missed due to his back.

[AingesBurner]

His back problems were there for 3 weeks and were gone after. I haven't heard anything of them for the last year. He's been recovering from IT band syndrome this season. He's 25 FFS. It's not like he's in his 30s and there some serious question about his long-term health. Yes, he's been injured and playing injured this season. I see no reason to assume he won't be back to his regular playing form, it's not like he's an old man or his injuries are long-term performance stoppers. He hasn't torn an Achilles or broken a foot bone or torn an ACL. He just has a **** IT band inflammation. There's nothing structurally wrong with any part of his body from what we know.

His back problems I think are yearly nagging injury but like I said I think the Jazz wait to put him on the market, also I think our death ball lineup will render him useless unless he's subbing for Gobert.

Do you have a source for that? From what I know the time he missed last January is the only time he's missed due to his back.

Maybe I'm wrong but I was pretty sure it was a yearly issue granted it didn't put him out for a bunch of games prior to last year.

[Fitz303]

Jazz fans can correct me if I'm wrong, but Hood, Favors, Lyles/Exum seems like an awful lot to give up for McCollum.

Hahaha yep, Favors and Hood should do it.

Sure it should do it. Just like Hayward+Gobert+Favors+3 firsts should do it... that's not the question. The question is why in hell would you offer all that for CJ **** McCollum?

I feel like you have no idea who CJ McCollum is, or the player that he's become. He's worth every bit of Favors and Hood, and then some. Portland wouldn't make that trade

[stitches]

Hahaha yep, Favors and Hood should do it.

Sure it should do it. Just like Hayward+Gobert+Favors+3 firsts should do it... that's not the question. The question is why in hell would you offer all that for CJ **** McCollum?

I feel like you have no idea who CJ McCollum is, or the player that he's become. He's worth every bit of Favors and Hood, and then some. Portland wouldn't make that trade

I know perfectly well who CJ McCollum is. He's been burning the Jazz every game for the last two years and Jazz fans have been drooling over him ever since. I've also watched him get burned every single night on D. I can appreciate his offensive game, I just don't value it as highly as others when it comes tied with him being a sieve on D and giving everything he gets on O back to the opponent on the other end. There is a reason why Portland has one of the worst defenses in the league. McCollum is not the only reason, but is one of the main reasons. Favors is one of the best two way bigs in the league and Hood is getting very close to being a neutral on D. I value that more than the scoring spurts of McCollum.

[Fitz303]

Sure it should do it. Just like Hayward+Gobert+Favors+3 firsts should do it... that's not the question. The question is why in hell would you offer all that for CJ **** McCollum?

I feel like you have no idea who CJ McCollum is, or the player that he's become. He's worth every bit of Favors and Hood, and then some. Portland wouldn't make that trade

I know perfectly well who CJ McCollum is. He's been burning the Jazz every game for the last two years and Jazz fans have been drooling over him ever since. I've also watched him get burned every single night on D. I can appreciate his offensive game, I just don't value it as highly as others when it comes tied with him being a sieve on D and giving everything he gets on O back to the opponent on the other end. There is a reason why Portland has one of the worst defenses in the league. McCollum is not the only reason, but is one of the main reasons. Favors is one of the best two way bigs in the league and Hood is getting very close to being a neutral on D. I value that more than the scoring spurts of McCollum.

CJ's defense, on his own, is alright. It's not great, but it's not bad. It's intensified by the fact that he has a worse defender playing beside him. When Lillard was out for the 5 games recently, and CJ and Crabbe were starting in the back court, his defense was much better. The problem is making him guard bigger SGs, and having Dame next to him, makes matters much worse. CJ isn't the reason the Blazers defense is so bad. Him having to guard out of position, and next to an even weaker defender is what makes the Blazers defense so bad.

As for his offense, he's scoring 24 ppg on 48 FG% 41 3pt% 90 FT%. That's 50/40/90 territory on 24 ppg and 4 apg. He's doing this while holding back as the 2nd option. He is virtually unstoppable one on one. CJ on a team with good defenders around him, would be an all star. I have zero doubt that if McCollum were on the Jazz, he'd be in the all star game this year. Probably ahead of Lillard.

[stitches]

CJ's defense, on his own, is alright. It's not great, but it's not bad. It's intensified by the fact that he has a worse defender playing beside him. When Lillard was out for the 5 games recently, and CJ and Crabbe were starting in the back court, his defense was much better. The problem is making him guard bigger SGs, and having Dame next to him, makes matters much worse. CJ isn't the reason the Blazers defense is so bad. Him having to guard out of position, and next to an even weaker defender is what makes the Blazers defense so bad.

As for his offense, he's scoring 24 ppg on 48 FG% 41 3pt% 90 FT%. That's 50/40/90 territory on 24 ppg and 4 apg. He's doing this while holding back as the 2nd option. He is virtually unstoppable one on one. CJ on a team with good defenders around him, would be an all star. I have zero doubt that if McCollum were on the Jazz, he'd be in the all star game this year. Probably ahead of Lillard.

I guess you have the recipe to have 2 all-stars on your team... just surround them with good defenders. It's that easy. Just please don't rob us of ours in the process. We(at least I do) like our two way players.

[sipclip]

If you add a number of other not-insignificant players it could.

For example, an expanded trade of CJ, Davis, Ezeli, Vonleh, Connaughton for Favors, Hood, Burkes, Lyles, Withey works and brings you guys right to the cap... But I imagine that is less exciting for you guys.

Yep, I feel the Jazz are sending too much value and the Blazers will feel the same way.

Hm, by going up to a 12 player swap, I could cut Lyles and Withey, maybe that's a little better?

Favors, Burkes, Hood, Ingles, Neto, Bolomboy
for
McCollum, Davis, Ezeli, Vonleh, Connaughton, Quarterman

As I said though, CJ's PPP makes this a very difficult trade to execute fairly.

You are going further and further in the wrong direction for the jazz from a talent standpoint. Guys like Ingles, Burks and Bolomboy aren't viewed as salary type fillers. Ingles has been incredible for us this. Burks is finally healty and when healthy has shown to be a 6th man of the year candidate.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using RealGM mobile app

[wickedwrister]

CJ McCullom for Nerlens and the Lakers pick

This has consistently elicited refusal from both sides.

As a Sixers fan I'd swallow hard at that trade but it does consistently make the most sense for both teams. Sixers could also eat Ezeli's contract since its on the shorter side and save a nice chunk of luxury tax burden for Portland.

All that being said still hope the Sixers trade Okafor instead and keep Noel and just roll with 48 min of Embiid/Noel protecting the rim.

Okafor and Lakers pick for CJ?

[Soulyss]

CJ McCullom for Nerlens and the Lakers pick

This has consistently elicited refusal from both sides.

As a Sixers fan I'd swallow hard at that trade but it does consistently make the most sense for both teams. Sixers could also eat Ezeli's contract since its on the shorter side and save a nice chunk of luxury tax burden for Portland.

All that being said still hope the Sixers trade Okafor instead and keep Noel and just roll with 48 min of Embiid/Noel protecting the rim.

Okafor and Lakers pick for CJ?

Unfortunately Okafor is exactly what we don't need. I actually would require a touch more protection on that pick, and would want the better of the Philly pick or the Laker pick as the trade bait for CJ if the only asset coming back is Noel who is a RFA next year. I think Philly ends up with a better record than the Lake show anyhow, but this protects Portland from the randomness of the Lottery.

[Mykhyn]

I liked this deal before Winslow got injured. Completed after Bosh medically waived...

To Kings: Dragic + Leonard + McRoberts

To Heat: CJ + Afflalo + Tolliver + Cavs 2017 Unprotected via Blazers

To Blazers: Winslow + WCS + Heat 2017 Top 3 Protected

Kings rumored to be ok with Dragic and his contract as an upgrade over Collison. They keep both and even play some minutes together. Also gets couple stretch 4's next to Cousins.

Heat trade all their youth and what is now a top 5 pick, for a duo of CJ and Whiteside. Riley gets cap to see who he can recruit to South Beach and make his big 3.

Blazers take the long play here. Rest of 2017 is to find out who is true core player next to Lillard. Who doesn't fit, they now have true assets to attach to them (looking at you Turner) and jettison for cap or player to be named later (consolidation trade). Heat 1st even with CJ on roster is lock top 10, Winslow and WCS are defensive as needed.

I like this trade regardless of Winslow injury.

Problem I see is I think Miami would want to get Cj/Winslow/Whiteside together. I think Kings might be willing to add some more value though.

[zzaj]

These CJ/Noel trades need to stop.

CJ: 23.5/3.5/4
for
Noel: 7.5/3/1blk (+injury questions and in a contract year)

Isn't going to happen. And that's ignoring CJ's PPP.